Nail....Meet Hammer

[quickesst]

The Daily Banter

Face It Sanders Fans, You’d Turn On Bernie In a Heartbeat If He Actually Won the White House
Chez Pazienza on September 09, 2015

"It’s tough not to admire Bernie Sanders. He’s a ferocious advocate for his constituents and the middle and working class as well as a guy willing to openly identify as a socialist in a country that’s always considered that a dirty word. Sanders is a genuinely decent guy and his voice in the Senate has been an invaluable one. He doesn’t mince words or pander and he doesn’t worry about much other than representing voters to the best of his abilities and sticking to his political guns as best he can. Even if you disagree with his worldview he deserves a good amount of respect for walking the walk in terms of being a man of the people.

With all of this in mind it’s easy to see why Sanders has a legion of supporters for his 2016 presidential campaign — and why those supporters are largely the kind of people you’ve already unfriended on Facebook because they won’t shut the fuck up about how Bernie is the Great Liberal Messiah come to save us all."

The rest here:
http://thedailybanter.com/2015/09/face-it-sanders-fans-youd-turn-on-bernie-in-a-heartbeat-if-he-actually-won-the-white-house/

[BlueMTexpat]

1. This is probably the best part

and it is something that I have been saying for a long time:

But here’s the problem: The office of the President of the United States is arguably the most establishment position in the world and anyone who ascends to it automatically becomes the head of a machine the left, by its very nature, dislikes and doesn’t trust. The left, certainly the strain of the left that would get behind someone like Bernie Sanders, is notoriously anti-authoritarian and while this doesn’t necessarily mean it wouldn’t be thrilled to see Sanders become the ultimate authority, it would make it suspicious of his intentions and actions from that point forward. The benefit of the doubt likely wouldn’t last for very long and former acolytes would quickly become attuned to signs of betrayal. And that betrayal would absolutely arrive at some point.

[fasttense]

10. Oh how the mighty are brainwashed

As if the presidency were merely a right wing tool. Power does not have to be RepubliCON or even conservative. You can use power in a liberal manner. When I was an officer in the Navy, I commanded troops. But I never was a conservative. My style of leadership was different than most Naval officers but in many ways my troops were more responsive and better organized.

FDR never had a problem using his power for liberal ideas and he kept getting reelected. FDR was very popular with liberals.

[SkyDaddy7]

12. FDR did many anti-Liberal things as well...

He went after farm workers, unions, sided with big business when politically convenient & locked up American citizens in internment camps. Many of these moves are what helped in ways to get him re-elected!

[Ellen Forradalom]

61. FDR had to practice politics in the real world

And it was an ugly business. He got some good things done, and did others that sowed the seeds for rebellion from the 60s onwards. In other words, he wasn't God. But I'd take an FDR over a Trump any day of the week.

[SkyDaddy7]

62. Over Trump? WTF?!?

Not sure where that came from...Of course, FDR like all POTUS have to practice politics in the real world & none of them are gods. Some here on DU think FDR was a Liberal God & did not wrong but he had his faults just like LBJ, Clinton & Obama. They all have done many good things while having to play politics in the real world.

[BlueMTexpat]

38. I am not quite sure how this response

has anything whatsoever to do with the paragraph that I cited.

Perhaps you meant to reply to someone else. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

Otherwise, your response is a total non sequitur.

[FarPoint]

2. I'm not convinced that many Sanders supporters are sincere.

I sense many social media, blogger- types are GOP,ers/ troll plants....The style of attack is that of Teabaggers rhetoric. So, it's difficult to even explore your post thread content with full measure. Many Howard Dean supporters can say, disappointment looms just around the corner.

[quickesst]

6. I think...

... that I should point out that there are Sanders supporters here who are not trolls, but do a damn good impression of them.

[FarPoint]

8. If that is true...

I'd say that the right wing media propaganda machine has a lot to do with imprinting their hate style journalism... It's a powerful tool they use..24/7 everywhere ya go...you see or hear them at the doctors office, hospitals, had stations, AM radio monopoly, ....effective enough to imprint onto a liberal progressive...

[SusanCalvin]

52. I actually hope you are right,

Because some of what I see strikes me as undermining his candidacy.

[quickesst]

5. Haha....

"Astroturfing is the practice of masking the sponsors of a message or organization (e.g., political, advertising, religious or public relations) to make it appear as though it originates from and is supported by grassroots participant(s)."

I don't think you know what you're talking about. It's an opinion piece by one person who I happen to agree with. It should go without saying that I do not include actual Bernie supporters in posting this piece. Unlike yourself, I will show a little decorum and not invade the Bernie Sanders group with inanities.

[NurseJackie]

7. +1 (Thank you) nt

[quickesst]

20. The fact...

... That I have enticed so many anti Hillary people to inappropriately post in this group is a badge of honor. Must have hit a big nerve.

[NurseJackie]

25. Ya done good!

It's often amusing to see the instinctive (read: not-thinking) swarming that some folks participate in. Whether it's alerting, or posting without taking a moment to notice the sub-group designation, or their repetitive use of debunked memes, recycled attacks, or overused/meaningless catch phrases, conspiracy theories, absurd outrage*, blind anger and irrational hatred... in my opinion, those things suggest a campaign that's plateaued and which is running out of steam.





*champagne glasses from Angie's List comes to mind

[quickesst]

28. I'll I'll drink to that....

... but make mine ginger ale.

[Half-Century Man]

9. They should rename that paper, "The Daily Blather".

In multiple meetings, gatherings, rallies, and online discussions, I have never heard Bernie Sanders described as a "Messiah" except by people trying to ridicule him or browbeat his supporters.
Bernie Sanders has promised us nothing more than lots of hard work and effort. Both, on his part, and on ours. He has reminded us of what the rewards are for our hard work. And outlined what the consequences are if we accept another round of the failed policies of the last 40 years.
There is no savior, but we can ind together and make the lives of the vast majority of us far better.

Progressives understand that, adherents of the status quo mock it.

[ybbor]

11. What you said^^^

Only hear messiah from those mocking, just like they did about Obama.

[Cha]

31. Yeah, and as quickesst says below.. "I've never actually heard, the annointed one, from a Hillary

supporter', either.. so why the double standard?

[quickesst]

40. I've been working all afternoon...

..... but I just wanted to say that I have challenged Sanders supporters on the coronation, it's her turn, anointed thing several times. So far, the overwhelming response has been a big can of...........................................

[Cha]

49. Double standard. They think it works for them. LOL

[quickesst]

50. Yep....

[quickesst]

14. And I have never heard....

... a single Clinton supporter who has ever spoken the words in regard to Hillary Clinton , The Anointed One, it's her turn, or the coronation. Exactly how to you address that? Could it be that is the impression Bernie supporters get? I have no doubt that if Bernie Sanders is elected president, and is not able to deliver Shangri La pronto, he will join the rest under the bus. Bank on it.

[chervilant]

15. + a gazillion

I've heard this assertion--Senator Sanders described as a "Messiah;" his supporters derogated--ad nauseam. It's as though HRC's supporters are working hard to convince themselves it's true.

A video of HRC's "lies" has gone viral, yet not one of her supporters from this forum has discussed with me what we must do to prevent the Republicans from successfully derailing her campaign using this and similar videos. If she wins the nomination (and, IMHO, that's a BIG if), we will have to contend with these and other issues, including the surveys that show that over 60% of those surveyed associate the word "liar" with HRC. That's just not going to garner support in the GE.

On the other hand, quite a number of people have become energized and engaged by Bernie Sanders' campaign. Senator Sanders has changed the political dialogue in our nation, and for that he has my undying gratitude. His awareness of the destructive and stultifying radical income inequity inflicted upon the vast Hoi Polloi by a handful of corporate hedonists (which for years has been a near constant concern for me and countless other US citizens, forced into marginalized existences by the corporate juggernaut) gives me hope that our nation can recover from this inequity, and provide a meaningful future for our younglings.

I consider this election the most critical one in my lifetime. Our younglings deserve a better future than the one we have thus far -- through action AND inaction -- bequeathed to them. I think Senator Sanders has a clear grasp of what needs to change, and I join the millions of other members of the vast Hoi Polloi in supporting him for our next President of these United States.

[OilemFirchen]

18. Here's an idea:

A video of HRC's "lies" has gone viral, yet not one of her supporters from this forum has discussed with me what we must do to prevent the Republicans from successfully derailing her campaign using this and similar videos.

You could stop assisting them.

[chervilant]

19. Did I link the video?

Did I suggest where to go and view it?

[OilemFirchen]

21. Nope.

But you did pen this:

... including the surveys that show that over 60% of those surveyed associate the word "liar" with HRC...

... which is an irrelevant pseudo-statistic typically slogged by the right-wing.

[chervilant]

22. Well, color me not surprised.

I see how survey research is only relevant and scientific if it supports a certain POV. Very clever.

[OilemFirchen]

26. What point of view is that?

That word clouds are toys for the easily distracted? That Republicans hate Democrats - specifically Democrats who likely have an opportunity to despoil their political goals?

You've got me. That is my POV, yes.

[chervilant]

27. ...

[Cha]

33. Wake up! Hillary's going to be POTUS!!

[chervilant]

23. Here you are, OilemFirchen:

Here is the link, and now you can honestly aver that I am contributing to the dissemination of this research from Quinnipiac University, published by ABC news,

"..which is an irrelevant pseudo-statistic typically slogged by the right-wing."

[Cha]

34. Ya know.. your input really isn't needed. No thanks.

[Cha]

32. Nah, we're working hard to elect Hillary as POTUS.. This election after President Obama is

another critical one and I want Hillary to carry on his legacy.

I don't listen to the propaganda spread by the rwingers or the other end of the spectrum.

Hillary has the knowledge and the experience to build on what President Obama worked so diligently to accomplish. She didn't advocate to have him primaried like BS.. he doesn't grasp anything.

Hillary actually appreciates Progress.

[Cha]

30. That's your opinion.. The Daily Banter is actually a Reality Blog that doesn't deal in fantasy.

Tells it like it is.

[treestar]

13. Yes indeed. This paragraph says it all:

No matter how confident Bernie Sanders may be of his ability to change the status quo in Washington — and no matter how confident his supporters may be in him — in order to get anything at all done Sanders would be forced to compromise and pick his battles

[quickesst]

16. I call that...

... reality.

[baldguy]

17. And once that compromise happens, or he fails to get his policies enacted into law...

Bernie Sanders will become a corporate whore & RW tool of the 1%.

[Cha]

35. Yes, of course.. and all the times too many of them railed on President Obama for doing the

that very thing.. they'd be hypocrites not to do the same to BS.

[Rose Siding]

41. He'll be called a 'Used Car Salesman' so fast your head'll spin

Additionally, expletives likely

[murielm99]

43. Many of them were here,

and they were unconditional Obama supporters, until he was elected. No one dared to criticize, or even discuss, the parts of his policy and platform they disagreed with. Never mind that DU is a discussion board. Then, it only took weeks for some of them to turn on him.

I believed, then, and now, that it was time to do the opposite, once he became the candidate and the President. I did not support Obama until he won the nomination. Then I worked for him and supported him to the max. I did the same for him as President. He has put up with much more than past Democratic Presidents. And I remember that Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton were badly treated, too!

I still think we need to show more loyalty publicly, even when we don't agree with everything. There will never be a perfect President or candidate. Not when we are all still human.

[Cha]

57. Nicely said, muriel.. Fortunately for our Planet those who always want to bicker about everything

and not give acknowledgement when the Democratic President does well are in the minority in the Real World.

[SusanCalvin]

53. Of course. I'm sure he expects that. I know I do. nt

[Treant]

24. Mainstreaming

He's popular since he's currently the underdog (and also has no real responsibilities to go with the campaigning).

I think, for a while, people will be inclined to cut him a break. Presidenting is hard, we get that, and there's an adjustment period.

If, however, Shangri-La doesn't start to materialize after the first year (and it won't as it can't pass Congress), the criticisms will start. By year 3 he'll be more reviled than Obama among the purists because he will have learned that compromise is necessary when enough disagree to block your agenda.

No matter who gets elected, we either get total gridlock or Obama 2.0. There really is no other choice.

[quickesst]

29. Exactly

[Buzz Clik]

37. Well stated.

If, however, Shangri-La doesn't start to materialize after the first year (and it won't as it can't pass Congress), the criticisms will start. By year 3 he'll be more reviled than Obama among the purists because he will have learned that compromise is necessary when enough disagree to block your agenda.

Bingo, but your time frame is generous. He would have a grace period of about 100 days. The first time he called a GOP Congressional delegation into his office, half of his supporters would abandon him loudly and permanently.

[Hekate]

66. It'll happen a lot faster than that. Before the end of the mythical 100 Days...

...there were DUers who were screeching that Obama had thrown the gays under the bus and that he had "promised" single payer health care during his campaign. He did none of those things, but the caterwauling about betrayal was something to behold.

[Buzz Clik]

36. FANTASTIC!!!

This is a dead on analysis of those who naturally gravitate to people like Sanders.

I would love to see Sanders win just to demonstrate this phenomenon.

[quickesst]

39. Now......

...let's don't get carried away ....although the prospect is tempting.

[NastyRiffraff]

42. Is the writer a DU member?

The Sanders fanatics are hands-down the most insufferably self-righteous among the politically motivated these days, proudly aiming hosannas in the direction of any word that tumbles out of their candidates’s mouth and touting each and every poll that shows him gaining ground as proof that America is “feeling the Bern” and turning its back on literally everything it’s voted for up to this point in its history.

He could be describing posts on DU. What I didn't like about this writer, though, is that he painted "the left" with a broad brush. He seems to equate the left in general with Sanders supporters. I'm part of "the left," but I support Hillary Clinton but I know she's not a messiah. She'll just be a good President, who will do everything she can to keep her promises. Some of them she won't be able to keep, just like any U.S. President in history. We don't have a dictatorship in this country.

[quickesst]

45. I don't see....

...the broad brush that you do in relation to the left as a whole. Seems to be talking specifically about one candidates supporters, which I myself do not include all of them. They know who they are, and the sad part about it is, a lot of those who I don't include in that group take offense, and jump to the defense of those who are referenced in the article. They also should know who they are and not be so hasty in defending the indefensible.

[MohRokTah]

44. I'm pretty sure even Sanders knows this.

I'm pretty sure he also knows there's no way in hell he will be nominated.

[quickesst]

46. I don't see it either....

....and Hillary's nomination will not be, as some have claimed, a "coronation". She's running a superb campaign, and Bernie should have ran a better one. That's all there is to it, IMO.

[question everything]

47. This is what we saw with Obama

He was a blank card when many projected their hopes and wishes.

Once he took office, actually, once he clinched the nomination, many (at least here, on DU) immediately expressed disappointment.

[quickesst]

48. Exactly

I really don't think anyone will ever live up to the expectations some people set. Perpetual disappointment is not something I would want for myself. I take the good with the bad and try to make the bad better. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. That's life.

[SusanCalvin]

51. I gotta kinda agree somewhat.

I'm a Bernie supporter who was kicked out of the Bernie group for expressing exasperation with some posters' excessive rah-rah (as I perceived it). Interesting note - those posts were NOT in the Bernie group, yet I was kicked out.

Thank you for listening to my mild venting. I will vote for the Democratic nominee in the general.

[quickesst]

54. You are....

....a common sense, and thoughtful person, as I'm sure most of Bernie's supporter are. I give no credence to anyone here who will not support the Democratic nominee. There is a right choice, and there is a wrong choice. There is no middle ground when the possibility of a republican in the white house could become a reality.

[SusanCalvin]

55. Exactly.

[quickesst]

56. And right back at ya!

Up before sunrise tomorrow. Have a good night.

[Dawson Leery]

58. A Sanders/Trump debate next October is going to look ugly.

Neither will be able to explain how they will implement their controversial ideas, no will they be able to explain away the negative impacts.

[quickesst]

59. I think...

.... that debate could end in a toss up, whereas, in my opinion, Hillary would shred Donald Grump and expose him for The charlatan that he is.

[Dawson Leery]

60. +1,000,000

[wildeyed]

63. :snort:

OMG, he they are on his Facebook too!

and why those supporters are largely the kind of people you’ve already unfriended on Facebook because they won’t shut the fuck up about how Bernie is the Great Liberal Messiah come to save us all.

[quickesst]

64. Heh...

[Hekate]

65. That is a most pleasurable read. It's nice to know that we are not the only ones...

...to see right through this foolishness.

[quickesst]

67. I know

I thought Mr Pazienza was spot on. And you are right, it is foolishness.