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DBoon

(22,356 posts)
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 12:05 PM Dec 2021

NYT: Behind Low Vaccination Rates Lurks a More Profound Social Weakness

Over the past four decades, governments have slashed budgets and privatized basic services. This has two important consequences for public health. First, people are unlikely to trust institutions that do little for them. And second, public health is no longer viewed as a collective endeavor, based on the principle of social solidarity and mutual obligation. People are conditioned to believe they’re on their own and responsible only for themselves. That means an important source of vaccine hesitancy is the erosion of the idea of a common good.

...

Americans began thinking about health care decisions this way only recently; during the 1950s polio campaigns, for example, most people saw vaccination as a civic duty. But as the public purse shrunk in the 1980s, politicians insisted that it’s no longer the government’s job to ensure people’s well-being; instead, Americans were to be responsible only for themselves and their own bodies. Entire industries, such as self-help and health foods, have sprung up on the principle that the key to good health lies in individuals making the right choices.

...

Of course, there’s a lot of good that comes from viewing health care decisions as personal choices: No one wants to be subjected to procedures against their wishes. But there are problems with reducing public health to a matter of choice. It gives the impression that individuals are wholly responsible for their own health. This is despite growing evidence that health is deeply influenced by factors outside our control; public health experts now talk about the “social determinants of health,” the idea that personal health is never simply just a reflection of individual lifestyle choices, but also the class people are born into, the neighborhood they grew up in and the race they belong to.

...

Research shows that private systems not only tend to produce worse health outcomes than public ones, but privatization creates what public health experts call “segregated care,” which can undermine the feelings of social solidarity that are critical for successful vaccination drives. In one Syrian city, for example, the health care system now consists of one public hospital so underfunded that it is notorious for poor care, a few private hospitals offering high-quality care that are unaffordable to most of the population, and many unlicensed and unregulated private clinics — some even without medical doctors — known to offer misguided health advice. Under such conditions, conspiracy theories can flourish; many of the city’s residents believe Covid vaccines are a foreign plot.


https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/03/opinion/vaccine-hesitancy-covid.html

Yes there is a paywall. Unfortunately, while lies are free, truth costs money.
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NYT: Behind Low Vaccination Rates Lurks a More Profound Social Weakness (Original Post) DBoon Dec 2021 OP
This is why I am against means testing for universal healthcare benefits Walleye Dec 2021 #1
absolutely! rurallib Dec 2021 #19
Yes, yes and yes. FDR knew what he was doing there Walleye Dec 2021 #20
Here's a link with no paywall teach1st Dec 2021 #2
R's want people to be free to "make their own decisions" about healthcare Freddie Dec 2021 #3
And they don't seem to get that without ACCESS to healthcare viva la Dec 2021 #5
to be commended for digging a bit beneath the surface stopdiggin Dec 2021 #4
Yet the right worships him.... SergeStorms Dec 2021 #11
while I loath RR, and just about everything he said or stood for - stopdiggin Dec 2021 #16
"in the 1980s, politicians insisted that it's no longer the government's job" PSPS Dec 2021 #6
Yes, that concept of A Common Good seems to be disappearing. Biophilic Dec 2021 #7
Also, when public health is not available to people/resources are cut, they CharleyDog Dec 2021 #8
Aw Yes, The Reagan Years DallasNE Dec 2021 #9
Install a chrome extension to disable JavaScript. It's like magic zaj Dec 2021 #10
"Since the 1980s" wryter2000 Dec 2021 #12
Actually, truth be known, DENVERPOPS Dec 2021 #13
You're right. Mr.Bill Dec 2021 #15
We here in Colorado DENVERPOPS Dec 2021 #18
Nothing rations healthcare better than profit motive... Wounded Bear Dec 2021 #14
they have carbohydrate brains too and can't think straight bucolic_frolic Dec 2021 #17
This issue goes WAY WAY back further than that BumRushDaShow Dec 2021 #21
Early 70's. We lined up at my primary school for rubella vaccinations... paleotn Dec 2021 #22
Link without paywall SouthBayDem Dec 2021 #23

rurallib

(62,406 posts)
19. absolutely!
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 02:57 PM
Dec 2021

One of the reasons Social Security is so successful is that everybody gets it.

Means testing turns a program into 'welfare' and all the attacks on that segment.

Freddie

(9,259 posts)
3. R's want people to be free to "make their own decisions" about healthcare
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 12:32 PM
Dec 2021

Unless you’re female, then you get no choice but to be a brood mare.

viva la

(3,286 posts)
5. And they don't seem to get that without ACCESS to healthcare
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 12:46 PM
Dec 2021

There is no choice.
uninsured people don't have a choice of health care providers, treatment, therapy, procedures, security.

Fortunately, now finally they do have a choice (most people) to get insured. But the Republicans would love to strip that choice away, along with women's right to choose reproductive health.

stopdiggin

(11,296 posts)
4. to be commended for digging a bit beneath the surface
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 12:45 PM
Dec 2021

something we don't always get ...

(the 'bootstraps' dogma - along with the accompanying 'takers' and 'welfare queen' propaganda - have sewn the seeds of our unraveling as fellow citizens and caretakers. Ronald Reagan, the bumbling tool of the selfish rich - and his eager apparatchiks - deserves every contempt that history chooses to bestow upon him.)

SergeStorms

(19,193 posts)
11. Yet the right worships him....
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 01:57 PM
Dec 2021

or at least they used to. Now they have a new golden, fatted calf, one who makes Ronnie Rayguns look like Chairman Mao.

Interesting that the NYT mentions "the 80s" as the turning point in U.S. healthcare, but doesn't lay it at the feet of Rayguns and his right-wing cronies.

Yes, the NYT is such a "liberal" news agency.

stopdiggin

(11,296 posts)
16. while I loath RR, and just about everything he said or stood for -
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 02:38 PM
Dec 2021

if you're approaching this from the other side, it's hard to argue that he didn't deliver, and deliver big, for his camp. Similarly - even those on the right that were repelled by his character and behavior (particularly the Evangelicals) are absolutely giddy with joy that Trump delivered (and delivered big) in terms of a supreme court that is solidly, militantly, conservative - for the next 30 years. So, yes - these two figures spelled 'Christmas' for those on that side of the spectrum.

(I don't label the NYTimes as a liberal news source - and I don't particularly wish them to be. On the other hand, I have a hard time seeing a lot of the, supposed, 'bias' heading in the opposing direction either. I suppose it's a matter of perception.)

PSPS

(13,591 posts)
6. "in the 1980s, politicians insisted that it's no longer the government's job"
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 01:01 PM
Dec 2021

Gee, I wonder who started that ball rolling and, eventually, started the destruction of the country after conspiring with terrorists to get elected president.

Biophilic

(3,645 posts)
7. Yes, that concept of A Common Good seems to be disappearing.
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 01:09 PM
Dec 2021

At first, it seemed to be doing so slowly, then steadily, and now rapidly. How can we connect with people who don't believe that all of us are important. Their silly 'all lives matter' flags and signs don't mean what they say. Only a few lives matter for these people. What happened to the pioneer spirit of all of us working together for the common good? All of the characters that John Wayne played would be appalled. And I hate John Wayne. I think the common good disappeared when the repugs realized they could have it all and not have to share any of it if they worked things right. I grew up with the myth of the common good, I took pride in it and I miss it.

CharleyDog

(757 posts)
8. Also, when public health is not available to people/resources are cut, they
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 01:25 PM
Dec 2021

turn to "home remedies" as that is all they have. Cue the pandemic, lack of options (at first), lack of trust, leadership that stokes "us against them" (trump's philosophy) people turn to magic cures: bleach, H202, Ivermectin, and now dirt.

DENVERPOPS

(8,810 posts)
13. Actually, truth be known,
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 02:16 PM
Dec 2021

Reagan was just the front man.

It was HWBush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Pearle/Wolfowitz etc that were running the show in the shadows....
Same as in the HW administration, and most definitely the EXACT same people in "W's" administration........

Some of us began screaming what was happening when Regan's boys committed Treason to "appoint" Reagan President.
Same exact thing with 2000 and 2004. Most just voted and then went home and immersed themselves in their own personal lives and did nothing to observe what was happening.

A perfect title of a book about the last 40+ years would be: WHILE THE NATION SLEPT

Mr.Bill

(24,282 posts)
15. You're right.
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 02:35 PM
Dec 2021

Reagan was just the carnival barker for people who wanted us to think that the government can't do anything right.

Except for spending trillions of dollars on weapons that will never be used.

DENVERPOPS

(8,810 posts)
18. We here in Colorado
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 02:56 PM
Dec 2021

know all about those weapons.......Rocky Flats, The Rocky Mountain Arsenal.

And then there is the matter of the 50K of mustard gas bombs currently sitting in the Pueblo Arsenal, just corroding away.
Chemical Weapons that were manufactured and stockpiled despite the Geneva Convention....?????????????????

There are countless sites across the nation that are in the same situation........
I sure wouldn't live in Portland Oregon, just downstream from the Hanaford? weapons plant. In my mind, that would be the number one worry. Nothing much is being done as far as cleanup there and the gigantic storage containers are finally rusting away and leaking.....

I often think that all the volcanoes, earthquakes, fires, climate changes, global warming, floods, etc are Mother Nature's way of saying enough is enough. You humans are not respecting my planet earth, and she has decided to get even.......

BumRushDaShow

(128,857 posts)
21. This issue goes WAY WAY back further than that
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 03:09 PM
Dec 2021
The 1793 Yellow Fever Epidemic: The Washingtons, Hamilton and Jefferson
May 28, 2020 by Neely Tucker


In December 1793, Martha Washington bought a new book by Mathew Carey called A Short Account of the Malignant Fever Lately Prevalent in Philadelphia. The following February she bought a similar title, A Short Account of the Yellow Fever in Philadelphia, for the Reflecting Christian, by Henry Helmuth. Her interest was personal. In the summer of 1793 when a devastating yellow fever epidemic hit Philadelphia she was in the city, then the U.S. capital, as the wife of the president. Carey, a publisher and bookseller, was also there. He joined a committee that helped the poor and sick who stayed behind when the wealthy fled. The Rev. Helmuth stayed to care for his congregants. The Washingtons remained in Philadelphia through the summer, but on Sept. 10 they left, as did nearly every member of city, state, and national government.

(snip)

Secretary of State Thomas Jefferson wrote: “It is called a yellow fever, but is like nothing known or read of by the Physicians. The week before last the deaths were about 40. the last week about 80. and this week I think they will be 200. and it goes on spreading.” Carey described how “acquaintances and friends avoided each other in the streets, and only signified their regard by a cold nod. The old custom of shaking hands fell into such disuse, that many were affronted at even the offer of the hand.” Carey estimated that out of a population of 50,000, about 17,000 left the city and 4,000 died. Later estimates put the death total as high as 5,000.

(snip)

The president, at home at Mount Vernon, described Philadelphia as “now almost depopulated by removals & deaths.” Thomas Jefferson commented snidely about treasury secretary Alexander Hamilton, who was sick with the fever: “A man as timid as he is on the water, as timid on horseback, as timid in sickness, would be a phaenomenon if the courage of which he has the reputation in military occasions were genuine.” Politics filtered into debates about yellow fever. “Contagionists” were likely to be Federalists who advocated restored trade with Britain and feared revolutionary France. They believed that yellow fever arrived on ships with refugees from France and its West Indian possessions. Pro-French Republicans, meanwhile, believed yellow fever was not contagious and that its causes were local.

Public officials, uncertain what to do, ordered quarantine and sanitation. Philadelphia’s free black citizens, including church leaders Absalom Jones and Richard Allen, were forced to fight back prejudice during the epidemic. Doctors were divided about treatment. Rush favored purging and bloodletting, while David Hosack and Edward Stevens, physician friends of Alexander Hamilton, believed in a milder treatment of quinine, wine and cold baths. Rush, whose methods were controversial, sighed, “I shall sooner or later be believed and forgiven.”

https://blogs.loc.gov/loc/2020/05/the-1793-yellow-fever-epidemic-the-washingtons-hamilton-and-jefferson/


Here's the house located in Germantown that the Washingtons fled to in 1793 & 1794 to get away from the epidemic (and summer heat) -



The house is still there and Germantown became a neighborhood in Philly, incorporated in 1854 when the "outer boroughs and townships" were folded into the city proper.

So the idea of "everyone for themselves" predates anything that we might think as some time period when suddenly America didn't care about public health. Any purported societal "collectivism" for care of the sick and poor never really existed except for a brief period when it wasn't automatically pawned off to religious institutions. So sadly, what we see today, is "as American as apple pie".

paleotn

(17,911 posts)
22. Early 70's. We lined up at my primary school for rubella vaccinations...
Sat Dec 4, 2021, 03:12 PM
Dec 2021

No kids that I knew of opted out. There was no screaming or wild hysterics at school board meetings. No one protested vaccinations in front of the school. Rubella was a killer and we all needed to be vaccinated. Of course, ideas of the common good and mutual obligation were strong in our parents, seeing as they survived the Great Depression, WW2, etc., etc., along with polio and a host of other diseases that proved preventable through collective efforts.

Sometimes I feel like we've all been transported to a world filled with nothing but selfish assholes. Thanks Ronnie Raygun and the rest of your neo-libertarian psychos. Great job, Republiscum.

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