WV Columnist Sets Off Storm Calling Michael Brown 'Animal' Who Had To Be 'Put Down'

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

Source: Talking Points Memo

The frustration from Charleston Daily Mail's editor and publisher Brad McElhinny was clear when TPM reach him by phone on Tuesday afternoon.

"I've had better days," he said.

His exasperation was understandable. On Saturday, Don Surber, the West Virginia paper's lone editorial columnist, took to his personal blog to offer his thoughts on "police brutality" and the killing of unarmed black teenager Michael Brown.

"This summer I had an epiphany as I watched packs of racists riot in Ferguson, Missouri, in support of a gigantic thug who was higher than a kite when he attacked Ferguson Police Department Officer Darren Wilson, who unfortunately had to put this animal down," Surber wrote.

Read more: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/don-surber-michael-brown-animal-put-down-charleston-daily-mail-apologizes

---

Surber is a featured columnist and the editorial writer for the Charleston Daily Mail, the state's No. 2 paper, which has long been considered the state's leading conservative outlet.

https://www.facebook.com/charlestondailymail

[freshwest]

1. 'The state's leading conservative outlet.' Well, there you have it.

[Blue_Tires]

26. He just put to print what 99% of conservatives already believe anyway...

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

30. And sadly some DUers too! Racism is not confined to the right. We've witnessed it right

here on DU and in the Democratic Party.

[AverageJoe90]

33. "We've witnessed it.....in the Democratic Party." Please tell me you're not serious.

Are you shitting me? This isn't the Democratic Party circa 1954.....there is NO real racism problem in today's Democratic Party.

Please, for the love of god, stop this shit. Okay? A few idiots here on DU(virtually all of them disruptor trolls) =/= problems with the Party. C'mon now.

[JustAnotherGen]

36. You just alerted on her - right?

Because I served on the Jury.

TBH - serious - just being truthful- it's not whining.

I'm right there with Liberal and for you to deny there have been raging bigots that lasted around DU is crazy.

People have been TOMBSTONED for that.

She's right.

People have had posting privileges revoked for their bigotry, racism, and prejudice.

And I'm not giving links - check any race related thread and you can normally see them as Name Removed.

[AverageJoe90]

38. I never ONCE said that it didn't happen, period. Not once.

But the sad truth is, I can't help but have noticed that there's been a few folks around here making this problem of a FEW idiots and/or trolls, and making it out to be this huge, major issue amongst Democrats and liberals in general, and usually out of some personal grievance.

I've got nothing against people talking about their bad experiences with trolls, etc., not at all. It's when people take on the appearance, no matter if intentional or not, of using that to spread some sort of negative agenda, that I take issue with. And, frankly, I've seen enough of the latter to the point where I'm just plain tired of it.

Can't we just discuss the issues without pissing on each other?

Edit: Edited the title. I'll be truthful and admit that last part went a little too far. Apologies.

[JustAnotherGen]

40. You've told me before you are pretty young

I'm going to give you a tip about life - good, bad, indifferent. You can throw it away if you so choose - but if you are pursuing a business/corporate America career I hope you will take it to heart.

Get used to it.

It's life.

It's how a lot of the 'game' works.

People piss on each other.

People are cruel, vindictive, and hateful. That is our true nature WHEN it comes to a 'Resource Race'.

I don't like it anymore than you do. But it's a message board. Take all of those whose 'approach you don't like' and put them on ignore or simply skip over their posts.

The ONLY reason you are getting this response from me? That alert on Liberal_Stalwart.

You'll be hard pressed to see where I've responded to you in a long time.

Take that as you will - as we all learn to do in time -



And that is: Take What You Need And Leave the Rest.


^It will serve you well in life^

[AverageJoe90]

42. I'll admit I was a little harsh in the title of my reply. I apologize.....

That was mainly due to exasperation.....I'll edit that out.

I don't plan on pursuing a corporate career, btw.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

110. So if you never once said that it did not happen, thank you. But if you admit that

it does happen, then you cannot make the claim that there is no racism in the Democratic Party and that the people of color here on Democratic Underground have not experienced racism/racial bias.

Can you?

---

And let me say this to you:

You and I have had run-ins before, so I'm well aware of what your point of view is. The last time we discussed issues regarding race (re: white privilege), I asked you to please step outside of yourself and listen to those who have experienced racism/racial bias/racial discrimination.

Don't just dismiss people's experiences because you can't come to terms with the racism that DOES exist.

Instead, listen to the experiences of others. Don't kick sand in their faces. Don't deny their experiences. And please, do not dismiss them.

LISTEN!! Open your mind, heart, and ears. LISTEN!!

[AverageJoe90]

112. I'm sorry, but.....

Don't just dismiss people's experiences because you can't come to terms with the racism that DOES exist.

It's not that I haven't come to terms with racism.....I know it's out there, and often nasty at that.....but let's be honest. There are people who have been pushing this "racism is widespread/epidemic on DU" meme, for some time now. And I find it rather interesting indeed that this only started really popping up AFTER the 2012 elections. Why is that?

Instead, listen to the experiences of others. Don't kick sand in their faces.

Don't deny their experiences. And please, do not dismiss them.

Do keep in mind, though, that listening doesn't automatically = agreeing with every single thing you say.

LISTEN!! Open your mind, heart, and ears. LISTEN!!

May I ask you to do the same? And, in the meantime, perhaps you could also try to stop posting incendiary shit on here just to prove some point you think needs to be made, or whatever.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

115. No one suggested that racism on DU or the Democratic Party is widespread. No one

said it, implied it, or whatever you said.

You also need to provide examples of "incendiary shit" on DU that I've said.

And if I said, I needed to be alerted.

And yes, no matter what you say to me; how offensive you are; or how resistant...unless you get me banned, I will NEVER shut up or back down.

So, I'll repeat again:

THERE ARE RACISTS IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY!!

THERE IS RACISM ON DEMOCRATIC UNDERGROUND!! (people of color have witnessed this firsthand, whether you know it, see it or not!)

Please alert me if that is "incendiary shit".

[AverageJoe90]

118. "No one suggested that racism on DU or the Democratic Party is widespread." That is absolute B.S.

Wouldn't have said that if it *hadn't* been uttered and/or insinuated by someone at some point. And no, I'm not going to spend hours and fuckin' hours trying to dig shit up for you, because, frankly, given my prior experiences, you aren't liable to listen, or care.

unless you get me banned, I will NEVER shut up or back down.

Wow. I literally could have said this exact same thing. No shit.....the irony abounds here, doesn't it?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

121. Really, I'm done with you. Let's just agree to disagree on this issue.

Unless you alert me, then you have no cause.

You have made accusations against me that are absolutely false! If they are true, then have me banned.

You won't, now, will you? And let me tell you why you won't: You KNOW that you are lying. You KNOW that your accusations are false.

That you refuse to do what you need to do to hold me accountable for what YOU stated I do, then you have no credibility and I'm done with you.

Welcome to IGNORE!

[heaven05]

134. who can you

accuse of "shitting all over this thread". Wow??? And your deflection into reverse racism is laughable and transparent. geez

[AverageJoe90]

135. Re: "And your deflection into reverse racism is laughable and transparent".

I didn't say a damn thing about "reverse racism" and you know it. You are LYING, sir. Lying. Either that or you have ZERO reading comprehension(at least when it comes to certain things, anyway).

[heaven05]

151. what ever you say

[1StrongBlackMan]

159. Help me out here ...

I am fairly well versed in the racial/racism lexicon, and I am completely baffled by his usage of the term "intrapersonal racism", in the context of the hidden post.

Is this another one of those pseudo-intellectual, fancy sounding words that he does not understand ... and hopes no one will take the time to look it up?

intrapersonal racism:

prejudice and bias, attitudes, beliefs, emotions, ideas, and thoughts; leads to internalized stereotypes

http://www.cram.com/flashcards/race-relations-exam-1-2087205

[heaven05]

161. I would think

you are correct on all points.

[1StrongBlackMan]

158. Interesting ...

There are people who have been pushing this "racism is widespread/epidemic on DU" meme, for some time now. And I find it rather interesting indeed that this only started really popping up AFTER the 2012 elections. Why is that?

I, and others, can provide you a list of PoC that had left DU, long before the 2012 elections, because of their experiences here. This is not a new observation, nor phenomena.

[heaven05]

133. Impossible

for people who have a stake in maintaining the status quo and that 'privilege' you mentioned...... just my observation on the continuing BS from some on this thread. You are right. Never will they admit it.

[1StrongBlackMan]

157. It's more than that ...

Don't just dismiss people's experiences because you can't come to terms with the racism that DOES exist.

From what I've read, he doesn't have a problem with acknowledging that racism exists, he readily admits that; it's just that he wishes to define what is/is not "REAL" racism. And that is no different from the position of any semi-rational rightwing conservative ... they admit the existence of racism; they just can't seem to see it in anything other than the most extreme cases, every other offering is "play the race card" or "being divisive."

[heaven05]

48. It figures

geez

[bravenak]

65. What do you mean by this isn't 'The Democratic Party' circa 1954?

I have had many things said to me by democrats here and else where, and not just trolls either. And how would you know, anyway? They're not going to be doing their slick racist stuff to you, they would find a black person to do it to, like most racist do.

I have had many racist things said to me by democrats. The don't even know it's racist until i switch the words black for white, then they call me racist for repeating them with the colors flip flopped.

I wish you would stop announcing that racism is dead in the Democratic party. It isn't true and you never even ask for or consider the black pov on the issue. You speak for us without our permission. We will let you know when the party has gotten it's racism completely under control. We don'y need one young white dude who never believes one thing we say on race issues considering themselves the decider on whats racist and whats not.

You never experience racism. So why do you do most of the deciding? I find it to be a bit too much. One young white guy deciding that racism is over somewhere without a shred of experience dealing with the issue personally. It's like priests deciding sex rules.

[AverageJoe90]

68. .....

We don'y need one young white dude who never believes one thing we say on race issues considering themselves the decider on whats racist and whats not.

Nobody needs anyone to "decide" anything. And yet, since you brought that up, it's obvious that there's clearly a double standard at work in which a certain few people here think that they, alone *should* be allowed to actually entirely decide what racism is and isn't, without anyone else's input. And that's just messed up.

And to be honest, as for the other stuff you've said, it honestly seems like that you have likely had a particularly unlucky draw of the cards with meeting people; and that does happen. But I'm afraid that it's also quite possible that at other times, you may have misinterpreted something as "racist", that actually wasn't(which, btw, I'm willing to admit I've made a few similar mistakes myself.). And, in regards to the former, I'm sorry you've had that kind of shitty luck. And yes, I do mean that sincerely.

All I'm saying is, one cannot allow their negative experiences to totally get in the way of reality, if they want to be on the up and up. And, by the way, I do realize this happens to many of us from time to time, myself included. But it still holds true. Just think about that for a bit.

[bravenak]

74. I would like you to consider the possibility that.

Since you yourself are not racist, most racists do not say racist things to, about, or around you.
It's not like you should not have a voice, but since others that experience it are the ones most affected by it and probably draw racist comments from people who are just not like you.

You seem to be of the mind that most people are as nice and good as you are. They are not Joe. You are kinda on the high end of the niceness scale and many people in this world are cold, cruel and positively inhumane when you get them alone.

You have no reason to be hateful, envious, jealous or hateful towards blacks. Many are not so fortunate. Many people have been spoon fed negative information and never did bother to spit it out, they simply regurgitate bullcrap and spooned it to others.

This is why I tell you you don't know. People who are bigots like to wait for people like you to leave the room before they say crazy stuff. They ignore you because you are acceptable to them. They wait for people like me to be alone before they say or do their evil little things. That's why you don't see it often, and I do. They literally sign up to troll me, and they get assistance from people already here. By the time they get banned, and their supporters feel foolish for supporting racist ideology, the damage is already done. They did their job. They got liberals to agree with them and hurt me. They peel back layers on people that you never knew were there. If we don't have a racism problem, then how are they able to get democrats to agree wholeheartedly with racist stuff before they get zapped.

At first I was shocked at how easy they were able to do it. Now, I just know it's normal. We have racist liberals. And most of them don't even know it and would be upset to see evidence of it. Sometimes posters will at least self delete their agreements with trolls, and sometimes no. Sometimes they are doing it unprompted. No troll found.

Think about it.

[lunasun]

81. Just unlucky or misunderstood ??? Wtf ? Can see why you were banned from forum wtf?

[AverageJoe90]

82. See Post #79 for context.

As pretty much anyone with a brain can tell, there was nothing objectionable about that comment I made. Not one WHIT.

[heaven05]

86. ???

geez

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

114. I'll give you a perfect example of racism in the Democratic Party--a RECENT example--

In 2008 during the Democratic Party primaries, every state submitted exit polls. In some states where Hillary Clinton won--West Virginia and Kentucky, for example--white Democrats openly admitted that they could not/would not vote for a black man. Period.

On Democratic Underground, many examples of racist statements made, but I'll give two that quickly come to mind because they're meant to diffuse, deflect and/or justify mistreatment of black people:

- Blacks commit more crimes than whites. (This is actually not true!)
- Trayvon Martin was a thug who got himself killed. (This was said even before all the facts were out)

More subtle forms of racism on DU which shocked me:

- Blacks need to be careful what they wear, how they speak, dress (because we all act, speak and dress the same?)

- If blacks would just work harder, it would help to address the race problem

- Dismissing race, emphasizing class (remember: when black men/women are pursued the pursuer doesn't know if that person has a Ph.D. or not; is lower-class, middle-class or not. They see skin color, not income! Ask Oprah!)

[AverageJoe90]

116. Exceptions don't prove the rule, Stalwart.

And, by the way, this:

- Dismissing race, emphasizing class (remember: when black men/women are pursued the pursuer doesn't know if that person has a Ph.D. or not; is lower-class, middle-class or not. They see skin color, not income! Ask Oprah!)

Isn't even actual racism at all(yeah, it can be ignorant, depending on the particular circumstances, but where's the hate in this? Or the fear? Or the insinuation of racial inferiority?), not by itself, at least. C'mon now. You can't possibly be this far out in the field.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

119. You don't get to say what racism is and is not. If someone is being stopped for

walking and doing NOTHING wrong other than being black/Hispanic/Asian--that IS racism!!!

"Exceptions don't prove the rule".

What the fuck do you mean by this? You don't make sense. None at all.

Again, if I've made incendiary comments, feel free to report me and suggest that I be banned or alert me. Whatever you need to do.

I WILL NEVER BACK DOWN!!

[1StrongBlackMan]

168. Notice the language ...

Isn't even actual racism at all

and:

NO real racism problem

I hope people can see this for what it is ... a non-affected person attempting to define what is/is not "REAL" racism. And that is no different from the position of any semi-rational rightwing conservative ... they admit the existence of racism; they just can't seem to see it in anything other than the most extreme cases., every other offering is "play the race card" or "being divisive."define something they have never experienced.

Note to readers: As a Black man ... the extreme cases of racism, while rare(r), are by far easier to deal with (because they are fairly rare), than the cumulative effect of the daily "non-REAL"/"non-ACTUAL", that many wish to dismiss, as "play the race card", "Incendiary", or "being divisive."

[heaven05]

153. again with the exception BS?

geez tired, old, transparent and laughable.

[7962]

144. Re: your crime statement: With regard to population percentages, they do.

Facts are not racist. They're just facts. And I'll be slammed for pointing it out, but thats the way it is. Blacks are 13% of the population and commit crime at twice the rate of whites. Violent crime by several more times.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-43
But I agree with you on your other points. And it can even go the other way too. Such as not being "black enough" or not "acting black". Thats going on right now with the QB of Seattle.

[JustAnotherGen]

147. Also

Being "too" black in Corporate America /Banking/Technology - the six figure jobs that can put more people in the top 5% than playing around with a little ball.

[heaven05]

154. I'm sure

you enjoyed pointing this stat out. Impossible to be sure that "facts" are not skewed by you or others.

[1StrongBlackMan]

170. Here's the problem with the statistical argument ...

That a population of 10, where one of the 10 is stupid = a 10%stupidity rate.

That a population of 100, where three of the 100 are stupid = 3% stupidity rate.

The population of 10, has a 70% higher stupidity rate than the population of 100, with 66% fewer stupid people.

Is the issue? If not, please take a stats class.

[7962]

174. The original poster mentioned pure numbers not percentages

and I dont know how else you can look at it. A smaller number of people are committing a larger number of the crimes. It is what it is. For your example to reflect the numbers the same way, you'd have to flip the metrics.
I dont like it any more than you do. I just dont know what to DO about it.

[1StrongBlackMan]

176. Okay, let's take those pure numbers ...

The average American is 66% less likely to be a victim of crime committed by a Black person, than a white person.

But more, the numbers reflect arrests, not crimes committed.

Further, fear not, crime ... particularly, violent crime is a function of proximity and frequency of proximity.

[7962]

177. True; know your surroundings.

And "perception is reality". In the city nearby, there has been a big effort to revitalize the downtown. A lot of people just WILL NOT go downtown because they're afraid of the crime. But crime hasnt been bad in the area for several years now. But to those people, just THINKING its bad has the same effect as actually BEING bad; less people downtown. It is starting to get better slowly but surely

[1StrongBlackMan]

178. Very true ...

and to drill down deeper ... what the FBI figures do not reflect is the criminality of those arrested. IOWs, many (if not MOST) of the violent crimes noted, were committed by, and committed against, a relatively small group of people engaged in other criminal activity ... specifically, the drug trade and/or gang activities.

To the downtown point ... that is absolutely true. We (the media/society) have spent so much of our time criminalizing poverty, (while painting it in Blackface) central cities are the source of fear ... Poor (Black) = Crime.

[1StrongBlackMan]

166. My question is ...

what does he mean by:

there is NO REAL {emphasis added} racism problem in today's Democratic Party.

What the hell does not mean ... is that like being "a little pregnant", or "a bit of an A$$hole"?

[bravenak]

167. He decides what is real for us is what I assume.

Only an assumption.

[7962]

173. Thats a pretty darn good way of looking at it, too.

Although I would say there are different levels of "assholiness" but pregnant is pregnant!!

[noiretextatique]

80. please tell me you are not serious

Yes, Virginia...there are racists at DU and in the democratic party.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

109. AverageJoe90, are you a person of color? Yes or no?

If yes and have firsthand experience with racism or racial discrimination, then o.k.

But if you are not a person of color and therefore are not the target of racial discrimination and bigotry on a daily basis, then how do you know that racism doesn't exist on Democratic Underground? How can you make that determination? Just because YOU may not have seen it, may not experienced it yourself, doesn't mean that the posters who are people of color have not!

[AverageJoe90]

111. Does it matter?

But if you are not a person of color and therefore are not the target of racial discrimination and bigotry on a daily basis,

So you believe white people can't experience ANY racism at all? That even the most hateful language and broad-brushing doesn't count, simply because of skin color, "whiteness", etc.?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

117. Yes it does matter because if you are not a person of color, then you are not

subjected to what people of color go through.

And therefore, you have no basis on which to conclude that racism doesn't isn't on Democratic Underground or elsewhere.

If you haven't gone through what we go through, then how do you know? YOU DON'T!!

And so you must attack me because you take issues with the fact that I and other people of color are sharing their experiences and you and others can't handle it.

Is this "incendiary" enough for you?

[AverageJoe90]

120. I'd like a straight answer, please.

I'll repeat myself again:

So you believe white people can't experience ANY racism at all? That even the most hateful language and broad-brushing doesn't count, simply because of skin color, "whiteness", etc.?

And so you must attack me because you take issues with the fact that I and other people of color are sharing their experiences and you and others can't handle it.

No, I take issue with people spreading B.S. and pissing on fellow DUers, and DU in general, and attempting to use individual personal experiences as a shield against criticism.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

122. If I'm spreading B.S. and doing all these things you say, REPORT ME!!!!!!

I'm clearly violating DU rules and regulations.

So REPORT ME!!!

You're on IGNORE!

Enjoying talking to yourself!

[Number23]

138. SHUT UP

Last edited Thu Oct 30, 2014, 07:03 PM - Edit history (1)

there is NO real racism problem in today's Democratic Party.

Edit but the sentiment remains. And so does my post in the pre-edit view.

[1StrongBlackMan]

171. I like your pre-edit version better ...

It amazes me that there is so little push back against him by other "liberal" white DUers ... Let someone spout blatantly ignorant "facts" on any 1%, income inequality, TPP, XL, NSA, or any of the other issues near and dear to the loudest voices on DU, and the spouter would have been PPRed, months/years ago.

Is this an example of "Silence being Consent?"

[Number23]

182. Thanks. I think I do too

Let someone spout blatantly ignorant "facts" on any 1%, income inequality, TPP, XL, NSA, or any of the other issues near and dear to the loudest voices on DU, and the spouter would have been PPRed, months/years ago.

Remember when people were getting PPrd for talking about chemtrails? CHEMTRAILS??? And the latest is PPring people who get time outs and create sock accounts to try to go around that. That is just No No Number 1 for the admins here.

But you can call black culture a "culture of deviancy," you can troll EVERY SINGLE SOLITARY race thread and the handful of black posters that bother to post here REPEATEDLY, and can come thiiiiiiiiiiiis close to calling black folks inferior while talking about our "limited and skewed lives" and still live to tell the tale months later.

Welcome to DU.

[Ash_F]

172. After 9k posts you should know better. /nt

[JustAnotherGen]

37. Your post survived a jury

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service







On Wed Oct 29, 2014, 06:41 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

And sadly some DUers too! Racism is not confined to the right. We've witnessed it right
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=931419

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Last I checked, whining about DU was a CS violation. And from what I recall, they've done this "racism is a major problem on DU and in teh Party" before, too.

Whatever this person's personal problems may have been with a few folks on here, it's just not cool for *anyone* to take their frustrations out in this manner.
.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Wed Oct 29, 2014, 06:47 PM, and the Jury voted 1-6 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Whining.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Seriously? Is this AverageJoe? You've GOT to be kidding me. You are kidding me with this right?
Whining? I'm going to go get alert crazy on you. You just alerted on this because you were BANNED from the AA Group for being a raging bigot. That was done by vote too . . .
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I'm not going to hide a true statement. There is racism everywhere. It exists in all groups. Pretending it doesn't is the worst thing we can do.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

Thank god. As if there has neveeeeeeeeeeer been a bigot in the Democratic Party in the past 20 years. And as if there has neveeeeeeeeeeeeeer been a bigot in our midst at DU.

TBH - truthfully - just telling you the truth -

I'm so sick of alertd over nonsense.

[AverageJoe90]

41. Juror #3's is totally facepalm-worthy, btw.

(BTW, if one must know, I hardly ever posted over there. I actually received that notification out of the blue, despite not having made ANY posts in a good while. Heaven05 and I didn't, and still don't get along all that well, and there's no doubt that this was just to get back at me.)

[JustAnotherGen]

43. I was in on that decision

And it had nothing to do with heaven05.

Quotes from the movie Charade -

REGGIE: Alex - how can you tell if someone is lying or not?

DYLE: You can't.

REGGIE: There must be some way.

DYLE: There's an old riddle about two tribes of Indians - the Whitefeet always tell the truth and the Blackfeet always lie. So one day you meet an Indian, you ask him if he's a truthful Whitefoot or a lying Blackfoot? He tells you he's a truthful Whitefoot, but which one is he?

REGGIE: Why couldn't you just look at his feet?

DYLE: Because he's wearing moccasins.

REGGIE: Oh. Well, then he's a truthful Whitefoot, of course.

DYLE: Why not a lying Blackfoot?

REGGIE (confused): Which one are you?

DYLE (entering, smiling): Whitefoot, of course.

To be honest with you - it had nothing to do with heaven05.

[heaven05]

50. thanks

I was just about to lower the boom. Never mind......

[JustAnotherGen]

64. That was jarriing to read

I think I can find the exact post . . .

[JustAnotherGen]

77. I found the thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11878524

And the day of the boot was September 7th. I have the automated message.

TBH - truthfully.

[heaven05]

87. I left a response on

that thread you mentioned, posted it to the wrong person, but you got the gist/point.

[JustAnotherGen]

89. I did get it

Hopefully I've also stopped this idea that you were the reason someone got blocked from a very specific protected group at DU.

[heaven05]

90. not likely

[JustAnotherGen]

91. Ahhh there go those

Misconceptions and finger pointing things again!


Any minute now I'm going to read: NO FAIR! I'm telliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing!

[heaven05]

92. mommieeee!!!!!

they did it again!!!!!

[Number23]

146. Heh. Just notice that cretinous little troll that alerted on my post was shown the door WEEKS ago

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=317160&sub=trans

Hopefully not the last one to do so, either.

[JustAnotherGen]

148. Yet

There has never been racial prejudice displayed towards blacks at DU. Go figure.

[Number23]

139. Heaven is not a host of the AA forum and had nothing to do with your banning.

And you are deranged if you think that he is the only black poster here that sees right through you.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

53. I have to laugh at the nonsense sometimes.

[heaven05]

44. +10000

Brown, Martin, Crawford and many more lately, according to some here, were responsible for their own death for being black while unarmed.

[heaven05]

49. truth hurts

and that alert, very touchy alerter when truth is spilled here.

[AverageJoe90]

79. "Truth"? If that was truth, then Jimmy Carter is a fuckin' Teabagger.....(edited)

Last edited Thu Oct 30, 2014, 11:48 AM - Edit history (2)

But it's not. Never was true.

This was the ONE post I could find:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11878524#post9

Umm.....pardon me, but who, exactly said.....That slavery made poor whites the victims instead of African-Americans? I'd like to see some proof for this before I make any judgement on the matter.

(Emphasis added post-facto, to illustrate the point of said question)

This was a reply asking for some context in regards to a comment that the OP alleged had made(I never did find any proof). And in regards to the naif who served the third spot on that jury, if this is what they were referring to when they claimed I was supposedly a "raging bigot".....well, they either can't read context for shit, or there was some sort of personal vendetta going on. Either way, it was bullshit all around.

Edit: However, though, I now realize that I actually had you confused with Number23 somehow. I apologize for the error and have retracted that part of this reply. (everything else still stands, however).

[JustAnotherGen]

85. It was not heaven

Stop that. heaven05 is not and was not a host of the group. And heaven was already aware of that thread as I posted it earlier in this thread.

Within that thread is link posted by gollygee - that you were hip deep on. And that's also the thread where Number23 - a group host got locked out due to a hide. A hide as far as I'm concerned - for telling the truth.


As you gain experience in the world you will learn to step back and look at the sum of the parts. Sometimes a lot of little things add up.

At the end of the day - heaven05 can't give you an explanation - because heaven was not part of the decision.

I don't know how to make this more clear?


Do you understand that heaven05 was not part of the decision?

Eta your post I'm responding to:

79. "Truth"? If that was truth, then Jimmy Carter is a fuckin' Teabagger.....

But it's not. Never was true. You never did give a proper explanation of why you all of a sudden decided to kick me out of the AA forums, btw. I even searched for posts I'd made from within the timeframe you'd banned me(Sept. 7th, going back at least a couple of weeks).

This was the ONE post I could find:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11878524#post9

Umm.....pardon me, but who, exactly said.....That slavery made poor whites the victims instead of African-Americans? I'd like to see some proof for this before I make any judgement on the matter.


(Emphasis added post-facto, to illustrate the point of said question)

This was a reply asking for some context in regards to a comment that the OP alleged had made(I never did find any proof). And in regards to the naif who served the third spot on that jury, if this is what they were referring to when they claimed I was supposedly a "raging bigot".....well, they either can't read context for shit, or there was some sort of personal vendetta going on. Either way, it was bullshit all around.

[AverageJoe90]

93. I just *now* realized I had him confused with a certain other individual.

And I have since retracted that upon realization of the error, and offered an apology.

That does not, however, change my salient point: there was absolutely no reason to kick me out for a perfectly innocent reply, requesting some context from the OP: and, as far as I can recall, there was never any proof that I could find that ANYONE had ever said that slavery hurt poor whites INSTEAD OF black folks(unless, perhaps, from a troll who was since tombstoned; but one can't read their replies at all after that).

Frankly, it's clear that Number23 had a personal agenda of some sort on their mind at that time. There was nothing that warranted that action and he and I both know it. I hardly ever posted over there, anyway, which makes things worse.

[JustAnotherGen]

95. Not Number23 either

If you have an issue with the boot - you should take it up with Admin of DU. Perhaps have the protected group shut down?

Psst - Number23 is a woman. She was actually hidden on that thread. Alerted on and hidden for some truth telling is all.

So far as I know it was not that big of a deal to her. . It's just a small group, within a little web site, on the world wide web.

However, if you feel there was a terrible injustice done to you - then you should work proactively to get the group removed from DU.

Good luck!

[AverageJoe90]

99. That's not what I saw. This is the message I got from the Automated Message system:

You have been blocked from posting in the African American group by Number23. If you believe this is an error, you may contact Number23 for more information.

So, is there some sort of flaw in the software I don't know about?

However, if you feel there was a terrible injustice done to you - then you should work proactively to get the group removed from DU.

That's not what I'm aiming for. At all.

[JustAnotherGen]

102. There are several hosts in the group

We work together.

So that said - are you just trying to get all the hosts removed? If the group removal is not the end game?

I won't apologize for that removal - none of us will.

I'm sorry - but I don't lick heels. It's not in my nature.

[AverageJoe90]

104. "I'm sorry - but I don't lick heels. It's not in my nature." Me neither.

So that said - are you just trying to get all the hosts removed? If the group removal is not the end game?

No. I don't generally do that kind of thing, even though, FYI, this isn't the only time I've been wrongfully booted from a group. I'll still rec any decent and/or thoughtful articles I come across in there, though.

[heaven05]

107. "decent and thoughtful"

right.......... they must be very subjective recs considering ..........

[AverageJoe90]

113. At least I've (indirectly) admitted to keeping an open mind.

You could at least give me credit for *that*, if nothing else.

[JustAnotherGen]

123. Prove to the Admin

That it was wrongful.

Earl G? Skinner? Elad?

Prove it to them.

[AverageJoe90]

125. Shouldn't be at all hard to do.

The truth is, though, no matter how right an appealant may be, the outcome still all depends on the Admins' own decisions.

[JustAnotherGen]

127. Go ahead

I welcome it.

[1StrongBlackMan]

130. Well, emotionally mature self-reflection ...

FYI, this isn't the only time I've been wrongfully booted from a group.

would suggest that, maybe, it REALLY IS you!

[bravenak]

143. That's it in a nutshell.nt

[Number23]

140. My "personal agenda" is to see as little of you on this web site as is humanly possible

TBH

[VanillaRhapsody]

55. OH GMAFB....

ridic!

[heaven05]

59. nope

[VanillaRhapsody]

61. yep...this is a stupid attack on Dem. and DU

Its not tolerated here. Just because it happens doesnt make it an idictment of the whole

[heaven05]

62. of course not

just like all people aren't racist and all black people aren't hoodie wearing thugs, I saw that stated here during that travesty of a zimpig trial. Thugs as described by some on here of murdered kids like Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown et al is stupid. All this protesting the truth about some on here does not diminish THE FACT that a certain number of people, here, have problems, ALL THE TIME, when it comes to acceptance of the truth about racism in amerikkkan culture and whites responsible for these acts of murder and terrorism. When it comes to issue of race, the black dead are usually, with the ones I'm talking about, responsible for their deaths whether unarmed or armed, shot one time or ten.....that shouldn't be tolerated, but is and if they, the elite, are called out about these types of rationalization(s), the caller gets hidden, usually. That's what I have witnessed.

Nothing stupid about the truth being said of the american people as represented on this board. Discussionist? I won't even start with right now. Big mistake. A lot of them are here now sowing dissension, mistrust and discord, I feel

[VanillaRhapsody]

78. exceptions do not make the rule...

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

69. Feel free to alert me and have me banned, then! You'll fail because you know that

what you are claiming is complete and utter BULLSHIT!!!!

[VanillaRhapsody]

76. NOOOO YOUR claim is the utter bullshit!

[AverageJoe90]

83. Forget about it. "Liberal Stalwart" was just here to cause trouble anyway, it seems.

Some fuckin' people.....SMH.

[VanillaRhapsody]

88. yeah some people is right

[JustAnotherGen]

96. Some people hold grudges

[heaven05]

97. yepper

[VanillaRhapsody]

101. some people also have good memories and whose

Skills include dot connecting...

[heaven05]

103. yep sure do

and very good at connecting dots.

[VanillaRhapsody]

105. some of us are..

[heaven05]

106. just saying

the street runs both ways.

[VanillaRhapsody]

129. not if its a one way street..

[heaven05]

132. yours is

more like a dead end with concrete wall waiting......

[VanillaRhapsody]

136. actually mine another Democrat on Pennsylvania Avenue...

what's yours?

[heaven05]

149. so you hope

the democrat at Pennsylvania ave hits a concrete wall. Right? Well if that's the case let me clue the clueless. Republicans and others have been directing "that Democrat at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave" down dead ends since 2008. Hasn't worked. He has really been smarter than all.

[VanillaRhapsody]

156. WTF are you talking about????

I want another win .....I plan to vote for whoever wins the Democratic Primary.....as I always do because I am a Democrat What is YOUR plan?

[heaven05]

160. well, we're on

the same page there. The rest of your book is unintelligible so far. That's WTF I'm talking about.

[VanillaRhapsody]

162. I am not writing a book...perhaps you are .

Leave that page out .

[heaven05]

163. good day to you

[VanillaRhapsody]

164. whatevs..

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

108. Then, report me! Report for slander. Report me for offending the entire Democratic Party.

Report me for condemning Democratic Underground.

REPORT ME!!!

[heaven05]

131. don't lose it

their forte is to try to goad people into TOS mistakes so they can laugh at you being hidden or banned. It's not worth it and we need people to stand up to the hypocrisy present. You didn't lie, slander or offend with the truth. Just keep on keepin' on.

[VanillaRhapsody]

137. exceptions do not make rules...

sorry!

[heaven05]

150. ?????

Last edited Fri Oct 31, 2014, 12:20 PM - Edit history (1)

your response doesn't even make sense, actually none ever have. Your defense of yourself and another has actually been your indictment.

[VanillaRhapsody]

155. actually not surprised in the least that YOU

don't get it frankly....

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

179. Oh I get it, I totally get what I'm dealing with here.

And guess what? There are a good number of people here who agree with me. We've had countless discussions off line about what we're dealing with. Trust and believe that.

Have a good day.

[VanillaRhapsody]

181. a "good many" is subjective and doesnt mean a majority

Does it?

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

180. As always! You know it! We know the truth, and

That's all that matters!

[AverageJoe90]

71. True. True.

I've even gone after trolls myself, on the rare occasion I've bumped into one. (Although, to be truthful, I usually try to take the educational approach.)

Infighting honestly doesn't help us one bit.

[XemaSab]

145. Allow me to translate:

AverageJoe90: "Infighting honestly doesn't help us one bit."

English: "Shut up, women, blacks, and gays, the straight white men are talking here!"

[heaven05]

165. hit the nail on the head

concerning all who................have said "shut up, women, blacks, and gays, the straight white men are talking here!" Great translation.

[kwassa]

169. Further translation.

"Things are true because I, AverageJoe90, say they are. No other proof is required. No links, no outside factual references, no back up of any kind are necessary. Simply my perception that this is the way the world is."

Yes, he has me on ignore, too. He couldn't answer my questions, so he avoids them by putting me on ignore. He does that to anyone he can't debate.

[XemaSab]

183. There's a reason why that post wasn't alerted on

[vlakitti]

2. Thanks to you and Talking Points Memo

for calling out this scurrilous bigotry. I'm angry but not surprised these fools think this way; this is the region that justified the slavery movement with racism.

The person who wrote this rubbish really has to be fired and his views repudiated.

[bvf]

14. Agreed.

Especially wrt to his needing to lose his job after this.

[JustAnotherGen]

63. Small point

And if you read my posts on this thread it's obvious my feelings on bigots - but WV - they were the good guys. Some of the kindest people in America get made fun of for being "Hill Billies". I've never been treated unkindly in a store in public - in places like WV, Southern KY - the Smoky Mountains. I have been NYC, Pittsburgh, San Francisco.

My greater concern in America is the polite bigot that stabs you in the back while smiling in your face.

They hide in plain site - its up to me to see - really see and figure out what kind of feet they have.

This guy? In this case?


Well now we know who he is.

[vlakitti]

67. You are absolutely right and I apologize

I know all that about West Virginia's stance in the Civil War. My brain was really creaky last night.

[JustAnotherGen]

73. That's okay

I descend from the Hills ( family) West VA. As awesome as my dad's family is - my mom's Scots-Irish, German, and French folks are pretty awesome too. My great grandmother I was extremely close to? Her grandfather was born and raised in WV. There's some of that steel in my blood. . That man was part of that "split" from VA as he was an abolitionist.

There's people with hearts of gold in them thar hills!

[Cha]

3. Ohhhhh Poor Don Surber.. Poor little thing. he had to watch Protests and Police Brutality and he

comes away with.. Bullshite.

The Editor..

"We're sorry about the impression Mr. Surber gave. That's not the view of the paper as a whole," McElhinny said. "His words were uncareful and he is aware of that. He is aware that although it was his personal blog, people realize he is a columnist and an editorial writer for the paper and it's certainly affected our reputation."

Can't wait to get an update.. personally, I think it's Surber who is the "animal"

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

4. They're feigning ignorance

This guy's worked there for decades and it's not the first time he's done something like this.

[Cha]

5. Yeah.. like "Who us?!"

Thanks for the OP Adenoid

[merrily]

51. +1

[KingCharlemagne]

84. Your short comment must be the most insightful of all the comments I've read. Any

apology this paper or columnist might make won't be a genuine expression of remorse. It will be merely a "We're sorry we got caught" moment.

To call a dead 18-year-old an "animal" takes some kind of prize for malign cruelty. It outdoes Cheney, if such is even possible.

[theHandpuppet]

10. Affected their reputation? Reputation as what?

Their reputation as the state's version of a right wing ass rag?

This is why I read the Charleston Gazette.

[Skittles]

6. disturbing

very, very ugly

[davidpdx]

7. Let me guess, their subscriptions will increase from more crazies buying the paper

[Aristus]

19. Yeah, more fishwraps and birdcage liners.

I don't imagine this fucknugget's target audience can actually read all that well...

[Scuba]

8. Sick.

[billhicks76]

9. I Won't Be Surprised

When people get active and put this slug down.

[czarjak]

11. Hell's bells...

Could have come straight out of the Lubbock Avalanche Journal.

[hatrack]

12. Cue shitstorm of whiny poutrage about how "oppressed" this guy is, and the 1st Amdt.

Can't wait . . . .

[maxrandb]

15. Hell, I'm surprised

he doesn't already have a "cookie-cutter" Hate Radio show, or appeared as a guest on a Faux News show.

[SnowCritter]

21. It was one hell of an audition

don't you think?

He'll probably on Hannity sometime next week.

[Feral Child]

13. Looks

like the USA is choosing up sides...

[heaven05]

16. just sad

there are good human beings and there are not so good human beings. No race or culture has a monopoly on good or bad behavior. These racial characterizations should be in the dustbin of history. But no, racism is alive and well in america and being perpetuated by MSM media, radio, television and internet, purveyors of hate and just plain stupid and ignorant people.

There is no justifiable excuse for this hate based on race.

Personally I will be glad to leave this ignorance and stupidity when my time comes for permanent removal from this plain of existence. Hopefully there will be a better consciousness elsewhere in this vast universe. Human beings are a pitiful, pitiful species. No more pride had for the human being.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

31. The black Kenyan Muslim in the White House and people have lost their fucking minds!

The racism was always there. It was just latent and hidden.

It all came to the surface that fateful day in Springfield, Illinois when this un-American Kenyan announced his run for the presidency.

People are unapologetic and proud; they are showing who they really are and what they really believe...and how they really think about us black folk.

[bullwinkle428]

17. These fuckers don't even feel the need to use dog whistles anymore.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

32. They never did. We all knew what "welfare queen" was. No one had to spell it out for us.

We all knew what Pappy Bush was doing with that Willie Horton ad or what happened to John McCain during the South Carolina Republican primaries in 2000.

This country's obsession with race will be its undoing.

[sinkingfeeling]

18. I could say alot of things, but I won't. Shame on WVA. Has Surber been fired yet?

[mountain grammy]

20. This is the very dangerous tack taken by right wing thugs,

and they are thugs. This is one column and it's shocking. Wait, there will be more and more until, one day, it's not shocking, it's the norm (it's already accepted among conservatives.) Then, look out! Once a race of human beings is designated as less than human, it becomes easy to annihilate them.

[negoldie]

34. Column

For factual correctness: it was written on his private blog, not a column for the paper. He should still be fired. but he will probably get a raise for selling more racism to the hillbillies.

[Psephos]

39. "selling racism to the hillbillies"

Irony is not your strong suit.

[theHandpuppet]

58. I find a lot of irony here

Particularly the stereotyping and bigotry one can find on a supposedly progressive discussion forum.

[theHandpuppet]

57. Hillbillies? Oh, you mean people like me?

Alrighty then.

[JustAnotherGen]

66. When I put it up here

Deliberately in "quotes" I hope it made clear my distaste for the concept.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1014&pid=931733

A lot of people have never been around the folks in what could be called a diaspora or sub culture.

I've noticed - many of the regulars in the AA Group here never use that terminology. Perhaps it's an understanding of what it feels like.

[theHandpuppet]

72. "Perhaps it's an understanding of what it feels like."

Yep, from untold generations existing at the margins of "society".

Always appreciate your comments and support.

[heaven05]

47. hhhhmmm

thanks for the history reminder. 1933, anyone remember? 2016 could start that ball rolling again with laziness next TUESDAY NOVEMBER 4TH 2014.

[appalachiablue]

22. Horrible, inexcusable. Surber should be fired by the publisher/editor asap. Very disturbing,

this widespread bigotry, dehumanization and hate.

[packman]

23. Fired? - hell, no

Promoted probably or at the worst resigns and goes either: 1. Runs for governor 2. Becomes a featured contributor to Fox News 3. Becomes a right-wing radio star.

[7962]

25. He's got a face for radio.

[JustAnotherGen]

142. Oh my

[1StrongBlackMan]

24. I can't comment on this due to my personal moratorium; but ...

This summer I had an epiphany as I watched packs of racists riot in Ferguson, Missouri, in support of a gigantic thug who was higher than a kite when he attacked Ferguson Police Department Officer Darren Wilson, who unfortunately had to put this animal down," Surber wrote.

And this:

"We're sorry about the impression Mr. Surber gave. That's not the view of the paper as a whole," McElhinny said. "His words were uncareful and he is aware of that. He is aware that although it was his personal blog, people realize he is a columnist and an editorial writer for the paper and it's certainly affected our reputation."

Should read:

He is aware that although it was his personal blog, people realize he is WAS an EX columnist and an EX editorial writer for the paper and it's certainly affected our reputation.

[heaven05]

45. yep

[vkkv]

27. When are the death-threatening drunk drivers of vehicles displaying the Confederate flag

-going to be pulled over by police and shot?

[heaven05]

46. no time soon

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

28. They're still publishing his columns as of today

new one up backing GOP candidate for U.S. Senate:
http://www.charlestondailymail.com/article/20141029/DM04/141029143/1279

[theHandpuppet]

29. Well, that was totally expected

Capito fits right in with that collection of slimebags.

[AverageJoe90]

35. Well, given that this is a conservative paper, in W.V., no less, I can't say I'm surprised.

Don Surber = dumbass moron.

Just another example of how the two sides are not NEARLY the fuckin' same. Liberals don't have a racism problem(in fact, I'd go as far to say that genuine modern liberals actually *cannot* be racist, simply thanks to the virtue of our ideology). Conservatives do, and many refuse to admit it.

[Louisiana1976]

54. True. A lot of conservatives are closet racists. Don Surber came out of the closet.

[heaven05]

60. Most these days

are out of the closet. Been out, big time, for the last 6+ years and more coming out every day. This country is whack......

[AverageJoe90]

70. Yes, and many of the Teabaggers have power in Congress.

Unfortunately, it doesn't help that our side still has to deal with plenty of infighting, misconceptions, finger pointing, etc. Just look at some of the comments I've replied to in here.....

[merrily]

52. Vile, him AND his paper. Vile and shameful.

[sakabatou]

56. I hope to hell he'll get fired soon

But I'm not holding my breath.

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

75. Contacts for the paper, who are hoping they can ride this out

They've issued no further statement, and even ran one of his columns today
-----
https://www.facebook.com/charlestondailymail
[phone]

Maramba, Philip
[e-mail]
Managing editor

McElhinny, Brad
[e-mail]
Twitter - @BradMcElhinny
Editor and Publisher

Merritt, Kelly
[e-mail]
Twitter - @EKMerritt
Opinions editor

Surber, Don
[e-mail]
Twitter- @DonSurber
Editorial writer/columnist

[heaven05]

98. thank you

for your post. An outing continues to be revealed. Surber is just part of the bundy-zimpig pack and won't change. Amerikkka has trained them well.

[Eugene]

100. Writer fired for calling Mike Brown an animal who needed to be put down

Source: Daily Kos

THU OCT 30, 2014 AT 08:46 AM PDT

Writer fired for calling Mike Brown an animal who needed to be put down

by Shaun King

Sometimes in life you get a second chance for mistakes you make.

When Don Surber, editorial columnist for Charleston's Daily Mail, called Mike Brown an "animal" who deserved to "be put down," and referred to protestors as "packs of racists," he crossed a line where second chances are much harder to come by.

Today Surber was fired by the Daily Mail for his incendiary comments Mike Brown and protestors and the following statement, titled "Regrets and a Change," was issued:

[font size=1]-snip-[/font]

Read more: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2014/10/30/1340293/-Writer-fired-for-calling-Mike-Brown-an-animal-who-needed-to-be-put-down#

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

126. Justice is served.

[Number23]

141. The best thing to come out of this thread.

[WhoWoodaKnew]

152. Many jobs await him.

[bullwinkle428]

175. Perhaps Hannity's buddy Hal Turner is hiring.

[samsingh]

128. calling any youth an animal pretty much is a sign of surber's racist slant i would think