White guys are killing us: Toxic, cowardly masculinity, our unhealable national illness

[SecularMotion]

When the New York Times editorial board issued its powerful condemnation of America’s gun culture, they went beyond mere outrage in response to the recent murder sprees in San Bernardino, California, and Colorado Springs, Colorado. The Times went so far as to suggest that “assault rifle”-style weapons should be banned from civilian ownership. As is our national ritual, President Obama also condemned gun violence, and just as he has been forced to do too many times during his tenure, pleaded that Americans must find a way to stop killing each other. The American people do in fact support stronger gun control laws; the NRA, functioning as the lobbying arm for the gun industry, opposes even the most basic common sense gun laws. The NRA wins while the American people die.

This is political intractability in a democracy broken by the power of a very well-funded interest group to subvert the public’s will. But, there is another little-discussed factor that helps to explain America’s obsessive and near pathological gun culture, unwillingness to treat gun violence as a public health crisis, Right-wing domestic terrorism, and propensity for mass shootings. It transcends all of those issues. But this factor is usually treated as verboten, something to not be unspoken of, because of the rage, threats of violence, and animus it inspires.

The common denominator is white masculinity and the particular ways that it is connected to American gun culture and the color line.

The gun is central to the founding of an American society where hierarchies of race and gender were central to the country’s Herrenvolk white racial settler democratic project. America was born as, and remains, a culture and society dedicated to maintaining the dominance, privilege, and power of white men over people of color and women. This was not an accident, bug, or a glitch. It was a feature.

http://www.salon.com/2015/12/16/white_guys_are_killing_us_toxic_cowardly_masculinity_our_unhealable_national_illness/

[Logical]

1. Some silly person alerted this and lost 0-7! LOL! Nt

[Lizzie Poppet]

6. I'd have voted to leave it, too.

It's a profoundly idiotic article, but so what? Not against the rules...

[Puha Ekapi]

8. I would leave it too...

...simply to show how idiotic the grabbers are

[Eleanors38]

20. White males killing, cowardly masculinity, Gunz©. What more does a DUer want?

[The_Commonist]

2. I was juror #1

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Sexist, racist post. Please hide this, it doesn't belong on DU.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Wed Dec 30, 2015, 08:27 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Yet more DU alert troll ridiculousness. Somebody doesn't like what something says, so they want it to go away? So now we're alerting on Salon articles that discuss New York Times editorials? Get your little dick out of your holster and face the reality of the situation - White guys are a problem. Not the only problem, but a problem, and one worthy of discussion. I am a white guy, so I have a little insight. We were told all our lives that we were the shit, and then when the shit hit the fan, it turns out we're just like everyone else - human. Unfortunately, there's a subset of white guys who can't take it, they can't stand losing their privilege, so they've decided to go out with a bang, and take a few innocents with them. This is what this piece is about, and if you can't handle it, maybe you should leave the planet, because it's going to get worse before it gets better...
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Gun nuts alerting! Funny!
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Some times the truth hurts.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: The overwhelming majority of gun massacres are by white men. Article is not sexist or racist, just accurate. The article asks relevant questions we should all be considering. Leave.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[JonLeibowitz]

5. Juror #6, the correct quantity is not number of gun massacres by white men, it is the RATE. n/t

[Squinch]

27. Awesome explanation! You should post that all over the place!

[DashOneBravo]

32. What about the female gungeon dwellers?

[ileus]

3. Damn those white people to hell.

[Logical]

16. I think you wish there was more of them. nt

[ileus]

18. It's not up to me....I produced two.

A replacement for my wife (daughter)

A replacement for myself (son)

The rest is up to you guys...I'm finished.

[Eleanors38]

21. Yes, more! More! Damning is such fun. And safe as a...

...sexist Penis® reference in GD.

[TeddyR]

7. Didn't we already see

This (misleading) article? Black males are a small minority of the population but commit over 50% of gun murders, so why are we trying to make this about race? And if we are going to make it about race then we need to be honest about it.

[hack89]

9. What race commits gun murder at a dispportionate rate?

You really don't want to introduce race into the gun control fight.

[marble falls]

11. Take race out of it: what economic/education level commits the most gun violence?

[Eleanors38]

22. Uh, the title: Race is broached.

[pintobean]

19. Jury results

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

Mail Message
On Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:50 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

What race commits gun murder at a dispportionate rate?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1172&pid=183489

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Wow, racist reply. Please hide.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Wed Dec 30, 2015, 01:57 PM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I don't see it as a racist reply.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I don't always agree with hack89 but he just posed a question. If we aren't going to talk about race and guns then the OP should be hidden too.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: The OP is both racist and race baiting. I'm not about to vote to hide a question about reality.
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Youre seeing something Im not. The whole OP is about race.

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[Eleanors38]

23. #3 has it right. It is a legit question, but doesn't follow DU Narrative©.

[ileus]

30. Oh man...an alert stalker got a smack down.

[sarisataka]

10. So we start by

Getting rid of all white men...

[marble falls]

13. All depends: where are you sending us?

[sarisataka]

14. I'd like to go

To Ireland but if my wife doesn't get to come I'll be in big trouble.

[marble falls]

15. I understand Ireland is pretty cheap away from Dublin. If I gotta go, Ireland sounds...

pretty good.

[Eleanors38]

24. Sounds like the Political Theory of Mass Extinction. Or a lawyer joke.

[sarisataka]

26. Reminds me of an old Soviet joke

when something like-

An American visitor to Moscow noted the lack of petty street criminals. Encountering a police officer he inquired, "I see no vagrants, pickpockets or other criminals. How did you accomplish that in such a large city?"

The officer replied, "The solution was simple. We arrested 100 criminals and had them publicly shot. Once the others saw what fate awaited them, they gave up crime."

The visitor was shocked, "We wouldn't do that in America. We have lawyers to protect criminal's rights."

The officer nodded knowingly, "We thought of that as well. We had the lawyers shot the day before."

[Eleanors38]

29. HA! That's good. Since we are into toxic masculinity, here's another "Ruskie"...

Two Siberian Russians were argueing over what makes a man a man.

"When a man falls through the ice into the sea, if he's a Real man, he can hold out for 40 seconds before dying."

"Ah, comrade, that is nothing. A REAL man can do it in 20 seconds."

[DonP]

12. Wow! Another Salon gun control article

Maybe if they finally reach 1000 articles bemoaning guns and gun owners, they get a free gun control law in the state or City of their choice?

Or maybe the gun control supporters will continue to preach and whine online and do absolutely nothing in the real world.

Oh and be sure to use the favorite talking points excuse; "The NRA won't let anything pass".

What a freakin' cop out.

[Logical]

17. Ahh, a non pro gun posts makes you sad! What a shock. nt

[DonP]

28. No Sadz here, it's actually pretty funny how big a fail gun control as a movement has become.

Even with a billionaire racist funding it, lots of media support and they still can't get jack shit accomplished. Always falling back on one excuse after another.

Now even the general public sees it for the failure it is, with violent crime continuing to fall to 40 year record low levels.

As a movement it's become irrelevant, with its handful of "sit on the couch" supporters declaring; "The tide has turned" every few months, but never actually doing anything beside whine online.

[Logical]

34. Bet you are in "cold dead hand" mode. Paranoia runs deep with your bunch. Nt

[DonP]

35. Got your degree in Telephsychology by mail or nights at the local JC?

Some folks take mental health seriously, but on DU gun control fans think it's either witty snark or an "NRA talking point".

They can tell that gun owners are "paranoid", "about to snap" and all have short penii, even the women, all just by posting online.

Too bad you can't be bothered to actually do anything for gun control in the real world, besides posting poor snark.

[Logical]

36. Lol, why don't you give me some of the ideas you are you doing !

[DonP]

37. Among other things, I teach Basic Pistol, Rifle and Illinois Concealed Carry classes

I've trained over 75 people so far, that now have Illinois carry permits.

I regularly attend local Town Hall and Zoning meetings to support more shooting ranges in my area.

I use days of my vacation time to drive to the State Capitol every year and stay at a hotel for two days for I-GOLD, Illinois Gun Owners Lobby Day and join 9,000 other gun owners to march and meet with our legislators.

I'm a certified Range Safety Officer and as a volunteer teach basic gun safety and marksmanship to local Scouting and other youth groups.

I probably spend over $5,000 a year on my teaching materials and shooting equipment.

I compete in several competitions including Service Rifle and High Power matches at the ISRA and other certified ranges.

I'm also an instructor for shooting and maintaining the AR15.

So, what are you doing and how much of your time and money do you commit in the real world to support your Point of View?

[Logical]

38. Those are gun-control tasks??? Nt

[DonP]

39. Who said anything about more control? We already have all we need, just enforce it.

In the Midwest alone there were over 30,000 denied NICS checks. And a total of only 40 prosecutions.

Mandatory sentencing for crimes committed with a firearm would be nice too, but the Illinois Black Caucus stopped that proposed law.

Again, what are you doing with your own time and money in the real world to support gun control.

Or are you just another "online supporter"?

[friendly_iconoclast]

41. Judging by the lack of response to your question, I suspect your interlocutor is serving in...

...the 2538th Keyboard Battalion and has 'Expert' ratings on both the M1999 mouse and
M2004 trackball.

That's cool and all, but I find those Special Chairborne Forces operators and their Dvoraks
kinda frightening...

[DonP]

42. It is funny how a simple question drives them away

That's not the first time it's happened either.

Just asking what they actually do and spend to support their hard core gun control beliefs makes them kinda shaky it seems. They always want to change the subject and talk about our penis size.

Much easier to type "FUCK THE NRA!" several times in an online thread, consider yourself a hero of the movement, then give up a few bucks or a day or two of your time to support your so called beliefs.

Pro Second folks actually do things, we spend time and money with our friends and family at the range or hunting a cut over cornfield in Iowa at dawn for pheasant or rabbit with our sons and daughters. Plus we love to share our sport and interests with anyone interested.

I've met total strangers at local ranges that turned into shooting buddies, just based on how much fun we had trying out each others guns over a thermos of coffee.

What do the control minded people do to meet and make like minded friends? Walk around downtown with a big sandwich board on that says "Fuck The NRA!"?

Must be lonely to be so angry all the time, based on what somebody else enjoys doing and the falling crime rate must really annoy them.

[Kang Colby]

44. Amen.

I do much of the same. I have given thousands of dollars to the pro-2A cause over the years, both national organizations like the NRA and SAF, and state organizations across the country.

If there's ever a proposed gun control CFR update, I'm writing a letter expressing opposition. If a bill makes it out of committee that even has a hint of gun control...I'm writing a letter and making calls. If there is ever a bill on the governors desk in any state of the Union, I'm making a call. When I hear politicians talking about gun control, I go ahead and write a check to the NRA.

Every winter, I'm front and center at my state's lobbying day. If any gun related bill is on the state house/senate docket for a public hearing...I will be there expressing support or opposition. I help and teach others how to do all of the same.

Most of my advocacy is in recruiting people who consider themselves liberals or progressives into supporting gun ownership. I take them to the range, supply the ammo, and teach them about firearms safety in a positive and safe environment.

Is it worth it? I would say so.

[Eleanors38]

25. Oh, Shame, Inc. on you DonP. Shame PLUS!

[mwrguy]

31. K&R

It was in GD last week, but it's worth reposting

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027455579

[DashOneBravo]

33. Yes it is.

Just look at the numbers.

[friendly_iconoclast]

40. "Just look at the numbers" The OP and your interlocutor would prefer we didn't- but here they are:

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/expanded-homicide-data/expanded_homicide_data_table_6_murder_race_and_sex_of_vicitm_by_race_and_sex_of_offender_2014.xls

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/expanded-homicide-data/expanded_homicide_data_table_3_murder_offenders_by_age_sex_and_race_2014.xls

The 'tl;dr' version- White guys are actually *underrepresented*, for the most part

[DashOneBravo]

45. Happy New Year.

Someone may alert on that.

[hack89]

43. I don't think you really want to introduce race to the gun control argument.

it will not be pretty when you start looking at who is actually killing others.