Shocking Nakba testimony by former Israeli Palmach fighter

[Scurrilous]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Lithos (a host of the Israel/Palestine group).

<snip>

"Ethnic cleansing, massacres, colonization and a great deal of racism are all revealed in this shocking video testimony of Amnon Neumann, who fought with the terrorist force (elite of the Haganah), Palmach, during the Nakba of 1948.

Neumann reveals that Moshe Dayan expelled Palestinians even as late as 1951!

Despite some moments of remorse, the former member of this terror group tells the interviewer that he refuses to talk about the massacres, in particular, because he participated in them. He also tries to portray Palestinian villages as all made of straw and mud houses!

Perhaps the selective amnesia that has afflicted almost all Jewish Israelis has not spared Neumann."

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/december292011/palmach-fighter.php

[aranthus]

1. Seriously?

The mere fact that Salem prints Gilad Atzmon should be enough to cause people to throw this one out with the fish. Seriously, you're better than this.

[Little Tich]

2. The testimony seems truthful to me.

It fits perfectly with what I already know about what happened in the Palestine Mandate at that particular period in history. That the Palestinians were driven out by various means is already well documented. There is nothing in the testimony that is new to anyone who is familiar with the I/P conflict.

Salem News may have pro-Palestinian bias, but the testimony stands on its own, and was originally from another source, silviacattori.net.

[oberliner]

3. Actually this particular article is originally from Electronic Intifiada's blog

That is where "silviacattori.net" took it from as well.

Though Electronic Intidada took the video from Zochorot and added their own commentary, which was reprinted (without attribution) on the "salem news" and other site.

The "warning to Palestinian refugees" for instance was originally made by Omar Barghouti of Electronic Intifada, though "salem news" does not make any such citation - indeed 3 of the 5 paragraphs (straw and mud houses, etc) were lifted from Barghouti's text in the Electronic Intifada blog post.

[azurnoir]

4. and silvia cattori's blog credits Omar Barghouti

http://www.silviacattori.net/article2602.html

but it is a valiant attempt at delegitimization indeed I credit you

are you frustrated that a source other than EI or a 'vanity" blog (both of which would be locked or removed) was found?

[oberliner]

5. Salem News ought not to need any help from me to be delegitimized

That anyone would think of it as a legit source to post from is startling.

It's certainly far worse than Electronic Intifada - in that it posts incorrectly attributed information as well as blatantly hateful material, the likes of which EI generally avoids.

[azurnoir]

6. and the circle completes two sources are forbidded for use here and one is delegitimized

as hateful but tell us is the material in the OP untruthful?

[King_David]

7. Ha, Oberliner completely nailed it

And the return was not so good .

As an observer :there was a lot of backpedalling, but no punch .

[azurnoir]

10. well that is your opinion but I would not expect any different

from the source thanx for your 'observations'

backpedaling eh you do understand the definition of that term right? exactly where did you find "backpedaling"?

[oberliner]

8. Alison Weir and Eileen Fleming are listed among Salem-News staff writers

That ought to be enough for anyone.

The OP is Omar Barghouti's (unattributed) opinion about a video from a year-old interview with someone. I don't doubt that he is truthfully stating his opinion.

The guy talking in the video is speaking in Hebrew. I can't speak to the accuracy of the English translation.

If we want to open things up to posting shocking things said on video, there are loads of Arabic-language ones translated into English and posted on sites with at least as much legitimacy as "salem-news" that I'm sure folks could dig up.

Do we really want to go there?

[azurnoir]

9. lol once again is the video honest or not?

as to "shocking video's" translated from Arabic being posted apparently you are not paying attention they are posted all the time here

[oberliner]

12. I have no idea

I don't speak Hebrew.

I don't know if the translation into English is accurate.

I don't know if the speaker is trustworthy - have never heard of him before.

[aranthus]

13. Neither does anyone else.

Last edited Mon Jan 2, 2012, 08:18 PM - Edit history (1)

Which is the point. If you have no basis for knowing if something is true or not, then the source and publisher are big clues. The fact that this is Omar Barghouti in Salem News by way of Silvia Cattori says something about whether it's legitimate. But those who want to believe the worst about Israel will continue to believe.

[Lithos]

16. I posted the link transcription from the people who conducted the interview in 2010 in my locking me

I would assume this is more or less a correct summary.

L-

[shira]

11. Nice little rogues list there....sleep with dogs, wake up with fleas! n/t

[Little Tich]

14. It seems as if the source (Salem news) is tainted,

for one with bias but also for cross linking to other sites that do not care too much about accuracy. I had no idea that EI was involved, but now I know. The events described in the video are impossible to discuss in the context of a contested source, I would very much ignore someone else who did something like that.

Please disregard what I said in my first post, it was hasty. Shitty source, unclear context, unverified translation; I'm not going to defend anything like that.

[Lithos]

15. I am going to be locking this thread for several reasons

1) The source as posted has definitely adlib'd from the original story. There appears to be a definite history of how this story has evolved from 2010, when the interview took place to the story making the rounds today.

2) The source of these additions is extremely biased and appears to have some relationship to people who have promoted anti-semitic materials in the past.

For the record, the original source (and the people who conducted the interview) is here (with the original transcribed testimony):

http://zochrot.org/en/testimony/amnon-neumann

I am not as familiar with Zochrot.org, but at first glance they appear to be more interested in establishing a rapprochment with the past and with today than not. Something which appears to be worth reviewing.

Regards,

Lithos