What "tolerance" really means

[Bgno64]

Gil Smart at Smart Remarks:

There's a dodge at the heart of all this complaining about "tolerance," and it's this: Implicitly, but often explicitly, those who complain that their anti-gay views aren't tolerated argue that gay marriage should remain illegal.

In other words, one class of citizens shouldn't have the same rights that are accorded to everyone else.

So ultimately the argument boils down to this: You're not respecting our right to limit other people's rights.

That kind of subverts the whole idea of "tolerance" in the first place, turning it into a Trojan horse for revanchism.

I will say this for the Phil Robertsons of the world. I don't agree with him, and I believe that there's a fear and hatred that lies at the core of what he had to say.

But he absolutely has the right to think it and say it. This being America, he even has the right to agitate for a government that reflects those beliefs.

Just as I, or you, have the right to try to elect politicians that will bury that idea in the past, where it belongs.

My saying that, however, does not make me "intolerant" of Robertson's views. That's not what "tolerance" is. Tolerance isn't about respecting everyone's ideas and never arguing with them.

Rather, tolerance says that whatever you think about a person's race or creed or lifestyle, you are willing — even eager — to ensure that person has the same rights and opportunities as everyone else.

Tolerance is the belief that prejudice has no place in law, that some groups shouldn't be favored over other groups, whatever the dividing line.

It means that you say what you say, you think what you think and live how you want, and I won't be over here trying to make it illegal. I will accept your right to be different. Your way won't necessarily be my way; it might, in fact, be utterly foreign to me, and it might be impossible for me to accept as the moral equivalent of my own ways. But so long as your way doesn't threaten my rights — I won't threaten yours.

[daleanime]

1. Big K&R...

[cinnabonbon]

2. So true.

I mean, how often have we heard "but you aren't tolerating my views?!" when people are being racist, sexist or homophobic. It's like people forget why tolerance is needed in the first place.

So ultimately the argument boils down to this: You're not respecting our right to limit other people's rights.

I love this one. Spot on.

[RC]

3. The crux of the problem

It means that you say what you say, you think what you think and live how you want, and I won't be over here trying to make it illegal. I will accept your right to be different. Your way won't necessarily be my way; it might, in fact, be utterly foreign to me, and it might be impossible for me to accept as the moral equivalent of my own ways. But so long as your way doesn't threaten my rights — I won't threaten yours.

We have too many people, even right here on DU, trying to make others conform to their view of the world.
People with their own confuse definition of tolerance, trying to impose their will on others in the name of tolerance. That is not tolerance. That, more than likely, is just plain bullying on the part of an intolerant person, who thinks they are being tolerant by trying to change others.

[The_Commonist]

4. I was discussing "tolerance" with an intolerant one once a few years ago.

I said "I don't think that word means what you think it means." His reply was, quite literally, "Oh yeah? Well what does it mean, smartypants?"

I said "Hang on a second, let me get to the computer and find an online dictionary." He said "Yeah, don't fucking bother, asshole!" and walked away.

I figured I'd won that round.

[modrepub]

5. To Me

the whole religious argument against gay marriage is bogus. Marriage is, at its heart ,a contractual agreement between two parties. IMO it outdates the christian faith and exists outside of it so it can not be limited by arguments based on faith. Besides, when a marriage is dissolved it's done so mostly outside of the church (in the courts).

Most of the opposition from the ultra religious is based (on the fear) that allowing unholy unions will eventually be punished by God. Fear of this type of "God looking the other way when his followers wander from the true faith" punishment can be found in the Old Testament.

[Delmette]

6. My 87 year old Mother said...

that she couldn't approve of her gay nephew (60+ years old). I told her she didn't have to approve, just accept him for who he is. I think that is part of tolerance, also.