Need support for Klobuchar and Franken in Primary Debates

[MaxRobes]

Fellow Minnesotans: If you want a series of Democratic primary debates this cycle please join this thread which is also cross posted in the front page Politics section. I am advocating that both Al Franken and Amy Klobucher belong in those debates. See if you don't agree with the following.

Hey, it is still only March, 2015. Let’s set aside for the moment the question of who will get our vote the first Tuesday in November, 2016 and let’s even set aside who will get our vote in the Democratic primary elections or caucuses in each state; plenty of time for all that. Instead let’s seriously consider who we would like to see in the Democratic Primary Debates. Now some may say we don’t want any damn debates. If you are one of those, go start your own thread. This is for those of us who think there is a real battle to be had over the very soul of the Democratic Party and we want to see substantive policy issues discussed openly, far and wide. So if this matters to you, please weigh in here. Who would you like to see in those debates? Let me begin.

There are three obvious choices that I believe will make most everyone’s list. I would simply like to see how these possible candidates present themselves in this forum.
Elizabeth Warren. I want her there. She can start off by saying “Don’t vote for me, I’m not running.” She should be there anyway. We all know why.
Bernie Sanders. I want to hear the old Socialist let’em have it with both barrels. That alone would be worth the price of admission.
Martin O’Malley. I don’t know much about him but I would like to. He might actually be electable as our VP nominee. That’s a little odd because most Dems don’t know him from Adam. Let’s fix that.

There are also three other folks who are certainly familiar if not obvious choices. I’ll call them the old guard. Here I am genuinely curious to know how these war horses assess the state of the nation and the state of democracy in America. I would like to see what direction they point and what pennants they fly.
Al Gore. He did win the popular vote in 2000 and he was right as rain about “The Inconvenient Truth.” He needs a chance to say, “I told you so”, and do it on a national stage. We need someone to champion the planet in these debates. Who better?

Howard Dean. Yah I know. “The Scream”. So what? He was right about the war in Iraq. He was right about the fifty state strategy. He is often right and reasonable on a wide range of other issues. His great mistake was to be four years ahead of the country. He knew in 2003 everything that was wrong with George Bush and his presidency. He had the courage to say it when few in the national spotlight dared to say it. It took the nation another four years to figure it all out. They’re slow learners. I’d like to remind folks of that by having Howard Dean on our debate stage.

John Kerry. John is a blow dried fluff ball but he looks like he should be president. I’m okay with him being there just to dress up the proceedings. It is also true that he is really being dragged through a knot hole in the Middle East as Secretary of State; he might surprise us and actually say something interesting.

Now I will go out on a limb and advocate two new names rarely heard that I feel belong on this debate stage. I happen to be from their home state. I am confident they would both hold there own.

Al Franken. Senator Al Franken. Newly re-elected and standing a little taller, he has the potential to bring a fresh outlook to the debate. He would attract younger viewers and happens to be a man of Jewish heritage not walking in lock step with AIPAC, Likud and Netanyahu. In short, he might be able to say things others on that stage dare not say.

Amy Klobuchar. This Minnesota Senator has one of the highest approval ratings in the Senate, is very well like and respected across Party lines, and has a winning communication style in her public appearances. Amy is baggage free. She would do well in these debates and she would wear well in the general election falderal, in my opinion. Full discloser, I am Amy’s local campaign manager though she doesn’t know that. She has never heard of me.

So by now someone is surely yelling, “What about Hillary?” Where is Hillary? Well okay. Yes, Hillary should be in these debates. I am also genuinely interested in learning where she hopes to take the nation and the Democratic Party. (Strange, isn’t it, we don’t know that, sitting here today?) My only suggestion in this case is that Bill also needs to be on that stage, sitting right behind Hillary, tied to his chair, with his mouth duct taped shut. That is, after all, what her presidency would look like on day one, should she win, until Bill pulls the tape off.

So there you have one potential set of debaters, nine in all. Well, nine and a half. So who are your nine? I demand to know. No shirking allowed.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

1. Not Klobuchar.

She waffles on everything, avoids controversy, and her staff people are rude. If you contact her office to find out where she stands on an important issue all you get is a bunch of noncommittal gobbledygook. I'd really like to see an actual progressive primary her.

[MaxRobes]

2. I think she is progressive on economic issues and rarely votes the wrong way by my lights.

She does keep a low profile on all the usual controversies, but that is smart in my opinion. Can you give me a few examples of where you think she is simply wrong on the issues.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

4. Usually she just waffles, but sometimes she's just wrong:

Last edited Sun Mar 29, 2015, 04:43 PM - Edit history (1)

In August 2007, she was one of only 16 Democratic senators to vote in favor of the "Protect America Act of 2007," which was widely seen as eroding the civil liberty protections of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. In 2011, she introduced the "Commercial Felony Streaming Act," a bill that would make unauthorized streaming of copyrighted material for the purpose of "commercial advantage or personal financial gain" a felony under US copyright law. This bill was backed by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and praised by industry groups even though it could possibly be used to prosecute ordinary people who post some videos on public sites such as YouTube. Even though she voted for the ACA, she was in favor of repealing or reducing one of the sources of funding for it - the tax on medical devices.

The main problem with her, though (IMO), is that she often refuses to state her position on controversial issues. This isn't "keeping a low profile"; it's just political cowardice. I used to send her office emails asking whether she would support or oppose certain legislation and urging her to do one or the other, but I don't bother any more because the answer was always some canned bullshit like this:

"Dear Ocelot,

I appreciate your contacting me about this important bill now before Congress. I will be carefully considering this legislation and you can be assured that my vote will support the interests of the people of Minnesota. I have also introduced a resolution to designate the cat the official animal of the Internet, which promises to receive bipartisan support. Please visit my website to learn more about my efforts to make America nicer, and to contribute to my campaign.

Thank you for supporting Amy Klobuchar for Senate. Please like me on Facebook!"

I want my senator to have guts like Paul Wellstone. Klobuchar seems to prefer to try to please as many people as possible by telling them as little as possible.

[scarletwoman]

5. Perfect!

I have also introduced a resolution to designate the cat the official animal of the Internet, which promises to receive bipartisan support.

Yup, that's Amy in a nutshell! Great post, thank you!

[dflprincess]

9. Exactly right nt

[question everything]

21. At least you got a reply

We just moved to Minnesota in 2002. We were not even registered to vote. Yet, I emailed Paul Wellstone about a specific topic and he replied on the topic!

Both Klobuchar and Franken just send canned reply. In one case - not even about the topic.

Yes, both are "Minnesota Nice" but I am not aware of any area where they distinguished themselves. Certainly not Klobuchar. I do remember, though, that one of the first acts of Franken was to promote therapy dogs for PSTD veterans.

[glinda]

7. She Co-Sponsored the Bill that allowed wolf hunting for sport.

She comes from a hunting family. THIS is NOT the issue but she has appeared to favor sport shooting over environmental reality. Her record on the Environment is not totally unfortunate but not great either. She is also on the Ag Committee and I see no offer to halt GMO and toxin patterns and Mega-Farming so prevalent in our State. She is pushing this in Cuba. Seriously bad news since they are known for their Organic Farming.
Amy's position as Blue Dog is a contributing threat to moving in the direction I would hope for on this Planet in general. She lacks support for alternative energy job creation but instead focuses upon mining, etc.....
I hold the same position when I first met her before she ran for Office...."what is this Republican doing here?"

[MaxRobes]

11. So Velveteen I give up, no convincing you on Amy. How about just supporting a full series of

primary debates that include some fine politicians from Minnesota. How about Franken and Keith Ellison? And Mark Dayton has as fine a record to run on as any other Governor out there. Minnesota is one of the bluest and most progressive states in the nation and we happen tohave a better then average crop of politicians now in office. If the folks at Minnesota DU won't support them, who will?

[dflprincess]

12. Who are they supposed to debate?

BTW - you won't convince many of us on Amykins. Though I'll give her credit for this, her staff writes the best non-response response emails I've ever read. Just don't call them and dare to question anything Amy is doing as stated above, they are very rude. I had more enjoyable and productive conversations with Norm Coleman's staff when I was calling to tell them what weasel I thought their boss was.

[MaxRobes]

13. They are supposed to debate Hillary Clinton ... and Martin O'malley, etc.

If and only if there ever are any primary debates this cycle.

[dflprincess]

14. They can't participate in debates without deciding to run themselves

and I don't think any of them are inclined to do that.

And, as none of them (except maybe Amykins) has any delusions about higher office, I would prefer they stick to the jobs they're doing so well rather than waste time and money on a symbolic campaign.

[MaxRobes]

16. My aasumption is that many would like to run but do not because the Clinton

machine has frozen the field. See my thread on worries about the Clintons.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

15. I agree that Minnesota has some very good people, but

if none of them are running for President (and as far as I can tell none of them intend to do so), how can they be included in the primary debates? I've never heard of a primary debate series that included people who weren't declared candidates, and I very much doubt that this would be allowed. There is an organization called the Commission on Presidential Debates that is responsible for setting them up, and it states on its web site that "its primary purpose is to sponsor and produce debates for the United States presidential and vice presidential candidates and to undertake research and educational activities relating to the debates." http://www.debates.org/index.php?page=about-cpd

No matter how excellent Franken, Ellison, Dayton and even Klobuchar may be, if they aren't actually presidential or vice-presidential candidates, how can they be involved in debates? - Unless some separate series of debates is organized involving non-candidates, and which nobody will pay any attention to because they aren't candidates. Guess I don't see the point.

[MaxRobes]

17. Yes, of course. That's why I posted this thread on the Minnesota forum to generate

support for the idea we need primary debates and to encourage Minnesotans to contact Franken, Klobuchar, Ellison, and or Dayton and ask them to run. Think globally, act locally, that's my motto.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

18. Announcing you are running for pres just to be elegible to participate

in primary debates strikes me as kind of bogus, and I doubt that any of those people would run unless they were truly serious about going the whole way - which requires not only the desire to actually be president, but an enormous amount of financial backing. Not gonna happen and I'm not going to waste my time tilting at that windmill.

[MaxRobes]

19. No, they would get in the debates by running for President. Really.

That is what this entire two thread exercise has been about. Identifying and recruiting more viable Democratic candidates to run for president because I am unconvinced that Hillary is the be all and end all of Democratic politics. But if you don't want to write Al Franken an e-mail and urge him to run for President I will understand.

[Thor_MN]

3. I take it the half is Warren since she isn't running?

Demanding? Interesting. Not very Minnesotan of you.

Welcome to DU.

[MaxRobes]

8. No, the half is Bill Clinton tied to chair and duct taped, sitting behind Hillary

[progree]

6. In case anyone is wondering, neither Klobuchar nor Franken are up for Senate election in 2016

I know their Senate elections is not what the OP is about, but the comments about Klobuchar got me wondering if she is up for reelection in 2016. I had to look it up to be sure. Well, she was last elected in 2012, so won't be up for election again [font color = red]until[/font] 2018. Franken, of course was just reelected last November, so he won't be up for election until 2020.

So we Minnesotans have got a U.S. Senate-less election coming up in 2016. (But all state senators are up for election in 2016 - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minnesota_Senate ).

[font color = red]On edit - changed "in" to "until" in red in the above[/font]

[dflprincess]

10. If you want a spineless Centrist

who'll smile at us while selling us out to Wall Street, Amy is your candidate.

[Jenoch]

20. I admit that I have not yet read the replies

to this thread, but what am I missing? Have Senators Klobuchar and Franken shown any interest in running for president in 2016?

[question everything]

22. Not them, but for some reasons, others do

http://fivethirtyeight.com/datalab/some-democrats-who-could-step-up-if-hillary-isnt-ready-for-hillary/

Two names popped up, though, that were more surprising. Senators Sherrod Brown of Ohio and Al Franken of Minnesota both raised a lot more money in their 2012 and 2014 campaigns, respectively, than we might have expected. Would they be running in 2016 if Clinton wasn’t?

[question everything]

23. Add CT gov Bob Malloy

And I agree with others. One has to run for the office to participate in the debate.

Of course, the party can, and perhaps should, have a debate about the issues regardless of presidential run.