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(3,845 posts)
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 07:29 PM Nov 2023

There's an existential crisis among conservative Evangelicals and the rhetoric of Trumpism is making it worse.


The falling away from the Christian gospel that has plagued conservative Evangelicals in the United States for quite some time did not originate with Trump. It was Ronald Reagan, running against the openly born-again Jimmy Carter, who invited Evangelicals into the GOP, via several prominent leaders, including Evangelist James Robison, and the now infamous Jerry Falwell. Evangelicals who went along with this traded their first love for worldly, political power which was an admission that they didn't really believe there was anything to the spiritual power upon which they once claimed to rely.

And it just keeps getting worse. The agenda he has laid out is as anti-Christian as it is anti-Patriotic and anti-American. It's fascist, no denying that. And the bigotry that drips from the rhetoric is a denial of the very nature of God and of the gospel message of Jesus Christ. As the Apostle Jude wrote, in his short but to-the-point epistle near the end of the New Testament, Trump is an intruder who has stolen in among the church, introducing licentiousness and perverting the grace of Jesus Christ.

"But these people slander whatever they do not understand, and they are destroyed by those things that, like irrational animals, they know by instinct...These are blemishes on your love feasts, while they feast with you without fear, feeding themselves. They are waterless clouds, carried along by the winds; autumn trees without fruit, twice dead, uprooted; wild waves of the sea, casting up the foam of their own shame; wandering stars for whom the deepest darkness has been reserved forever." Jude 10, 12-13, NRSV

Though these verses aren't a specific prophecy for our time, they are certainly prophetic in terms of being an accurate description of Trumpism, and of Trump, and should be heeded by any sincere Christian as a warning to stay away and not be associated with this apostasy in any way.
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There's an existential crisis among conservative Evangelicals and the rhetoric of Trumpism is making it worse. (Original Post) lees1975 Nov 2023 OP
Aww. 2naSalit Nov 2023 #1
I grew up in an Evangelical family. Girard442 Nov 2023 #2
And they completely miss the point where Jesus turns all of that Old Testament violence around. lees1975 Nov 2023 #13
Trump's Christians/evangelicals are the public face of Christianity in America today. keithbvadu2 Nov 2023 #3
And they brought it on themselves . . . hatrack Nov 2023 #4
Wait! bigmonk Nov 2023 #5
K & R - recommended FakeNoose Nov 2023 #6
This started well before Falwell during Nixon's presidentcy. Billy Graham flashman13 Nov 2023 #7
True, but it was Reagan that gave the Christofascists real political power. catbyte Nov 2023 #9
Please do. These creeps need as much exposure as possible. erronis Nov 2023 #10
... catbyte Nov 2023 #8
They don't do what Jesus told them surfered Nov 2023 #11
Screw them all - yesterday, today and forever. dchill Nov 2023 #12
This needs to be exposed. lees1975 Nov 2023 #14


(6,066 posts)
2. I grew up in an Evangelical family.
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 08:03 PM
Nov 2023

More and more I'm convinced that for Evangelicals, Jesus is just Santa Claus for slightly older children. The Yahweh of the OT who cast Adam and Eve out of the Garden, drowned the Earth and nearly every living thing on it, burned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah with everyone in them, drowned Pharaoh and his soldiers when the battle was already won, and tortured Job to win a wager with Satan is the one they love.

They're just into tormenting and smiting, and damning to eternal Hellfire.


(3,845 posts)
13. And they completely miss the point where Jesus turns all of that Old Testament violence around.
Tue Nov 28, 2023, 12:30 AM
Nov 2023

Last edited Tue Nov 28, 2023, 02:59 PM - Edit history (1)

In Matthew 5:17, he claims to be the fulfillment of the law and prophets, which effectively ends theocracy and the old covenant.

His Sermon on the Mount starts with the characteristics found in the Beatitudes. Where among those words do you find anything descriptive of the Chrstian fascists who surround and support Trump?

All through this narrative, which is actually a cumulative record of his preaching, he turns the old covenant around by saying, "You have heard that is was said...but I say unto you...

Blessed are the peacemakers for they shall be called the children of God.

If anyone says "I love God," but hates his brother, he is a liar. for he who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has ot seen. And this commandment we have from God. Whoever loves God must also love his brother.

And so on.........

He got crucified for that.

Whatever you want to call it, Trumpism, American Fascism, Christofascism, Christian Nationalism, does not, in any of its attributes or positions, exhibit one grain of any virtue or character of true Christianity. So Christians have no business whatsoever being loyal to, supporting or voting for Trump. That is, by Biblical definition, apostasy.


(36,707 posts)
3. Trump's Christians/evangelicals are the public face of Christianity in America today.
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 08:03 PM
Nov 2023

My fellow Christians, support me; your savior, your Messiah, sent to you by God.

And they certainly do support him.


(32,604 posts)
6. K & R - recommended
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 08:43 PM
Nov 2023

Read this OP link to the end. It's not long and it's very enlightening! This writer gets it.


(657 posts)
7. This started well before Falwell during Nixon's presidentcy. Billy Graham
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 09:04 PM
Nov 2023

dove into politics via Nixon with great gusto. I have never understood why Billy gets a pass as being something other than a right wing nut evangelical. Look at the monster of Franklin Graham sired by Billy. I'm fairly sure Frank learned his bigotry at the old man's knee. Billy was always a wing nut, but he was savvy enough to know that the greater American public would not accept explicit bigotry. He really hit the big one when he became Nixon's preacher/muse. He became a regular in the White House. Graham really liked being close to power. He liked the power of being America's most loved preacher.

I'll tell you my Billy Graham story in a later post.


(34,354 posts)
9. True, but it was Reagan that gave the Christofascists real political power.
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 09:40 PM
Nov 2023

Before Reagan, they were just a convenient voting bloc that they pandered to during election years and then forgot after the elections. He kowtowed to Jerry Falwell and the rest of them and authorized faith-based programs within the federal government. Nixon was chummy with Billy Graham, but the rise of the Religious Right gathered momentum during the Carter Administration. They were the religious form of the Tea Party during the Obama tears because they objected to his "liberal" views. They really got a foothold and were emboldened thanks to another completely irreligious President, Reagan, which is so ironic. Once they got their foot in the door, nothing stopped them and we're dealing with the terrible fallout today.


(483 posts)
11. They don't do what Jesus told them
Mon Nov 27, 2023, 09:50 PM
Nov 2023

Jesus told them to “welcome the stranger.”
Many want to build a wall and put razor wire on buoys in the Rio Grande.
Jesus said, “sell everything you own, give it to the poor and follow me.”
Many subscribe to a prosperity gospel.
Jesus said to “care for the sick.”
Many of them prevent the expansion of Medicaid.
They think homosexuality is an abomination, but so is eating shell fish.

It’s all about believing…a faith without works, which is meaningless.



(3,845 posts)
14. This needs to be exposed.
Tue Nov 28, 2023, 11:35 AM
Nov 2023

There are people out there doing this. Democrats need to find a way to neutralize this group as a voting constituency for Trump. It may come down to just putting out enough of this kind of information to keep a lot of them home on election day, or discourage them into voting third party. Frankly, I believe an argument could be made to convince them to vote Democratic, though their lock-in to single issue politics, on abortion rights and LGBTQ rights is an obstacle.

There's an appalling, and I mean appalling, level of ignorance among members of conservative churches about doctrine and practice of Christian faith. And support for Republicans has become a doctrinal point of practice for many people. And there are people in some of these churches, especially if the pastor is a rabid, right-wing extremist who sees government as a way to impose religion on those who don't accept it by conscience, who are more than willing to ignore the Christian values which make gentleness and respect primary principles of practice. But there are enough who can be convinced not to contribute to the dismantling of American freedom just because some people who are free make decisions they don't like.

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