It's Simple, Actually...

[WillyT]

Nominate HRC, and watch the Repukes come out in droves...

And if it looks like the Establishment put its finger on the scale...

Watch all the energy, passion, and youthful exuberance of the Democrats drain away.

Nominate Bernie... and watch the Nation and the Establishment change...

Watch young, old, Democrats, Independents, and yes... many sane Republicans...

Change the world.

[Metric System]

1. LOL

[PyaarRevolution]

4. You think this is a joke.

Many will feel disenfranchised, especially the young people.

[John Poet]

9. Yep, Hillary is a Double Negative for turnout--

she'll drive Republican turnout UP,
and Democratic/Liberal turnout DOWN.

Hell, some rank-and-file union members might even vote TRUMP against Hillary,
since he's been against all the trade deals, and she's supported them.

[PatrynXX]

10. yeah rather sick bullies off to my general Conservadem right seem to think this is a joke

that ah Single payer is a joke ah being liberal is a joke ah well I guess thats that then. Democratic party is officially dead. Defeated by the CLinton party

[Plucketeer]

40. MS doesn't really think it's a joke

That LOL is nervous laughter in the face of what is perceived as a dreaded outcome. There's really NOTHING to dread about real and substantive change - change for the good. Not the rhetorical change we got short-changed with in '08 - not the "change" of dynasties again - not a change of gender or race or ANY of those superficial changes like a coat of new paint , which while nice, would likely justgive us more of the same, old ONE PERCENT, piderdle down dumb-onomics.

No, for this LOL-er, the unknown on the other side of the threshold where the hopeful populace dare to tread is terrifying! After all - the royalistic governance of the past four decades is all they've ever known. Geez - how COULD we stand and do for ourselves?

Yeah - it's not really funny for any LOL-ers with "H" avatars. They're simply scared to death of a realm where WE (the people) call the shots.

[rhett o rick]

72. The goal is to get the first response slot not to post a substantive post. nm

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

78. Behavior which has always made me wonder if Kindergartenders were populating the internet.

Behavior which typifies the level of intelligence which explains Trumps popularity.

[rhett o rick]

80. With as serious as things are in the world, you'd think grown adults would

be above this petty crap.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

81. Especially here.

Maybe it's just nostalgia, but I could swear that when I first began reading DU, back in 2008, the the general demonstrated IQ level was higher.

[rhett o rick]

82. I think some got frustrated with those here to cause trouble and not discuss issues.

The Group "Populist Reform of the Democratic Party" still has some great discussions.

[Dark n Stormy Knight]

83. Good to know.

Thanks.

[Old Codger]

7. LOL

Really, that is so 2008

[Ned_Devine]

43. Even in 2008 it was something dipshits would say

[SammyWinstonJack]

42. Yeah, really funny.

[Agony]

65. Lots of Luck! Peons... the usual Hillary supporter disdain for ordinary people. LOL!

Hillary supporters are why I won't ever vote for her…

LOL!

[Gene Debs]

67. Hillary Clinton will mobilize the base like nothing else. Unfortunately it'll be the Republican base

[Stryder]

69. This right here ^.

She will de energize the Dems, turn off the Indies and bring
Repubs off their death beds to vote against her.
So we get the added bonus of a down ticket disaster.

[Got it]

70. Exactly. n/t

[ErikJ]

85. She's toxic nt

[rhett o rick]

74. Yes you got the first response slot. I guess that's some kind of victory. Did you read the OP?

It's very simple, you either support the American Aristocracy or the People. Hint: H. Clinton is part of the American Aristocracy.

I can only conclude that you are happy with the state of America because voting for the status quo will guarantee a continuation.

[Metric System]

77. I think you should read the article below. It sums up your response perfectly:

"I was blown away by the complete inability for Sanders supporters to respect that people may actually support Hillary Clinton for valid reasons. No, instead the comments run from — this author must be ignorant of the “truth” (i.e., not intelligent enough to figure it out) to this author must be part of an organized smear campaign."

http://www.dailykos.com/stories/2016/1/22/1473797/-I-will-not-condone-the-conspiracy-theories-and-the-ugliness-I-am-supporting-Clinton

[rhett o rick]

79. The problem with that is that I can't find a Clinton supporter that will explain the

"valid reasons" they support her. Some say she is tough and think that alone is enough. But being tough on Iraqi's, or on college students in debt, or tough on drug crime, may not meet the standard for a Democrat. Margaret Thatcher was tough, but I wouldn't vote for her either.

Some say she has "experience". Again, that alone isn't enough, esp if that "experience" has huge mistakes.

There are two sides to the class war and simply saying that one supports the Wealthy 1% over the People 99%, because they have valid reasons, isn't enough. What valid reasons override the 50 million living in poverty?

[thereismore]

86. Right on! nt

[Gore1FL]

103. I am blown away by the Clinton supporters that act in the same way.

You are going to havea difficult time trying to take high moral ground on a flat plain.

[WillyT]

105. Happened The Same Way In 2008

[Gore1FL]

102. i can;t help to notice you add a lot of posts

but very little substance.

Rather than a thread drive-by, why don't you try to argue the OP?

[99th_Monkey]

2. Well said WillyT. We need to nominate a candidate who draws folks across the board

not one who has more baggage than an Amtrak train, and is more hated than just
about anyone by Republicans (who Hillary said were her 'number one enemy')

[Live and Learn]

3. Hear, hear! nt

[stillwaiting]

5. It already looks like the Establishment has done more than put their finger on the scale.

It's why Hillary must lose if the Democrats are to win the White House.

Hillary can not win.

[guillaumeb]

6. When you put it that way the choice sounds easy:

But remember that it took 400 years of slavery and Jim Crow, and redlining, and murder by police, and blacks are still not treated as equal.

So maybe the Third Way will bring single payer, and a living wage, and more income equality.....

in 400 years.

[Hoyt]

8. Republicans are going to fall all over themselves embracing Sanders. LMAO.

[PatrynXX]

12. should be easy

just point and look at Donald... no contest. Bernie wins. But up against Donalds twin. 50/50

[TCJ70]

19. They do exist...

...my own, lifelong republican mother said the other day that if Trump or Cruz are nominated she'd gladly vote Bernie...but followed it up with there being absolutely no way she'd vote for Hillary.

[WillyT]

21. Thank You For That !!! - Truly !!!

[hueymahl]

57. Yes!

I have had exactly the same experience. Older members of my family who are republicans hate trump an cruz but hate Hillary more. They think Sanders is a little crazy and way too liberal, but would rather have him than another Clinton.

[Chef Eric]

25. Sanders will get plenty of votes from Republicans.

Read and learn.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/11/the-lifelong-conservatives-who-love-bernie-sanders/417441/

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/6/22/1395700/-Republicans-for-Bernie-Sanders

http://www.salon.com/2015/08/21/republicans_for_bernie_sanders_why_the_democratic_socialist_is_sweeping_his_home_state_partner/

https://www.reddit.com/r/RepublicansForSanders

[pangaia]

28. That is not what Willy said.

You just made that up so you could feel good.

[sibelian]

49. I don't think the numbers will be particularly large. But they be larger than Hillary's.

Republicans despise her. They think she's untrustworthy.

[sammythecat]

54. A relatively small, but significant, minority of Republicans

will actually embrace Sanders over whichever Republican nutbag he'd be running against. Hillary, however, is an entirely different situation because Republicans have had an absolutely visceral hatred of Hillary Clinton for over 25 years. They will fall all over themselves voting against her and a small, but significant, number of Democrats won't bother voting if Hillary is the nominee.

[Le Taz Hot]

61. You do realize you're the only one saying that, right?

[green917]

64. i have a few friends from my time in the military

Who are life-long republicans taking a serious look at senator sanders and really liking what they see and hear. These aren't fence-sitting independents or moderates either but staunch republicans. They (as i think many republicans do) realize that his plans offer the best future for our democracy and our society in general.

[Hoyt]

66. Yeah, I have some like that too. They'll take a serious look and decide callousness, warmongering

and racism trump Sanders when they enter the voting booth.

[green917]

106. i actually have hope for a couple of mine

Others, well, they will follow your template here exactly.

[rhett o rick]

90. That's your best? Well it's a strawman. No one said that they will. But what has been

pointed out is that if H. Clinton wins the nomination, it will certainly galvanize the Republicons to vote against her. On the other hand, many moderate Republicans will vote for Sanders in lieu of the Clown that the R's run.

It's simple math that Sanders will get more Democrats to vote and some Republicans while Clinton will get less Democrats to vote and galvanize opposition to herself.

If you truly want to win in Nov, best support Sanders.

[uponit7771]

101. +1

[fbc]

11. But Hillary will get things done! LOL

A Hillary Clinton presidency would be nothing but four years of impeachment hearings.

[Divernan]

45. First term spent accepting "donations" to the Clinton Foundation

with prompt payoffs of govt. contracts, and poor ole Bill being shuttled by Air Force Two (equipped with Navy Doctor and oxygen tanks) around the country, and propped up to fund-raise for her second term.

[thereismore]

87. Except the "things" do not include single payer. nt

[retrowire]

13. Vote Hillary, and watch

as the majority of passion that annoys you Hillary supporters so much turns it's back on you.

Hillary is not favored. She is highly disliked on all sides... Why can't Hillary supporters see that?

It's an uphill battle with Bernie AND Hillary.

But Bernie's got the support that's willing to fight that battle. Hillary's got a message that says, "we can't get up that hill, let's go this way."

Fuck that, we want to climb the damn hill! So if Bernie loses, this energized base of Bernie's is NOT going to carry over to her. It just won't happen guys. And Hillary will lose the WH for the Democratic party. I'm sorry but it's just not meant to be.

[Marty McGraw]

26. Not just the whitehouse

but Washington all together.

[freebrew]

53. And the HRC supporters will come out in droves...

blaming Bernie supporters for staying home.

A LOT will stay home rather than decide: Tweedle-Dum/Tweedle-Dee...

(Nader didn't cost the election, BFEE did)

[sammythecat]

56. Well put. I agree completely.

I try to understand why there is even a question among Democrats which candidate to support. To me, Bernie is everything real Democrats have longed to see for decades. Finally, we have a genuine, true-blue Democrat who is pissed off and willing to fight and keep on fighting. The way I see it Hillary has one, and only one, thing going for her and it's that she's a woman. But the wrong woman. If there was a male Democrat with her record, her history, and all her negatives, he would have been dismissed out of the race a long time ago. He wouldn't stand a chance. At all.

[Punkingal]

14. I want to change the world. Along with Bernie and millions of others.

[Voice for Peace]

15. There is nothing more pragmatic than inspiration.

?cb=1408962241

[asuhornets]

16. Your post is

delusional. Just saying.

[WillyT]

20. And You Think All Those Young Newly Minted Supporters Of Bernie...

Are Gonna Show For Hillary If It Looks Like The Game Is Rigged ???

They will not only not show, you will never hear from them again.

They're already used to being accused of not getting up off their asses.

Usually by older, pissed of, Establishment types.

[asuhornets]

23. Well if that's

the case then I guess we all will have to suffer under a Republican President. I'm for Hillary but if Sanders win, I'll vote for him. And that is the difference between me and them(you).

[WillyT]

30. Me... I'm In California... I Can Vote For Mickey Mouse And It Wouldn't Make A Difference...

Last time it mattered here, was 1968... and they shot our guy in the head.

[asuhornets]

34. lol

well I'm in Georgia so I guess we are in the same boat

[sellitman]

88. Sad

If every one in California took your approach the GOP will win. That is not a valid answer.

BTW I hope Bernie wins and you don't have too vote for Mickey Mouse, but your attitude discuss me.

[Divernan]

46. The difference between you and Willy is this

In your 4+ years of membership on DU, you have cared so very little about the direction and status of the Democratic party and politics that you have posted all of 60 posts. Now you post a brief insult, calling Willy T delusional, with not a jot of substance to back up your insult or debate the OP.

You're deep in the negative cred zone, you know.

But I know. To you this primary is simply an occasion for LOL, LMFAO and 1 line insults. We see you for what you are. Not a pretty sight.

[asuhornets]

55. So what..

It doesn't matter if I post infrequently. Bernie supporters on DU are very insulting at times. When they start vetting Bernie, you guys are going to go crazy.

[olddots]

93. my dear asuhornets

[NorthCarolina]

58. Reserve account.

eom

[Empowerer]

104. What does posting on DU have to do with one's commitment to the Democratic Party?

Wow.

[sibelian]

50. Explain why it is delusional. nt

[SmittynMo]

17. 100%

I agree,approve, and support this post 100%. I could not have said it any better. It's 100% to the point and exactly what I see in the future.

[Mr.Bill]

18. I like Bernie, but get ready,

as soon as he wins a few primaries, every Republican candidate will start calling him a communist.

Republican turnout will go through the roof, regardless of their nominee.

[zeemike]

35. And they won't be running Trump or Cruz against him

You can count on that.
Because that will turn off independents and some moderate Republicans.
And while the commie label works for Trump and Cruz supporters it don't work as well as it used to.

[Ed Suspicious]

37. We simply don't give a fuck what republicans say about us. They have zero credibility.

[sibelian]

51. Which do you want? "He's a commie" or "she's a witch"?

They will say whatever they need to say in order to oppose the candidate. The significant factor is the extent to which they are credible to the voting populace in making their accusations.

[mikehiggins]

59. That's not the way it will go

The choice will be between

Sanders is a Communist/Socialist/Old Jew From NYC

Hillary is... well, Hillary

Which one do you think the GOPukes will find more offensive? Which will get their voters to the poll?

I swear, the Clinton faction reminds me of nothing more than schoolkids who'll give the bully their lunch money before the bully even asks for it.

[sibelian]

60. They can't STAND her. And it's for mostly the same reasons Bernie supporters don't like her.

Everything I've seen from conservatives echoes the wariness around her apparent Machiavellian tendencies.

[rhett o rick]

91. The Republicans will be shooting themselves in the ear if they try that. Of course they will

keep those idiots that they've always had, but some of the moderates are getting sick of the diatribe. In any event, Sanders has a better chance in the general than Clinton.

[lastone]

22. Beautiful

Thank you, this is the truth. There was a drudge poll today showing Bernie as second to trump by 6-8 points, amazing how even on a right wing news site Bernie has yuuuge support! The Sanders Tsunami will change the world!

[MeNMyVolt]

24. At the pub again?

[WillyT]

31. No... Not Yet...

[Change has come]

32. It seems you joined DU just to hurl insults.

[MeNMyVolt]

33. Just at those I have a sincere fondness for.

[Ed Suspicious]

38. I think that's the case.

[SammyWinstonJack]

44. Sure seems like that.

Good at it too.

[pangaia]

27. Great truth, Willy !!!

[CoffeeCat]

29. Beautiful, poetic...

...thank you so much. That was lovely.

[SoapBox]

36. Words of Wisdom.

And words that need to be taken seriously...our country and 99% of our citizens depend on a win by Bernie.

[Duval]

39. Huge K&R!

I believe we can make it happen. And change is exactly what we need. So many are hurting now and if Bernie's Democrats get out and get involved, we can make a very good beginning.

WillyT, you've been a "path finder"!!

[pnwmom]

41. Simple like unicorns and puppy dogs.

[rhett o rick]

73. Wanting to end poverty is a big goal but to call it wanting a unicorn is downright sad.

Sad that Democrats will use the rationalization that it's too hard to fix, to justify accepting the status quo.

Also, using that emoticon is sad also. Really?

[pnwmom]

76. All progressives have that as a goal. The issue is whether steady, incremental,

achievable progress is the best path, or some fantasy idea of a bloodless "revolution."

[libdem4life]

96. I'm taking my pitchfork to the voting booth and then...pulling the lever. That's how a

"bloodless revolution" happens in this Century. Heard of quantum energy? From what you say, I doubt it.

Here's one definition ... en′ergy lev`el
n.
one of a quantized series of states in which matter may exist, each having constant energy and separated from others in the series by finite quantities of energy.
Also called en′ergy state`.

It was one of the greatest discoveries of our generation...the "aha factor". Bernie has much of that essence in his message.

When the People are ready, the Leader will appear. Presidential politics came to Bernie Sanders. He has not coveted it for decades.

[pnwmom]

98. Apparently you've never heard of the House and the Senate.

You should acquaint yourself with them. They're the bodies that write laws. And Bernie would be constrained by the same Congress that would constrain Hillary or Martin.

He won't be able to wave his magic wand and get them unelected. Senators are elected, by the way, every years. So he's stuck with 2/3 of the 2016 Senators till at least 2020 no matter what. And a 60 vote majority is required to get anything past the filibuster.

[libdem4life]

100. I forgot about the Party of Nope. I also know that he has reached many times across both

the R and D aisle and believe you me, when his "revolutionaries" start showing up, it won't take long. Already new candidates are declaring based on his principles. DWS, perhaps being the most notable.

This isn't just some little whim. I remember Ronald Reagan ... much to my chagrin ... and what he did. Also Arnold S., perhaps to a lesser degree. Well, Bernie is the other half of that. And setting Hillary back on her heels...perhaps into retirement... is no small accomplishment, either.

It's our turn to school the establishment. I believe he is the only one who it is well known does not have an enemy in Washington. He's come from nothing to at par or ahead. He works with people...he brings people together. That's the best we can ask. Not many of those you mentioned above have these character or political traits.

[Enthusiast]

47. Kicked and recommended! It really is that simple.

[LWolf]

48. Change the world.

Be that change.

[hrmjustin]

52. The planets will align, world peace will unfold, and we will all sing

Kum ba ya together.


Sorry but this is more fantasy.

[sadoldgirl]

62. Sorry to see that have something against peace.

[TIME TO PANIC]

63. You think we believe change will be easy and happen overnight.

Keep the insults coming, it seems to be helping her in the polls.

[libdem4life]

97. That's what I think of every time. It's got to be maddening...what's an Oligarch to do?

[Gene Debs]

68. Fantasy is thinking Hillary Clinton gives a shit about you.

[Got it]

71. Again...

Spot on!

[rhett o rick]

94. The Oligarchy Neither Loves You Nor Hates You, you just have resources they want.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/127710206

[thereismore]

89. That really worked for her in 2008. nt

[rhett o rick]

92. Believing that supporting the rich and wealthy will solve our poverty problems is fantasy.

Fighting for honesty and a fair shake for the 99% may be a big goal but it's worth fighting for. Clinton supporters are fighting to keep the status quo. Keep 16 million children living in poverty, keep the continuing growth in corporate profits.

[rhett o rick]

75. It is very simple and you put it the best I've seen. Thanks WillyT.

If it's so simple why are there Democrats that want to continue the domination of our government by the American Aristocracy?
I guess they either benefit directly from the corruption, are in denial of the troubles the People are facing, or trust that the Aristocracy will make things better.

[99Forever]

84. Simple and basic.

Feel the Bern and give the World a chance at healing.

[jwirr]

95. K&R

[libdem4life]

99. Thanks for the post. Keep them coming. We need the inspiration !!!

[WillyT]

107. Last Kick From Me... I Think...