Pope Francis Says Atheists Who Do Good Are Redeemed, Not Just Catholics

[BridgeTheGap]

Pope Francis rocked some religious and atheist minds today when he declared that everyone was redeemed through Jesus, including atheists.

During his homily at Wednesday Mass in Rome, Francis emphasized the importance of "doing good" as a principle that unites all humanity, and a "culture of encounter" to support peace.

Using scripture from the Gospel of Mark, Francis explained how upset Jesus' disciples were that someone outside their group was doing good, according to a report from Vatican Radio.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/05/22/pope-francis-good-atheists_n_3320757.html

[LostOne4Ever]

1. Im liking this Pope

Soooo much better than the last one.

It looks like the RCC finally has the reformer it needs! I hope he speaks up in favor of birth control and women's and gay's rights next

I might no longer be a believer, but I can still hope my old church changes for the better can't I?

[Laelth]

7. The Pope's point is that being a believer doesn't really matter.

What matters is being a good person, and that's the best message that I think any pedagogical human (i.e. a teacher, or a priest, or a rabbi, on an Iman) can convey.

I am thrilled.

-Laelth

[LostOne4Ever]

15. Salvation by faith

is one of the things I hate about Christianity in general. Even if this is just a re-affirmation of established doctrine, I am also thrilled to see this.

[djean111]

2. "Francis explained how upset Jesus' disciples were that someone outside their group was doing good"

Still happens today.
I have even been informed that anything I personally do that is good, as an atheist, is the result of the Christian god working through me.
I can do good without wanting or needing any sort of redemption, thankyewverymuch. Kind of insulting, in a way.
And - exactly how does this "rock" atheist minds? I can see where it might rock some religious minds - but atheist minds? Why? Are we supposedly seeking redemption? Did we need a push from a pope in order to "do good"? Don't think so.

[JNelson6563]

8. My guess...

I am guessing what was meant that we atheists would be shocked to hear such a statement from the pope, of all people.

Julie

[Humanist_Activist]

11. Why, I was taught that good acts, not just faith, is a requirement to go into heaven...

I was taught this in PSR(a type of catholic sunday school(on Wednesdays), growing up. This covers all other people of other religions, including nonreligious people.

[JNelson6563]

16. Pretty much the same here.

I went to Catholic school and we were aways taught what you did/how you lived were what mattered most.

Julie

[RevStPatrick]

3. What if an atheist doesn't WANT to be redeemed through Jesus Christ?

They gonna do it anyway?
Kinda like how the Mormons are baptizing dead people, like it or not?

[trotsky]

4. It has that kind of feel to it, doesn't it?

A pat on the head, and a "Good job, atheist! Jesus has saved you too!"

[darkangel218]

5. Ewwwww!!!

*shrugs*

[TygrBright]

9. No. The headline is misleading.

The doctrine of universalism is well-established in Catholic tradition. It was, essentially, a response to claims that the purpose of Jesus' mission on earth was to redeem a select group of human beings. It's also a direct refutation of the doctrine of "predestination" which is incorporated into several Protestant sects' beliefs.

Various (heretical in the Catholic Church's view) doctrines were advanced in the past, claiming that Christ's purpose was ONLY to save (insert specification here) people. In other words, if you weren't that particular kind of person (born Jewish and converted, belonging to a particular sub-sect of Christian believers, predestined by God, etc.) it didn't matter how good you are or how earnestly you emulated Christ or even if you were baptized, you couldn't be saved.

The doctrine of Universalism states that Christ's mission of salvation is available to all humanity, no exclusions, no exceptions, no predestinations.

No one is "forced" to be saved, no one is "forced" to be a member of the Catholic Church, etc. under the doctrine of universalism. Merely, no one is excluded.

No one.

Ever.

You can live your whole life as a devout member of another sect. You can be a vicious anti-social criminal. If, at the last moment of your conscious will, you truly wish to accept Christ's salvation, you can still qualify. But you have to want it.

informatively,
Bright

[Laelth]

6. This is PROFOUND, and truly remarkable.

So far, my best hopes for the new Pope have been fulfilled.

k&r

-Laelth

[Humanist_Activist]

10. That's setting the bar rather low, is it not? He didn't change anything...

this is similar to the Catholic Church's teachings on "Virtuous Pagans".

[Laelth]

13. The Pope was not speaking ex-cathedra, so, you are right.

Even if he had been speaking ex cathedra, it's possible that nothing would have changed, if, as you suggest, this is just an iteration of long-standing church doctrine, but I don't recall either of the last two Popes focusing on this particularly "inclusive" church doctrine. I am especially fond of the Church's continued rejection of Luther's problematic translation of Paul's letter to the Romans, "Man is justified by faith alone." It's good to hear the Pope rejecting that notion once again.

Perhaps my enthusiasm is unjustified, but it has been a long time since I had any hope for Catholicism.

-Laelth

[Humanist_Activist]

18. It is just reiterating long standing Church doctrine, and I see his attempts at reaching out as...

no different than what JPII did when reaching out to Jews.

[Laelth]

19. Perhaps you are right that this is just more of the same kind of cynical outreach.

Of course, I hope you are wrong. We'll see.

Cheers!

-Laelth

[snot]

12. I think this is awesome,

even if it is a little like the Mormons christening non-believers after they're dead.

[dimbear]

14. The pope says a lot of things, and they don't all agree with one another.

Don't you hate friends that tell you your new romance is going to break your heart? Don't you resent them--even though you secretly suspect that what they say is true?

[hrmjustin]

17. When asked if I am saved I say yes 2000 years ago like everyone else.

[mr blur]

20. Don't panic! - Damage Control has stepped in -

On Thursday, the Vatican issued an “explanatory note on the meaning to ‘salvation.'"

The Rev. Thomas Rosica, a Vatican spokesman, said that people who aware of the Catholic church “cannot be saved” if they “refuse to enter her or remain in her.”

At the same time, Rosica writes, “every man or woman, whatever their situation, can be saved. Even non-Christians can respond to this saving action of the Spirit. No person is excluded from salvation simply because of so-called original sin.”

Rosica also said that Francis had “no intention of provoking a theological debate on the nature of salvation,” during his homily on Wednesday.

http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/05/23/heaven-for-atheists-pope-sparks-debate/

Not much chance of having to mix with atheists in heaven: everybody wins!

[rug]

21. Not if Saint Otteran has anything to say about it.

Patron Saint of Atheists

Saint Otteran (or Oran) was a monk who lived on the tiny, beautiful Scottish island of Iona, a sacred isle which became a burial place for Scottish and Viking rulers. When Saint Colomba was exiled from Ireland in 563, he founded a monastery on Iona with several companions, one of whom was Saint Otteran.

Legend has it that Saint Colomba's attempts to build a chapel on Iona were thwarted as the building was myseriously destroyed every night. A voice told Saint Colomba that the chapel could not be completed until a man was buried alive in the foundation. Obliging soul that he was, Saint Otteran volunteered for the task and was buried alive so that the chapel could be finished.

Some time later, Saint Otteran, whom all had supposed to be long dead, pushed his head up out of the floor and informed the congregation that contrary to popular belief, there actually was neither a heaven nor a hell. Saint Colomba, aghast at this impertinent revelation, pushed Saint Otteran back into the ground and had him buried more securely beneath the chapel, where he remains to this day.

http://thedailylalee.blogspot.com/2009/01/patron-saint-of-atheists.html

[Ian David]

22. Vatican Representative: Just to Be Clear, Atheists Are Still Going to Hell

Vatican Representative: Just to Be Clear, Atheists Are Still Going to Hell
http://www.democraticunderground.com/121880946

[dimbear]

23. My roommates once explained Catholic teaching on this. Both graduates of Fordham.

Who gets to heaven? First, only Catholics. Second, out of professing Catholics, about 1 in 7.

Like them odds?