Is it sacrilegious to use a dry roux?

[rhett o rick]

I tried it and liked the results in my gumbo.

[JayhawkSD]

1. May not be sacreligious, but

You are kidding yourself if you think you are actually making a roux. A dry roux is not a roux, it is toasted flour. No recipe for gumbo ever called for toasted flour. Seriously, think about the difference between fried fish and baked fish. Between fried bread and toasted bread.

I have, of course, never tried a "dry roux," that is to say I have never tried toasting flour and never intend to insult any of my Southern dishes by doing so, but the flavor cannot possibly be anything even close to the unique flavor of a properly prepared roux.

Are you trying to make gumbo healthy by leaving out one tablespoon of oil? Don't be silly.

[Cracklin Charlie]

2. I had never heard of "dry roux"

So, I went and looked it up.

Oh, My! I think you better leave that alone! I don't know if a dry roux is a sacrilege or not; but, as a former Southerner, I would never use that roux as a substitute for a true roux. That is just all kinda wrong!

I do declare, I'm gonna take to my bed, 'til the bad cloud passes! I'll get up directly, and whip up a mess'a gumbo!

[supernova]

3. No but why would you

want to?

The fat that you use also is a flavor carrier in the dish, moreso than any other molecule in the dish. A traditional roux is only about a couple of Tablespoons of roux for an entire pot of sauce or gumbo, so you aren't saving anything caloriewise and tamping down on the flavor.

Disclaimer: I do low-carb nutrition and I support the consumption of fats, not wheat products. So there is that. Many times, instead of adding a roux, I just let whatever it is cook down or use tapioca starch if I'm pressed for time.

[rhett o rick]

5. Convenience. I like to use roux in lots of my dishes and having the dry

roux available is very convenient. I dont have to spend 20 min stirring each time I want a roux. Dont think that I would substitute convenience for quality but I need to understand how the quality of my dishes are effected differently with one vs. the other. I cant tell the difference.

Some one above said that dry roux is just "toasted flour", which is partially correct. There are different ways to prepare a dry roux besides toasting. But that's not the point. A dry roux is cooked flour as is a roux. The difference is that in a roux the flour is cooked with oil. So the only difference I see is that a dry roux does not have the oil. I am not cutting calories to the point of worrying about the oil so I can easily add oil to the dish. Or actually if one wants, one could stir the dry roux into some hot oil and you have your nice nutty brown roux.

[Major Nikon]

7. The difference is more significant

Cooking roux in oil allows for a much better heat transfer than you would ever get without it. If there were a shortcut to making it the French would have figured it out hundreds of years ago. If you want convienience, make it up in a batch and store it in a mason jar. It will keep for weeks at room temperature, months in the refrigerator, and indefinitely in the freezer. When it reaches room temperature, the flour and oil will separate. Just mix it back together before you use it and it will be just as good as fresh.

[sir pball]

12. Roux freezes quite well

All you need to do is make one giant batch once, pour it into ice cube trays, then freeze and transfer to a gallon ziploc bag. I always keep blonde and brick on hand, it's incredibly convenient to be able to just grab a few cubes as needed. Bonus, if you pick your ice cube trays right, you can pretty much get each cube to be a "standard" (1T flour + 1T fat) unit.

As an aside, dry-cooked flour is not the same as fat-cooked flour though. It's an irrelevant difference probably 95% of the time but cooking in the fat will make the starch behave differently than if it's dry-toasted, mostly with regards to clumping and gluiness. Not enough to worry about, though.

[rhett o rick]

13. Thank you for the great post. It wouldnt surprise me to learn that there is a difference.

I started this thread to find out. Maybe at some point my taste buds will develop to tell the difference but not yet. I freeze the toasted flour roux.

[sir pball]

14. With pleasure!

Raw (as in not cooked in fat) flour and roux won't taste noticeably different, but will thicken differently. I've never sat down and compared, but off the top of my head raw flour will be "stickier" than a roux - there's no fat to coat the starch, so it will bind up much easier. It'll work fine, I use slurry in a pinch quite a bit, but given how well roux can keep it's what I'd call "suboptimal"

[rhett o rick]

15. I admit I am not an expert at making gumbo but I dont thicken it very much.

Therefore, it might make little difference if my roux is made with oil.

[sir pball]

16. It shouldn't really matter with gumbo

I'm thinking more of a binding bechamel level...that would end up being paiper-mache if you used raw flour.

[rhett o rick]

17. Ok thanks. I will keep that in mind. nm

[flamin lib]

4. Yes, I have used it and contrary to the other replies it was quite good

in my chicken & sausage gumbo. Is it exactly the same as traditional roux? No but still quite good.

You still need a tbs to cook down the trinity and for that I use either bacon fat or smaltz (chicken fat) to add some flavor back. I also tend to use less of the brown flour.

It cuts calories by almost 1000 per recipe for 6-8.

[rhett o rick]

6. I use butter to cook the vegetables and then add more when I add the roux.

Not low cal but very tasty. Last night I had scallops and shrimp. I serve rice separate to be added as one likes. Thanks for the comment.

[Phentex]

8. I did this for a light version of gumbo and it was delicious!

at the time, I did a bit of googling and found it to be a very common practice.

I ended up not toasting the flour for the amount of time called for because mine browned faster and I did not want a burned taste. I asked the chef about it and she I could do it in a skillet on the stove top if I didn't want to do it in the oven like I did.

If you want flavor but not fat, I think it does the trick.

[rhett o rick]

9. Thanks for the response. I keep some stored in my freezer and add it to soups

and stews as well as gumbo.

When you say "light version" are you referring to calories?

Do you have a favorite recipe? I am still experimenting.

[Phentex]

10. Recipe...a bit healthier I guess...

Nancy is a local chef who likes to trim fat and calories when she can although it's not to the nth degree.

----------

Luscious and Lighter Seafood Gumbo

from Nancy Waldeck

1 Cup Whole Wheat Flour
1 Tsp Olive Oil
2 Cups Chopped Onion
1 Cup Chopped Red Pepper
1/2 Cup Chopped Celery
1 TB Smoked Paprika
1 (15 oz)Can Fire-Roasted Tomatoes
1 TB Purchased Cajun Seasoning
4 Garlic Cloves, Grated
24 - 32 Oz Veggie Stock
2 Bay Leaves
1 (8 oz) Pkg Crab Meat
1 LB Medium Shrimp, Uncooked, but Peeled and Deveined
1 Pint Oysters
1 Tsp – 1 TB Hot Sauce
Kosher or Sea Salt and Freshly Cracked Black Pepper to Taste
Warm Brown Rice, Chopped Parsley, Thinly Sliced Green Onions

Step One Place the flour in a 400F oven. Cook for about 20 - 30 minutes or until nicely browned, stirring with a whisk occasionally. Remove
from the oven and set aside.

Step Two Heat the oil in a stockpot. Add the onion, red pepper, celery, and smoked paprika and sauté until the veggies are tender. Add the tomatoes, Cajun seasoning, garlic,
stock and bay leaves, and bring to a boil. Gradually add the browned flour, stirring with a whisk. Reduce the heat and simmer uncovered, for 20 minutes, stirring occasionally.

Step Three Remove and discard the bay leaves. Add the shrimp and cook for 3-4 minutes or until the shrimp just begin to turn pink. Add the crab, oysters and hot sauce.
Taste for salt and pepper. Serve the gumbo over the brown rice, garnished with chopped parsley and green onions.


Chef's Note: Traditionally Gumbo is made with a Roux - or mixture of oil and flour stirred until it becomes brown and toasty. I’ve substituted the roux with toasted flour, which gives much of the same flavor without all the fat!

[rhett o rick]

11. Thank you very much.

My recipe is similar but I use green bell peppers in lieu of the red. But I will try the red. Also I use chopped canned tomatoes and not the fire roasted. Will definitely try the fire roasted.

I mix my dry roux with a little stock before I add to the pot. Not sure that is necessary if you dont get lumps doing it directly into the pot slowly.

I just had some two nights ago and I am ready again.

thanks again.