Do You Cheat at Solitaire?? I guess I do...here is an example. What does the jury say?

[Stuart G]

I play a game called Free Cell...kinda keeps me sharp and focused if that is possible..
So I get so far..................AND......
and there is a button you can press called, "undo...and it takes back the moves you made..
In this way, I can see which mistakes I made in trying to beat the game. If one takes enough time,
and effort, each game is beatable, if you make the correct moves. Most of the time, I can figure it out
without the undo button, but some of the the time, I gotta use it three or four times, to get the correct
path to win.....Now..is that wrong, or cheating????

WHAT DOES THE JURY SAY???

[Scuba]

1. You'll not make your golf mates happy.

[HopeHoops]

2. Locking for unacceptable cheating strategies.

Just kidding. EVERYONE cheats at solitaire.

[Stuart G]

3. Using the method outlined..here is my success rate.

I have won 88 percent of my games.
..out of about 850 played..won about 735.. I guess that is crazy???
oh, so what...

If I did not use the undo method...I probably would only be at...say 35 to 50 percent..got that..

[HopeHoops]

4. I win 2 out of 3 regularly without cheating.

The trick is to clear from the right whenever possible instead of using the stack.

[pokerfan]

5. Not cheating, it's just a different game

A modified version of (Klondike) called "Thoughtful Solitaire", in which the identity of all 52 cards is known, has a known solution strategy that works 82% of the time but requires significant computing power. Because the only difference between the two games (Klondike and Thoughtful) is the knowledge of card location, all Thoughtful games with solutions will also have solutions in Klondike (in theory). Similarly, all dead-ends in Thoughtful will be dead ends in Klondike. However, the theoretical odds of winning a standard game of non-Thoughtful Klondike are currently unknown. It has been said that the inability for theoreticians to calculate these odds is "one of the embarrassments of applied probability".

You are playing a somewhat 'Thoughtful' version Freecell, that's all.

McCoy: Lieutenant, you are looking at the only Starfleet cadet who ever beat the no-win scenario.
Saavik: How?
Kirk: I reprogrammed the simulation so it was possible to rescue the ship.
Saavik: What?
David Marcus: He cheated.
Kirk: I changed the conditions of the test; got a commendation for original thinking. I don't like to lose.

[hunter]

11. If the identities of all the cards is known...

... a computer can play the "game in it's head" using as many "undos" as needed before making its official "outside it's head" move.

Works the same for people, but we have a tough time mentally juggling all those the cards in our heads. But with practice the game is learned. Same sort of thing happens with chess, or riding a bike -- the process of looking forward becomes something "automatic" accomplished by brain machinery outside our conscious selves. Hitting undo is the same as a learner falling off a bike and getting back up to try again.

If you were an amoral mad psychologist you could quickly teach people to play a good game of freecell by setting up a game where the undo button gives the player a nasty shock, but winning a hand gives the player a reward. You could adjust the levels of pain/reward to optimize performance...

...which is basically how our entire society is set up, by amoral gaming monsters with their hands on the pain/reward dials. Be a good little wage slave, learn to play my game!!! The profit making machinery of Las Vegas casinos is writ large upon the world.

Those who have pain/reward responses outside the norm, those who don't respond to pain or reward in a statistically normal fashion, who are insensitive to one or both, or hypersensitive to one or both, are a threat to the game masters. They disrupt the game or they refuse to play. Therefore they must be excluded from the games.

In the real universe at large there is no "cheating." Things can happen. Things that can't happen don't.

I'd rather live a life where I was growing a garden rather than playing a game, so that's what I do.

The funny thing is that when I play freecell I play much better when I know it's entirely without consequence and outside the stream of my stream-of-thought conscious self. I'm a much better freecell player when "I'm growing a garden" than when "I'm playing a game."

[HeiressofBickworth]

6. I play Free Cell, also.

I think that if the game programmer provided an "undo" button, the use of it can hardly be called cheating.

[trof]

7. Mine will only undo my last move.

After that, no go.
OTOH, Spyder will let you undo unlimited moves.
I'm with you, if the undo button is there, it ain't cheating to use it.

[dimbear]

8. Freecell has been analyzed quite thoroughly, and there are

a few rare deals that you just cannot win no matter what.

[kimi]

9. When I used to play Solitaire compulsively

I hit the "Undo" button all the damn time. I lurve the "Undo" button!


If that didn't work, I'd just shut down the stupid computer. Yep, just shut it off. And when it came back up, my stats were always 100% wins.


Don't give a hoot what the "Jury" says. (Cause I kinda know what they'll say, anyhoo.)

In MY mind, I am a master - or mistress - of Solitaire. And that's how it'll always be, in MY mind. Humph.

[surrealAmerican]

10. That's not cheating - it's learning.

Last edited Sat Jan 28, 2012, 08:54 PM - Edit history (1)

Only people who don't have the patience or desire to learn consider it "cheating".