Gun Control & RKBA
Related: About this forumGeorgia Man Arrested for Triple Murder
ajc.com reportsDeKalb County investigators said late Wednesday they have identified the man accused of shooting three people to death at an apartment complex. But they havent found him yet.
Brian Levern Gupton, 32, allegedly shot two men and a woman, possibly following a discussion over the theft of money, according to police.
Officers arriving at the Crystal Point Apartments, off Columbia Drive in south DeKalb, around 1:20 a.m. found the three people shot in the parking lot, according to Mekka Parish, police spokeswoman. All three died from their injuries, Parish said.
Detectives believe the trio were at the location meeting with the suspect in reference to a dispute over the theft of money, Parish said in an emailed statement. During this encounter, the suspect pulled out a weapon and began firing, striking the three victims.
No mention in the article about his past, whether he was a lawful gun owner or not. But, it doesn't matter. In this, gun owners are all the same. Some of them think the gun is the answer and use it to settle scores or end arguments.
Gun-rights fanatics are heavily invested in the idea that gun owners are divided neatly into two categories, the good guys and the bad guys. Nothing could be further from the truth. They're all brothers of the gun.
What's your opinion? Please leave a comment.
Cross posted at Mikeb302000
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tblue
(16,350 posts)Count me as one on the side of peace. I am done with the bullies and the bullets.
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)You still have the question of what you will do if you are confronted by a violent criminal.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)Remmah2
(3,291 posts)Just violent.
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)gejohnston
(17,502 posts)mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)gejohnston
(17,502 posts)based on ATF and FBI statistics. On average, he has been arrested if not convicted more than a couple of times, and the gun last sold through an FFL ten years ago (the gun might be older, the national average is 11 years.) Also, statistically, the victims are likely to have criminal records as well.
lina92
(1 post)I would assume that whatever they were arguing about was probable cause for them to be murdered... -__- considering the fact that I knew one of the victims, I would have to say NO, he didn't have a criminal record.
As for why they were murdered, only the killer knows that. I was simply pointing out that most murders and their victims generally have records. I'm sorry for your loss.
hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)![](/emoticons/hi.gif)
GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)It is rare that we get personal knowledge of person involved in an incident. Do you know anything else that you could share with us about this?
friendly_iconoclast
(15,333 posts)You and the Bloomberg obsessive are two peas in a pod- The ends justify any means...
mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)friendly_iconoclast
(15,333 posts)...since there are at least three names associated with "mikeb30200"...:
Mike Bonomo, purportedly a 55+ expat from New Jersey living in Italy:
http://www.blogger.com/profile/09806175370305006933
mikeb302000
On Blogger since July 2008
Profile views - 4393
My blogs
Mikeb302000
Democurmudgeon
About me
Gender Male
Location Rome, Italy
Introduction I'm an American expat living in Italy these last 22 years.
Jason Kilgore, AKA "Baldr Odinson:
http://www.blogger.com/profile/11818934498607763309
Baldr Odinson
On Blogger since January 2011
Profile views - 1482
My blogs
New Trajectory
Walmart Shootings
Mikeb302000
Kid Shootings
About me
Gender Male
Location Eugene, Oregon, United States
Introduction I am a volunteer activist for reducing gun violence in the Eugene, Oregon area, and all of Oregon. Join me! www.ceasefireoregon.org
Interests Gun Control, Peace, Suicide Prevention
Don't piss on our legs and tell us it's raining.
Straw Man
(6,624 posts)... new age psychobabble. So in your mind, I and the people with whom I shot sporting clays this afternoon are morally equivalent to murderers? Your mind must be a very small and dark place.
People who use guns to "settle scores or end arguments" are, by definition, criminals. I am not a criminal. Kindly retract your slimy insinuations or crawl back under the rock from whence you periodically emerge to spew this shit.
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)Or a very large and empty place.... with interesting accoustical properties. Dusty. Stagnant, even. Odor of decay, perhaps.
Reverberation counts as "interesting accoustical properties", yes?
mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)Accusing me of that makes you sound stupid. I said gun owners are not neatly divided into good guys and bad guys.
"People who use guns to "settle scores or end arguments" are, by definition, criminals. " This is another lie. Only convicted felons are criminals. Remember, even unfit gun owners are innocent until proven guilty. That's why we need another category called "hidden criminals."
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)you did imply that we are likely to be thugs and criminals
Straw Man
(6,624 posts)You are saying that they (I refuse to say "we"
![](/emoticons/wink.gif)
Spare us the sophist parsing -- you're not very good at it anyway. Using a gun to settle a score or end an argument is criminal behavior, whether or not one is convicted for it, and it is immoral behavior in any case. If you insinuate that I have a bond with those who engage in such behavior, I will ask you to apologize or tell you to fuck off. You didn't apologize. So fuck off.
Jenoch
(7,720 posts)What is your point exactly? Yes, sometimes a gun owner with a previously unblemished record does commit a crime with a gun. There are a variety of reasons I am sure.
aikoaiko
(34,170 posts)Your hatred for lawful gun owners is the perfect foil for NRA hyberbole.
The NRA thanks you.
hack89
(39,171 posts)because they happen to enjoy competitive target shooting?
Now I know you are not serious but are here merely to stir shit.
mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)When the argument falters, exaggerate what the other guy said and argue against that. Good strategy.
hack89
(39,171 posts)ok - so explain to me how you differentiate between criminals and lawful gun owners.
former-republican
(2,163 posts)ileus
(15,396 posts)There are millions and millions of us out here....take today to give thanks that in our country we have the tools of freedoms and safety on hand all the time.
Later on today we'll be headed into the field to hunt another of our countries great traditions. Here in Virginia we have a one day turkey season in celebration of Thanksgiving.
Of course rifle season is also open.
Good luck out there my friends and remember stay safe.
sarisataka
(18,656 posts)because I own a device that can be used to commit a crime. I have argued with people while armed and never had even considered drawing a weapon. Yet by your implication, I am no better than a multiple murderer; if fact you imply I am already a criminal, I just haven't actually been convicted of a crime yet.
I could say all gun control fanatics are douche-bags but I have had pleasant discussions with several so I know that is not true. Would you like to try the shoe on Cinderella?
BTW I will spend Thanksgiving with extended family, about 20 people. I will be carrying an S&W 638 loaded with Winchester .38 135 gr. +P and have two full reloads. I will let you know if I some how refrained from shooting anybody or if the gun leaps out of the holster and starts shooting on its own...
mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)"I could say all gun control fanatics are douche-bags"
If you said that you'd be wrong, just like I'd be wrong if I said ALL gun owners are bad guys. But, I didn't say that, did I.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)with "brothers of the gun"
and here
sarisataka
(18,656 posts)your writing is somewhat unclear
Then you say
Then later
So.... first all gun owners are the same i.e. bad people, criminals, hidden criminals... whatever, then it is some think the gun is the answer... i.e. there are good gun owners and bad gun owners, but then back to *all brothers*, i.e. if not bad now, they will be...
So
![](/emoticons/shrug.gif)
BTW Thanksgiving was a lot of fun. Met some cousins from Canada who I never saw in person before. The only ones who knew I was armed were my wife, kids and brother. The only casualty was a delicious turkey.
rrneck
(17,671 posts)if I thought you were actually making any money off this slanderous bullshit I might at least have some respect for that.
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)An apartment complex (looking rather low-rent...), a luxury automobile, a mug-shot of a suspect currently hiding (thus indicating a prior criminal record), a dispute over money...
I'm gonna go out on a limb here and predict a squabble over a criminal endevour, by people who were all legally disqualified from owning firearms.
Shall we start a pool?
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)can't even keep from contradicting himself inside of 4 of his own words:
some = all now? even forgetting the rest of the idiocy, that's just straight up dumb.
Aiko is right - NRA is giving thanks today for people like Mike.
mikeb302000
(1,065 posts)I've made my position abundantly clear about gun owners being divided into three categories, good guys, bad guys and hidden criminals. But, because you can't argue straight up, you look for little word problems to pick on.
gejohnston
(17,502 posts)per capita, there are more felons in MAIG
Straw Man
(6,624 posts)I think it has more to do with psychobabble, buzzwords, propaganda, and plausible deniability.
And yet here you squander a perfect opportunity to explain exactly what you meant and score a juicy rhetorical point. One starts to doubt your sincerity, Michael.
I'll bet that somewhere along the line, someone told you that you were a pretty good writer. That person was wrong.
That a person can lecture me about the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" in the same thread where he asserts the doctrine of "hidden criminals" beggars belief. I'm supposed to await the judgment of a court before I so much as characterize a behavior as criminal, yet you would circumscribe a person's rights because that person might someday commit a crime. Such inconsistency: the mind reels.
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)Oh Snaps!
aletier_v
(1,773 posts)If I remember correctly, the average mortality rate is around 25-30%.
3 of 3 is about 10% probability.
I'd guess that he shot each one multiple times, perhaps after they were already down.
Ah, did my math wrong, it's 1/3 x 1/3 x 1/3 = 5% or so.
Eleanors38
(18,318 posts)and punish other people on a mass basis.
You, Mike, should smile for your official I.D. photo.
Eyes of the World
(93 posts)Bruce Lee claimed that the man with the weapon was the one at a disadvantage. When it is gone they are helpless.
Did you know that the Russian military has developed a martial art designed to keep an attacker away long enough to get your gun out and make an effective shot? It is not automatic, it takes work and practice. Relying on a firearm for your bravery is just stupid.
Remember - One doesn't kill with a gun, one kills with their heart. One who kills with their heart doesn't need a gun.
PavePusher
(15,374 posts)I also have several years of hand-to-hand combat training, but it's much riskier, far more dependent on physical strength, stamina and dexterity, and requires far more constant, expensive and risky practice to stay capable. Not everyone can do that.
Loudly
(2,436 posts)slackmaster
(60,567 posts)...to protect us.
Loudly
(2,436 posts)glacierbay
(2,477 posts)along with most constitutional scholars including Pres. Obama? Are you saying that they're all wrong and you're right? What are your credentials in Constitutional Law? Can you cite the Law that says our 2A right ended at Appomattox?
Loudly
(2,436 posts)gejohnston
(17,502 posts)certainly not Stevens, a life long Republican nominated by Ford. It just looks that way with people like Scalia and Roberts. It is easier to over turn a decision that restricts individual liberties than one that expands it, which is partly why Roe is safe.
you're just hoping for it to happen. It's settled law now. But you didn't answer the question, what are your constitutional law credentials? Can you cite the law that erased our 2A right at Appomattox?
Also, Pres. Obama doesn't agree with you either and I consider him a whole hell of a lot smarter than you on constitutional law. Care to explain that?
ileus
(15,396 posts)rrneck
(17,671 posts)ileus
(15,396 posts)When I first started my collection common Morgans could be bought for 5-7 bucks. I gave many away in Internet forum giveaway threads. I wish I had kept them all now.
slackmaster
(60,567 posts)![](/emoticons/donkey.gif)
fightthegoodfightnow
(7,042 posts)You lost the Civil War.
friendly_iconoclast
(15,333 posts)1) Slack may or may not be a little "chronologically enhanced", but I doubt he's old enough
to have been around for the Civil War.
and
2) Neo-Confederates are about as common as passenger pigeons here at DU.
Kindly put your bigotry aside.
fightthegoodfightnow
(7,042 posts)Just a fact. The South lost the war.
I think it is YOU who is PRE-judging. I was born in Alabama, have in-laws from Georgia and grew up in Virginia. Even there, the history books show the South lost the Civil War.
He stated 'If every individual in a free state is not secure, the state is not secure.'
Hogwash.....anyone who thinks this Nation is not secured because I do not own a gun is well... Just wrong. If by state, he meant one of the 50, I repeat what I said before. The South lost the war. The oft repeated insistence by some that having a gun is a pre-requisite for security is silly.
slackmaster
(60,567 posts)![](/emoticons/crazy.gif)
DonP
(6,185 posts)slackmaster
(60,567 posts)![](/emoticons/hide.gif)
fightthegoodfightnow
(7,042 posts).
slackmaster
(60,567 posts)1. I was born in Kansas and now reside in California. Kansas was admitted to the Union as a free state in 1861. I have never lived in any state that was ever part of the Confederacy.
2. No known blood relative of mine fought for the Confederacy. I have ancestors who fought in the Revolutionary War on the side of the colonists, and in the Civil War on the side of the Union.
3. I have never engaged in any kind of advocacy for secession, segregation, slavery, or any of the other traits that make the Confederacy a historical pariah in the eyes of most Americans.
4. No known ancestor of mine ever owned a slave. People on my mother's side were early Pennsylvania colonists who were pacifists and strongly opposed to slavery. My father's family was Mennonite. They immigrated to the USA in the 1870s. Mennonites are strict pacifists and have also always opposed slavery.
5. My advocacy for the right to keep and bear arms is libertarian at its roots. I believe strongly that people have a fundamental right to own, say, or do anything they please as long as it hasn't been prohibited through due process of law.
6. The security of a free state as mentioned in the Second Amendment refers to security at all levels, from the individual up to the society as a whole. If I feel that owning firearms is appropriate for my personal security or the security of my household, I have the right to own them. If you feel that owning a gun would not make you more secure, or if for any other reason you wish not to own one, I respect your personal choice. I ask that you respect mine in return.
I find it very odd that you would state to me "You lost the Civil War." Obviously that war ended almost a century before I was born. I have never made any statement that would logically connect me with the Confederacy or even the modern South.
Have you confused me with someone else? Or perhaps you have made a "package deal" fallacious assumption that my advocacy for individual freedom on things like abortion and gun ownership mean that I must somehow be connected with the losing side of the Civil War.
Either way, your remark makes no sense whatsoever. Is it intended as some kind of insult?
fightthegoodfightnow
(7,042 posts)To much to respond to here and I'm not going to attempt to respond to all.
My response about the South winning was in response to the individuals need for a gun to protect the state did not connect the dots well. It's often a rallying cry in the South for why we need guns to protect our freedom, which I don't buy. I grew up in the South and heard it often. The evidence is the South lost the Civil War (not for lack of guns but lack of manufacturing and other reasons). Even now, I do not own a gun and I am no less a champion of freedom.
I respect all the points you made and apologize for not expressing myself well.
ileus
(15,396 posts)before anything else matters.
The state doesn't operate on individual safety but community safety. It's up to the private citizen to assure his/her personal safety at any moment in time.
ileus
(15,396 posts)Maybe mikey is right....he may have been a hidden criminal.
Tuesday Afternoon
(56,912 posts)GreenStormCloud
(12,072 posts)Law enforcement is still looking for him. Read the article that you referenced.