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bluedeathray

(511 posts)
Mon Nov 11, 2013, 11:40 AM Nov 2013

I'm not a "Conspiracy Theorist". Can we agree on the definition?

This comes from a JFK website, but is relevant to many of the discussions here. especially in terms of trying to nail down a definition that we can agree on.

I'm not suggesting (nor would I) that one narrows ones thinking or beliefs. Simply that in terms of a discussion, when one uses the term "blue", one doesn't mean "green".

Then let's debate the CRAP out of it!

http://www.ctka.net/2013/con_prim.html

7 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I'm not a "Conspiracy Theorist". Can we agree on the definition? (Original Post) bluedeathray Nov 2013 OP
I think we can all agree Ace Acme Nov 2013 #1
Your use of "skepticism" fadedrose Nov 2013 #3
"Speculation" or "Hypothesis" or "Educated Guess" all work for me. Ace Acme Nov 2013 #4
"Theorist" doesn't seem to be the right word fadedrose Nov 2013 #2
It's interesting to me that none in this "group" who so carelessly throw around the term Ace Acme Nov 2013 #5
I never use that expression fadedrose Nov 2013 #6
I'm a cognitive dissident ;>) Ace Acme Nov 2013 #7
 

Ace Acme

(1,464 posts)
1. I think we can all agree
Mon Nov 11, 2013, 04:04 PM
Nov 2013

Last edited Mon Nov 11, 2013, 05:21 PM - Edit history (1)

... that some people have a kneejerk conspiracist interpretation to many influential news events--that if some prominent dissident gets cancer or is killed in an automobile accident, or somebody shoots up a school or a movie theater or a congressional campaign rally, they will immediately claim the evidence bolsters their theory of a larger conspiracy involving many such events. For instance, those who believed in Icke's Alien Reptilioids from outer space instantly saw 9/11 as a confirmation of their theory--because who else but an all-powerful reptilioid could possibly have pulled it off? I prefer to call those people "conspiracists" because often times their "theories" don't deserve the dignity of the name, but I think we can all agree that those folks are conspiracy theorists.

I think we can also agree that some people are kneejerk skeptics of official versions of events, pointing out discrepancies, questionable evidence, unjustified assumptions, and facile conclusions in the official accounts of influential events. These people are often accused by the defenders of authority of being conspiracy theorists even when they don't advocate any theory. The self-styled "debunkers" try to dispose of the skeptics' questions by implying that they necessarily involve a silly conspiracy theory and thus are trivial, and by demanding a plausible alternative theory that they can reject as either 1) unproven or 2) less persuasive (to them) than the official theory. Demanding proof of an alternative theory before you will even admit the need for investigation is a particularly blatant bit of sophistry when you consider that the official version is rarely proven and that much of the documentation and physical evidence on events such as the assassinations of JFK, MLK, and RFK and such as 9/11 has been locked up in secret files for decades or even destroyed.

Michael Moore said "I'm not into conspiracy theories, except the ones that are true or involve dentists." I think we need to distinguish between conspiracists who think everything is a conspiracy, conspiracy theorists who advocate a particular theory, and skeptics who restrict themselves to questioning the official accounts and demanding more information. I think the serious skeptics' implicit assertion of official coverups deserves a pass on the "conspiracy theorist" label, which is slapped on by the Valiant Defenders of the Powers That Be in the unreasonable claim that any skepticism is inherently a silly theory.






fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
3. Your use of "skepticism"
Mon Nov 11, 2013, 05:25 PM
Nov 2013

or skeptic, or skeptical are all words that might be more appropriate in describing most of us.

And conspiracy might be too strong a word if very few may be involved.

What's a fancy word for "hunch"?


 

Ace Acme

(1,464 posts)
4. "Speculation" or "Hypothesis" or "Educated Guess" all work for me.
Tue Nov 12, 2013, 02:33 AM
Nov 2013

Last edited Tue Nov 12, 2013, 05:57 PM - Edit history (3)

Speculation is fine when it's clearly labeled as such.

An hypothesis is a speculation that is potentially testable.

An educated guess implies that a serious researcher has done serious research in an area where much of the necessary information is unavailable and has come to a tentative and provisional conclusion.

fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
2. "Theorist" doesn't seem to be the right word
Mon Nov 11, 2013, 05:15 PM
Nov 2013

It implies that if one does not accept the standard explanation of an occurance or anomaly, it is because one has an theory as to what really is the truth.

Many like me do not have theories, but also don't accept widely believed explanations.

Find the right word(s), bluedeathray. It's a good idea because I don't believe nothin' they tell me yet I can't figure out what's going on and am sheepish about saying, "duh."

 

Ace Acme

(1,464 posts)
5. It's interesting to me that none in this "group" who so carelessly throw around the term
Tue Nov 12, 2013, 06:00 PM
Nov 2013

"conspiracy theorist" are willing to help rigorously define the term.

They prefer that it be a stinky vague cloud they can poot on anyone who asks inconvenient questions or asserts inconvenient facts.

fadedrose

(10,044 posts)
6. I never use that expression
Tue Nov 12, 2013, 06:45 PM
Nov 2013

Although it is a legitimate title for a group of people who espouse theories for say Kennedy's assassinating, the moonwalk, the Towers, etc., these people can give you a detailed list of their evidence proving their "theory."

For them, the title remains as it is - conspiracy theorists. It's truthful.

I'm the problem. No theories, just doubt, skepticism, like Thomas in the NT...

After some agonizing, I think I am a cognitive dissonant.

Okay, your turn.

 

Ace Acme

(1,464 posts)
7. I'm a cognitive dissident ;>)
Tue Nov 12, 2013, 06:48 PM
Nov 2013

Last edited Fri Nov 15, 2013, 01:16 PM - Edit history (1)

I'm noting the lack of interest of the P 3 3 d u n k 3 r $ here in defining the term they use so carelessly, and find so convenient, to nuke serious thought.

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