Priorities

[ellisonz]

This discussion thread was locked by krispos42 (a host of the Gun Control & RKBA group).

Do you prefer to spend your extra $$$ on guns or re-electing the President?

8 votes, 6 passes | Time left: Poll closed
	Guns
	6 (75%)
	President Obama
	2 (25%)
	6 DU members did not wish to select any of the options provided.
Show usernames Disclaimer: This is an Internet poll

[holdencaufield]

1. Are they mutually exclusive?

President Obama has publicly stated he support the RKBA, so where is the conflict?

Supporting Obama IS supporting guns and vice-versa.

[ellisonz]

2. That's not the question.

"Do you prefer to spend your extra $$$ on guns or re-electing the President?"

[Trunk Monkey]

92. WTF is "extra" money? I don't have any of that

[Union Scribe]

15. There isn't one except in the minds of

those who angrily patrol this DU group insisting that people who disagree with them aren't real Democrats and should be banned from the site.

[discntnt_irny_srcsm]

88. +1 :) n/t

[Jenoch]

3. You are only

wasting people's time and not making any worthwhile point with this 'poll'.

[ellisonz]

5. I think you're making my point for me very well.

Good job. Here have a donut:

[sarisataka]

4. I don't have extra $$$

[Reasonable_Argument]

6. So really you're asking

What's more important, our constitutional rights or the reelection of the president?

[ellisonz]

8. Don't reframe the question.

Are you spending your extra $$$ on guns or President Obama? It's a simple question.

[Reasonable_Argument]

10. Well

I donate to the president and the NRA. So I split my money.

[gejohnston]

7. false choice.

Send Obama twenty bucks, buy a couple boxes of shells, or reload them, go to the range and remind folks who signed those silly laws in Massachusetts.
Ultimately, it isn't about money for propaganda on the idiot box. It is having serious discussions from a populist point of view, help folks jump through the hoops of those voter ID laws, even if you have to drive them to the DMV and pay for them yourself. It is about putting fliers on car windows at Wal Mart.

[rDigital]

9. Sorry, but this is a false dilemma push poll. I'll pass. nt

[ellisonz]

11. So you'd rather have a new gun and President Mitt Romney?

[petronius]

12. How about both (and a lot more things)?

[ellisonz]

13. That's why the OP Title is "Priorities"

We're not doing the Republican thing and pretending we can have our cake and eat it too. Are you spending your extra $$$ on guns or President Obama when presented with the choice?

[petronius]

16. Both and more, like I said. It's not an A or B choice.

Why do you think it is?

[ellisonz]

18. Mitt Romney is outraising President Obama.

Do you think it's more important right now to by guns or to donate to the President? What good will your guns do you when Romney is President?

[Union Scribe]

21. What good will your cable do, for that matter.

Or your haircuts. Or your fertilized lawn.

[petronius]

22. You didn't answer my question - why do you think it's A or B?

And I actually haven't bought any guns this year (although I do plan to stop by the gun store later this week), but I have bought plenty of other things that aren't donations to the Obama campaign. Including the bottle of wine I'm working on - should I regret that $2.00?

And now that I think of it, I need to renew my DU star next month - do you advise against that waste of my disposable income?

[ellisonz]

25. Actually I did.

"although I do plan to stop by the gun store later this week" - hey that's money that could go to Obama or through 5 bucks to keep Skinner, Elad, and EarlG sheltered.

What's your priority guns or defeating Mitt Romney?

[petronius]

28. No, you didn't. Why is it only one or the other?

And, in your opinion, should I not donate to DU next month? DU is not Obama, after all.

Out of curiosity, though, have you spent any money recently on anything other than essential life support and Obama? If the answer is "Yes", how do you not perceive the fundamental non-cleverness of this thread?

[ellisonz]

29. I don't buy guns/ammo. n/t

[petronius]

31. That's cool. There are lots of things I don't buy. So?

[ellisonz]

33. Dodge. n/t

[petronius]

36. Honda, actually. But again, you haven't answered my questions in any of the previous

posts. Is there a word for that behavior?

[ellisonz]

53. Yeah regretting taking you off ignore.

Man you squirm like a worm.

[Clames]

56. Well, nobody forced you.

Try using that clicker on your mouse (or touchpad) and you can fix that. You can also trash the group which would seem to do you, and many here, a favor as well.







Then you can make a post about it in Meta.

[ellisonz]

60. I haven't trashed this group...

...because I enjoy seeing right-wing shitheads tombstoned - like your friend "Johnny Rico:" http://www.democraticunderground.com/1240126570

Saw that one coming a mile away

[Clames]

64. Didn't know that one.

But here...

[Union Scribe]

58. I think you're badly misreading the way this thread has gone. nt

[petronius]

61. I squirm? Why don't you just answer the questions, then?

Seriously, dude, I'm trying to have a conversation with you. Why is it a one or the other situation: Obama donation versus guns (or anything else)? If it's wrong to spend money on shooting-related items during election season, what else is it wrong to buy? Or conversely, what is it OK to buy?

Do you actually condemn people for any/all expenditures that are non-Obama and non-essential-for-life? Bottom line, my first answer to you was "both" - why is that in error in your opinion?

[ellisonz]

66. You reframe the basic question to avoid having to provide a direct answer...

...to present an extraneous argument that has no relation to the core problem which you then salute as having been the basic question in the first place. It's tiresome.

My question was simple - what is the priority right now - buying guns or beating Romney - both has nothing to do with it!

Back to ignore.

[petronius]

74. Well shoot, and you never even helped me out with that

'Should I donate to DU?' conundrum...

And on edit: 'Both' has everything to do with it - none of us, no one on the planet, is actually faced with the choice you present. If we were, if anyone was forced to choose between 'buy something/anything nonessential' vs. 'Obama wins', then the choice would be Obama. But that situation absolutely doesn't exist, which is why everyone on this thread decided to point out the fallacy of your little gotcha game, and which is what you've apparently decided to run away from rather than engage in actual discussion. I'm sort of embarrassed for you, to be honest.

[Union Scribe]

35. Isn't the time you spend posting better spent

collecting cans and recycling them for money for Obama? What's your priority, fucking around online or beating Rmoney?

[ellisonz]

52. Clearly, you have no clue...

...how many people pick the public trashcans for recyclables. May I dare say, that statement just showed how out of touch you are with reality. I mean I work in parks and recreation, I know how many people pick those cans. I would always put their ability to scrap together a few bucks to eat ahead of picking recyclables for political donations.

[Union Scribe]

55. Wow, you're even perfect when NOT doing things!

I love that though, 'I would collect cans for Obama, but I don't hate the starving, like you,' lol. Nicely done.

[ellisonz]

57. It's true.

Like I said, I work in parks and recreation, I see the need up close, which is why I have so detest the Mitt Romney's of the world and their pawns. What field do you work in?

[Union Scribe]

59. Yet instead of focusing on that, our common goal

of Rmoney coming nowhere near the White House except as a tourist, you spend all your time trying to pigeon hole and litmus-test other posters here. Instead of coalition building, you're here telling people they aren't good enough for your version of this site and this political party.

And it's in the name. I'm a writer.

[Missycim]

90. Can I assume you pay for your internet?

Why dont you have it shut off and send the money to the Presidents reelection fund?

[Union Scribe]

14. Please list the things you spend your "extra $$$" on

and we'll help you decide if it would be better spent on Obama's campaign*. I mean it's only fair that you play your own silly game.

*And he's not the only Dem needing money, of course. What about local candidates? Why ignore them in your push poll?

[ellisonz]

17. I've given already and will give more soon.

Do student loans count? Also, I'm applying to grad school. I don't spend any money on guns.

So have you given to local candidates or are you buying guns/ammo?

[Union Scribe]

20. I'm sure if we try we can get him some more money.

Let's see. Do you go to movies? Rent them? How much do you pay for internet service? How about a mobile plan? What's more important, Obama or Angry Birds? Do you have HBO or anything like that? Can't you make do without until after the election? Surely there's some area where you could be sending Obama money where you're currently just spending it on "fun." Let me tell you, there's nothing fun about a Rmoney presidency!

If people shouldn't be spending money on things you don't like so that they can instead send that money to Obama, you'd better be pure as the driven snow on that account, right? So please lead by example and tighten the belt for the cause.

[ellisonz]

23. I go hiking 30 minutes away twice weekly.

I don't go to the movies, rent them, internet is for work/news, cellphone is for work. No HBO. Like I said, what little occasionally goes to something like a new pair of shoes/clothing to replace worn out items, is certainly not for a luxury item like guns/ammo. How much have you spent this year on guns?

My belt is a piece of cord.

[Union Scribe]

34. Yeah, I expected that.

The whole 'I'm practically a monk' reply. I have to say I did NOT see "my belt is a piece of cord" coming. I guess I'll take your word on that, lol. And nowhere in all that defensiveness did you once get the point, that people spend their money on tons of shit they don't necessarily need (well, everyone but you...isn't that right?), and that it doesn't mean they hate the US and want Republicans to win, for fuck sake. Nor does it mean they AREN'T donating to Obama and/or local Dems, and it sure as hell isn't a logical launching pad from which to finger-wag at other DUers. It's just a petty and bankrupt tactic.

And as I've told Hoyt approximately a brazillion times, I don't own any guns. But I did buy a box of ammo for a rental gun at the range a few months ago. I must be a closet repuke huh?

[ellisonz]

39. I don't spend my money on guns.

I would never buy a gun or ammo before donating to the President. I'm frugal and I have my priorities straight.

I don't know why you're struggling making the distinction that re-electing the President is more important than guns other than you're really wrapped up in the whole gun culture nonsense, especially for someone who doesn't even own a gun. Sad.

Do you want to guess what the overwhelming answer to such a question in GD would be? What is more important - buying fancy Christmas presents or defeating Romney? In fact: Shblamm: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021184303

[Union Scribe]

41. You do a lot of laughing for someone with such awful arguments.

You don't like DU gun posters, so you posted a bullshit poll as a "gotcha." The horrible logic was pointed out, so you run off to get some pats on the head in GD. THAT's sad.

[ellisonz]

63. Can't stand the heat. Get out of the kitchen. n/t

[Clames]

69. Heat? No flames here.

Seems most of the posters went peepee on your little tinder pile you tried to setup.

[Union Scribe]

70. smh

You have failed so hard in this thread that future logic textbooks should include a chapter on it. And you've topped it off with a phrase so meaningless that it...well it sums up your efforts here tonight, actually. I'm going to bed, with the full knowledge that the second I log off you'll think you've somehow ended up the victor of this mess you started. Hence my reply title.

[ellisonz]

68. Also, GD doesn't seem to be flailing to justify obsessions like the Gungeon.

It's lopsided in favor of Obama - 14-2 at the moment. Point proved.

[Clames]

71. You had a point here?

[Jenoch]

85. Why are you spending your money

on something as non-essential as movies instead of donating that money to the Obama campaign?

[Clames]

19. What a lousy, poorly conceived poll.

I spend my extra money on lots of things, I have that option since I live well below my means. Last weekend I spent it on tools and paint for a house belonging to a work colleague who is moving away and needed some serious help to get the house ready to be rented.

[ellisonz]

24. So how much are you spending on guns?

[Clames]

26. Not as much as I'm spending on food...

...and all the other gifts I'm buying.

[ellisonz]

27. Good going, Romney. n/t

[Clames]

30. You sure you should be congratulating him on this site?

You really must like gambling...

[ellisonz]

32. At least I'm not buying guns...

[holdencaufield]

38. I appreciate that because ...

... some of the more popular models are getting hard to find. Many companies have sold out their production runs for the year and it's only August.

The fewer people buying, the easier (and cheaper) it will be for the rest of us.

[Clames]

40. That's the truth.

Ruger's stopped taking orders for the next few months to work on backlog.

[holdencaufield]

42. I have two Chiappa models on backorder

They won't be delivered until November. Luckily -- I already have my Rugers

[Clames]

46. I was looking at a Chiappa Rhino 5" in .357

They are awfully proud of them judging by the going prices here. Love to find a Mateba Unica one of these days too.

[holdencaufield]

43. Every bite of that ...

... Hamburger Helper is another vote for Romney!

How do you sleep at night?!

[Clames]

48. Well, I got an awesome deal on a new European pillow top mattress for starters...

[holdencaufield]

37. Priorities ...

A President ... Democrat or Republican, is something that only lasts a few years

While a gun ... Is something you'll always have.

[ellisonz]

44. Wow.

Please stop using the Star of David as your avatar if you're going to make such ignorant comments. Because President's never make decisions that influence the course of history

[holdencaufield]

45. It's appropriate that I use it ...

... because I am trained to recognize when something is in need of a good mocking.

[ellisonz]

47. Generally

When one mocks, they do not make foolish statements. Do you know how many Yiddish words there are for fool? Quite a lot. In this case you're mostly being a klutz

[Clames]

51. Really?

I think you are actually thinking of schmuck, putz, or schmendrek you pashkudenyak...

[ellisonz]

54. My point exactly.

The statement in question was fucking ignorant and the defense thereof was a failure. We Jews have more sense than that, I'm really starting to think "holdencaufield" needs to read less Salinger and more Torah! I personally am offended to see the symbol of my faith associated with such ignorance.

Priorities ...

A President ... Democrat or Republican, is something that only lasts a few years

While a gun ... Is something you'll always have.

[Clames]

62. Rly?

Here's you sign...

[holdencaufield]

65. "I personally am offended to see the symbol of my faith associated with such ignorance. "

.. Mazel Bish!

[ellisonz]

67. I look at life without needing to make asinine statments...

...about my love guns being more important than electing sound leaders.

[holdencaufield]

72. Since you're a homeboy ...

... you might be interested in supporting this fine, Jewish organisation.

http://jpfo.org/

[ellisonz]

76. Do you realize how many more groups there are dedicated to peace? n/t

[Clames]

73. No...you just spend your time lamely trying to troll hunt...

...and generally annoy this group. Such important work you do...

[ellisonz]

77. I don't know why you guys have such a problem...

...stating that at this moment, it is more important to support the President than buy guns. Pretty sad isn't it? Even GD is able to say, that at this moment it is more important to the support the President than buy Christmas presents.

Such hard 's

[Clames]

87. I don't know why you have such a hard time understanding nobody really wants to bother with you...

...and your poll. Flame bait is flame bait and it's boring and predictable coming from you. It's a dishonest question really.

[ellisonz]

89. I don't know why you have such a hard time supporting Democratic causes...

[Union Scribe]

49. Shall we add avatar police to your pretend resume?

Maybe you should start a Meta thread about this injustice

[ellisonz]

50. Spoken like the poster with nothing but a question mark.

?

?

[Jenoch]

86. President's what?

[slackmaster]

75. What is this "extra $$$" you write of?

Right now I'm saving up for some dental work.

[ileus]

79. Does he really need my money to win in a 42 state landslide?

I haven't nor will I ever donate money to anyone running for office anywhere.

Mark my words Barack is going to win all buy 8 states by the time the election rolls around. People are dumb but not dumb enough to vote for the other ticket.


I still need to order a new upper to complete a project I started in March, and stock up on ammo before the goobs head out to clear the shelves on November the 7th. I'm not going to be caught without at least a years worth of practice ammo like the last election. I went almost 8 months without getting to the range in 2008. Never again...

[hack89]

80. Can I take my wife to dinner and the movies? Or is that wasting extra $$$? nt

[rrneck]

81. Curses! Outed by ellisonz, troll hunter!

Would have gotten away with it too if it hadn't been for those darn kids!

[CokeMachine]

83. Summer Break Is Over

and the troll hunter(s) is/are back in mom's basement doing something. What, I don't know, but something.

[NewMoonTherian]

82. You asked the question poorly, or you just asked the wrong question.

But I think I know what you're getting at.

I more highly value preserving and expanding gun rights than reelecting President Obama, or any other president in the future. Obama losing would be a significant setback. Registration or microstamping schemes would be a disaster.

[Remmah2]

84. That's like the question:

Do you still beat your wife?

[ellisonz]

93. Do you?

[Remmah2]

95. I beat my wife rarely.

She's a much better Scrabble player than me.

[ellisonz]

102. You're lucky she doesn't pull a gun. n/t

[Remmah2]

110. Only if she catches me cheating.

She hates when I peek at her letters.

[X_Digger]

91. Ahh this old chestnut again..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/117231665#post31

Lovely false equivalence again.

[ellisonz]

94. Care to the answer the question?

It's a simple question. I don't see how it's so hard to say that in fact you do care more about re-electing the President than buying new guns and ammo.

[X_Digger]

96. And buy into your false equivalence?

I daresay I've given more to Democratic candidates, spent more time and energy in various state and local election phone banking, or shuttling more voters to the polls than you have. Put your money where your mouth is. How much have you spent on re-electing the president?

And nice slide from 'do you spend more on' to 'do you care more about'. Did you think I wouldn't notice?

Transparent.

[ellisonz]

97. So you're buying more guns rather than supporting the President?

[X_Digger]

98. So your fingers are in my mouth again?

[ellisonz]

101. Care to answer the question...

...or are you just going to spout your little phrases.

[X_Digger]

105. I refuse to buy your false equivalence.

And I refuse to let you attempt to then put words in my mouth.

But hey, how much have you donated this election cycle? How many hours of phone banking and door knocking have you committed to? Do you have a list of voters who need a ride to the polls? Have you even reached out to your local party committee and signed up to help out?

We're up to $1,200 and change in 2012. (I'm sure of the $1,200 {$600 x 2}, but my wife bought some bumper stickers, and I'm not sure what they cost.)

eta: formatting

[gejohnston]

99. how did you come to that conclusion?

I interpret it as he is saying that he is doing more for Democrats than you might be.

[ellisonz]

100. Conclusions don't end in question marks. n/t

[gejohnston]

103. it does when you pretend it is a question

[PavePusher]

104. I like pie.

And turtles.

[PavePusher]

106. Dis topic are full uf Gun Control Phale and...

[krispos42]

107. Let's look at your results:

For guns over Obama: BigAlanMac, bad sofa king, LTG, ileus, Marinedem, trouble.smith, NewMoonTherian, Callisto32, Lizzie Poppet

For Obama over guns: Scuba, MADem, Son of Gob, dballance, ellisonz, rrneck, broiles

For none of the above: JustABozoOnThisBus, glacierbay, inkool, AndyTiedye, slackmaster, SQUEE, Remmah2, Simo 1939_1940, Union Scribe, holdencaufield, rDigital, Reasonable_Argument, sarisataka, Clames, gejohnston, Missycim, Trunk Monkey

Wow, look at all the Gungeon regulars picking guns over Obama.



Typical false choice. Frank Luntz, is that you?


Now, should I close down this thread, or do you want Mitt Romney to win?

[ellisonz]

109. Why do you hate Christmas?

What is the more important fiscal ($$$) priority- buying fancy Christmas presents or supporting the re-election of Barack Obama?

21 votes, 3 passes | Time left: Unlimited

Christmas Presents: 2 (10%): demmiblue, RZM

President Obama: 19 (90%): geckosfeet, Scuba, Quantess, lovemydog, dimbear, applegrove, madokie, Firebrand Gary, Locut0s, Proles, Politicalboi, pinboy3niner, Tracyjo, Warpy, Scootaloo, silverweb, sakabatou, elleng, TeamPooka

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021184303

See it's really not that hard.

Now, should I close down this thread, or do you want Mitt Romney to win?

Is that a threat?

[krispos42]

111. No dodging.

Answer the question.

[ellisonz]

112. So you do hate Christmas...

...how intolerant. - no but really if you want to use your superpowers go right ahead. I can't stop you.

[krispos42]

113. Locking

Our good, loyal Democrat ellisonz, when faced with a difficult choice, choose to defeat Mitt Romney.

Regards,
Krispos42, Group Host

[virginia mountainman]

108. LOL, since their not mutually exclusive... I picked the first..