Who is/was the most overrated actor or actress to you? John Wayne played John Wayne in every single

[debm55]

Last edited Thu Jun 1, 2023, 11:19 PM - Edit history (1)

film in my opinion. same with Tom Cruise and Meg Ryan.

[50 Shades Of Blue]

1. James Stewart.

ETA: At least I can watch him. John Wayne is an instant click for me in ANYthing.

[debm55]

2. Me too about Wayne, but Stewart showed more of a range then Wayne ever did.

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[Diamond_Dog]

5. Me three

[Major Nikon]

60. ...

[debm55]

61. OMG

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[Major Nikon]

64. Perhaps not the best casting decision ever made

[debm55]

66. And I bet he still acted like a cowboy. Did you ever see the movie???

[debm55]

72. Was it the Seven Samauri?

[Harker]

88. "The Conqueror", 1956.

Genghis Wayne.

John Kahn, maybe.

[debm55]

91. that's funny

[unblock]

11. Agreed on john Wayne. But Jimmy Stewart? Really?

He's one of my favorites from that era. He was great in rear window.

[Paladin]

19. Hitchcock got a great performance out of him, in "Vertigo." (nt)

[Peregrine Took]

40. Didn't AH want Cary Grant for Vertigo but he wasn't available? 'Think I heard that.

He did do a good job.

LOL to that comment he made to Kim Novak about her hair color (after she had changed it back to her "normal" color) that her hair color "didn't really matter" to her!

[3catwoman3]

69. 2 other movies that I think were well done are...

…Shenandoah and Flight of the Phoenix.

[3catwoman3]

74. I was talking about Jimmy Stewart movies.

[debm55]

76. Sorry, I will remove my post.

[malthaussen]

3. That's a slight exaggeration, but in substance I agree.

Not a big fan of John Wayne. But some of that dislike has to do with the garbage roles he was frequently given. Hollywood westerns tended to be crap (with several exceptions, because there are a LOT of Hollywood Westerns). And most of the WW2 propaganda films are painful to watch.

OTOH, I love "Rio Bravo," but mostly because Walter Brennan kicks ass in the film.

-- Mal

[Tetrachloride]

12. According to Robert Pirsig's book "Lila: An Inquiry Into Morals", the stoic cowboy character came

from the American Native Indians.

[ProfessorGAC]

67. Or El Dorado...

...which is essentially the same movie as Rio Bravo.
I like both of them.

[debm55]

79. All of his movies are essentially the same.

[Paladin]

83. I'm no fan of Wayne's politics or acting.

But I still believe that "Red River" is the best Western ever made.

[Cartoonist]

4. Roger Moore

Too prim.

[unblock]

6. He's widely recognized as lousy. So not really "overrated"

[SalamanderSleeps]

7. There is a difference in between type and brand.

John Wayne and Tom Cruise perfected their brands, but were, and are, extremely wooden performers. No growth.

While on the other hand actors like Charlize Theron, Jeff Daniels, and Steve Buscemi are real emotive technicians that can be anyone they find interesting.

The are artisans.

The other guys are drama merchants.

[Aristus]

8. John Wayne for me, too.

They finally gave the racist son-of-a-bitch an Oscar pretty much for playing himself for so many years.

I hate the fact that he was a bully and a chest-pounding armchair warrior. He was the ur-MAGAt; talking a big game about love of country, but not backing it up with any meaningful national service.

[bucolic_frolic]

9. Most of them, especially all the really big names

They play the same character in every film. They seem regurgitated to me. Flat facial expressions, grunts. So few good actors anymore. It could be that it's just the nature of film anymore. Really good onscreen takes really good training, directing, and the budget and time to tease out the best, yet films don't really go big budget anymore. They pay the "star" and everything else is cost-plus.

[Codifer]

10. But then so were

Jimmy Stewart, Cary Grant and Paul Newman... (although to a lesser degree than Marion Morrison).

It might just be that I have much more respect for these three than I do Marion, but I think they did it better and it seemed more natural when they played themselves. They were not doomed to play phony assholes.

Marion was doomed to play the "big dick energy" badass bar brawler war hero (in EVERY service from SeaBee to Flying Tiger).

So sick of that crap character being foisted on the young as an ideal.... (buy a gun, be a freakiong Hero).

Sorry... bad mood this morning. Watched the news.

[debm55]

13. I would also have to add Tom Cruise. To me, in any film, he is Tom Cruise. Last movie I saw of his

was RainMan and that was for the Dustin Hoffman character.

[LakeArenal]

25. Agree on Cruise.

[debm55]

18. Hope you are feeling better.At first, I didn't know who Marion Morrison was --then it hit me-John

Wayne's real name. Here's a hug for you

[SalamanderSleeps]

33. I miss Paul Newman.

As "Sully" from; Nobody's Fool.

"Boy, a guy goes to jail for a couple of days and the whole town goes to hell!"

[unblock]

14. Kevin Costner

Believable in a baseball movie.

In anything else, like dances with wolves, I'm like, why did they time-travel a modern-day baseball player into this story?

[LakeArenal]

27. I agree with you on him.

[debm55]

39. I think he was perfect in Dances With Wolves. I haven't see him in any other film though.

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He also produced and directed that film which earned him two, count em two Oscars.

[Aristus]

98. I would like to have seen Chris Cooper in the role.

Cooper is a criminally underrated actor who would have totally owned the role of Lt. Dunbar, and maybe have prevented the film from being a feel-good white savior flick.

[unblock]

15. Nicholas cage

Better actor than Costner, but that's about it.

[debm55]

21. Nicholas Cage has been making some really shitty movies. I think that they go directly to Netflix

Last edited Thu Jun 1, 2023, 07:38 PM - Edit history (1)

He may have been good at one time, but he is a "actor" repeating the same role over and over. No growth.

[TexasBushwhacker]

47. He's bad with his money

Has a tendency to blow his money on houses and cars. He owned the IRS over $6 Million at one point.

[debm55]

50. And his recent movies are terrible. I feel his best days are way behind him. JMO

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[stopdiggin]

16. Not a big Hollywood fan. But I'd also go with the Duke

as probably the best example of true nadir. Just a flat out lack of talent. Ruins just about everything ..

Edit: on second thought. Cruise also deserving mention. Pretty much a stick figure. Sucks the air out ...

[debm55]

34. Even in The Quiet Man---he was still John Wayne. The movie was about a boxer, who flees to Ireland.

Last edited Thu Jun 1, 2023, 07:24 PM - Edit history (1)

And he was still John Wayne in Ireland. Movie should have called Cowboy on the Run,Visits Ireland.

[rsdsharp]

17. Jim Carrey.

A rubber faced, one trick pony.

[Upthevibe]

71. rsdsharp .............

I know Jim Carrey is mainly know for his comedies (which I don't like).

Having said that, I thought he was EXCELLENT in, The Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. Also, I thought he was great in, The Truman Show.

[rsdsharp]

78. I've seen Truman. I thought it was alright.

Everything else I’ve ever seen is so outrageously cartoonish. He sure as hell isn’t worth $20 million per movie, in my opinion.

[brush]

20. John Wayne is an automatic No in my book...

not just because he was a terrible actor, but because he was a known racist and stated it opehly.

Other automatic NOs for me when I see them in movie credits are Mickey Rooney, Shirley Temple, Bing Crosby, Ryan O'Neal, Mel Gibson, Susan Sarandon and Steven Seagal.

That's all I can think of now, but that's quite enough.

[lastlib]

22. Ronald F.* Reagan

(*F. for Fuckhead...)

He was a shitty actor, a shitty governor, and an unbelievably shitty president.

[pandr32]

28. He was a shitty governor and president because shitty acting.

He was playing parts badly the whole time.

[CatWoman]

58. however, he was pretty good The Killers

[Major Nikon]

63. He was never an A-list actor

So not really all that famous even in his heyday. The best thing his acting career got him was the SAG presidency which evidently he used to coerce sex from wannabe starlets. When a young actress named Nancy Davis came to see him about getting off the blacklist he arranged a bit of quid pro quo which resulted in her getting pregnant and they were forced to marry to keep from ruining both of their careers. Naturally what would be apply described as illegal sexual harassment today, the wingnuts call "a love story".

[lastlib]

68. Personally, I always thought of him as a shit-list actor........

[hunter]

96. How can you say that? He got top billing as California Governor and POTUS.

You know why I hate and boycott television news and opinion?

Television pushed Ronald Reagan and Donald Trump as superstars, ignorant incurious meat puppets the both of them.

Ronald Reagan would do or say anything for a blow job. He was not a man of good character.

It only got worse as Reagan began to lose his mind.

By some unusual circumstances I saw Reagan at a brief public appearance during his second term. He was a confused old man who didn't know where the hell he was or what he was doing there, being pushed around by his handlers. Everyone must have seen it. But as soon as the television lights came on and he was standing at the podium, his acting skills kicked in, and he turned on the charm. It was an A-List performance.

Of course that's the only thing the newspapers and television news reported.

[Major Nikon]

102. He was the ideal GOP candidate

He could read a script, but was dum as a stump and completely apathetic to everything going on around him. It took zero effort to manipulate him.

The reason his handlers always kept him away from the press was because he inevitably said stupid shit when he went off script. He toasted the people of Bolivia to the Brazilian president. He told a fictional story about a Medal of Honor recipient to a group of real Medal of Honor recipients.

The biggest failure of the press was not calling out Saint Ronnie's brain rot. Had the public known about it, I doubt he would have done so well against Mondale.

[Tetrachloride]

23. The actor is the face of the writer, line producers, executive producers, film editors, costume des.

designer. The actor can also be the face of the whitewashed audience. So, there’s opportunities to be imperfect.

Sometimes the actor is a producer as well.

Sometimes the actor has sway.

Movie studios want glamorous style because that’s where the money is.


There’s an awful lot of -isms not mentioned yet in this thread.

As for me, I focus on the portrayal of the story. If I need non-fiction beyond what might be in a movie, I’ll buy some prunes and read DU Science, Environment and Foreign Affairs.

[iwillalwayswonderwhy]

24. Jeff Goldblum

He always sound surprised and condescending. Andie McDowell, her performances seem so wooden.

[Botany]

26. Adam Sandler is Gawd Awful

Jimmy Stewart was brilliant in Harvey and John Wayne was very good when he played himself
in True Grit, the Shootist, and The Man Who Shot Liberty Vallance (racist, sexist, and campy but
I like it.)

[LakeArenal]

30. Can't stand Carey. Or Adam Sandler.

But I don’t think of them in the same realm as Cruise or Costner.

[Effete Snob]

36. Agreed

I think he did one thing I liked, but I can't remember what it was.

[debm55]

92. I agree.

[Peregrine Took]

41. Can't stand Sandler also, WoodyHarrelson. It always feels like he's acting.

[debm55]

48. I liked Woody in Cheers, don't like him in his movies--comes across as weird

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[moniss]

29. What I used to laugh at

were some of the character names they gave him in those early Western shorts he did. I remember one where he was Joe January.

[LakeArenal]

31. For me any character that is the "never say you're sorry" type.

Edit: Steve Segal, Vin Diesel.

I would also add that John Wayne comes from a time where today we considering “overacting”.

Example is Bette Davis movies are all overacted. But I love them all.

[unblock]

44. Good point about that era. All the actors were stage actors

On a stage you have to act loud and big so they can see and hear in the cheap seats. Movies are more intimate so that style comes off as overacting.

Of course these days we sometimes have the opposite problem, like Matthew mcconaughey who just mumbles his lines....

[LakeArenal]

45. Very true.

[Fla Dem]

32. Clint Eastwood. Always brooding, man of few words

whether that was the role or not was how he protrayed it.

[Peregrine Took]

35. Bill Murray - always plays the same sarcastic role over and over. n/t

[Effete Snob]

37. Will Ferrell

Painfully self-conscious in almost every role.

[beveeheart]

38. David Caruso - acts the same every time

Also agree about John Wayne..

[progressoid]

43. +1

[beveeheart]

49. Exactly! lol

[Peregrine Took]

42. Let me sneak in a great acting performance...Martin Sheen in Apocalypse Now.

We were looking for a movie we hadn't seen in a while....wow - top actors BECOME the person they are portraying. Sheen became "Williard."

[yellowdogintexas]

56. Martin Sheen in Anything! Best in the Business

or tied with Tom Hanks

[TlalocW]

46. Brando

I'm not saying he wasn't good, but I never got why people went apeshit over him.

[yellowdogintexas]

57. his early work - Streetcar Named Desire, for example

was awesome.

I loved him as Don Corleone and when he did the total sendup of himself playing Corleone in "The Freshman" it was a total hoot !

found this while looking for a list of his work
https://www.goldderby.com/gallery/best-marlon-brando-movies-ranked/reflections-in-a-golden-eye-2/

[debm55]

97. Brando early work was great. Last Tango in Paris had an unscripted scene in it. Brando and the

Director were the only two that knew what was going to happen. The actress didn't. That brought my idea of Brando down alot.

[bedazzled]

99. Brando played a Japanese man in "Teahouse of the August Moon"

It was truly horrifying.

Almost as bad as Katherine Ross playing a native American in "Tell Them Willie Boy is Here." A sour note in a great film.

I agree with you on "The Freshman." HYSTERICAL!I
I will never look at a komodo dragon the same way again...

[debm55]

101. I thought he was great in On the Waterfront

[First Speaker]

51. Wayne gave an excellent performance in his very last film, *The Shootist*...

...he played an aging gunslinger dying of cancer, but he didn't play "John Wayne". He underplayed, and gave the character some real shading. That's the film he should have been given an Oscar for--or at least a nomination--and not *True Grit*.

[debm55]

54. I thought True Grit was his last film?

[First Speaker]

65. No. True Grit came out in 1969...

...and Wayne won the Oscar in 1970. But he made a number of films after that, with The Shootist coming last in 1976. Wayne died in, I think, 1977 or 78...

[Chainfire]

52. I always thought that John Wayne was a caricature of a standard issue bully.

He was a draft dodger in WWII, and then plays all of the war hero parts. Doesn't that remind you of a bone spur draft dodger playing president?

[debm55]

53. You mean tRUMP???

[debm55]

55. Russell Crowe, wonderful and sexy in his early films. Is he still making films?

[Niagara]

59. My Overrated List.

John Wayne: Always the same role. As crazy as it sounds, I just started getting into westerns during the pandemic and still continue to watch them when given a chance.




Elizabeth Taylor: Beautiful, vibrant woman. Terrible actress.




Clint Eastwood: Always the same role. Acts like a jerk in a yelling whisper and squints. And squints some more. Perhaps too much of a man to wear glasses?




Vin Diesel: I don't know, I just can't stand the guy and gives me the creeps. He comes off as a degenerate.




Matthew McConaughey: I will not be manipulated into liking this weirdo. Perhaps he should go back to playing his bongo drums naked.



Bruce Willis: I'm sorry to hear about his recent diagnosis. I feel terrible for his children. I don't believe the man has any acting talent what's so ever.




Amy Schumer: Not funny. Not at all. Next.



Keanu Reeves: Compassionate, humble, and charitable. I adore this man. Terrible actor.



Kevin McCarthy: This Creepo stinks! He deserves every Razzie he gets.

[debm55]

62. Great

[Doc_Technical]

81. I agree that Bruce Willis usually portrayed his "Bruno" character,

but I thought he was pretty good in "12 Monkeys"
(Even though Brad Pitt stole the show)

[Mad_Dem_X]

90. Agree with you on Keanu

One of my favorite films is Dangerous Liaisons...except for his performance. He almost ruins the movie for me.

[debm55]

95. Also agree with Keanu

[Upthevibe]

73. debm55 ...................

I completely agree about John Wayne....OMG! I can't stand to watch him try to act.

[debm55]

75. John Wayne and Tom Cruise. I was watching Top Gun 2. I like the flight scenes and Kenny Loggins song

They only had one darn minute of the song. I watch half, just to make sure I was right about Cruise--stiff as a board, no emotions.Maybe I should watch the whole thing. Decide to take the garbage out and come back on here. Remembered Wayne as one of those --America, love it or leave it guys of my youth.My new name for his film The Quiet Man is A Cowboy Moves to Ireland.

[debm55]

77. Meg Ryan know only for the scene in the restaurant with Billy Crystal and numerous face changes.At

one time she was pretty popular as America's sweetheart. I think she was overrated too.

[jcgoldie]

80. Fuck John Wayne

Just needed to be said.

[a kennedy]

82. I'm saying Dustin Hoffman......only pause is when he played a woman, Tootsie.

He’s Dustin in EVERY roll. Ugh…….

[debm55]

86. What about his part in RainMan?

Last edited Fri Jun 2, 2023, 12:15 PM - Edit history (1)

[a kennedy]

87. Ok, that's two he's not Dustin......😅

[avebury]

84. Diane Keaton

She plays the same type of character in every movie she does.

[Mad_Dem_X]

89. You're right!

The only exception I can think of is The Godfather movies.

[debm55]

93. Always the ditsy character.

[Emile]

85. Meryl Streep

Just kidding 😃.

My pick as the worst actor of all time is John Wayne.

[debm55]

94. Brad Pitt-good looking, but always Brad Pitt,

[a kennedy]

103. Shut up......ok, sorry for saying shit up.....but I love Brad....and I know you're right, just

hurts me when you say it, and I know it’s true.

[debm55]

104. That's okay, good looking man, but always Brad Pitt.

[bedazzled]

100. Audrey Hepburn. Nothing but a clothes hanger

Didn't think much of
Elizabeth Taylor, either. Now Susan Hayword, there was an actress.

Will Smith always plays himself. But you love him anyway...

[debm55]

107. I never said I liked Will Smith or Liz Taylor. I think that was another poster.

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[malthaussen]

113. But a clothes hanger with beautiful eyes.

She mostly played herself, but that self was pretty likeable. Although, I have to admit, I have very little sympathy for the overt gold-digger in "Sabrina."

-- Mal

[scarletlib]

105. Wow! No one nominated Charlton Heston?

He, like John Wayne, pretty much played the same character in all of his movies. His performances strike me as wooden.

[debm55]

106. I thought he stunk in Ben Hur and he won an Oscar for it.

[scarletlib]

108. Here is a fun fact about Ben Hur

The DVD “The Celluloid Closet” is where I heard this:

Gore Vidal (uncredited scriptwriter) was interviewed. He said he and some of the other persons on set were bored. I don’t remember his opinion on Charlton Heston. As a practical joke he and Stephen Boyd who played Messala, Ben Hur’s best friend, decided to play him as gay during the movie.

Charlton never caught on and they had a good laugh about it.

[debm55]

109. Thank you

[blueknight73]

110. Samuel Jackson

Love him because he takes no shit from anyone and speaks out on things that piss off the right wingers, but he's the exact same angry actor in most movies

[debm55]

111. I have only seen him on commercials, not movies. Started to watch Pulp Fiction but it was too

violent for me. Thank you for posting.

[Paladin]

112. Richard Dreyfuss. Same guy, no matter what the movie is. (nt)

[malthaussen]

114. I had a friend who would say Kate Hepburn.

Now, Dorothy Parker would agree, and it can be argued that Kate also tended to play Kate. But four Academy Awards would lead one to think that there must be something there. One wonders if the strong women (for a given value of "strong," mind you, she always surrendered to the man in the end) role raised aspirations in the souls of the rest of the women in Academy for how they would like their lives to be.

Full disclosure, though: I love Kate, and think she's on the short list for most beautiful woman of all time, "beauty" encompassing more than just her cheekbones.

-- Mal