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Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 01:17 PM Sep 2014

List of public schools destroyed by the Israeli military in Gaza

02/09/2014

The United Nations Office for Humanitarian Affairs estimates that about 500,000 Palestinian children will not be able to return to school as normal in Gaza as a result of the War.

174 schools in Gaza were bombed and damaged.

26 public schools and 1 UNRWA school in Gaza did not open its doors at the beginning of the school year of 2014/2015 after being completely destroyed by the Israeli military.

30 other schools were not able to open because of the high numbers of displaced persons still residing in them.

447 children killed during the Israeli military attacks will not return to school at all.

http://www.adalah.org/eng/Articles/2323/List-of-public-schools-destroyed-by-the-Israeli-in

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List of public schools destroyed by the Israeli military in Gaza (Original Post) Jefferson23 Sep 2014 OP
and how many of those schools sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #1
If you know and or have a link to the conclusions of reports, please post it. n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #2
well we do know that sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #3
I am not aware of any such conclusions from UNRWA. They said exactly that? n/t Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #4
yes the did sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #5
Your earlier statement was: Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #6
so those sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #7
Who said they magically appeared, and I already stated what UNWRA said..it was a vacant school and Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #8
in the report you quoted sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #9
I know what it said, I posted it to you. Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #10
is hamas sabbat hunter Sep 2014 #11
I fail to see the point you're trying to make with your question about Hamas. Jefferson23 Sep 2014 #12
what we know is that UNRWA found weapons in previously vacated school buildings and how do we know t azurnoir Sep 2014 #13
Well, if Israel bombed them then they must have been guilty Scootaloo Sep 2014 #14

sabbat hunter

(6,827 posts)
1. and how many of those schools
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 06:30 PM
Sep 2014

were being used by Hamas as storage for weapons, rockets and missiles? How many were being occupied by Hamas terrorists to launch attacks from?


sabbat hunter

(6,827 posts)
5. yes the did
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 08:13 PM
Sep 2014

in fact they condemned it

http://www.unrwa.org/newsroom/press-releases/unrwa-condemns-placement-rockets-second-time-one-its-schools

AGENCY DEMANDS FULL RESPECT FOR THE SANCTITY OF ITS PREMISES IN GAZA

Gaza

Today, in the course of the regular inspection of its premises, UNRWA discovered rockets hidden in a vacant school in the Gaza Strip. As soon as the rockets were discovered, UNRWA staff were withdrawn from the premises, and so we are unable to confirm the precise number of rockets. The school is situated between two other UNRWA schools that currently each accommodate 1,500 internally displaced persons.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
6. Your earlier statement was:
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 08:33 PM
Sep 2014

*the UNRWA admitted that Hamas had taken over the schools for just such purposes.

Yet they do not lead to your conclusions. They condemn they found rockets in a vacant
school. You seem to be reaching for something more that will relieve Israel of responsibility
for the destruction listed in the OP I posted.

I would not count on that until all the inquiries are done. This is only a sample of what is
to come:

snip* But Hamas is to blame – right?

Israeli officials – military and otherwise – repeatedly state that the military is doing all it possibly can to minimize harm to civilians. However, they argue, Hamas is endangering the lives of the civilian population, and is therefore solely responsible for the consequences of Israel’s actions: people killed, injured or displaced, and homes and infrastructure ruined.

In this vein, in response to a joint letter by several human rights organizations, including B'Tselem, the Israeli Attorney General wrote on 5 August 2004 to Att. Tamar Feldman of Israeli NGO ACRI (Association for Civil Rights in Israel) that Israel is committed to upholding the law, but "terrorist organizations make cynical, criminal use of the civilian population as human shields in the face of IDF activity. In this reality, unfortunately, even legal, proportionate attacks carried out in keeping with international law may cause unintentional and unwanted harm to civilians and civilian property". Similarly, Israeli Chief of Staff Benny Gantz said in a press conference on 6 August 2014 that "the result in Gaza has been devastation, and the tragic blame lies with Hamas leaders, who operated from within concentrations of population".

Hamas did, indeed, violate international humanitarian law (IHL) during the fighting: its operatives fired at civilians and civilian locations within Israel, concealed weapons in civilian buildings and institutions in the Gaza Strip, and even fired from locations close to civilian structures or from within such structures. In doing so, Hamas endangered civilians within Gaza, forcing the civilian population to be a part of the sphere of fighting. Such conduct is unlawful, as B'Tselem has repeatedly stated and wishes to underscore once more.

However, Israel is wrong in shirking responsibility for the consequences of its actions and in laying them at Hamas' door. Israel and Hamas are each responsible for their own actions. The Israeli premise is faulty, on legal, factual and moral grounds:

From a legal standpoint, IHL – which stipulates rules of war for exactly such circumstances – actions during hostilities are not dependent on "reciprocity": one party's breach of the law does not give the other party carte blanche to do so. Israel is well aware of this issue. Therefore, along with depositing responsibility at Hamas’ doorstep, Israeli states it carefully abides by IHL. Those statements, however, issued by government and military officials, do not hold water:

Israel states that all the attacks on Gaza were only aimed at military targets – yet it defines "military target" so broadly that the term loses all meaning. In the last operation, the term came to encompass civilian buildings, such as the family homes of Hamas military operatives. This violates the fundamental IHL principle of distinction.
Israel states that all its strikes in Gaza were proportionate, and that the fact that civilians were killed does not in itself contradict that. Yet after dozens of strikes, each killing many uninvolved civilians, while Israel did not prove or even claim military gains significant enough to render such damage proportionate, this argument is no longer tenable. This conduct violates another central tenet of IHL – the principle of proportionality.
Israel states that the military warned residents in Gaza prior to attacks – but issuing warnings is not enough in itself. True, hundreds of thousands of Gazans – including children, the elderly and sick individuals – were given warning that they should leave their homes. Yet, if there is nowhere to go, when there in not always enough time to complete the evacuation, and when traveling is unsafe – as many Gazans reported in recent weeks – it is unreasonable to expect the entire civilian population to evacuate. Indeed, many civilians did not leave their homes, either for fear or because they could not. Under such circumstances, Israel should not have assumed that all civilians have indeed left their homes and fully heeded its warnings.

http://www.btselem.org/gaza_strip/20140811_a_death_foretold

sabbat hunter

(6,827 posts)
7. so those
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:02 PM
Sep 2014

rockets just magically appeared in the schools?

No, they did not appear by magic.
UNRWA condemned the use of the schools to store weapons. Those weapons were placed there by Hamas, (who controls Gaza), thus UNRWA is condemning Hamas.

IF there are weapons placed in the schools, they become legitimate military targets. Israel did the proper thing to warn civilians who might be inside to get out. Many a nation/group (including hamas) would just bomb civilian targets with no warning regardless if there were weapons inside or not.

Do you think that Hamas is above such things as placing military weapons, personnel in civilian buildings?

They are a cowardly lot, and as cowards do, they hide.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
8. Who said they magically appeared, and I already stated what UNWRA said..it was a vacant school and
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:12 PM
Sep 2014

you seem determined to rebuke B'tselem's statement, as well as concluded Hamas is responsible
for all the damage done to all the schools. Based on what I have no idea, as I said previously, the
inquiries are no where near over. You may feel Israel did not violate any laws, but you're not
really in a position to make that determination, are you?

To answer your question about what Hamas has done or not, I will wait for the reports.

sabbat hunter

(6,827 posts)
9. in the report you quoted
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:20 PM
Sep 2014
Hamas did, indeed, violate international humanitarian law (IHL) during the fighting: its operatives fired at civilians and civilian locations within Israel, concealed weapons in civilian buildings and institutions in the Gaza Strip, and even fired from locations close to civilian structures or from within such structures. In doing so, Hamas endangered civilians within Gaza, forcing the civilian population to be a part of the sphere of fighting. Such conduct is unlawful, as B'Tselem has repeatedly stated and wishes to underscore once more




So we know that Hamas has a history of doing just such things, so is it that hard to conclude that they continued to do so, and would indeed store weapons in schools?

Do you agree that Hamas is lead by a bunch of cowards?


Israel warned when they were going to attack such buildings. Could they have taken more care or given more warning? I do not think so for the most part. Hamas I think is about 90% to blame for civilian casualties due to their cowardly actions and Israel 10%.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
10. I know what it said, I posted it to you.
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:23 PM
Sep 2014

I will wait for the inquiries to be done. Israel's present and past history is abominable, they and Hamas
have nothing to celebrate.

sabbat hunter

(6,827 posts)
11. is hamas
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:39 PM
Sep 2014

just as abominable?

Oh and grammar nazi time. All history is past. You don't need to say past history.

Jefferson23

(30,099 posts)
12. I fail to see the point you're trying to make with your question about Hamas.
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 09:55 PM
Sep 2014

Hamas has a documented record as does Israel, they are what they are. Determining
who is more evil, I will leave that to you.

I see it this way, no matter who the players are..who has the ultimate power, political/militarily, who
is primarily responsible for the problem.


PMH..past medical history...inserted 'past' does have it's relevance.


azurnoir

(45,850 posts)
13. what we know is that UNRWA found weapons in previously vacated school buildings and how do we know t
Fri Sep 5, 2014, 11:12 PM
Sep 2014

Because UNRWA made public statements, the way it's worded "admitted" sounds as if they were caught and confessed which is certainly not true

 

Scootaloo

(25,699 posts)
14. Well, if Israel bombed them then they must have been guilty
Sat Sep 6, 2014, 03:36 AM
Sep 2014

Sort of like when the police shoot someone, it must be because the person was a bad guy, because police only shoot bad guys!

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