AFRICAN-AMERICAN GROUP: Dear white progressives: Stop telling black people how to vote

[steve2470]

http://www.salon.com/2015/07/21/dear_white_progressives_stop_telling_black_people_how_to_vote/



We are now in the midst of the 2016 presidential election, which means both parties are pandering to their bases as well as to unlikely voters who may be swayed to their respective sides. Although it’s early, this election cycle has already been dominated by questions of which candidate will garner “the black vote,” as if black people are monolithic. Given that thousands of black people are currently leading a social justice movement across the nation that the media has dubbed the “Black Lives Matter Movement,” the black electorate appears to be at the forefront of politicians’ minds.

There is a history of black communities voting Democrat — that is, when we are actually allowed to vote, as we were historically targeted for explicitly racist disenfranchisement in the 20th century and felon disenfranchisement in the 21st century. During the 19th century, the Democratic Party was well known for instituting anti-black policies in the South such as Jim Crow, poll taxes and literacy tests. Since then, the Democratic Party has shifted its image to racial indifference, while the Republican Party picked up its racially hostile characteristics.

Today black communities continue to be betrayed by both sides of the aisle in this toxic political system, which prioritizes exuberant campaign spending over protecting human rights. Both Ferguson and Baltimore saw uprisings in the face of police terror in the last year. And each city watched Democratic city and state politicians lead violent militarized occupation in response to protests, including the National Guard, tear gas, rubber bullets and riot police. The fact is that neither political party is “for black people,” but white liberal and moderate voters continually impose upon black communities the candidates they feel are most sympathetic to black experiences.

A bizarre phenomenon has developed out of this — Bernie Sanders supporters lurking in the dark trolling shadows of Twitter to condescendingly tell black people what’s best for us inside a system designed to crush us. One person even went to so far as to call Sanders “one of the first Black Lives Matter Activists.” Others juxtapose his image with captions of Martin Luther King Jr. quotes, and thrust such egregious depictions at black Twitter users. Sanders supporters list his involvement with the civil rights movement as though they have now come to collect on his debt — black people must repay Sanders for his service by voting him into office.

more at link

[Lisa D]

1. Interesting article!

And the folks in the comments section are just proving her point.

[Stellar]

3. Yep...it's the same bs everywhere and there is always somebody that will post his

accomplishments. As if I didn't understand the first 500 times that it was posted.

[Stellar]

2. An excellent article and I couldn't have said it better. nt

[HassleCat]

4. You don't owe anything to anyone

This is partly the result of the rise of interest group politics, enabled by the formation of PACs. Candidates are forced to pursue voters as member of particular interest groups in a way that reminds me of the things advertisers do to sell products to black consumers. I'm not black, but I would be insulted by some of the shameless pandering, as I guess you are. All this stuff diminishes the role of the individual and promoted the notion that "certain types of people" form nearly monolithic blocs of humanity. In politics, the black vote is pursued this way because black voters usually go for one candidate in very high numbers. This makes the black vote look like a winner-take-all proposition.

It is wrong to propose black voters "owe" anything to Sanders. All we should be proposing is that black voters take a good look at Sanders, his record, his early involvement with civil rights, his commitment to social and economic justice, etc. It is, or should be, a plea for consideration, not a harangue. Sanders has been trying very hard to understand the BLM issues, and it appears to be a sincere effort to incorporate social justice issues into what has been mostly an economic justice platform. But nobody should suggest this establishes any kind of debt, obligation, etc. Clinton has a strong emotional connection to many black voters, and that's perfectly legitimate. We (Sanders supporters) have no business suggesting that connection is somehow overcome by anything Bernie did, or is doing now. We need to state our case to black voters without lecturing them about why they're wrong to support Clinton over Sanders, as if they're deluding themselves or something.

[Number23]

16. Holey moley. I freaking love this post.

FYI steve (the OP) is not black. He is a white guy, Sanders supporter and one of the many friends of and supporters of this forum and the handful of AA members that are still here.

It is wrong to propose black voters "owe" anything to Sanders. All we should be proposing is that black voters take a good look at Sanders, his record, his early involvement with civil rights, his commitment to social and economic justice, etc. It is, or should be, a plea for consideration, not a harangue. Sanders has been trying very hard to understand the BLM issues, and it appears to be a sincere effort to incorporate social justice issues into what has been mostly an economic justice platform. But nobody should suggest this establishes any kind of debt, obligation, etc. Clinton has a strong emotional connection to many black voters, and that's perfectly legitimate. We (Sanders supporters) have no business suggesting that connection is somehow overcome by anything Bernie did, or is doing now. We need to state our case to black voters without lecturing them about why they're wrong to support Clinton over Sanders, as if they're deluding themselves or something.

Sweet Jesus, it is so wonderful to read this. I cannot thank you enough for this post. Welcome to the AA forum, HassleCat.

[onpatrol98]

19. Excellent!!!

[Fred Sanders]

28. Thank you for the research and context.

[lib87]

5. The Quote that Sums up my Feelings

The fact is that neither political party is “for black people,” but white liberal and moderate voters continually impose upon black communities the candidates they feel are most sympathetic to black experiences.

I wish this could be on the front page of the website.

[mhatrw]

10. So let's all give up on the political process just when

we finally have a surging Presidential candidate who is too progressive for either party?

[lib87]

12. Show Me Where I Said/Implied That in my Post

[Jim Lane]

15. Would you explain "impose" in this context?

I didn't understand a lot in the linked article, and that was part of what confused me.

What's supposed to happen is that party candidates are chosen in primaries and office holders are chosen in general elections, by free and fair vote. The departures from that ideal are generally not the work of white liberal and moderate voters. For example, the recent rise in voter suppression (ID laws and the like) has certainly been opposed by white liberals; it's harder to pin down "moderates" because the meaning is less clear, but certainly white conservatives have been the primary culprits in voter suppression.

Whites, like blacks, do advocate on behalf of their preferred candidates. The phrase "telling someone how to vote" has a connotation of coercion, but advocacy isn't coercion. If I hand out leaflets for a candidate, I'm not imposing my candidate on anyone. It's still the voter's choice. And that's true even if I, as a white liberal, hand a leaflet to a black voter. Is that the kind of conduct that's being objected to here?

[lib87]

17. If you want Some examples what the author means by imposing, check out the comments section

of the article. Many commenters ignoring the author's feelings and concerns altogether. Plenty of defensiveness and paternalistic comments.

[randys1]

21. I was reflecting over the weekend about what Greg Palast said about the only white

guy to show up at the Black Caucus over the Bush/Harris crime of stealing Florida, etc.

Stole it by disenfranchising TENS of THOUSANDS of African Americans, and per Greg this is happening still and RIGHT NOW in multiple states.

Anyway, I have no doubt that Bernie Sanders is who he says he is on ALL issues.

But if I was a Gay American or Muslim American, and I was fearful of what the deeply hateful teaparty wants to do to me if they take power, I would not give a shit about where a candidate was 40 yrs ago in a protest march.

I would not only want to know where he stands now but I would want it to feel and sound sincere, and for a while there Bernie wasnt doing that.

I can tell a Black person that Bernie is the best on their issues of those available, but how do I really know that?
I dont.

For instance is he on paper the best? No doubt, but what can he accomplish?

Anyway, i am jumping all over the place, one thing I am sure of, white libertarians who threaten to NOT vote for whoever the Dem candidate is, are the LAST fucking people who should be lecturing Black people about the value of voting.

[greatauntoftriplets]

6. Amen!

[SusanCalvin]

7. Yep.

I still find the number of Bernie "supporters" who don't get this absolutely incredible.

[leftofcool]

8. Amen!

[mhatrw]

9. Since the system ain't working, why support the ultimate system candidates?

Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden are of, by and for the system. Bernie Sanders can't get a single system politician to endorse him because he is and has been the most antiestablishment politician holding a major federal political office since Wellstone was assassinated.

Why is it a crime for white progressives to try to convince black progressives to also support the most progressive candidate?

Sure, it is always bad to condescend. But since when is is bad for progressives to champion progressive candidates to other progressives?

[Chitown Kev]

13. You say that as if Bernie Sanders isn't part of the system.

He's been in the Congress for 25 years. he has his own thing going on, yes, but he's still a "part of the system" and will be even more a "part of the system" if he is elected president...that has more to do with the nature of a system than anything else.

Now whether Bernie Sanders can tweak that system in a minor or even major way...that's the question.


And whether Paul Wellstone, who voted for the Defense of Marriage Act (and publically regretted that vote) AND the 1994 crime bill, was assassinated sounds like a conspiracy theory to me, one that I will admit to have heard of. And that I might possibly even believe.

[SusanCalvin]

14. "Sure, it is always bad to condescend."

That's exactly what I personally have seen. Not from anywhere near everyone, but from enough to notice. That and tone-deafness. And not listening. And refusing to recognize reality.

"I would not trust the Golux overfar. He cannot tell what can be from what can't. He seldom knows what should be from what is." James Thurber

[mhatrw]

18. I agree that, in general, white people hate to think about racism.

And, in general, they really hate to think deeply and clearly about it.

[JI7]

20. sanders is part of the system also. he supports chuck schumer as senate dem leader

[mhatrw]

22. And that makes supporting a corporate statist OK? n/t

[JI7]

23. isn't that what Sanders is doing by supporting Schumer ?

[randys1]

24. What the new Bernie fans dont understand is by DEFINITION if Bernie is

a house and senate member for 20+ years, he is part of the system.

For the same reason he wont attack Hillary anymore than he has to, he wont stray out of the system too far because you cant change it from the outside, you have to be inside.

[blackspade]

25. This is why I refuse to use twitter.

It is filled to the brim with idiot trolls that lots of people actually take seriously.
Articles that rely on twitter as their 'evidence' only perpetuate the stupidity that is now our political discourse.

folks should vote for whoever speaks to them.

[Fred Sanders]

26. The fact that Clinton has the overwhelming support of black and minority voters should be cause for

celebration within the Democratic Party, it is the voting engine that will retain the WH and SCOTUS for generations and Congress soon enough.

To try and tear her down to bring up another is not only reprehensible, it only helps to divide....though rather unsuccessfully, have to add that.

[jazzwinders]

27. Thank you!

Thanks for posting.

[xfundy]

29. My racist asshole sister continues to believe

that black people are somehow like a 'borg' in which they all think alike. Oh, and that they have an extra bone in their foot, which makes them athletic.

[yardwork]

30. I'm seeing this, too.

I can't believe that any serious candidate believes that bullying people is an effective way to get their votes, so I have to assume that this is the personal behaviors of "supporters" rather than real campaign strategy.

[CarlaJonesChicago]

31. I don't think Im voting Bernie

To be honest, I'm leaning towards Hillary Clinton. It's not due to her hubby. I want somebody in office who has experience with various departments and issues. People give her crap for not acting female enough. People give her crap because she is a female. Which one will it
be? Bernie Sanders isn't bad, but he is definitely to extreme for the job. I appreciate him but he won't be able to get a real foothold on the nomination. Hillary is being bullied and it's pathetic. Republicans know she will win it because she is perfect for the job. Yes I believe she will put heat under the Republicans ass too. We need to face hard facts. Hillary Clinton will be get the nomination. Sanders should be Veep. We need his ideas and we need her firm personality and strong government experience.

[1StrongBlackMan]

34. As a Host of this Group ...

I want to welcome you and invite your participation.

I think you will like this Group ... especially when the main board gets to be too much.

[Blue_Tires]

32. kick

[MrScorpio]

33. Kicking!