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Related: About this forumDuckhunter935
(16,974 posts)Secret lists that you have no due process, are arbitrary on how you get on and impossible to get removed from.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)The man who shot up The Pulse was taken off that list by the FBI. I don't think it's impossible to challenge your place on the list. But letting terrorists or even potential terrorists inside the US buy weapons is absolutely insane.
People with serious mental health issues cannot buy guns. What happened to their civil rights?
Civil rights are just dandy, but they should not be used to let possibly dangerous people have access to guns, whether it's a mental health assessment, a felon (especially someone who has murdered before), or an FBI terrorist watch list.
This last guy from Orlando was interviewed, investigated and removed from the terrorist watch list, because they did not find enough evidence to indicate he was a potential terrorist. And GOP is worried about some people arbitrarily being put on the watch list? How do the rights to buy a gun for those few people compare to the civil rights of people killed or injured in a terrorist attack compare? Do you think that maybe it's better to inconvenience a few to save the many from death or serious injury?
What about people who end up being executed for a crime they did not commit? They had more than their 2nd amendment rights taken away. but that's OK with the GOP and even a lot of people here, because they don't want to give up the opportunity to kill someone that pisses them off.
Yes..we do make mistakes in the name of safety. Like Cenk said, let's work on trying not to make those mistakes, instead of allowing potential terrorists in the US to buy weapons.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)You can not find out if you are on a list.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)How nice you are so concerned about the 2nd amendment rights of (how many? We will never know.), while innocents are slaughtered by weapons that can still legally be purchased by people on the terror watch list, who might actually end up being terrorists.
They aren't just pulled out of a hat, you know. There does have to be a reason to put them on the list. And apparently, you have to do a lot of sketchy stuff to be kept on the terror watch list. I mean this last guy had red flags...too many red flags and they still took him off.
But let's worry about the "How many?" "We will never know".
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)and it will be far worse under a republican administration.
Red Knight
(704 posts)Especially on a Democratic website.
If we are that concerned with the rights of the 2 percent let's just abandon all lists--no-fly lists-whatever.
Let's take no action whatsoever.
We'll just let Carly Fiorina keep praying.
I agree about fixing the problem so that we can cut down on mistakes. But to flush the program because a few people are mistakenly put on the list is insane.
If Democrats feel that way--I don't know what to say. I'm thinking I really don't know this party sometimes.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)And BLM that end up on these secret Bush lists that have no legal recourse to fight being put on those lists. Sad people here do not believe in innocent until proven guilty and due process of law. That scares me.
I agree, fix the list, than I would support them.
passiveporcupine
(8,175 posts)for hanging onto the "constitutional right" for everyone in America to buy a deadly weapon like a gun.
The empathy for those killed by guns astounds me.
I am done here. Waste of time. Not the time to be defending guns at all...think of the people mourning right now and give it a rest.
Duckhunter935
(16,974 posts)Ensure we put the resources to ensure the lists are accurate, have appropriate oversight and an appeal process. Due process needs to be respected. Do this and I will have no big deal with it. For now the system should at least flag on a weapon purchase if a person is on the list and alert the FBI.
paleotn
(17,912 posts)...just think of the profits they'd be leaving on the table!