San Diego Atheist Group Looks To Spread Non-Belief

[rug]

Friday, November 22, 2013
By Claire Trageser

Stroll through Balboa Park on a Saturday afternoon and you'll get a pretty good religious education as you pass everything from Hare Krishnas to evangelical Christians. But then you'll see another kind of group.

They've set up a booth with an awning that says, "Relax, Hell Does Not Exist." When you approach, member Tommy J gives you his pitch.

"These are what we call theistic pretzels," J says, holding up a small hard pretzel. "And a theistic pretzel, as we can see, is made with actual twisted logic. But some people have a little more hunger in their souls, they're looking for maybe a little more than that, so we will save them with the power of Cheez-Its."

This pretzel-preaching gathering is put on every weekend by the atheist group San Diego Coalition of Reason.

http://www.kpbs.org/news/2013/nov/22/san-diego-atheist-group-spreads-non-belief-church-/

[longship]

1. Call it community outreach. ;-)

At least atheists aren't knocking on my front door in the morning. I do get Mormons and JW's though. I always very politely tell them that I am not interested and wish them a pleasant day.

[rug]

2. If they knock on my door and hand me a pretzel, I'm calling the police.

Unless it's covered in chocolate.

[longship]

3. Well played, my friend.

Actually I don't go along with a claim that the intent of this is to convert theists. It may be, in part, an outcome. I think that one cannot convert a theist to atheism without them harboring doubt in the first place. Can one really call that a conversion?

I know that this is in part a rhetorical argument. I think that is sensible because atheists do not seem to use the tricks and techniques that theists do in their outreach programs. I like to compare it to the outreach of the LGBT community over the past years and nobody can credibly claim that the goal of that is conversion.

As always.

[cbayer]

4. This concept of "deconversion" bothers me though.

If that's the goal of some sects of this growing movement, I would predict knocks on the door in the future.

Outreach is a good thing. Evangelizing is quite another.

[longship]

5. Well, I have never known it to happen.

I'd be very surprised to hear it was happening in any substantial amount. I agree that it is an extraordinarily bad idea.

I also presume that the atheist movement is not growing due to conversions, but to outreach to people who already doubt. The true believers are not going to be converted anyway.

Also, this outreach, and any atheist evangelizing that exists, is likely increasing because of the excesses of the more fervent of the believers who seem to see anybody who does not believe everything as they do as a threat to their freedom to believe that way. How could anybody take such claims seriously? Then, you have the ones who go into government to force their beliefs on everybody by legislative fiat. They, or their sock puppets, also play the persecution card upon opposition.

If they don't like atheist activism, tough shit for them. They likely are substantially responsible for atheism ascending in activism and influence.

[cbayer]

6. There some info about it in the article and there was recently

a book review posted here that is being sold essentially as a handbook for deconversion.

I do agree with you though about the underlying reason for the rise in absolute numbers, and I think that's a good thing. Normalizing atheism would be a benefit for many and decrease the prejudice and fear towards atheists in general.

One must acknowledge, however, that there is a sub-group that is clearly anti-religious and not just areligious. Some of the leaders within atheism have led this charge, which is often what needs to happen within a burgeoning movement.

But as atheism becomes a normalized position and acceptable to more and more people, that kind of activism will become less important and more marginalized. I think that's happening already to some extent and in some areas.

[longship]

7. Well, I am strongly anti-religion.

But not anti-religious. I don't give a f*** what a person believes or not as long as they keep it to themselves. That's why I am equally against atheism evangelizing as that for theism.

But if somebody brings up the topic of religion, I often will engage in a conversation about my lack of belief. Rarely is that with Sunday morning door knockers. It is more likely to happen over a beer.

I almost always frame such discussions not as advocacy, but as explanation of my lack of belief in gods. However, if somebody steps over the line to evangelizing their belief in god, so be it. Then, I will go at it full force, albeit still politely.

I am most aggressive to those people who, after saying that they are agnostic, state that I cannot call myself an atheist. Then my normally polite demeanor has a tendency to slip. I don't have to take any such claims seriously and am likely to descend into overt ridicule. I also don't like being told that I am going to spend an eternity in Hell.

As always, my friend.

[cbayer]

8. Your position and attitude are unlikely to be perceived as hostile

or evangelizing, longship.

Discussions like you describe can be fun and entertaining. They can lead to greater understanding and tolerance. That's all good.

I think people can call themselves whatever they please and also object strongly when people tell me what I am and am not.

Hope you are well. Enjoy your Sunday "meeting" tomorrow.

[longship]

9. I am not worried what people think of me in those discussions.

As long as I am polite, what should I worry about? And if they interpret me as evangelizing for atheism that's not my problem. I always frame such discussions in first person. There's no way one could get away with calling it evangelizing. If somebody accused me of that, my response will be, "It does not at all bother me what you believe. Why do you think I would be in anyway troubled by the fact that you believe in god?" Or something like that.

So I really do try to be careful not to tread on toes too much. I am self secure in my beliefs and do not feel threatened by others who do not agree with them. Maybe that helps. I don't know. I am not an expert on my own psychology.

We got a trace of snow last night, still on the ground. Cold, but sunny, today.