GOP has votes to pass Keystone
Source: The Hill
Republican gains in the Senate have given Keystone XL supporters a filibuster-proof majority to pass a bill approving construction of the controversial pipeline.
Before Tuesday’s election, supporters had 57 votes in the Senate in support of Keystone, including a dozen Democrats. After Republicans picked up seven Senate seats (and counting) in Tuesday's election, the vote count for Keystone had ballooned to 61.
GOP Sen.-elects Mike Rounds (S.D.), Shelley Moore Capito (W.Va.) Cory Garnder (Colo.) and Joni Ernst (Iowa) are all Keystone backers.
"The election of several pro-Keystone Senators puts the passage of Keystone that much closer and shows energy projects like Keystone is a priority for our country," Ryan Bernstein, Sen. John Hoeven's (R-N.D.) chief of staff, told The Hill on Wednesday.
Read more: http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/gop-has-votes-to-pass-keystone/ar-BBd7Vl7?ocid=mailsignout
And the hits keep coming....
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RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)That's it. Game Over! The Human Race has lost!
I wonder what they will do with all their money when there is no more clean air to breathe, no more clean water to drink, and the planet is too hot.
Response to RoccoR5955 (Reply #1)
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libmom74
(633 posts)
"Only when the last tree has been cut down; Only when the last river has been poisoned; Only when the last fish has been caught; Only then will you find that money cannot be eaten."
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)People suck and I've given up on them.
It's the millions of other species that will be affected by this that I'm concerned about.
But then, I'm one of those job-killing, tree-bark-eating commies that worships Gaia and doesn't believe in the righteous gospel of prosperity in which God gave 'Muricans carte blanche to burn up the earth.
FUUUUUUUUUUUUCK PEOPLE!!!! ESPECIALLY REPUBLICAN CORPORATE NON-PERSONS!!!!!!!
NCarolinawoman
(2,825 posts)
Couldn't agree more. They are the innocents.
City Lights
(25,830 posts)
cilla4progress
(26,525 posts)prefer animals to humans. My husband and I have one child, a daughter who I love with all my heart who is an environmental policy major and is presently in Costa Rica studying sustainability.
But by and large, I prefer animals and nature to people, and we have cats, dogs, chickens and horses at my place.
I am also pagan, in that I find divinity in nature.
It's nice to be able to start coming out about this (preferring animals and nature to people), and to find fellows in my species who feel the same way.
It's the thing I'm saddest about.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)Gotta love hyperbole.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)clearing the Boreal Forest in Canada, for oil. I guess that you are not aware that the trees on this planet provide much of the oxygen necessary for most life. I guess that you are unaware of the problem that we currently face if we keep using fossil fuels with the reckless abandon that we have been. Perhaps you are unaware that many in the GOP want to gut the EPA, thereby letting corporations pollute as much as they care to.
So though it may not be the only factor, the pipeline is a major factor in the end of human life on this planet as we know it.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)The oil in Canada is being removed Keystone or not. It will be shipped by other pipelines, rail, ship and truck -- as it is now. The pipeline means nothing about the removal of oil.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)I am very aware of reality. So much so that I want to keep our planet in a condition that will facilitate mammalian life. This oil has to remain in the ground, if we are to survive. THAT is reality.
Saying that they are going to move it no matter what, is just surrendering. This is the problem with so many of us today, we don't have the testicular fortitude to fight for the correct things, or even fight at all.
Good Luck with the go along, get along gang.
former9thward
(33,424 posts)I don't see you throwing yourself in front of the trains.
daleo
(21,317 posts)former9thward
(33,424 posts)Thus more economical. But not having it is not going to stop anything.
hopemountain
(3,919 posts)not when the future and well being of the planet and living things are at stake. what will you do when there are no more resources on this planet to suck up for your money?
Recursion
(56,582 posts)So it's not a question of what any of us will do.
I still haven't heard a convincing argument that blocking the pipeline would reduce the amount of oil extracted. If somebody could make that case, I'd be all about stoping the pipeline. As it is, I just don't see the point of throwing away political energy on whether the same amount of oil goes through point A or point B on its way to poisoning the atmosphere.
rock
(13,218 posts)True, but the most important source (certainly by volume produced) is the blue algae as found in the oceans.
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)And charged the people a dollar and a half* to see 'em.
*Adjusted for inflation. Actual price in 2014 dollars is somewhere in the tens or hundreds of thousands. Plus the innumerable non-financial costs like: complete destruction of the earth and everything in it.
rock
(13,218 posts)Yea! 
We have zero chance of losing trees and wide open spaces? I drive up and down the many states on the East Coast and all you see are trees and open land. Have you ever been to West Virginia? Pennsylvania? Maryland? North or South Carolina? Georgia? Florida? Heck you can drive for miles and only see trees and open space. I never understood the negativity of saving trees and open space. That is our country! We are made up of trees and open spaces. Our land development is at best 10 percent. We have a long way to go to destroy our portion of Earth.
hopemountain
(3,919 posts)yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)hopemountain
(3,919 posts)12 gorgeous monterey pines succumbed to drought in one neighborhood in socal and were removed this week. trees provide much more than oxygen to our atmosphere. they host billions of living organisms and support a web of mycylia across the globe. few people understand the importance of the humble mycelium - but, i tell you, they are key to our existence just as the oxygen, water and salt are to the human body.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)
WestSeattle2
(1,730 posts)Alyeska pipeline in the 1960's as well. Said it would decimate the caribou species. YAWN. They have more caribou in Alaska now than ever before. Hell, generations of caribou have made mad passionate love to each other under the full Alaska moon while using the pipeline to stay dry.
Will they cut down trees in Canada to remove oil? Yes. Will they replant more trees to more than compensate for the ones they remove? Yes.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)
DCBob
(24,689 posts)They will keep drilling and digging and fracking until we figure out how to wean ourselves off oil.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)as the people of Mayflower, Arkansas, can tell you
AnalystInParadise
(1,832 posts)cheaper energy costs and less reliance on Saudi oil are teh DEVILZ!!!!!!
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)And find another planet to rape pillage and destroy with slave labor no doubt.
The rest of us left on Earth will slowly choke to death while fox news assuredly tells us its all a left wing hoax.
Apparently we are too damn stupid to survive as a species for much longer.
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)I never saw the movie but that description sounds pretty familiar.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)It may just be prophetic is nothing changes real soon.
Science fiction today, reality in 20 years?
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)all this $#*! is about to come down on us so fast we won't have time to put up an umbrella! 
sammy750
(165 posts)If is all about more power and land grab from the people living where the pipe line will be laid. The GOP has constantly lied about the number of jobs created. But I hope Obama will veto any bills they pass.
RufusTFirefly
(8,812 posts)Pipeline Job Estimates Scrutinized
Global Labor Institute report disputes industry predictions
In Pipe Dreams? Jobs Gained, Jobs Lost by the Construction of Keystone XL, the institute says more jobs could be destroyed than created by the pipeline.
...
Sean Sweeney, director of the Cornell ILR Global Labor Institute, said today (Sept. 28, 2011)in an interview: "This report questions the jobs claims promoted by TransCanada Corporation, the American Petroleum Institute (API) and other proponents of the pipeline. The report's findings should generate a high level of skepticism regarding the value of KXL as an important source of American jobs."
...
"The industry's U.S. job claims, and even the State Department's analysis, are linked to a $7 billion Keystone XL project budget. However, the budget for Keystone XL that will have a bearing on U.S. jobs figures is dramatically lower – only around $3 to $4 billion. A lower budget means fewer jobs."
...
Overall, (Lara Skinner, associate director of research at the Cornell Global Labor Institute) said, "Keystone XL could kill more jobs than it creates. There are alternatives to this kind of dirty energy that, if supported, could create large numbers of jobs in the emerging green economy."
Source: Cornell University School of Industrial and Labor Relations
madville
(7,847 posts)Welders, equipment operators, truck drivers, surveyors, engineers, etc.
All construction jobs are temporary in nature though, when the project is over they move on to the next one, that's the case with any construction project.
sinkingfeeling
(57,835 posts)against FEMA aid to the areas ruined by its first rupture!
PSPS
(15,321 posts)
Tarheel_Dem
(31,454 posts)Perhaps it's time the people who blow off midterm elections see what can happen when you sit on the sidelines.
New High: 61% Favor Building the Keystone XL Pipeline
Wednesday, April 23, 2014
Support for building the Keystone XL pipeline is now at its highest level ever.
The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 61% of Likely U.S. Voters now at least somewhat favor building the major oil pipeline from Canada to Texas, while just 27% are opposed. This includes 37% who Strongly Favor the project and 10% who Strongly Oppose it. Thirteen percent (13%) are undecided. (To see survey question wording, click here.)
Support for building the pipeline is up four points from 57% in January and now has edged above the previous high of 60% found in November 2011 when President Obama first delayed the project for further environmental study.
Sixty-two percent (62%) believe it will be good for the U.S. economy if the pipeline is built. That’s up from 56% at the beginning of the year and also a new high. Unchanged are the 10% who think the pipeline will be bad for the economy. Twelve percent (12%) say it will have no impact, while 16% are not sure.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/april_2014/new_high_61_favor_building_the_keystone_xl_pipeline
Enrique
(27,461 posts)Tarheel_Dem
(31,454 posts) Enrique
(27,461 posts)like Obama did with the quarantines. You think presidents should pander like Chris Christie. I disagree:
The poll, from CBS News, shows a whopping 80 percent of people want American citizens and legal residents returning from West Africa to be quarantined until it is determined that they are Ebola-free. Another 17 percent think they should be allowed to enter the country if they are symptom-free at the time.
(...)
The White House struck a defiant tone on this issue on Wednesday, with Obama saying, "We don’t just react based on our fears. We react based on facts and judgment and making smart decisions."
Tarheel_Dem
(31,454 posts)indication of public opinion than an ass stompin' election (even a low turnout midterm), he's listening to the will of the people. But, when he goes against public opinion, he's showing leadership? 
Darb
(2,807 posts)I bet you do.
Doesn't matter a lick. My hope, although unlikely, is that Pres. Obama just says, "not on my watch".
Tarheel_Dem
(31,454 posts) Darb
(2,807 posts)We shouldn't be enabling the worse idea in human history. The Alberta Tar Sands will contribute mightily to the death of millions over the next 50 years, via famine, flood, pestilence, and most likely war on an unprecedented scale.
Well gee, let's poll the teabaggers on how they feel about it, they are well informed. And let's make sure we ask the oil companies too, they have no skin in the game. And let's not forget commodities speculators, and hell, all of Wall Street for that matter, they are unbiased. Hey, I got it, let's have fox news conduct the poll.
Public opinion doesn't matter. Science does, and sadly, our public is scientifically dimwitted.
http://oilsandstruth.org/tar-sands-101
hopemountain
(3,919 posts)bullshit.
truebrit71
(20,805 posts)..
NickB79
(20,354 posts)
7962
(11,841 posts)It depends upon what the GOP offers in return for a vote on the Pipeline. If Boehner and McConnell are willing to allow other votes - e.g. on minimum wage, immigration reform, and improvements to the ACA, then Democrats should cooperate. Obama's veto depends upon what the GOP offers in return.
ballyhoo
(2,060 posts)
sharp_stick
(14,400 posts)Talking with my family in Alberta it sounds like they're ready to just go it alone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_East_pipeline
Samantha
(9,314 posts)The pipeline still has to be approved by The President of the United States since it crosses an international border. Read the Constitution. Passing a Federal law does not cut it. But they will still try to do that, of course, and they will assume the American people do not know the procedure for approving a pipeline such as this.
Sam
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)So that he doesn't get viewed as the "obstructionist" by the ign'ant 'Muricans who think this is all about JOOOOOOOOOOOOBS. Obama is being effectively blackmailed into doing whatever the GOTP wants him to do. They've been salivating for this for a loooooooong time. And it basically can be summed up as "making that slave boy dance a whippin' jig."
------------------------------------
Dear Republicans:
You suck. Please go die in a fire.
Thank you,
The Tiny Subset of American People With an IQ in Positive Integers
Samantha
(9,314 posts)Additionally, the United States Government has treaties with native American tribes that would be violated if this treaty goes through. They have already made their objections known and are prepared to fight, literally, to keep this pipeline from violating their rights granted by these treaties.
Sam
malletgirl02
(1,523 posts)The Republicans will not take any of the blame for it going through and will say it is all Obama's fault. I will put money on that.
Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)on social media.
hollowdweller
(4,229 posts)I mean, to me, unless the company and the landowner agree on a price it's not free market right??
I mean taking some guys hayfield against his will and paying him "fair market value" as determined by the gov't how is that difft than a socialist country??
Certainly more worthy of wingnuts and militias ire than a rancher who is grazing on gov't land?
Betty
(1,352 posts)For the pipeline and see how much they like "eminent domain".
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)If it's good for rich white guys and pisses off the heathen Gaia-worshiping tree fuckers, it's not "communism." 
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)Thus, the headline reads: "GOP has votes to pass Kidney Stone". 
TwilightGardener
(46,416 posts)No use hand-wringing over it.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)
okieinpain
(9,397 posts)refineries by truck. i guess cleaning up one spilt truck load would be easier then cleaning up a pipeline spill. but if you guys are upset about them using this oil well you're too late. you're probably putting it in your gas tank already.
CaliforniaPeggy
(156,619 posts)It will, once refined, go onto the world markets and be sold overseas. We will not profit from it in any way. And we take most of the risk.
okieinpain
(9,397 posts)our states by thousands of truck loads. so pick your poison.
brett_jv
(1,245 posts)That oil was never staying in the ground anyway, pipeline or no. And a pipeline is better than shipping it in trucks or by rail, in pretty much every possible regard. The pipeline is almost certainly going to have minimal (or even positive) impact on global warming in the end.
The thing that's most frustrating about it is just people's STUPIDITY w/regards to WHY it's being built. Canada wants it so that they can sell/ship their now-land-locked (meaning ... the US is a main consumer, due to existing obstacles to shipping) oil ALL OVER THE WORLD ... whilst the people that 'support' the pipeline have been sold on the idea that it's going to INCREASE the 'energy independence' of the USA, and lower gas prices. Fact it, it will DO NOTHING OF THE SORT. IT WILL FACILITATE SHIPPING OF N. AMERICAN OIL ALL OVER THE WORLD. IOW, IT DOES THE OPPOSITE YOU FRIGGIN' IMBECILES.
But since people apparently WANT to be stupid imbeciles ... I say f*** it, build the damn pipeline. I'm way more concerned with things like SS and Medicare and the right to choice and not sending our kids off to die in foreign wars, things of that nature. Keystone Pipeline or no, it won't affect me or mine. Those other things that teh GOP win could jeopardize ... MIGHT.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)You do know that Earth is STILL our only home. We need to not build the Keystone XL pipeline, and end our use of fossil fuels NOW, or there will be no need for things like Social Security and/or Medicare. The Human Race will be lucky to survive if our environment is made any worse by these corporations whose only concern is profits.
kansasobama
(1,750 posts)The BIG Cry was it was bipartisan. Unfortunately, Dems who supported it lost. So, now, President could veto it since it is partisan.
Odin2005
(53,521 posts)Gas prices are low here because of the glut of oil from Alberta, if the pipeline is built the glut will no longer exist and so prices will rise.
MurryMom
(107 posts)Gas prices will also rise if more Canadian oil is exported via Houston, thereby reducing supplies in North America.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)
Ampersand Unicode
(503 posts)So that they can point to their book of fairy tales and say "SEE? WE TOLD YOU SO!!!11!!"
They basically want to make Revelation a self-fulfilling prophecy. Don't count out the close ties that the Jesus-freak faction of the GOP has with the big-business/fossil-fuel conglomerate arm.
Darb
(2,807 posts)right on the head.
Alberta Tar Sands is the biggest mistake in the history of mankind.
father founding
(619 posts)You need 60 votes to pass anything in the senate.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)There are Democrats and Republicans who support it.
Darb
(2,807 posts)Hopefully.
Tarheel_Dem
(31,454 posts) Darb
(2,807 posts)but the actual vote on a bill has always been 51 to win. Over-riding a veto is 67 (two-thirds, both houses), however, and is written into the constitution, that cannot be changed except by extreme measures and a couple years time.
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)I thought you were talking about cloture. Well they'd only have to get another 7. It's probably not going to happen, but it's possible.
Darb
(2,807 posts)the biggest folly in the history of mankind. The combination of razing the arboreal forest, burning billions of barrels of oil to do it, burning billions more barrels to dig up the tar sands, using trillions of gallons of fresh water in the production process, leaving square mile after square mile of polluted retaining ponds (inland seas, actually) behind, and then, on top of that, burning the finished product up in cars and trucks, is without doubt, the dumbest possible thing that humans could be doing given our current climate reality.
I bow down to the might of this stupidity.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)That's what I don't get about the anti-pipeline push: nobody has ever come up with an argument that without the pipeline, less oil will end up getting extracted.
Isn't this just a question of the same amount of oil being moved through Point A rather than Point B.
One_Life_To_Give
(6,036 posts)When you have multiple offers of employment one can choose where and upon what to work. When the economy is still poor you take whatever you can find. Likewise for many Dem Senators the choice is for the lesser of two evils.
Darb
(2,807 posts)I guess one evil is keystone, which is a ridiculous canard besides being an evil, but what is the other supposedly greater evil?
One_Life_To_Give
(6,036 posts)Mortgage payments and food on the table are powerful motivators. When your constituents are unemployed/under-employed the wise representative pays attention.
Darb
(2,807 posts)then what 50 going forward?
The jobs increase is a canard. Negligible effect. Greening our economy would create millions.
Your reasoning doesn't hold water. Billion dollar giveaway for realistically a minimal amount of jobs and a disaster for the climate.
No thanks.
One_Life_To_Give
(6,036 posts)While it's better to have atleast a job. Minimum wage doesn't really work to keep making those mortgage payments. Especially the mortgage one undertook when they had a substantially better paying job before.
WASHINGTON — The deep recession wiped out primarily high-wage and middle-wage jobs. Yet the strongest employment growth during the sluggish recovery has been in low-wage work, at places like strip malls and fast-food restaurants.
In essence, the poor economy has replaced good jobs with bad ones. That is the conclusion of a new report from the National Employment Law Project, a research and advocacy group, analyzing employment trends four years into the recovery.
“Fast food is driving the bulk of the job growth at the low end
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/28/business/economy/recovery-has-created-far-more-low-wage-jobs-than-better-paid-ones.html?_r=0
Darb
(2,807 posts)Last edited Fri Nov 7, 2014, 07:46 PM - Edit history (1)
that is your business. And your delusion. Lots of jobs have been created, some low wage, some not. That article is from last April, 6 months ago, the economy has created around 1.2 million jobs since then. Are you saying that all those jobs cannot pay a mortgage?
10,000 temporary construction jobs is jack diddley squat in the grand scheme of things. It is not a good argument for enabling the destruction of our way of life via climate change. Any questions?
http://oilsandstruth.org/tar-sands-101
RiverLover
(7,830 posts)
polynomial
(750 posts)We need clean water!
Jackpine Radical
(45,274 posts)There would have been no veto.
vi5
(13,305 posts)Don't they still need 4 Dems to reach 60?
I mean it's a given that the President won't veto it, but don't they still need Dems to break ranks?
What are the chances of that happening? 
c588415
(285 posts)Keystone will not pass, and repeal of Obama Care will remain intact. With that said, I predict in 2016 that Hillary will be our next president, and the GOP will lose both houses to the Dem's.
Screw the GOP
flamingdem
(40,891 posts)
quadrature
(2,049 posts)cleaner air?
fewer trucks on the roads?
fewer railroad accidents?
more jobs?
edit
cleaner oceans, less shipping?
daleo
(21,317 posts)Thus accelerating global warming. Unlocks a vast reservoir of money, for fossil fuel corporations to buy politicians and undermine democracy.
Darb
(2,807 posts)to provide you some material that might make you rethink that question.
http://oilsandstruth.org/tar-sands-101
adigal
(7,581 posts)
Cha
(319,072 posts)their future.. shame on the ones who were selfish.. not giving our Planet a first or second thought.
KinMd
(966 posts)would have any idea what the Keystone Pipeline was.
kelliekat44
(7,759 posts)
eringer
(529 posts)The GOP will be doing the Democrats a favor when they railroad through approval of the pipeline. There is no upside for them. First, the Keystone XL pipeline no longer becomes a political football. Second, when it ruptures and destroys the environment, the GOP will get all the blame. Sounds good to me.
Vinca
(53,994 posts)Maybe the challenges will stop it until sane people are elected again. Or not. I'm beginning to wonder why I should worry about the purity of red state water if they don't care and continue to elect Republicans.
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)It is already built, even Canada doesn't care to refine that sludge. Have ANY of the state govs said 'no'?
The permit process is Federal, will the permits be approved by the EPA new greenhouse gas limits?
Refining that sludge-crap to kerosene is a very, very, dirty air process. Hope they check those permits for Corp. fibbing about how much greenhouse gas.