Once and for all! Here and now! Is professional wrestling fake?

[ohiosmith]

Last edited Sat Dec 24, 2011, 02:40 PM - Edit history (1)

[Angry Dragon]

1. Maddog Vachon also looks like Andre the Giant and Vern Gagne

not any more than the republican presidential debates

[ohiosmith]

3. NO! But you are right about the guys in the ring.

[geardaddy]

2. oohh! Mad Dog Vachon!!!

I grew up watching him, Baron Von Raschke, and Verne Gagne.

[ohiosmith]

5. The golden age.

[steve2470]

4. When I was 11 in 1969 I didn't think so !

[ohiosmith]

6. But you know better now. Right?

[steve2470]

7. yes lol nt

[ohiosmith]

8. Good!

[Major Nikon]

9. John Stossel found out the answer to that question the hard way

[ohiosmith]

10. Love it.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

54. My favorite John Stossel segment ever.

In fact, the only tolerable John Stossel segment.

[hifiguy]

11. It is scripted, but the athleticism is real.

Everyone involved knows who is going to "win" and who is going to "lose" beforehand. So it is not competitive in any sense of that term. If the moves many wrestlers use were done without pulling them, many would never wrestle a second match. Pro wrestlers are great athletes, but they do not engage in athletic competitions. Many "injuries" are just part of the storyline. If a guy keeps wrestling while "injured" it's a work - i.e., part of the storyline. If a wrestler disappears for a while it means he was legit hurt.

If you smellllllalalalallalalllll what THE ROCK is cooking!

[ohiosmith]

12. NOOOOO!

[cheneyschernobyl]

50. I tend to think of it as

a violent soap opera. Lots of acting, mystery, some real life/personal events thrown into storylines, add a dash of suspension of disbelief (example The Undertaker) = some great entertainment.

When we watch a movie we know some of the items are "fake"/scripted/completely unrealistic, but we don't let it get in our way of being entertained. That's how I view pro wrestling.

Personally I enjoy the pro wrestlers who use scientific/amateur type wrestling moves/holds. Those guys are artists, and the wrestling ring is their canvas. Guys like Bob Backlund, Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat, Chris Benoit (murder/suicide issue aside), Kurt Angle, and Bret "The Hitman" Hart I never get tired of watching.

It doesn't take a lot of skill/training to bash someone in the head with a chair. Unfortunately for some guys that seems to be their thing.

[OriginalGeek]

13. My Dad let me believe in Santa Claus for as long as I was willing to but

he told me very early on that wrestling was all scripted and and acting.

And then we proceeded to enjoy watching Ivan Putski and the Von Erichs anyway.



God Dammit I miss my Dad.

[ohiosmith]

14. So, are you saying Santa is fake?

[OriginalGeek]

23. I never said I was unwilling yet

!




Edit to add: I forgot to mention that much later I happily watched the Rock and Mankind and Undertaker with my daughter until she got tired of it.

Nowadays she doesn;t care about wrestling but she will drag me to most any movie the Rock is in. (And hey, his wrestling paid off - he isn't a terrible actor. Way better than Chuck Norris.)

(Please don't tell Chuck I said that though.)

[ohiosmith]

28. I don't have to tell Chuck. He knows. He's omnipresent man.

[OriginalGeek]

36. Oh Shi......!

[nolabear]

15. Two words:

Andy Kaufmann

To his eternal credit, it took Lawler about fifteen years to fess up. It was the most brilliant performance art I know of.

[Hayabusa]

21. I've seen several of them,

but after viewing the Letterman confrontation on tape, I have to declare that this was the greatest Worked Shoot in the history of pro wrestling.

[cemaphonic]

29. Yeah, that feud was a thing of beauty

Even though Kaufmann was a dilettante and outsider to the close-knit wrestling world, he put on a heel persona that has rarely been equaled. Those crowds in Memphis wanted his blood something fierce.

I also think it's funny that all of Kaufmann's showbiz buddies thought he was insane for associating himself with something as low-class a pro wrestling, and then a few years later, you had Hulk Hogan and Wrestlemania, and all of a sudden actors and musicians were tripping over themselves to get in on the wrestling buzz.

[Hayabusa]

34. Amen.

I know that WWE doesn't own the classic Memphis wrestling footage. I know that Andy is dead and thus has no product to shill. I know that it's been almost 30 years since he last graced the squared circle. I know that it's all political and not a real Hall at all. Despite all of these, the WWE should put Andy in their celebrity wing of their Hall of Fame. He was that damn good.

[HappyMe]

16. Fake.

[Tikki]

17. Our son has been a worker..

It is a display of choreographed simulated violence with very real repercussions
if something goes wrong.

The Tikkis

[hifiguy]

18. Indeed.

Steve Austin wound up needing neck fusion surgery after one of the Harts didn't line him up quite right for a pile-driver. He later said he couldn't feel his arms or legs for almost a minute. If you cannot trust the guy you are wrestling very serious injuries can take place. Can you imagine what could happen to a guy wrestling, say, The Big Show if Show didn't know what he was doing? He could probably kill someone with one punch.

[Lionel Mandrake]

19. How did it get to be that way?

High school and college wrestling are real. So are the various forms of wrestling in the olympics.

Does anyone here prefer fake wrestling to the real thing?

[Hayabusa]

22. I prefer it

And generally, the line between the worked and the shoot (ie scripted and real) is thought to have originated sometime in the 1920s, I believe. Early pro wrestlers still needed to know how to properly defend themselves in case the usual setup of having another pro wrestler in the crowd accept the "open challenge" was screwed up. Yes, it was possible that the World Champion faced Farmer Joe in a real fight.

It also came in really handy when your opponent decided to go off script and try to win for real.

[cemaphonic]

31. Oddly, it didn't really develop from high school and collegiate/olypmic wrestling

I always thought it did, since having wrestled in high school, it's a pretty boring spectator sport if you don't understand the scoring rules, and I always figured that pro wrestling was an attempt to jazz it up.

It actually came from carnies and their strongman attractions. As Hayabusa said, they would challenge the hometown heroes to last in the ring with them, but they had a handful of (well-kept secret) moves to rig the matches in their favor. Over time, this coalesced into a bunch of different regional companies with their own territories, rosters, traditions and "rules." Mostly these regional promotions stayed out of each others way until Vince McMahon took over the WWF from his dad, and expanded it into a national company, buying out most of the regions in the process.

[Lionel Mandrake]

41. That's a very interesting history lesson.

In a way, it's not surprising that one type of fakery gave birth to another type of fakery.

When I was a kid, my dad used to watch wrestling on TV. His favorite wrestler was Gorgeous George. But he also liked some of the bad guys, including Mr. Moto:



As a kid, I was infuriated when the referees failed to notice the foul deeds of the bad guys.

[bigwillq]

20. Rehersed

[ohiosmith]

37. Nuh uh!

[RueVoltaire]

24. Who cares if it's real, I love it!

[ohiosmith]

38. Rowdy Roddy.

I've come to chew bubblegum and kick ass. And I'm all out of bubblegum.

[RueVoltaire]

39. I love THEY LIVE! He is awesome in that!

[HopeHoops]

25. Andy Kaufman invented it. Ever see "Man on the Moon"?

[ohiosmith]

43. Great movie.

[HopeHoops]

45. Jim Carrey said Andy Kaufman and Jerry Lewis were the inspiration for what he is.

It's quite fitting that he played Kaufman in the movie. He did the voices and facial expressions so well that you could mistake him for the real thing. I didn't know that Kaufman invented the "pro wrestling" thing until I saw that movie, but it is true.

Still, I think my favorite scene is when he finishes reading "The Great Gatsby" and everyone left is sleeping except for the one guy who claps and says "ALL RIGHT!"

[baldguy]

26. Professional wrestling is just as real - or fake - as any other theater performance.

It's just performed by some exceptional athletes.

[ohiosmith]

52. They're not acting. They're not!

[zanana1]

27. My husband watches it.

I've never seen one guy bleed.

[SecurityManager]

30. Performance just like a soap opera with better set ups

January 22, 1980

Larry Zbyszko turns on Bruno Sammartino

Best heel turn ever in pro wrestling!

I was throwing things at my television LOL

[Hayabusa]

32. I've seen clips

of their cage match at Shea Stadium (in it's early days, the WWE used to run huge shows at Shea), I believe. Damn that was a feud.

[LynneSin]

33. About as fake as the last orgasm I had

nuff said!

[retread]

42. So you think it's real? n/t

[ohiosmith]

44. I have no response to that.

[LynneSin]

53. Most people don't

I was always the consummate actress on and off stage!

[UnrepentantLiberal]

55. Even though your orgasm was fake

it showed great athleticism.

[arbusto_baboso]

35. Even if it's fake, it still shows great athleticism.

Gotta respect 'em for that, at least.

Just because the fights aren't real doesn't mean they don't get hurt.

[RueVoltaire]

40. Just came back to give this thread a rec for

getting me to watch awesome wrestling videos on Youtube, for almost an hour! Merci beaucoup, ohiosmith! I'd wave, but I haven't figured out the smilies yet!

[ohiosmith]

47. My pleasure RueVoltaire.

Here you go: http://www.democraticunderground.com/emoticons/

[madrchsod]

46. the injuries are not fake

[cherokeeprogressive]

48. Anyone who thinks so is a "Pencil-Neck Geek". n/t

[irisblue]

49. roller derby?

could that be...staged too?
poor spelling

[slay]

51. No

and by no - i mean yes.