Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
Sat Jan 8, 2022, 10:20 AM Jan 2022

This afternoon, 3:00 pm Paris time, French electricity is running at 55 g CO2/kwh.

https://app.electricitymap.org/zone/FR (Accessed 9:04 US EST, 1/8/22)

It is producing 45.3 GW of nuclear electricity, 3.54 GW of electricity using dangerous natural gas (representing 42.95% of its carbon emissions) and importing 626 MW from Germany, where the carbon dioxide output is 354 g CO2/kwh. (This minor contribution to French electricity, imported electricity from Germany, represents 5.42% of France's emissions.)

The largest source of electricity in Germany this afternoon, German time, is coal (23.1 GW), followed by wind (22.6 GW). For the benefit of humanity let's hope the wind keeps blowing in Germany, since the Germans will burn more coal if it stops. Solar is producing 4.70 GW of electricity in Germany, but the sun will go down in about 2 hours, suggesting more coal or gas (4.78 GW as of this writing.)

France is exporting electricity at this writing to Great Britain, Italy, Spain, and Switzerland, all of which have higher carbon dioxide impacts than France. Only Norway 24 grams of CO2/kwh, which has bottled up most of its mountain rivers for electricity, has a lower CO2 impact per kwh than France.

Paris is the "City of Lights," the city of sustainable lights.

Have a nice weekend.

10 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
This afternoon, 3:00 pm Paris time, French electricity is running at 55 g CO2/kwh. (Original Post) NNadir Jan 2022 OP
Update: 5:31a Paris time, French electricity at 48g CO2/kwh, and exporting to all its neighbors... NNadir Jan 2022 #1
Check out Estonia. hunter Jan 2022 #2
As of this writing 7:27 EST US, "green" Germany is running at 472 g CO2/kwh. It's a disgrace. NNadir Jan 2022 #3
"Green" Germany just went over 500 g CO2/kWh. NNadir Jan 2022 #4
At noon EST US 01/01/22, Germany's wind turbines are at 2.61%... NNadir Jan 2022 #5
From late Nov 2011 Finishline42 Jan 2022 #6
From Jan 1, 2022 Finishline42 Jan 2022 #7
And the point is what? NNadir Jan 2022 #8
I am not anti-nuke Finishline42 Jan 2022 #9
Yeah, right, a "I'm not an anti-nuke" anti-nuke who complains about cracks in a two nuclear... NNadir Jan 2022 #10

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
1. Update: 5:31a Paris time, French electricity at 48g CO2/kwh, and exporting to all its neighbors...
Sun Jan 9, 2022, 12:46 AM
Jan 2022

...except Spain: It's exporting 1.57GW to Germany, which is currently at 207g CO2/kwh because the wind is blowing and "only" 17.49% is coming from coal. It's also exporting to Belgium (95g CO2/kwh) whose power supply is dominated by nuclear energy, Britain (108 g CO2/kwh) and Italy (carbon info unavailable) but is importing from Spain (115g CO2/kwh), whose lone nuclear plant is producing 20.6% of the country's electricity as of this writing.

https://app.electricitymap.org/zone/CH

Switzerland (95g CO2/kwh) is now an interesting case, because all of the electricity produced internally comes from either nuclear energy or hydro, but the biggest contributor to its electricity related carbon emissions is what it imports from Germany and Austria, both of which are anti-nuclear countries.

It is before dawn in Europe and solar energy is producing zero energy in all these countries, making its capacity useless.

The carbon dioxide dumped by any nation at night or day will remain in the atmosphere indefinitely, since no technology is in place that can remove it even at the rate it is dumped on future generations.

Demand in Europe, as in most countries, is lowest just before dawn, particularly on a Sunday.

I trust you're enjoying the weekend.

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
3. As of this writing 7:27 EST US, "green" Germany is running at 472 g CO2/kwh. It's a disgrace.
Sun Jan 9, 2022, 08:29 PM
Jan 2022

It appears the wind isn't blowing all that well in Germany. The capacity utilization is 16.37%.

The difference is made up by burning coal and helping to kill the planet.

The only countries doing worse than Germany are Estonia, Poland, Bosnia, Latvia and Bulgaria, the latter, just barely.

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
4. "Green" Germany just went over 500 g CO2/kWh.
Sun Jan 9, 2022, 11:24 PM
Jan 2022

Accessed at 22:16 EST (US), 10:16P January 9, 2022: https://app.electricitymap.org/zone/DE

508 g CO2/kwh as of this writing.

As of this writing the same figure for France is 79 g CO2/kwh.

Apparently Germany feels it isn't "too dangerous" to dump highly toxic coal fly ash and the dangerous fossil fuel waste carbon dioxide directly into the planetary atmosphere when the wind isn't blowing.

I mean, it's not their fault the wind doesn't blow continuously.

A screen shot from about 10 minutes ago when it was 504 g CO2/kwh.



Play stupid games; win stupid prizes.

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
5. At noon EST US 01/01/22, Germany's wind turbines are at 2.61%...
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 01:20 PM
Jan 2022

...of capacity, are are actually produng less electricity than Germany's three remaining nuclear plants.

Coal is producing the largest share, 41.05% of it's electricity, followed by gas at 19.65%.

The German carbon intensity is 514g CO2/kWh. France, which is at an unusually high 99g CO2/kWh because the wind isn't blowing there either, is currently exporting electricity to Germany, the equivalent of three nuclear plants output.

France has about 17.2 GW peak of wind junk, but it's operating at 9% of capacity utilization, hence France is burning gas, accounting for 57.39% of its emissions of the dangerous fossil fuel waste CO2.

Finishline42

(1,161 posts)
6. From late Nov 2011
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 06:01 PM
Jan 2022

Unusual situation: electricity prices in France for tomorrow are the highest in Europe at €280 per MWh (baseload). https://t.co/H3xFkHJRnN pic.twitter.com/2cb0mJQEEZ— Kees van der Leun (@Sustainable2050) November 30, 2021

Finishline42

(1,161 posts)
7. From Jan 1, 2022
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 06:03 PM
Jan 2022
Two French nuclear reactors were shut down for inspection following the discovery of cracks in safety equipment. Also, multiple French nuclear plants are facing extended 10-year maintenance outages throughout 2022



?s=20

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
8. And the point is what?
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 07:16 PM
Jan 2022

It is typical of anti-nukes that they are scrupulously indifferent to the FACT that the German coal being burned today is killing people, since air pollution kills seven million people per year.

18,000 people died today from air pollution of the type today the Germans felt completely free to release because the wind wasn't blowing.

Was anyone injured by the shutdown of the nuclear plants, other than the coal burned in lieu of their operation by the Germans, or is it yet another case where paranoid people emphasize could over is? "Is" as in "Air pollution is killing people continuously.

The German wind industry was operating at less than 3% capacity utilization this afternoon, and Germany was adding to air pollution, which kills people continuously, and yet we have to hear about cracks in two nuclear plants.

Every fucking wind turbine on this planet spits out microplastics from cracks, before they turn to rot on average in less than 20 years.

Today, Germany, because the wind industry is unreliable, chose to dump dangerous fossil fuel waste - irretrievable and impossible to contain - because it embraced the lie that nuclear energy is "too dangerous" and climate change and dangerous fossil fuel waste are not "too dangerous."

This should be clear to any thinking ethical person on the planet, and yet, somehow, in defiance of reason and decency, it isn't.

Let me repeat that another way: The ethics of anti-nukes should disgust any decent human being.

Finishline42

(1,161 posts)
9. I am not anti-nuke
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 07:28 PM
Jan 2022

But I will point out the fault in your campaign as an advocate for nuclear power.

It's real simple...

The US has over 100 nuclear plants that produce 20% of our electricity. (BTW I think we should keep existing plants going as long as it's safe to do so).

There is absolutely no way we are building 100 or 200 nuclear power plants to increase that portion of our grid to 40 or 60%. We couldn't even complete the 2 reactors in South Carolina that were 50% complete.

The problem is easily...

NIMBY. Who wants one anywhere close to where they live?

The cost of the electricity produced isn't anywhere close to market

Nobody is going to pay for the cost of construction over the 10 years it takes before it produces the first watt they can sell. How the heck are we going to build 100-200 in 10 years?

NNadir

(37,959 posts)
10. Yeah, right, a "I'm not an anti-nuke" anti-nuke who complains about cracks in a two nuclear...
Mon Jan 10, 2022, 10:12 PM
Jan 2022

...nuclear reactors while 18,000 people die every damned day from air pollution.

...A "I'm not an anti-nuke" anti-nuke who is worried that the company decommissioning the bogeyman at Three Mile Island doesn't have enough insurance while over 70 million people have died from air pollution in the last ten years...

Is there anyone who fails to understand that I've been listening to this idiot rhetoric for almost two decades here, and longer elsewhere? I keep repeating: When I started here in November of 2002, my first exposure to this garbage thinking built around cut and paste posts from websites run by idiots, the concentration of the dangerous fossil fuel waste carbon dioxide in the planetary atmosphere was 372.68 ppm. Yesterday it was 417.81 ppm, a little over 19 years later.

Bourgeois rich white people don't want nuclear plants in their backyard? That's the problem? How about we put a gas plant in their back yard? Are they OK with that?

How about we shut the power down whenever the sun isn't shining and the wind isn't blowing? Rich people can install generators, of course, and they will, and they'll run them on gasoline or dangerous natural gas or propane without ever stopping to think for a New York second what that means.

Or how about we get a few million Congolese slaves to dig cobalt for our batteries and build a big battery mountain the size of Mount Whitney laced with nickel, cobalt, methyl ethyl ketone and, oh yeah, lithium?

Rather than trash wilderness, how about a 1000 giant wind turbines, grinding away whenever the fuck the wind blows at the edge of a gated community of people paying servants from the third world to wax their Teslas?

If, the Germans were required to pay for the people killed by the coal they burned, would our "market" worshipping Ayn Rand worshipping assholes still carry on about how cheap wind energy is for the few hours the wind blows, and fuck the rest of the times.

What fucking part of this graphic escapes the pixilated minds of the people pouring this oblivious shit out, year after year after year after year?



EIA European Residential Electricity Prices

You know what? I don't fucking worship "the market." I'm not fucking Ayn Rand. However, I note that requiring that we built two systems to do what one can do more cleanly isn't frugality. Quite to the contrary, it's a sybaritic drunken festival of stupidity and waste.

But I repeat:

The amount of money "invested" in so called "renewable energy" in the period between 2004 and 2018 is over 3.036 trillion dollars; dominated by solar and wind which soaked up 2.774 trillion dollars.

Source: UNEP/Bloomberg Global Investment in Renewable Energy, 2019. We spent this money for no result.

You know what Germany was doing today, while never falling below 480 g CO2/kwh, and spending most of the day above 500 g CO2/kwh? It was dumping waste that will be impact every generation hereafter, directly into the planetary atmosphere.

There is no commercial technology that can remove this waste. It's there essentially forever as far as human beings are concerned.

Modern Nuclear plants are built to last 80 years. The real problem is that this generation of wind and solar powered bourgeois consumer minded assholes is unwilling to leave a damned thing other than waste, ash, destroyed seas and destroyed atmospheres to future generation. If we cared a whit for future generations, we'd build nuclear plants for them, pay for them, and let all of the rewards of our efforts stand for a legacy of caring and love and hope for the lives they will lead, a gift to allow them to do the great things the humans might do in the absence of ignorance. Instead we do the opposite.

The United States built 100 nuclear reactors in about 25 years while providing the lowest cost electricity in the world. They were designed by people with slide rules rather than computers. Many of these reactors are still running decades later, although anti-nukes have done everything in their pernicious power to destroy these devices, destroy the institutions where they were studied and designed, caused nuclear engineering departments at major universities to shrivel, cheering for the destruction of valuable infrastructure designed by some of the finest minds that ever existed, all this while crowing a reactionary call to return to so called "renewable energy" that was abandoned largely in the 19th and early 20th century for a reason.

I resent being addressed as if I am stupid. And let's be clear. Chanting the same dogmatic drivel year after year at me here, while I watched carbon dioxide rise by over 45 ppm, is treating me as if I am stupid.

Numbers don't lie, but people do.

And whining "I'm not an anti-nuke" while dragging out every anti-nuke shibboleth of entrenched encrusted ignorance is not a remotely believable statement, not for a New York second.

I can only return contempt with contempt.

Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Environment & Energy»This afternoon, 3:00 pm P...