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Fri May 7, 2021, 12:10 PM

Do I belong in AZ?

I’ve lived in, and mostly loved, AZ for three decades. Approaching 80, I’m probably going to make some kind of move in the next few years. This most recent stunt by our legislature has me questioning whether this state has just become too bizarrely hyper-rwnj for a liberal former n.y.-er to live in any longer. Fellow AZ-ions, thoughts?

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Arrow 36 replies Author Time Post
Reply Do I belong in AZ? (Original post)
marybourg May 7 OP
Moostache May 7 #1
marybourg May 7 #14
Kali May 7 #2
marybourg May 7 #13
Kali May 7 #18
marybourg May 7 #25
Kali May 7 #29
Hugh_Lebowski May 7 #3
abqtommy May 7 #4
marybourg May 7 #5
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #6
marybourg May 7 #8
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #19
marybourg May 7 #27
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #28
marybourg May 7 #30
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #32
marybourg May 7 #33
Buckeye_Democrat May 7 #7
marybourg May 7 #11
Buckeye_Democrat May 7 #12
blueinredohio May 7 #9
marybourg May 7 #10
ChazInAz May 7 #15
marybourg May 7 #16
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #20
slightlv May 7 #31
ChazInAz May 8 #36
Mosby May 7 #17
PoindexterOglethorpe May 7 #21
Buckeye_Democrat May 7 #22
marybourg May 7 #23
Buckeye_Democrat May 7 #24
marybourg May 7 #26
wackadoo wabbit May 7 #34
marybourg May 7 #35

Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:13 PM

1. Move to Texas

Right now it seems worse than AZ, but demographically, it is possible to make Texas Blue more readily than we could make AZ sane.

If TX does flip, the GQP is officially over at the national level...of course, you would probably want to stay in Austin or Houston or San Antonio...

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Response to Moostache (Reply #1)

Fri May 7, 2021, 01:49 PM

14. Having lived in N.M., I've met a lot of Texans.

Maybe they weren’t at their best when partying in N.M., but it’s hard to consider the desirability of moving in with them.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:13 PM

2. I would say we need all the blues to stay.

we helped elect President Biden. yes the asshats are doing asshat things to try to stay in power, but their desperation just shows how out of touch they really are.

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Response to Kali (Reply #2)

Fri May 7, 2021, 01:46 PM

13. Until now I felt that way, too.

But I’m hitting a wall here, now.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #13)

Fri May 7, 2021, 03:32 PM

18. are you in Maricopa county?

try Tucson?

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Response to Kali (Reply #18)

Fri May 7, 2021, 05:20 PM

25. Yeah, but it's not M.C. that's the problem. It's the state

government. They may not be “counting” your ballots, but they’re still the duly elected government of your state. I did check out Tucson when moving to AZ, but frankly I found it too much like ABQ, that is, too small town. The restaurants were better, however, than both ABQ and PHX. I hope you’re able to enjoy them!

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Response to marybourg (Reply #25)

Fri May 7, 2021, 06:50 PM

29. heh, I'm 50 miles east of there, so not often! but enough.

I agree, Tucson is similar to ABQ. small city but pretty good restaurants and fair music and arts community. funny, my sister in law is moving back to Tucson from ABQ, she and husband are drama instructors, playwrights, etc. not moving for political reasons, his health is not great so closer to families and little bit lower altitude from their place NE of the city.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:14 PM

3. I'm only here because it's affordable and I'm a homeowner ...

The only other state I'd live in is CA (where most of my family is), which I can't afford, so this is just a nearby option that's affordable.

This Fraudit and voter suppression shit has definitely gotten me very pissed at this place in general but I feel pretty tied down. Just re-fi'd the house too, so ... yeah.

Likely going to suck it up for a bit, and try to be part of the solution.

Saying I 'belong here'? Not likely words I'd ever use

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:23 PM

4. Like Savoire Faire, I've lived here and there. I lived in AZ and other areas, now I live in

New Mexico and love it.

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Response to abqtommy (Reply #4)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:39 PM

5. Been there. Done that.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:45 PM

6. Move to New Mexico.

I came here in 2008 from Kansas, and it was the best move I could have made. The southern part of the state is more Republican and conservative, but mostly not right-wing. Albuquerque and north is all good. I'm in Santa Fe.

I lived in AZ twice: Tucson in the 1960s, Phoenix in the 1980s. I can't imagine going back there to live.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #6)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:50 PM

8. Tried NM. Not for me.

I’m sure it’s better now. I lived there 35 years ago. Spaghetti was the only pasta. Restaurants had no a.c.. “Car Wash” meant *you* washed your car with their water. And that was all in my first day or two. I did say I was a N.Y.-er.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #8)

Fri May 7, 2021, 04:36 PM

19. It is vastly different now.

There are real Italian restaurants. They all have a.c. Real car washes. This state has changed for the better in those 35 years. I lived in Phoenix 35 years ago and clearly it's gotten worse by every measure in the same length of time.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #19)

Fri May 7, 2021, 05:36 PM

27. That's good. Do they still advertise regular

(homogenized) supermarket milk as “homo milk”? Do they still want to come and inspect your house if you work from home? That would have gone over well this past year. Do they now have restaurant servers who have themselves ever eaten in a restaurant? I would imagine “yes”, by now. I know there are even national stores, like Costco.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #27)

Fri May 7, 2021, 06:11 PM

28. I've never seen milk advertized that way.

I don't work from home but somehow I don't think they are doing that. And restaurant servers here are every bit of the range from inept to incredibly good as I've experienced in the many places I've lived in or visited.

I feel like you are describing some totally podunk place from the 1930s. That is not remotely the New Mexico I've experienced.

Better yet, this is a state that makes voting incredibly easy. Lots and lots of early voting, and so long as you are in your own country you don't need to care about a specific precinct. Show up, tell them who you are, and they print the specific ballot you need on the spot. Fill it out, it goes into a machine which will spit it back if you've done something like double vote.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #28)

Fri May 7, 2021, 06:55 PM

30. Yes, it felt very much like the 30's did on the east coast, but it was

the late 1980’s. I remember huge lines for voting, which was day of, only. Also - waiting in MVD for new license, but couldn’t get license until another applicant showed up to get their picture taken, because they had a camera that took 2 pictures on 1 frame, so they didn’t develop it until they had 2 pictures. I lived there about 1750 days. I have about 1700 anecdotes.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #30)

Fri May 7, 2021, 08:06 PM

32. It is so completely unlike that now.

The MVD does not do two pictures. Possibly the easiest voting in the country other than not having same day registration. When I lived in Phoenix and went to vote in some kind of election, I went to my usual polling place and surprise, surprise, it was somewhere else. Needless to say, there had been no notification of the change. Here, no sweating the exact polling place. How vastly better a system.

Your experiences here are nearly 40 years ago and it's a completely different state. You should check it out with an open mind. As I said before, this state has moved forward enormously. Arizona has gone backward. Not that it was that wonderful then.

Shortly after we moved to Phoenix, a mayoral election took place. It was an important election because no matter which candidate won, it would mean a change in the fundamental power structure that had been running the city since 1948. We both registered to vote, but decided to sit out the election because we felt we didn't know enough about the issues or the candidates to make an informed choice. On election day, my husband was out of town and so when we spoke I said, "Oh, by the way, Terry Goddard won the election." He said he'd tell his Phoenix co-workers who were on the same business trip with him. So when he saw them at breakfast the next morning he gave them the news. They both said, "Huh? Who? What are you talking about? What election?" At that point one of them had lived there seven years, and the other for eleven, and they were convinced that so long as they didn't have to brush snow off their cars in the middle of winter, nothing else mattered.

And that was the attitude I found over and over. No involvement in anything else. Indifference to the quality of the public schools. Not even being aware of an important mayoral election. Not even taking kids to the park on a wonderful winter day.

While I agree that brushing snow off my car in the middle of winter isn't fun (although my car lives in the garage, which is actually highly unusual here in Santa Fe) it is simply not the only thing that affects quality of life.

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Response to PoindexterOglethorpe (Reply #32)

Fri May 7, 2021, 09:25 PM

33. Glad to hear that N.M. has moved forward.

And that you’re obviously enjoying living there.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:49 PM

7. Your Democratic votes will continue to help there.

If I moved to Arizona, I'd probably want to live near Flagstaff.

The people in that part of AZ seemed nicer and better educated compared to others, in general, when I vacationed there for a couple weeks.

That area is more Democratic too, as I later learned.

I don't know much else about AZ, obviously, like the cost of living at various locations.

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Response to Buckeye_Democrat (Reply #7)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:59 PM

11. If I was willing to live with Flagstaff weather, I'd have stayed in N.Y.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #11)

Fri May 7, 2021, 01:04 PM

12. Oh, okay.

I preferred the weather there! Lol!

Most of Arizona was too dry for me, but different strokes for different folks! And it was cooler at the higher elevations.

I certainly didn't mind the low humidity when it was hot, though! Similar temps with Ohio's humidity would be pure hell, but it didn't feel that bad in AZ.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:56 PM

9. Don't move to Ohio they're getting just as bad.

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Response to blueinredohio (Reply #9)

Fri May 7, 2021, 12:57 PM

10. And the weather's not as good.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 02:04 PM

15. I left in April.

Lived in Tucson from 1979. Liked it a lot: much more liberal than Springfield, Illinois where I grew up. (Born in Budapest.) Good theater community for an actor. But the republican state government belonged entirely to big business, and gradually grew crazier and more corrupt over time...accelerating alarmingly in the past few years.
In February, I had the opportunity to fulfill a life-long dream. I bought a church in Atchison, Kansas, and have been converting it into a theater.
This audit stunt is exactly the sort of thing I expect from the appalling legislature. Just look up AZScam and the more recent alternate auto fuels boondoggle to comprehend their level of clumsy criminality.

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Response to ChazInAz (Reply #15)

Fri May 7, 2021, 02:13 PM

16. That's great! Wish you all the best!

And I remember both the boondoggles you mention.

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Response to ChazInAz (Reply #15)

Fri May 7, 2021, 04:38 PM

20. Oh, dear lord, Kansas?

That's going from the frying pan into the fire.

I moved here from Overland Park, KS, which is actually a pretty blue and liberal part of the state, but that's another place that has gotten steadily worse in the past decade.

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Response to ChazInAz (Reply #15)

Fri May 7, 2021, 07:28 PM

31. Wow! Hello Neighbor!!! Welcome to the area!!

Atchison is my birth city. Lived there from birth to when I left at 18 for the Air Force! Lived several places since then, but moved back to Leavenworth after my discharge. In a way, we're gonna be neighbors!!

Atchison is a really sleepy little town. I think I'd go nuts there now. The big highlight for teens is driving up and down the "main" downtown streets.

BTW, if I could ask... which church building did you buy?

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Response to slightlv (Reply #31)

Sat May 8, 2021, 12:46 AM

36. It's a beauty.

Belonged last to a splinter Latter Day Saints group. Built in 1900, it's on the corner of North 9th Street and Santa Fe.
I have fellow transplanted Tucsonans near by with whom I worked for five years running a haunted house in that desert city. I'm in good company!
Planning on opening in October with "Spoon River Anthology", and showing classic films on the big screen.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 02:56 PM

17. Phoenix has everything

Recreation, food, arts, sports, skiing and boating reasonably close, close to cali, Vegas, Tahoe.

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Response to Mosby (Reply #17)

Fri May 7, 2021, 04:41 PM

21. 100 degree temps at midnight.

Old people hanging out all day in a shopping mall because they can't afford the a/c.

When we lived there in the early 80s and had a young child, I'd take him to the park a couple of blocks away. Invariably I was the only mom with a kid there. We never did figure out what the supposed "outdoor life style" was unless people were thinking in terms of sitting by the pool drinking a margarita.

I mean, even on the days when it makes sense to live there, in January or February when it's 72 degrees out, clear skies, absolutely gorgeous, I'd not see another mom. And this was in a very residential area.

My husband once remarked that the only way to dress for the heat was to wear an air conditioned car.

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Response to Mosby (Reply #17)

Fri May 7, 2021, 04:43 PM

22. It was all right-turns for me in that city.

I've never been to a place that was so near-impossible to ever make a left turn.

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Response to Buckeye_Democrat (Reply #22)

Fri May 7, 2021, 05:06 PM

23. Then you never lived in the suburbs of N.Y.

We lived 65 mi. from the city and couldn’t make a left turn out of our leafy suburban street. That’s exactly when we decided it was time to retire. 35 years ago. Tried N.M. first, but it was like another planet. And not in a good way. Have been very happy in a distant suburb of Phx, but I’m thinking we’re in a whole new world of rw nut-jobbery now.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #23)

Fri May 7, 2021, 05:15 PM

24. Yep! I still haven't even visited NYC.

I'd like to go there someday, to at least experience it. Maybe after the pandemic is clearly behind us.

Phoenix might seem small to you.

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Response to Buckeye_Democrat (Reply #24)

Fri May 7, 2021, 05:23 PM

26. No. After having lived in N.M., I tell people that PHX is like London

and Vienna to me.

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Response to marybourg (Original post)

Fri May 7, 2021, 11:36 PM

34. My late husband grew up in Arizona

He always said that the state was much more "liberal" (we're grading on a curve here) in recent years than it was when he was a kid.

Most of the state isn't a problem; think of all the progressive initiatives that have passed in the last couple of decades. The problem is that the right has literally fallen off the edge and become more and more unhinged. But that's happening in all states, not just Arizona.

Trump revealed the shadow of the U.S.'s collective unconscious and, by so doing, made it acceptable for this dark craziness to show itself. That's what we're seeing now. This country is in for a bumpy ride, no matter where in it you go.

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Response to wackadoo wabbit (Reply #34)

Fri May 7, 2021, 11:38 PM

35. Yes, I think you've nailed it.

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