Help me create the perfect Vegan Burger!!!

[Taverner]

The Boca and Morningstar options are like cardboard, without the nice cardboard flavor.

WHAT would you do to make a perfect Vegan Burger?

[hack89]

1. I would start with ground sirloin

and add a tomato slice to make it healthy

[ohiosmith]

9. Agree, but add some pork fat and hold the tomatoe.

[baldguy]

19. +1

The term "vegan burger" is an oxymoron.

[Bucky]

24. Unless you're talking about a German small landowner.

No, wait. "Vegan German" is also probably a contradiction.

[A Simple Game]

26. And onion, lettuce, and mayo. n/t

[rug]

2. Bacon.

I know.

I don't care.

Bacon.

[siligut]

3. Brown rice, portabello mushrooms, tempeh, garlic, onion . . .

What would you use to bind it? People seem to like black bean burgers too. I think tempeh has a meatish texture and the mushrooms add a hearty, earthy taste, brown rice has a rich, nutty texture. Also, soy sauce adds depth of flavor.

I like Morningstar Grillers, they feel and taste the most like meat burgers to me.

[siligut]

4. You have to have a soft, fresh bun, a slice of onion, pickle chips, yellow mustard and ketchup too

Lettuce shreds are also important as is a nice slice of tomato. Using a charcoal grill helps add meaty flavor to a veggie burger patty, but you have to get it to bind together so it won't fall apart and drop onto the coals.

[CBGLuthier]

5. Forget the entire concept and eat something else

Not a fan of faux food. Why bother when there are tons of things that taste good as they are on bread without trying to imitate meat.

We would rather make some nice tortas with refried black beans and avocado slices than try to fake a burger.

But if you insist I would start with Bulgur wheat.

[siligut]

6. I wonder if it would work if you ground up sticky rice and then cooked it

And then mixed it in with the ground mushrooms and tempeh to bind it. I agree, there are plenty of wonderful vegetarian dishes, but sometimes you just want a burger.

[pokerfan]

10. This recipe looks like a lot of work

But it looks reasonable:

an easy to make mix for homemade veggie burgers that taste out of this world
Ingredients

1/2 cup dried chickpeas
1/2 cup dried black beans
1/2 c dried red lentils
1/4 cup peanuts
1/4 cup almonds
1/2 cup sunflower seeds
1/2 cup sesame seeds
1/2 cup old fashioned oats
1/2 cup cornmeal
2 tbs flour
1/4 cup brown rice,
1 tsp dried basil
1/4 cup dried onions, opt
2 tsp dried parsley
3 tsp Kosher salt
2 tsp baking soda
pepper to taste

http://www.restlesschipotle.com/2011/07/make-your-own-veggie-burger-mix/

[siligut]

14. Interesting that you grind dry beans and rice, then just add boiling water to make the patties

But it seems it works. She says you can't cook them on the grill, which is a minus, but otherwise the recipe does look really good. I have tried using liquid smoke to get a grilled flavor but it is just awful. I wonder about using thick aluminum foil on the grill with holes poked in it to allow the charcoal flavor to get to the veggie burger.

[TheCruces]

64. The foil thing should work

[Flaxbee]

17. that looks like it could be good, once you've assembled all the ingredients.

As an alternative, portobello mushrooms are great either as fajitas or as burgers .... and portobellos with avocado are fabulous.

[TheCruces]

63. Faux meat is also why people think being vegetarian is so expensive

All the fake crap is expensive. I do eat meat, but sparingly. However, I very rarely get meat analogues. Much cheaper to use tofu and tempeh.

[HappyMe]

7. I would run to 5 Guys

to eat a real burger.

[OriginalGeek]

12. There's one right across the street from my work

It's a good thing I don't get paid enough to eat there more than I do...

[Major Nikon]

8. Cows are 100% pure vegan

Ground chuck is the obvious (and best) choice.

[Mendocino]

28. Do you know how

mad cow disease is spread? Cattle being fed the diseased products of other cows.

[Major Nikon]

29. That's one way it can be spread

Cows can also get the disease spontaneously without eating any meat products at all. For the last 15 years, cows in the US can't be fed meat or bone from any other cow, sheep, goat, etc., and the vast majority of US beef cattle get a vegetarian diet.

[Mendocino]

33. Us regs only partially prohibit this.

Cross contamination is still common. Chickens for example can be fed cattle products, chicken products then fed back to cattle. And do do livestock producers always follow the regs? I think not. What happens to downer cows if they aren't directly slaughtered? It would be naive to think these poor animals aren't rendered back into feed.

Today a new case of Mad cow was reported here in the US.

You stated that cattle are "100% pure vegan", but then you state "a vast majority are vegetarian".

Spontaneous Mad Cow? Never heard of that, get back to you on that one.

[Major Nikon]

34. Can does not mean it happens

As far as a case of mad cow coming from a chicken, I've never heard of this, but that's not to say it hasn't happened. Feeding cattle meat products is much more common overseas. In the US, the vast majority of beef cattle are raised on pasture land and only spend a few weeks before slaughter in a feed lot where they are generally fed grain. Some areas that don't have as much access to cheap grain are feeding table scraps in some feedlots, but this is not a source of mad cow disease.

[Mendocino]

37. Even a cursory search on

Wiki- Cattle feeding, drop down to BSE confirms cross feeding contamination between species.

Have you heard of Howard Lyman? He is known as The Mad Cowboy, a former rancher and farmer. In his book "No More Bull" he states that the 1997 ban is "flouted by feed mills, cattle still feed on the blood of their own species, as well as ground-up dogs, cats, horses, pigs, roadkill and their own dung. We feed ground-up cattle to chickens and then we feed chicken litter back to cattle."

Since it only takes a miniscule amount of prions, the organisms that cause Mad Cow, to infect an animal, even a short amount of time spent in a feedlot can cause the disease.

[Major Nikon]

43. Some feedlots feed their cattle all sorts of stuff you wouldn't imagine

In some cases they are actually feeding used bedding materials from other animals to cows. Some feedlots also feed table scraps to cows (but more often hogs). However, what you have to remember is they only do these things when the alternative (grain) is more expensive which is not the case in most areas. The beef industry is also moving towards branded beef where what they are fed during the feedlot stage is specified (usually corn), so at least around here it's pretty easy to find beef that's fed exclusively a vegetarian diet. I suspect that on the east coast it may be more difficult.

[kwassa]

11. Neither Morningstar or Boca taste like cardboard.

They don't taste like beef, either, but I don't expect them to. They do taste very different than each other.

[Taverner]

40. They taste horrible to me

But I figure that has to be because they appeal to the lowest common taste denominator for the most sales

There has to be a better recipe

[OriginalGeek]

13. Which reminds me

we had a cook-out thing at work a while back and, in addition to the regular burgers and hot dogs, they were handing out veggie burgers of some kind (no idea the brand - probably something they bought in bulk at Costco so whatever they carry) and my friend went down and got his hamburger topped with a veggie burger becasue it was easier than trying to manage lettuce and pickles and all that other salad stuff. He said it was pretty good. I tried one too (without the meat burger) and didn't hate it like I thought I would - But I'm not sure how healthy they are...like how many could I safely eat and not do more harm than a double cheese burger would do anyway?

As long as I don't think of it as a burger it's fine.

[Archae]

15. Vegan burger is an oxymoron.

I wouldn't ever want to even try plants disguised as a burger.

I eat plants, and I eat meat.

Not one disguised as the other.

[kentauros]

30. Not necessarily.

hamburger
1610s, "native of Hamburg;" the meat product so called from 1884, hamburg steak, named for the German city of Hamburg, though no certain connection has ever been put forth, and there may not be one unless it be that Hamburg was a major port of departure for German immigrants to United States. Meaning "a sandwich consisting of a bun and a patty of grilled hamburger meat" attested by 1912. Shortened form burger attested from 1939; beefburger was attempted 1940, in an attempt to make the main ingredient more explicit, after the -burger had taken on a life of its own as a suffix (cf. cheeseburger, first attested 1938). The -burg is Ger. Burg "fort," in reference to the moated castle built there c.825; the first element is perhaps O.H.G. hamma "ham, back of the knee" in a transferred sense of "bend, angle," with reference to its position on a river bend promontory, or M.H.G. hamme "enclosed area of pastureland."

Therefore, a "hamburger" can be an "enclosed area of pastureland" with a "fort", and that can be a very vegan place indeed!

[Cronkite]

16. Why do vegans insist on shaping the food they eat to look like meat?

You never see a meat eater shaping his/her hamburger to look like a cucumber, why do vegans insist that their food look like meat?

[Flaxbee]

21. because most vegans were raised to appreciate certain flavors / textures ... and were raised eating

meat. Hamburgers, lasagna, fajitas, etc. - they're all good "food forms", if you know what I mean.

Vegans and vegetarians choose no-meat diets for a variety of reasons - health, ethics, whatever. But that doesn't mean that we don't long for a good burger every once in a while. It's just that the thought of eating animals is unappealing.

[siligut]

22. Good answer. nt

[flvegan]

23. ...

and that's one to grow on.

[kentauros]

31. Think about bread, and buns.

Now think about what shapes fit in those established shapes. Would you put a cylindrical shape on a flat, large round bun? How well would a flat, large round shape fit on a cylindrical bun? And, unless you're Wendy's, would you willingly put a square shape on a round bun, or conversely, a round shape on a square bun?

The better question to ask is: why is meat shaped the way it is?

[Codeine]

35. Because I spent the first 18 years of my life eating meat?

I enjoy the textures and flavors I grew up with, but I'd rather not kill a helpless and abused animal to get those flavors when I don't have to do so.

Besides, if it wasn't burger-shaped it would look awfully silly on a burger bun.

[jobycom]

52. Probably because buns are round.

Same reason milkshakes are shaped like a glass of water.

If someone comes up with an idea to make a sandwich patty and call it a "burger," we eat it or don't based on whether we like it or not, not on whether it looks or tastes like meat. Marketers call them "burgers" to market to non-vegetarians (and probably some new vegetarians), and because everyone knows what a burger is. They could call them "Sandwich Patties" or "Vegetable Disks" or "Saucer Shaped Edible Grain and Vegetable Bread Filler," but "burger" is just easier to recognize.

[lastlib]

18. Just eat meat. You're at the top of the food chain, fercryinoutloud.

What's the point of being there if you're gonna eat vegetables?

What is a cow, anyway? "You are what you eat," and cows eat vegetables. So eating a cow is just eating processed vegetables.

[jobycom]

53. How are we at the top of the food chain?

We get eaten by everything from bears to bacteria. Bacteria are the top of the food chain. They begin eating us the day we are born and don't stop until we are inedible dust.

[lastlib]

60. Yeah, but do they have an opposable thumb???

And how many bacteria have they sent to the moon???

[siligut]

61. More bacteria than men have been to the moon

Bacteria go everywhere we go, en masse. And their whole bodies are opposable thumbs.

[MiddleFingerMom]

20. k

[GoCubsGo]

25. I'd start with an Amy's Kitchen veggie burger...

I'd go with an "All-American" burger, tomato, onion, and some chipotle mayo, and maybe some soy cheese.

[Archae]

27. Blech.

(Munches on a Quarter Pounder with cheese)

[IndyJones]

41. With extra pink slime? Mmmmmm....

[ohiosmith]

32. Recipe:

One vegan de boned and freshly ground. Select age and weight based on number to be served.

For every two pounds of ground vegan add four strips chopped bacon, one minced onion, one raw egg, one half cup of bread crumbs, and salt and pepper to taste.

Mix well using hands or wooden spoon.

Form into quarter pound patties and place on hot grill/griddle for five minutes per side, turning once.

Allow to rest for three minutes.

Place on butter toasted buns. Dress and garnish as desired.

Guaranteed to please.

[Codeine]

36. Why is everyone who posts to a vegan thread so determined to act like a dick? nt

[ohiosmith]

39. Can't speak for others. It's my gift.

[Codeine]

47. LOL! From one dick to another, fair enough, sir.

Well played.

[siligut]

44. Veganism and vegetarianism seems to be one of those wide divide topics

Either you do or you don't and there isn't much in between. The non-believers in this thread have responded, mostly in clever ways, just to voice their opinion and kind of rib the rest of us. I resented it at first because I really wanted ideas to create a great vegan burger, but it is fine with me now, because this thread contains those too.

[CBGLuthier]

55. I don't think it has to be that absolute

I am a quasi vegetarian. I tend to not really ever eat any meat but occasionally a little seafood. I have no issue with what anyone else does for a lifestyle. Vegans and wholesale meat eaters alike.

I do not engage in trying to make non meat meat like however. There are just too many other things to enjoy. We have made attempts in the past to create a faux burger and ultimately it just does not really satisfy. The closest we ever come is to bake or fry some falafel and stuff it into pitas and dress like a gyro. That is fairly satisfying.

[siligut]

59. I don't think it has to be that absolute either, but I have worked with people who do

Most of the vegans I have known have been radical vegans. I vary along the line, mostly stick with vegetarianism. I did go through a phase where I could smell the difference between vegans and meat eaters. I feel better when I eat vegetarian.

[jobycom]

54. For the same reason Ted Haggerty denounced homosexuality, maybe?

Most people are just curious when they hear I'm vegetarian, but some people go off the deep end, as they do in threads around here. To me it's a guilty conscience. They get defensive because something in them makes them feel attacked just because I exist. Maybe they want to be vegetarian. Maybe they feel some kinship to animals and part of them can't reconcile that with eating meat. Whatever. But that defensive aggression always makes me assume they feel guilty about their diets and take it out on anyone who makes them remember that.

Of course, there's always the good-natured ribbing (NPI). In person we can tell the difference, but online it's hard to tell sometimes when it's good-natured teasing and when it's that angry defensiveness.

[kwassa]

56. I think they feel guilty about how badly they eat.

and need to take it out on others.

I eat mostly vegan for health reasons; I had a heart attack. I would like not to have another one. I actually like eating vegan, too. New tastes and flavors.

But I will eat seafood, and once in awhile, meat, if it is really interesting meat.

[Codeine]

38. The Boca vegan patties taste pretty good.

But then for me burgers are more about pickles, onions, avocado, tomatoes, and burger sauce than anything else.

[siligut]

45. What do you use for burger sauce?

I have tried thousand island dressing, like the burger joints use, but it really didn't work that well for me.

[Codeine]

46. I mix Vegenaise, ketchup, mustard, apple cider vinegar, a dash of olive and a dollop of dill relish.

Occasionally I'll add a little vegan Worcestershire sauce, but I rarely buy it.

[siligut]

48. I haven't tried vegan Worcestershire sauce

I am going to have to look for it, thanks. I have used a chopped olive salad on veggie chickpea burgers, sort of like a muffaletta, they turned out quite good.

[nadine_mn]

42. Try marinated portobello mushroom caps, grilled

Frankly, I hate mushrooms but my husband (meat eater) and my my best friend (vegetarian) love them so when I had a cook out I decided to try them. I think I had three different marinades, I know one was teriyaki. Anyway, my husband loved the meaty texture of the mushroom and both loved the taste.

I am going to try a fairly simple looking black bean burger recipe Cinco de Mayo for my mom (vegetarian) and husband. I was raised a vegetarian, but rebelled and started eating meat in high school. I know first hand the struggle to find meatless alternatives. My mom is not vegan ...she still eats eggs and dairy products so that helps in finding recipes.

Many recipes for black bean burgers mention that without egg to bind it, they become crumbly.

Good luck on the search

[TheCruces]

65. My favorite marinade for portabello mushrooms (or any veggie, really) is...

Annie's Shiitake vinagarette. It's awesome.

[HopeHoops]

49. Portabello, TVP, quinoa, and shredded carrot for starters.

[snooper2]

50. Add 25% Italian sausage (ground of course)

Gives it All the flavor

[siligut]

51. Costco has a very good Italian spice/herb blend

It really gives an Italian sausage flavor to sauces

[kwassa]

57. Trader Joe's Meatless Italian Sausages are really good.

My favorite of the fake meat products.

[queenjane]

58. Dr. Praeger's California Veggie Burgers!

The yummiest vegan burger (and I've tried them all). My Costco sometimes has large boxes of them for $10. Whole Foods sells them, as well.

I've made several different recipes of vegan burgers (I like them with veggies, not soy protein), and while they can be good, it's alot of work. Dr. Praeger's is always in my freezer.

[harmonicon]

62. Step one is beef.

Step two is making a real burger.

Step three is eating it and realizing that people keep on trying to make other kinds of "burger" because burgers are awesome, but nothing will ever compare to a real burger, despite what any sort of diet or Hindu faith may have led you astray from this truth.