Pittsburghers against Michael Vick breaks the 20,000 mark.

[Divernan]

"The silver lining in Vick coming to our beloved city is that we can use our voice to help prevent dog fighting here and to crack down on those people who are currently partaking in it. Did you call or email your representatives today? Tell them you would like them to support House Bill 113, Senate Bill B373, and House Bill 1469. Channel your disgust and outrage into something positive. Who knows how many dogs you could save? Keep sharing our posts to get the word out."

https://www.facebook.com/Pittsburghersagainstmichaelvick/photos/a.1038972956142833.1073741828.1038306939542768/1042773545762774/?type=1&theater

Here's a final parting image for you: (From The Lost Dogs by Jim Gorant, senior editor of Sports Illustrated):

“As that dog lay on the ground, fighting for air, Quanis Phillips grabbed its front legs & Michael Vick grabbed its back legs. They swung the dog over their head like a jump rope, then slammed it to the ground. The first impact didn’t kill it. So, Phillips & Vick slammed it again. The 2 men kept at it, alternating back & forth, pounding the creature against the ground until, at last, the little red dog was dead.”

Vick has been interviewed saying he really wants to get a dog; he misses having a dog. Yeah. He wants a dog the way a pedophile wants a 2 year old child.

[Divernan]

1. Please take action if you are a Pennsylvanian.

Three bills are currently being considered in Pennsylvania: House Bill 113 (for stiffer penalties), Senate Bill 373 (anti-tethering/severe weather), House Bill 1469 (dogfighting falls under RICO). All you need to do is email or call your legislator. Simply state your name and say you are a constituent and ask them to please support HB113, HB1469, and SB373.

[femmocrat]

2. K & R

They are planning a demonstration outside the next home game--- heard it on the news tonight. Hope there is a huge turnout.

[daa]

3. Here I thought the guy paid his dues. Eom

[Divernan]

4. Nope, he plea bargained to one federal count of transporting across state lines

instead of dozens of counts under Virginia's animal cruelty statutes. So he got sentenced to 23 months and served 18. If he'd been prosecuted and convicted under Virginia's laws, he was looking at up to 65 years

Here is what Virginia law provides in terms of sentencing for animal cruelty related crimes:
https://chrisdurant2000.wordpress.com/2011/01/02/michael-vick-was-wrongly-convicted/

In Virginia, a first offense that does not result in the death of an animal is a Class 1 misdemeanor, which carries a sentence of twelve months or less and a fine of up to $2500 or both. A person committing a second offense, or if the animal dies as a result of the first offense, is guilty of a Class 6 felony, punishable by up to five years in prison or, in the alternative, a prison sentence of less than a year or a maximum fine of $2500 or both. In addition, the owner of a dog or cat injured or killed as a result of cruelty is entitled to a damage award for the value of the animal or the damage done.

Just so we’re clear, Michael Vick was sentenced to 23 months and served 18. Hmm. Now, I am no math wizard, but that seems quite short of the potential maximum. Oh, and he did have to pay a $5,000 fine and another $100 in administration fees.

Why, you ask? Because Michael Vick was not convicted according the Virginia Animal Cruelty laws. Instead he was indicted in Federal Court and pled guilty to one (1), I repeat, one count of “Conspiracy to Travel in Interstate Commerce in Aid of Unlawful Activities and to Sponsor a Dog in an Animal Fight Venture”. An offense that carries a two to five year sentence. I am going to say this again because it’s important: ‘Vick was sentenced to 23 months and served 18 months’. Again, not quite two years and certainly short of the five year maximum sentence. But again, this is only for one count or offense. So Michael Vick has NOT paid his debt to society.

One count. This is unbelievable. Between 2001 and 2007 Michael Vick sponsored dogs in eleven fights. Additionally, he traveled to four states to purchase eleven dogs. Again, could this not be construed as 22 counts? Even with Vick’s meager sentencing this would have equated to 396 months or 33 YEARS!! And even at an absolute minimum, why was he not charged with four counts of the incredibly weak “Conspiracy…”?

But better yet, if he had been truly tried according to Virginia’s Animal Cruelty Laws he could have been tried for twenty dog fights and nine executions. SIXTY FIVE YEARS! Instead, he was again allowed to plead out (while serving out his Federal sentence) to ONE count of dog fighting (the single Animal Cruelty charge was dropped as a part of the plea agreement) and received a three year suspended sentence for time served on the Federal charges. The prosecutor (Virginia’s Surry County Commonwealth Attorney General – Gerald G. Poindexter) didn’t feel that the costs associated with transporting Vick to Virginia from Leavenworth penitentiary in Kansas was worth it. There was also another $2,500 fine which was suspended as well. Nice job, Poindexter. I am sure the good people of Surry County think you’re a real legal eagle, huh?

Some more of Chris’ great math – If Surry County had actually tried Vick they could have charged him with those 29 offenses and reaped $72,500 in fines. Another area I am not an expert in, is travel logistics, but I cannot imagine it would come any where near $72,500 to transport Vick the 1,160 miles (I Google Mapped it) – I mean, that’s $62.50 a mile!? They could have fueled an Abrams M1 armored tank (probably one of the world’s worst gas efficient vehicles) for the entire trip for a mere $3,420.

Another side note: Five of the surviving dogs rescued from Vick’s compound had to be put down. He was not held accountable for those either. But, according to Virginia law, he absolutely should have been. That would have brought the potential charge count up to 34 and another $12,500 for Mr. Poindexter’s ridiculous transportation fund.

Let me point out a few things that should sicken even the hardest of you that may be reading this. First, as if dog fighting isn’t vicious enough, the animals that did not meet Vick and Co. standards or lost their fights were executed. Now I do not mean that they were euthanized by a simple and clean (or slightly humane) method. No, these dogs were sadistically tortured and killed (at times by Vick’s own hands) using methods that required even a slight degree of premeditation and a strong degree of sociopathology – malice and forethought: HANGING, DROWNING, ELECTROCUTING, BLUDGEONED WITH A SHOVEL, SLAMMING THEM TO THE GROUND, et al. That kind of emotional detachment is truly frightening. If Vick and the others associated with Bad NewZ Kennels had done to humans what they did to these dogs, they would be mentioned in the same breath with Dahmer, Gacey, Manson, BTK and other notorious serial killers.

Vick is reported as having experienced an adrenaline rush and euphoric like high from his participation in this savagery.

Here’s a little tidbit for you:
“The FBI considers animal cruelty a predictor for violence and continued violent behavior… and is a considered factor when profiling serial killers.”
Nice, huh?

And if you can still overlook the glaring brutality committed by and on behalf of this man, then you seriously need to get your football shaped head out of your ass and consider the situation without Vick. Vick is just a man, he is not a football god, and he is not the savior of the sport as a whole. There are hundreds of quarterbacks between the current NFL rosters and those in the many colleges and universities around our country. Most may not have the talent level of Vick, but fortunately (to the best of our knowledge) they don’t have the violent pathology either.

As ridiculous as this is, even the Humane Society of the United States is jumping on the Vick bandwagon and is considering sponsoring Michael Vick to adopt a puppy. Vick is reported as saying it would:
“…be a big step in the rehabilitation process. I think just to have a pet in my household and to show people that I genuinely care, and my love and my passion for animals; I think it would be outstanding. If I ever have the opportunity again I will never take it for granted,” Vick told NBC, “I miss having a dog right now. I wish I could.”
There should be a massive public outcry calling for the immediate and unconditional resignation or simple termination of HSUS CEO Wayne Pacelle. This is an outrage. I seriously hope that anyone who previously gave or is thinking about giving to the HSUS will better spend their money supporting the law enforcing ASPCA or even better their local shelter.

“Junkies want drugs and pedophiles want children.” It doesn’t mean we give them to them. Vick is no different. Vick’s sentencing prohibited him from owning a dog until 2012. This man should never be allowed to own a dog. Let him explain to his girls what daddy did and why they cannot have that cute little puppy and live with the full weight of his actions.

[MattSh]

10. While it might not be personally satisfying...

Unless the prosecution kept open the possibility of reinstating the charges at a later date, then legally he HAS paid dues. More often than not, when a plea bargain is reached, some or all of the original charges are dropped and upon fulfilling his sentence, in the eyes of the law has paid his dues to society.

And often a plea bargain is made because the prosecution doubts they can either prove that charges or that prosecution would result in greater jail time.

Plea Bargain Basics: Negotiating a Lesser Crime | Nolo.com

A plea bargain is an agreement between a defendant and a prosecutor, in which the defendant agrees to plead guilty or no contest (nolo contendere) in exchange for an agreement by the prosecutor to drop one or more charges, reduce a charge to a less serious offense, or recommend to the judge a specific sentence acceptable to the defense.

As criminal courts become ever more crowded, prosecutors and judges alike feel increased pressure to move cases quickly through the system. Criminal trials can take days, weeks, or sometimes months, while guilty pleas can often be arranged in minutes. Also, the outcome of any given trial is usually unpredictable, whereas a plea bargain provides both prosecution and defense with some control over the result—hopefully, one that both can live with.

For these reasons and others, and despite its many critics, plea bargaining is very common. More than 90% of convictions come from negotiated pleas, which means less than 10% of criminal cases end up in trials. And though some commentators still view plea bargains as secret, sneaky arrangements that are antithetical to the people’s will, the federal government and many states have written rules that explicitly set out how plea bargains may be arranged and accepted by the court.

Complete story at - http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/the-basics-plea-bargain.html

[Sheldon Cooper]

11. I'm chuckling at the idea of you attempting to school Divernan

on basics of law.

[Divernan]

14. Vick's plea bargain was w/ the Feds; local good ole boys in VA just declined to prosecute.

Vick never entered into any plea agreement with the state of Virginia "justice" system. Federal prosecutors had no legal standing to drop charges of violation of state laws.

In fact, I actually do have a fairly complete knowledge of plea bargaining - in that I'm a retired law professor/trial lawyer (as well as 10 years as a staff attorney for a state legislature). If the unfortunate women who were victims of sexually rapacious pro athletes chose to pursue prosecution and go through the hell of testifying at a criminal trial - where their whole past sexual history would be considered "relevant" in cross-examination - AND their attacker was found guilty by a jury (always a crapshoot, but particularly when the accused is an award-winning athlete), THEN the victim could file a civil action for monetary compensation against the perp. And since the standard of proof is lesser in a civil action, the fact of guilt found in a criminal trial guarantees success in a civil trial - although again, the amount of compensation depends upon the whim of the jury. I can certainly understand rape victims choosing a fat, private compensation along with a do-not-disclose clause over waiting years for a criminal trial to come to a final resolution while having one's entire sexual history dragged into public view. Of course the victim is free to file a civil action without a prior criminal trial, but with much less chance of success, particularly in a "he said, she said" situation and where the jury is likely to pick up on the fact that the local DA did not prosecute the accused.

Aside: If you want to respond with a detailed explanation of the difference between standards of proof in civil versus criminal actions, go for it. Oh, or you could go for statutes of limitations - which vary crime by crime and state by state. But you'll be doing it for non-lawyer readers, not me, cuz I already know that too!

But please, stop distracting from the point of my OP, which is that Vick has gotten off very lightly for his sociopathic levels of greed and cruelty, and that there are laws pending in the state legislature, passage of which can be effected by the level of voter support therefor and passage of which would protect animals from cruel treatment.

You know, if a protest such as this in Pittsburgh, generates enough negative PR to influence the Steeler organization to not renew Vick's contract or to think twice before signing any other such athletes - even the ones who pay off their victims to shut up - that would be a step in the right direction.

[MrScorpio]

5. I'm wondering when the same sort of effort will be applied toward Big Ben...

Or does his long-standing sexist and abusive treatment against women not matter for whatever reason?

[Divernan]

6. Many comments in the Burgh that Dan Rooney wouldn't have put up with either of these guys!

[MrScorpio]

7. Well, it's quite remarkable that he's still flying under the radar

And has yet to be made accountable for his own behavior.

On one hand, the guy who did time for his crime can't be accepted under any circumstance, and on the other, the guy who only paid a settlement in a rape case would be cheered unconditionally were he to play.

Dogs matter, it seems... Women? Eh, not so much.

[Sheldon Cooper]

13. You won't get any love for Roethlisberger from me.

The guy's a creep and probable* rapist and I find him, and the rape culture surrounding sports in general, to be sickening. He should have been bounced from the team altogether but of course there's way too much money involved for something like that.

* I say probable only because technically he was not arrested or tried for any allegations. In The Court of My Opinion, there's no doubt in my mind that he's guilty of rape for the incident at the GA bar.

[Curmudgeoness]

8. I am baffled by that too.

I will admit that I don't get into any sports, so I don't understand the idolizing of players to begin with. But there are many Steelers who have done some horrible things and have not been "punished" by the fans. They tolerate a lot of bad behavior.

Then again, I think that most of the people who are opposed to Vick are not really fans, just like me. And if Vick does a great job with Pittsburgh, all will be forgotten. But not by me. The level of violence that Vick toward the dogs is creepy. Just for the record, I am disgusted by Big Ben too.

[840high]

9. +1

[Sheldon Cooper]

12. +2

And I agree that the fans will embrace Vick if he does well. All will be forgiven, in other words.