Southern Tier Hot Spot For Meth Labs (New York)

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

For those of you who insist the world is a safe place, that self defense handguns are unnecessary, or that people who carry for self defense are being paranoid.

The following takes place in Broome County (neighboring my county) and Tioga County (one county west of that.)

Whose to say I will never encounter a crew cooking meth? I already stumbled upon an unoccupied meth lab a few years back.

In the last ten years, there have been more than 300 methamphetamine labs uncovered in New York State. Almost a quarter of those in Broome and Tioga Counties. The latest drug bust was Thursday, on Hooper Road in the Town of Union. Three men were arrested after manufacturing the illegal drug. Officials say the Southern Tier is a hot spot for meth labs. And the most active area in New York State. "It just so happens that the first cookers that came in over the last decade happened to be associated with the Southern Tier and settled here, and what we find is when one person learns it, they teach between 5 and 10 other people, so that's why the Southern Tier is a hot bed of activity for meth labs," said Lt. Patrick Garey with the New York State Police. Police are also concerned with the number of weapons showing up in drug busts. They found 7 guns in Thursday's meth bust alone.

http://www.wbng.com/closings/81934707.html?m=y&smobile=y

And please do not tell me 'you will never outgun a meth crew' - I would rather have the ability to fight back as opposed to letting them victimize myself, my wife and our children.




It was my dogs who first alerted me to the presence of something unusual - the place stank like urine. Bottles and jugs everywhere, the grass (in the summer) was brown, apparently they dump stuff all the time.

WHAT TO LOOK FOR – APPEARANCE OF THE STRUCTURE

A house or other structure containing a meth lab usually has one or more of the following characteristics:

UNUSUAL ODORS – Making meth produces powerful odors that may smell like ammonia or ether. These odors have been compared to the smell of cat urine or rotten eggs.

COVERED WINDOWS – Meth makers often blacken or cover windows to prevent outsiders from seeing in.

STRANGE VENTILATION – Meth makers often employ unusual ventilation practices to rid themselves of toxic fumes produced by the meth-making process. They may open windows on cold days or at other seemingly inappropriate times, and they may set up fans, furnace blowers, and other unusual ventilation systems.

ELABORATE SECURITY – Meth makers often set up elaborate security measures, including, for example, "Keep Out" signs, guard dogs, video cameras, or baby monitors placed outside to warn of persons approaching the premises.

DEAD VEGETATION – Meth makers sometimes dump toxic substances in their yards, leaving burn pits, "dead spots" in the grass or vegetation, or other evidence of chemical dumping.

EXCESSIVE OR UNUSUAL TRASH – Meth makers produce large quantities of unusual waste.

[SecularMotion]

1. You're in Margaretville?

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

2. Delaware County, yes.

[rickford66]

3. I live in Broome

I believe the highway system is as good a reason as any for our drug problem. I81, I88, NY17 etc. Proximity to NEPA. I don't see how carrying a gun everywhere is the answer. I'm not about to encroach on someone's property without a good reason. A friend or relative maybe? If you want to confront drug gangs, be my guest. Maybe alerting law enforcement might be a better choice, except in Bradford County PA. It's pretty corrupt down there.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

4. We got lost in the woods amidst the aftermath of a tree blowdown....

..and my dogs ran over to the place.

I don't carry a gun everywhere.

I carry in the woods.

EDIT: it was not too far from 17, north of Roscoe.

[jmg257]

5. Trout Town USA! Been at Junction Pool a few times. nt

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

6. Beautiful area.

Cat Hollow, Pepacton Reservoir, East Branch Delaware River.....

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

7. I love...

Last edited Fri May 6, 2016, 04:40 PM - Edit history (1)

the Mud Pond/Trout Pond area but it gets crazy there during hunting season.

My wife and I call it the 'Ostfront' because of all the dead deer with the bones sticking through the snow during the winter.

[rickford66]

8. How do you get lost in the woods?

Were you on your own property? If it was someone else's property, did you have permission? We live in a rural part of Broome. I only enter others' property with permission and others have asked my permission to enter mine. Your dogs have to be leashed or on your property under your control. If you have a need to carry a firearm in the woods when not hunting, maybe you shouldn't be in the woods. If you do carry in the woods, invest in a cheap compass. Please keep out of my woods.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

9. Wow.

I said it was a blowdown.

Massive amounts of trees had fallen, had to climb and crawl to get out. Could not go back because we had come down an icy hill on the way in. Going back would have caused us to make a several hour circle back. The trees just kind of got worse as we continued on.

I was on state land until I lost my way. The state land went right up to behind the house. I did not need permission to be there until I was right on top of the scene, even then, the meth lab was in an abandoned house. I have met the owners of the land the house is on, they are from downstate.

They (the meth cookers) were the ones trespassing. I was just lost.

In New York, dogs cannot 'run at large' (run around without the owner) but they can be off leash in the woods.

[rickford66]

10. Sounds like you were prepared for bear but not bad weather.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

12. The bad weather...

....had gone through several months before.

I was doing a trail maintenance check.

[rickford66]

14. So why not carry a compass?

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

15. I do. This is what it looked like.

That's not a photo from that area, but it looked exactly like this.

Somehow we ended up in the middle of it and had no idea how we got there. Shit just happens sometimes.

But we got out without a problem, other than a tour of the backyard of a meth lab.

I had my compass out all the time. If I had not, we still would be there.

[rickford66]

17. The you weren't lost like you said.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

18. Well technically....

....if you know where you are but have no idea how to get to where you want to go without crawling through that mess...

.......if that's not the same as lost...

Then no, I guess I was not 'lost.'

What would you call it then?

Covered in trees?

I think 'lost' comes pretty close.

[rickford66]

21. Not knowing your way out would be lost.

Entangled may be more what you were experiencing. I apologize for "assuming" you just went into the woods nilly willy. All my neighbors have hand guns, rifles and shotguns. I've never seen them carry one unless they were hunting. I still don't see a reason to carry a firearm like you do. I believe you have a better chance of shooting yourself than a criminal in the woods.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

23. OK, entangled.

Next time I tell the story, I'll use that word.

I am a volunteer Catskill Mountain trail maintainer.

That was near one of my sections of trail.

Being in the middle of it was totally disorienting.

Besides, my dogs were scared shitless, and they were actually my main concern.

Luckily it was a relatively small section, acreage wise, so a combination of chain sawing and re-routing re-opened the trail by spring.

I've passed by the building several times since, you have to look carefully from the road to see it.

The driveway has weeded-over, I don't think anyone has been back since.

[SecularMotion]

31. I've hiked in the Catskills

Thanks for your service. It's one of the better trail systems I've hiked.

The farthest west I've been is Slide Mt. I've done 5-6 peaks in the North lake region and many hikes around Kaaterskill Falls.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

32. Try this website.

https://en.wikivoyage.org/wiki/Catskills

Go to the 'To Do' section.

Hunter Mountain: at 4,040 feet, the second highest peak in the Catskills, with the western approach trailhead located at the east end of Spruceton Road, Spruceton, NY. Hunter Mountain is similar to Slide Mountain in that the trails (the western approach from from Spruceton) utilize old roads to create a scenic, quite physically demanding but not particularly dangerous hike. There is a firetower at the top of Hunter, and during the summer, there may be an interpretive guide - who spends nights in the nearby cabin - to welcome you to the top of the mountain. An interesting - and otherworldly - experience is to take the Colonel's Chair side trail down to the tops of the Hunter Mountain ski area, which is virtually abandoned during the summer. Be careful navigating as you approach the main ski slopes, there is a network of side trails up here that are not well marked.

Devil's Path: 25 miles of hell. One of the most popular trails in the Catskills, featuring 18,000 feet of elevation change over its length. Consistently featured in hiking magazine articles entitled 'The Five (or Ten) Most Dangerous Hiking Trails in the (State, United States, World, Solar System, etc.) This trail is laid out so that there are quite a number of day trip loops that utilize this trail as part of the loop, but return the hiker to the same parking area at the end. Dogs and children should be left at home for the eastern section (Jimmy Dolan area to Route 214) however the western (Route 214 to Spruceton) section is not much more risky than other trails in the area.

Escarpment Trail: 24 miles of rugged, rocky and at several points dangerous terrain, running generally north/south along the Catskill Escarpment - the huge wall of a mountain overlooking the Hudson Valley of the northeast Catskills. A sample section of the trail can be experienced at the North-South Lake area, accessed via County Route 18, Haines Falls, NY. The entire trail requires three days and two cars.

[SecularMotion]

37. I've done all three

Hunter Mt - twice - once in snow

Devil's Path - hiked a portion to Plattekill Mt through Jimmy Dolan Notch

Escarpment Trail - mostly around the top of Kaaterskill Falls and North Lake

This is my trail guide for the Catskills

[center][/center]

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

38. Second only to the Bible.

That's been my handbook for 25 years.

Make sure you get the new maps - they have mileage between junctions.

For the summer, when the trails in Ulster County get too crowded, try the Mary Smith area south of the Pepacton Reservoir.


AND..... Balsam Lake Mountain Fire Tower. Must see.

[gejohnston]

24. you don't really know if they are carrying handguns or not

I believe you have a better chance of shooting yourself than a criminal in the woods.

I doubt there are statistics to back that up. There are parts of Norway where you are legally required to carry a gun on such nature hikes.
In my neck of the woods, private often isn't marked unless you have GPS map. This is especially true in the Checkerboard.
http://www.blm.gov/wy/st/en/programs/nlcs/Continental_Divide/ckrbrd.html

[rickford66]

26. I guess I won't go hiking in Norway then. Rats.

[gejohnston]

30. mostly in polar bear habitat

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

33. If anyone is interested in Norway.....

Try the TV series Occupied

10 episode series.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okkupert

Great show.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

28. Wyoming....

My wife really wants to go to Wyoming, and other northern Rockies states.

What do people carry out that way?

[gejohnston]

29. depends on the individual

in Grizzly country I recommend something big. Before CCW was more liberalized, when I was a kid, I know of several women who worked around the truck stops and oil field bars to carry .25s, illegally, at the time. They figured the couple of hundred dollar fine was worth the risk. When hiking, I usually have a Walther P22. I think a Ruger Bearcat would be a better trail gun. I like single action revolvers. I have been pondering dumping my LC9 for a DA revolver as a carry.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

34. It would be my K frame (Model 66)

And an 8mm Mauser bolt action.

[gejohnston]

35. My oldest brother carried an N frame

as a cop. It was his camping gun too. My other brother carried the K frame 19 on patrol. I can relate to the TV show "Blue Bloods." Why I wasn't an SP or AFOSI astounds some people.

[beardown]

11. Huh?

" If you have a need to carry a firearm in the woods when not hunting, maybe you shouldn't be in the woods."

I can at least understand the rest of the points of your post, but I'm not sure what your point was with the above line.

If you have a need to carry a firearm in the city, maybe you shouldn't be in the city.

If you have a need to keep a firearm in your house, maybe you shouldn't be in your house.

If you have a need to carry a firearm in the military, maybe you shouldn't be in the military. Okay, this one was just for fun.

If you have a need to wear a short skirt and revealing sweater, maybe you shouldn't be in the bar.

Lots of reasons to stray onto owned property. No fences. No signs. Borders BLM land. As in this case, storm damage could easily obliterate existing landmarks and property lines.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

13. "storm damage could easily obliterate existing landmarks"

Exactly. I volunteer to do trail checks. I GPS the tree (or two) that falls across the trail.

Crews come in the spring with chain saws.

They go directly to the offending trees without searching for obstructions. That's my job.

Never expected anything that bad.

[rickford66]

16. I don't carry a firearm anywhere.

If I was afraid of the woods, I would stay out of the woods. Same with the city. People get shot every day because someone was afraid. The vast majority of drug related shootings are because of deals gone wrong or robbing drugs. If an innocent bystander gets shot, there was probably no way to prevent it by carrying a weapon. Anyway all you guys carrying will protect the rest of us, right?

[jmg257]

19. Shit no. Why would you expect that? nt

[rickford66]

22. Obviously I don't expect you to. Keep your safety on please.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

20. "Anyway all you guys carrying will protect the rest of us, right?"

All you guys...? I have no idea.

Me?

Yes, actually. It was what I was trained to do.

http://www.military.com/join-armed-forces/swearing-in-for-military-service.html

[rickford66]

25. See my comment #22.

I don't expect any "civilian" to protect me with a firearm. Armed criminals expect trouble because they are doing criminal activity. The armed civilian walking down the street isn't going out draw and shoot him or her. Clerks in retail establishments where an armed robbery is more probable is a different story and potential robbers should know better.

[CompanyFirstSergeant]

27. "The armed civilian walking down the street isn't going out draw and shoot him or her."

I'm good.

I'm that good.

[rickford66]

36. GB&U. My favorite movie.

[jmg257]

39. A sure classic!

"You see, in this world there's two kinds of people, my friend: Those with loaded guns and those who dig. You dig."