Help please!

[nightwing1240]

I am in an ongoing battle with a Trumpian hypocrite that honestly believes that all gay people are going to hell because they are gay. The same for trans people. She says there are bible passages, my argument is that Jesus said to love thy neighbor as thyself without reservation. I am aware of plenty of nasty stuff in the old testament and acts of the apostles. But of course my arguement is that Jesus Himself never spoke of it and they were just men.

What makes this worse is it is a social online game we play and as she has a large club, she has began a "Bible Study" and is pushing her crap on all of them. Many of whom are gay and now crying because they feel they have sinned and are going to hell.

She also has a twelve year old granddaughter who is trans and is making her feel awful too. I have plead with her that these children are taking their lives daily and that gays face sooo much abuse and worse to please stop but she will not.

It's to the point I am just trying to save some lives here and not getting anywhere. Any help is most appreciated. Thank you

[Croney]

1. I would announce I'm leaving the group and explain why,

and urge others to join me.

[nightwing1240]

2. Well I was summarily tossed out

And called a blashphemer so I cant speak to the group now

[Beastly Boy]

3. Ask her to quote the bible passages that she is referring to.

This will shut her up in a hurry, because there are no passages, either in the Old testament or the New testament that refer to either gay people going to hell, or trans people in any context, or gay women in any context. There is one passage (I believe in Deuteronomy) that refers to prohibition of sleeping with a man as you would with a woman. No mention of punishment for any of the above.

Step 2: Share her response with the large club you referred to, and quit the club because the Magat in charge of it is using the club to promote anti-Christian beliefs.

[WhiteTara]

4. define battle

[sinkingfeeling]

5. Ask her if she eats shrimp or crab or lobster. Ask her if she wears clothing that mixes fibers.

Both of those have the same Biblical penalty as being gay.

[usonian]

6. They are locked into cult behavior, which is anti-Christian.

You can't influence them. Expend your energy in ways that will benefit yourself and others around you.
They can play the devil ("By Their Acts You Shall Know Them…" ) but you can't play God.

I hope you find better company, people who either agree or who are open to the qualities of equality, honor and fairness.

And to be rational about this, a cult peaks at a certain percentage of people who can be deeply duped into self-defeating behavior, (they have to put on blinders to shut out truth) whereas due to the inherent good in people (yes, it exists) good can grow, hopefully in exponential ways. (like pyramid sales gone right!)

And you can vote for people who can alter the climate and laws of the land.

https://democraticunderground.com/100216524810
Ibram X Kendi used to believe in changing "hearts and minds" but realizing how insanely difficult that can be, he has opted for changing the laws of the land, and hence, the climate, the common sense of the people.

An antiracist America can only be guaranteed if principled antiracists are in power, and then antiracist policies become the law of the land, and then antiracist ideas become the common sense of the people, and then the antiracist common sense of the people holds those antiracist leaders and policies accountable.

[raging moderate]

7. Matthew 19:9-12, during a discussion of marriage:

Last edited Sat Jul 1, 2023, 07:35 AM - Edit history (3)

Jesus said Whosever shall divorce his wife, except for adultery and marry another, shall commit adultery...."His disciples said unto him, "If that be the case, it is better not to marry." But Jesus said unto them, "This teaching does not apply to everyone....for there are some who were born eunuchs...and some were made eunuchs by men... and some have made themselves eunuchs." So even back then, some people were born with genitalia/identities that were not clearly male or female. Actually, ancient Greek scholars also mentioned this phenomenon.

Also, there is Matthew 25: 34-40:
"When the Son of man shall come in his glory....then shall all nations be gathered before him, and he shall separate them into two groups....Then shall the King say to those on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of th world, For I was hungry, and you gave me food; I was thirsty, and you gave me drink, I was a stranger, and you took me in; I was naked, and you gave me clothing; I was sick, and you helped me; I was in prison, and you visited me." These people will say, "What are you talking about? When did we ever see you before?" And the King shall answer them, "When you helped the people suffering in these ways, you were really helping my brethren, so you were really helping me."

Also, there is John 13:34:
"A new commandment I give unto you all: "Love one another, as I have loved you."

And, oh yes, poor misunderstood Paul in Ephesians 4:32:
"Be ye kind to one another, and tenderhearted, and forgive one another, as God has forgiven you..." Paul did mean well. He was just one of those very decisive, forthright, legalistic people.

While I am at it, I must clear Paul of one false accusation. He DID NOT speak contemptuously of women or say that men should marry only because it is better to marry "than to burn" with desire. In fact, it was primarily a woman whose question was being answered here, as he urged her to think very carefully about marriage, because she would lose a lot of freedom if she married. Actually, the passage that is often quoted here (Corinthians 7:25-39) urges both men and women to be very cautious about getting married, because everyone loses a lot of freedom in marriage and undertakes obligations to please one's husband or wife.

[murielm99]

8. I am glad you are a raging moderate.

Nice post. Thank you.

[raging moderate]

9. Thank you. Al Gore coined that phrase.

Boy, was I ever mad when he supposedly "lost" that election!

[Major Nikon]

10. I seriously doubt there's anything you can say to someone that deluded

Most of these people have been indoctrinated since birth on their hate. The best thing you can say is you are pretty sure Jesus doesn’t care much for assholes and only loves you because he is required.

[Rhiannon12866]

11. She needs to read actual passages from Jesus, not whatever bigoted stuff she's spouting

For example: 'Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me. '