2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumClinton Now Again Moving Left Of Bernie by Pretending To Be For Universal Healthcare But Really
For 1990- Clintoncare - HMOs- Already A Part Of The 2016 ACA Healthcare Plans.
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2007/november/getting_the_facts_ri.php
My comment: Jesse Jackson called his 1988 Healthcare Plan-Single Payer. In the 1992 Campaign, Bill took up the Plan and called it Universal Health Care which actually meant HMOs-Health Maintenance Organizatons to privatize healthcare at government expense. Read the link above.
http://oakhcft.com/press/return-of-the-hmo%E2%80%8A-%E2%80%8Aand-thats-not-necessarily-bad/
My comment: Hillary just flip flopped the wording from ACA to Universal Healthcare because the GOP controlled Congress and third way New Democrats, Barack Obama and others, have set up HMOs to limit two or three office visits paid by insurance for 2016. And PPOs are being sent elsewhere to a very less extent in ACA; PPOs being sold by insurance companies. In the 1990s, HMOs were not being set up the strangle the number of visits like the 2016 Plans have been set up by third way giving way to the GOP!
People are going to be very angry at ACA having had their two or three visits by the early Fall. The Clinton's think that they can shape-shift through the Caucuses say H C is not for two visits ACA but for Bill Clinton's unlimited HMOs of the 1990s.
Very deceiving and some might call using dirty tricks on Sanders and the American People to get Clintoncare done by January 1, 2016.
https://berniesanders.com/press-release/clinton-flip-flops-health-care/
My comment: And now we know why she flipped. She got Hillarycare/Clintoncare of the 1990s by triangulating with the GOP and New Democrats to set up and even more limited HMO ACA which Republicans can use to take more money from Uncle Sam and give Americans less healthcare. I just hate all these takes and faker 1% Oligarchs and their PTB operatives. ACA is turning in to another Trickle UP just like the 2009-10 American Recovery and Reinvestment Act money.
http://www.democracynow.org/2016/2/2/after_dead_heat_in_iowa_will
NowSam
(1,252 posts)<iframe width="560" height="315" src="
" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>Bjornsdotter
(6,123 posts)Hillary said,
"If, for whatever reason, the Congress doesn't pass health care reform, I believe, and I may be to totally off base on this, but I believe that by the year 2000 we will have a single payer system," she said. " I don't even think it's a close call politically. I think the momentum for a single payer system will sweep the country... It will be such a huge popular issue... that even if it's not successful the first time, it will eventually be. "
And she was right! Good thing we have Bernie to move forward.
saltpoint
(50,986 posts)her mind on that issue.
Hoyt
(54,770 posts)JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)When Democrats are weak, Republicans take Congress.
It's the fault of the half-measure Democrats like Hillary and Debbie Wasserman Schultz that we have so many Republicans in Congress.
Bernie is a stronger Democrat than Hillary. He will bring lots of Democrats into Congress.
saltpoint
(50,986 posts)the closer that candidate tends to be to U.S. Americans' chief concerns about their country.
Sanders is a pretty deep blue guy.
NowSam
(1,252 posts)She will say anything! She just doesn't care. How those who support her reconcile the zillion contradictions? I just need to know. Please explain how you can tolerate the lies?
Thank you, Bernie. You restore my faith in humankind. The power of WE.
MissDeeds
(7,499 posts)NowSam
(1,252 posts)Pretty ugly lately!
MissDeeds
(7,499 posts)Primary time can get pretty heated around here. Don't hesitate to use the 'ignore' feature. Your time on DU will be much more enjoyable.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Bjornsdotter
(6,123 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Why bother?
That isn't a strategy and it isn't even a tactic.
arcane1
(38,613 posts)Her own words!
Them: Single Payer will NEVER HAPPEN!!!1
Us: "I don't even think it's a close call politically. I think the momentum for a single payer system will sweep the country... It will be such a huge popular issue... that even if it's not successful the first time, it will eventually be."
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Bjornsdotter
(6,123 posts)....that keeps on giving on so many levels.
Spitfire of ATJ
(32,723 posts)saltpoint
(50,986 posts)She's done it for a long time now.
Wall Street Wanda.
onecaliberal
(32,887 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)Filed away for future reference and use.
Uncle Joe
(58,402 posts)Thanks for the thread, DhhD.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)This is part of history, this can't be changed or re-written to day. No more pretending, just the truth, Hillary has been for healthcare for a long time. Her contention at this time is Medicare for all will not pass this congress, Sanders has already sponsored a bill which did not make it out of committee so there would not be a vote on the floor for Medicare for all.
frylock
(34,825 posts)thesquanderer
(11,990 posts)Even that quote about it being inevitable was meant as a threat. In full context, she was telling the powerful interests that they should back her health reform plan, otherwise they'd end up with single payer, which of course none of them would want. She was promoting her plan as a way to STOP progress toward single payer.
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2014/december/hillary-clinton-1994-statement-on-single-payer
frylock
(34,825 posts)please.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)which is what he wants. New Democrats have - limited- ACA which is what they want. the GOP has the Trickle Up and Privatization that they want.
Know what Hillary Clinton wants for the American people? Health Care being limited and limited as time goes by. She is really a cut that out candidate.
What happens when Republicans remind the American People about the third way real 1990s presidential administration and all of its triangulators, still triangulating? It will loose the election.
What will really provide health care to all Americans? Sanders single payer system.
succinct. thanks!
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)going to pass with a heavy Republican congress, Sanders already knows this fact. A single payer system has to get passed in congress, it does not matter who the president may be, with almost 60 times to repeal ACA I don't think they are going to wake up in January 2017 and say it is time for single payer. This is what Hillary is saying and we know this republican congress is not going to allow this. This is the reason for raising funds for down ticket Democratic candidates, it will be difficult but is possible.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)About 1/3 of Congress is up for re-election this Nov., another third Nov of 2018 and on and on until Democrats can undo the damage that the third way and the Republicans have brought to working American families.
You say that they are not going to wake up. It is our job to wake them up. Ask them why ACA has no public option. Ask them to explain the limiting of office visit in ACA when we were told that ACA would get less expensive and better and better as the years went by. Demand that they explain how they let this happen. Simply inform yourself and vote for a candidate that is for single payer.
People are going to become angry by Nov over this two visit healthcare. This January Republicans voted to repeal ACA to cover for third way reducing the benefits. When they do not get everything they want in reductions to health services to Americans so more ACA money can Trickle Up, they send a passed Bill over to Obama to veto. Obama went into office with a Democratically controlled House and Senate and dropped the Pubic Option without Republicans asking him to do that. Strange? Not for Republicans and third way. It will be hell on us though. Some Democrats might have to go along with Republican candidates on repealing it, I am afraid. People ages 55 to 65 need more than two doctor visits a year. How about sick children with cancer-two visits-really. And it is your taxes going to wealthy CEO instead of health care for us. Sad. See why some Demos will not vote for Hillary Clinton? Democrats need to work for single payer.
http://prospect.org/article/debating-public-option
http://prospect.org/article/debating-public-option
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)the proposal Sanders has of Medicare for all is not going to happen and it will take a few elections cycles before the members to Congress are elected. I can see why Democrats do not buy Sanders pie in the sky Medicare for all, this has been explained many times, I don't expect even the single payer to be added to the ACA in the next four years, maybe not even in eight years. So as you can see we have a difference in opinion, Hillary is hoping to improve on ACA, I don't hear Sanders say he wants to improve on ACA.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)How on Earth can people, especially Democrats keep believing in the Reaganomics supply side Trickle-down economy. It has been debuked a zillion times and was the BIG 2008 Campaign promise of Barack Obama and the Democratic Congress.
What the hell is happening to people's ability to remember and think; to not repeat a wrong move again and again over 40 years? It is insane to repeat a process that does not work!
Hillary Clinton means to me; 4 more years of ACA getting more expensive with more limited HMO doctor access and less and less care each year while the money moves into Big Salaries and Huge Bonuses.
I believe that the real reason for Obama's need to veto the Jan 2016 repeal of ACA is because insurance companies had told him that the percentage monies for profits must go up for 2016 budget and Obama said, No (to defunding PP too). He is a lame duck for 2017. What has Hillary Clinton told them about her Plan for 2017? After they handed her PAC lots of money?
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)four more years of hopefully holding on to ACA, the Medicare for will not get out of committee.
mckara
(1,708 posts)Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)mckara
(1,708 posts)Neither was Bill who signed the Repeal of Glass-Steagall
The ACA is an insurance company boondoggle, which is the reason Hillary and Chief Justice Roberts approve of it.
A Simple Game
(9,214 posts)the Republicans have tried to repeal 60 times, good luck with that Hillary.
Dems to Win
(2,161 posts)I was very active in health care reform during the 90s, and she never, ever supported single payer. She would never even say the words 'single payer' in public.
DhhD
(4,695 posts)And she did say it up thread in a video.
Before Iowa Caucus she was saying that she wanted to strengthen what ACA has become. Now she uses the words Universal Health Care.
She is messing with people's minds with her hysteria. Sad day for her supporters, in my opinion.
This OP is party about the single payer of 1988 Democratic Campaign so your reply seems to be off topic.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)I have some beachfront property in Arizona and a bridge in Brooklyn for sale, cheap. Such a deal!!
saltpoint
(50,986 posts)the bridge... and could you throw in a tooth from the jaw of St. Jerome?
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)from the true cross.
saltpoint
(50,986 posts)Cruz has one of those!
Or maybe he does -- lodged in his throat -- which is why he is so incredibly annoying when he talks.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)zentrum
(9,865 posts)Last edited Wed Feb 3, 2016, 11:56 PM - Edit history (1)
That's what she means when she says "pragmatic".
She looks and talks like everything people mean when they say politicians can't be trusted. The more I see her, as a life long female Democrat, the more disaffected I am from her and the Party. The corporate Democrats are a disaster for the Party and almost as bad for the country as the Republicans.
And David Brock, bringer of Justice Thomasrunning her campaign. It's like inside-out world.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)because, as my mother used to say, "mark my words," she will bring some real shit .. who knows what....
BERNIE KEEP SMILING !!!!!!!!!!
zentrum
(9,865 posts)
so strong and centered the day after the election, talking to reporters. He's been in Washington for decades. He knows how these people are.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)zentrum
(9,865 posts)
.I was a wreck on Monday night waiting for the Iowa results.
jfern
(5,204 posts)dsc
(52,166 posts)flip flopper it makes you ignorant.
uponit7771
(90,356 posts)... with these guys.
I don't know if I want to be around this joint on Super Tuesday
NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)Call me when she moves left to the majority position, otherwise color me UNIMPRESSED.
Recursion
(56,582 posts)Which are a much, much bigger cost sink than insurance companies.
With O'Malley's departure we don't actually have a workable healthcare plan in the race anymore, so I don't get why there's such a unidirectional volley of stones being thrown here.
jalan48
(13,881 posts)Jack Rabbit
(45,984 posts)John Poet
(2,510 posts)Hmmm.
bowens43
(16,064 posts)her flip flops and lies, hillary has been on every side of every issue....