2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumCan we agree now that Rubio is "it" for 2016?
Rubio avoided the VP pick like the plague.
Rubio will have 8 years of experience in the Senate by 2016.
When Romney loses... it will be the "fault" of the mainstream Repubs who nominated him. I guaran-damn-tee you that the next Repub candidate will be a Tea Bagger and NOT Jebbie.
It's Rubio... Rubio/Haley 2016
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graham4anything
(11,464 posts)It will be Jeb vs. Hillary.
forget anyone else.
Rubio won't even be in any office by then, neither will most of the 2010 winners who only won because the democrats didn't contest it properly
Jeb has cleared the deck.
(and republicans will never nominate a minority.)
Hukdonfonix
(56 posts)Let me start by saying I believe Hillary (and I was a Hillary supporter in 2007-2008) when she says she's done with Politics when she retires next year.
Number two, I'm not sure if you realize it or not... Rubio was elected in 2010. And a Senate term is 6 years. Rubio WILL be in office until then.
Number three, Romney is seen as a squishy middle of the road moderate. Why would the Pubs nominate another one in 2012? The failure of Romney is a failure of a Jebbie too.
The Repiglican will stand up in righteous indignation Wednesday Morning in November and say "See!! We told you!! A genuine Conservative will win given the opportunity".
cr8tvlde
(1,185 posts)of the Democrats and muted her enemies. Bill Clinton did not just give the best speech of his life just for Obama...make no mistake, he was reminding everyone of the Clinton name and power. And Bill has redeemed himself with his non-partisan non-profit.
Jeb, I think, like Hillary, will step forward if "asked". They both have skeletons...heck, they might even agree to keep it out of the gutter for once. Now that would be a quid pro quo I could cheer for.
The two American political families...it would be a real race.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)means the tea party will be totally repudiated so someone not associated with either Mitt or the tea party.
Jeb comes off as a sane person to the republicans(and more important-he can go in there saying he knows how to win, and his family knows how to win. And Florida and Texas are two states the repubs need to keep(and Texas will be turning blue soon enough, and Florida will be blue this year.)
Jeb for some reason has very high ratings, is seen as someone who does want to do something about immigration(because heknows the repubs need to enlarge their base) and Rubio is not known.
And with Mitt so repudiated, the Bush's bad news will be old news to the republicans who vote in the primaries(we already know Jeb is bad, but that doesn't matter to republicans.)
The whole primary changes made a few weeks back at their convention were all helpful to Jeb(a known entity, and horrible to any upstart).
And Jeb has a book coming out in the next six months(on education I believe, his subject)
so beware and re-read Paul Waldman's Fraud to remind oneselves about how the Bush's do things over and over and over again
As to Hillary, read past posts of mine, no politician in their right mind says they are going to run until they do. And Hillary don't need to enter at the earliest late 2013, and really she don't need to enter officially til Dec. 2014 or mid-winter 2015.
(all she needs to do is make sure all the other democrats don't run and then run unchallenged ).
And it will be a woman President in 2016. Time is due. And Hillary by far is the single most qualified candidate of either sex, and no woman (except maybe Michelle, but if she ever runs herself, it won't be in 2016. (I would prefer they put both Obama's on the Supreme Court, wouldn't that be something.)
Ter
(4,281 posts)They complained. What did they do in 2012? Nominated another one.
graham4anything
(11,464 posts)and the tea party is as welcome to "real" republicans as much as they are to us.
The rightwing extremists like Rand and Ron and all the other nut jobs are not part of the republican power.
The Bush's control the party, have for 40 years, and just because WE the democrats don't like their politics doesn't mean they still don't control it within the power (people be damned.)
Look at the royal treatment Bush41 gets, (just this weekend, he was all over tv on the Ryder Cup sidelines, all the players bowing down to him and his son W who was there (and pearl based Barbara.)
If you think the Bush name is really tarnished, you are beliving the hype.
And remember another thing- Rush Limbaugh himself has not won on any issue of his in what? 25 years? Ever? They are just big mouth pieces.
Meanwhile Karl Rove kept getting what he wanted by winning the lower offices for future use
and systematically attempting to repudiate the extreme right, same as the right was repudiated when Goldwater/Miller set them back a few years.
It is a inner-party struggle, and if you think George W. Bush did anything wrong to what his own plan was, you are mistaken. Everything that happened from 2000-2008 was on his plan and what he wanted.
Then he left the next president 8 years of cleaning up, so that they can do more and more the following 8 years.
It's a chessmatch, games are long (in years) and not everything today is apparent til tomorrow comes.
Trouble is, Obama plays chess better than 41 or 43, and our key is to prevent 45 from being Bush,Jeb, because the repubicans would vote for him, running as a "winner" with the family background to prove it.
And the Bush family (around for decades, profiteers for who knows how long(WW2 at least),
will continue to make billions.
Ask yourself another question-as bad as the times are supposedly to the republicans, how many dollars did the Bush family as a whole lose from 2008-2012. How many dollars did Mitt Romney lose in those years, while he yaps about how bad it has been, has he or anyone he knows had it bad? And ask Mitt(with a lie detector going), would he vote for Jeb Bush if Jeb were running, or would he vote for Rand Paul?
And ask a regular republican blue collar worker, how much worse Rand would be over Jeb.
At the end of the day, Jeb will get half the repubs while Rand would get at most 10%, maybe a little more than his father did because he is better looking and younger and has a voice that doesn't sound like he inhales helium, but not winning numbers. And ask yourself why a blue collar worker that is racist and would never vote for a black president or a woman, why would they vote for a darker skinned Cuban named Rubio (who quite possibly would have his own birther problem to them?)
No way a republican would actually vote for Rubio(or Jindal or the others.)
(If they would, McCain would have won with Sarah, however even most republicans felt Sarah was not qualified, and all her polling showed and told her not to run in 2012, but to keep going for the commercial success she discovered.
So remember- "they" that complains the loudest is the Bush's, who want the deck cleared for Jeb. (that is the reason Ryan was picked and looks so incompetent that he cannot give any one any real facts about his ideas- so that he is repudiated, as are all other tea party people so that one of the teaparty folk don't get anywhere near the nomination four years from now.
May the democratic party and Hillary be strong enough to stop Jeb.
Because the republicans won't stop him, being that they actually like him, and the nomination is his for the asking.
(I am convinced he also could have been nominated this year, but I am also convinced going in Jeb planned it just as I said here, and that to the Bush family, 8 years is not too long to sit back and count the money then re-start it again to make it even more in 2016, should the democrats fracture and not come together with the strongest candidate and not some way to the left person who might have great ideas conceptually and be a great person, but is marked as a flake by the right and like McGovern gets whipped in the general.)
(look how easy Tim Russert finished any hope of say Dennis Kucinich back in 2008.)
blm
(114,658 posts)to be Jeb's ascension.
That is why I know BushInc won't rig the voting machines en masse for Romney - they probably will for some senate and congressional seats, though.
Too many people still don't 'get' the Bush family and the fascist cronies who surround them. It all goes so much deeper than most realize. BCCI report is a great place to start that info-load.
Ter
(4,281 posts)But I also see it slowly changing. In 2008 there just weren't enough anti-police state tea baggers in the House, Senate, and Governors. 2012 there are many more. Look at the NDAA vote in the Senate. It passed what, 87-13? Many of those 13 "No's" were newly elected Republicans. Same think with the Patriot Act. It renewed, but last year in the House 30+ Republicans voted to strike it down. Many were freshmen. 2016 may swing even more to weed out the establishment. Rand Paul may take this one all the way to the White House.
powergirl
(2,393 posts)Jeb vs. Hillary
And can't use Rubio as VP because they are both from Florida
tanyev
(49,304 posts)
longship
(40,416 posts)Why is anybody worrying about 2016? We have a minor detail of the 2012 presidential election. And a Senate to hold and a House of Representatives to regain. And that all happens in about four weeks, not four years.
We will have four years to argue over the Democratic and Republican 2016 nominees, neither of which we will know for another three years or more.
So, forgive me for disagreeing.
cr8tvlde
(1,185 posts)Frankly, this one is becoming pretty much a shoe-in. What we need to do now is shout out the the registration/election/etc. fraud up front and center so the MSM have something to fill in their 24 hour time with. Massachusetts and Wisconsin, the home states of the Rs are going Democratic...some over 50%.
regnaD kciN
(27,643 posts)In other words, GOTV!
We can wait to speculate about 2016 until November 7th.
outsideworld
(601 posts)Lol'd not because its not possible but because speculation of all this is going to be useless if we dont win the election within 35 days
fleur-de-lisa
(14,704 posts)his 2010 fund-raising irregularities should knock him out of the race pretty quickly!
I really think the TP is on its way out, although it may take a few years for them to become totally irrelevant. When the repukes lose the presidential campaign, the Senate majority and some key congressional seats in November, they will be forced to take a hard look at the nutjobs who have taken over the party. Perhaps the TP assholes, the religious zealots, and the racists should split off and form their own nutcase party?
flamingdem
(40,899 posts)He owns a house with Rivera and both enjoy using their party credit cards for personal purchases among other things. Of course Rivera is involved with something far worse which will require a certain quantity of singing to the Feds to save his own hide, we can always hope he implicated Rubio.
monmouth
(21,078 posts)
nc4bo
(17,651 posts)
left on green only
(1,484 posts)By 2016, the rube will be back in Cuber charmin the women folk with his forked tongue.
Thrill
(19,342 posts).
Hukdonfonix
(56 posts)I might agree with you.
The Velveteen Ocelot
(130,558 posts)about anybody.
cr8tvlde
(1,185 posts)I agree he wants the pick. But the Rs two candidates from the South? and a Cuban Hispanic? I wonder if the Tea Party can carry them, especially with Florida likely going Blue in 2012.
For the Ds, Hillary plus Bill Clinton's magic...and Julian Castro plus his twin and big credentials in Texas/Southwestern Hispanics... going to be interesting, to say the least, especially if Colorado, Arizona and Nevada turn Blue this year. More of a Southwestern/West Coast bloc than the actual number of electoral votes. And Texas with favorite son(s), and Ohio filling in a northern/northeastern bloc...
The House 2014 will surely be a clue.
Hukdonfonix
(56 posts)If Florida, Colorado, Arizona and Nevada all go DEM this year there IS NO Repiglican party in 2016.
cr8tvlde
(1,185 posts)to take over in 2014. My sense is that the Democrats ...and the electorate ... will be ready for 2010 payback/reboot.
The Southwestern Hispanics are on "native ground" and are a force just learning political effectiveness.
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Ter
(4,281 posts)n/t
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)Ter
(4,281 posts)n/t
Laura PourMeADrink
(42,770 posts)reason to switch parties
Why are you so negative about it?
Ter
(4,281 posts)Plus presidents aren't usually as popular in their second terms because they move from the middle and alienate them. We'll see though. It almost happened in 2000. Hell, there's a good chance it did happen in 2000, with the Florida fiasco.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)The fact is that there is real animus between Cuban-Americans and Hispanic-Americans because CA, like Rubio, have never given a damn about undocumented workers, if they are here they automatically get visas. Hispanic Americans resent the special treatment Cubans get and resent even more the fact that CA never express solidarity.
That is why he wasn't picked for VP, he only appears strong among those that aren't more familiar with the under currents of the Hispanic community.
Sekhmets Daughter
(7,515 posts)Cuban Americans do NOT believe they are Hispanic! When he first told me that I couldn't stop laughing....
sammytko
(2,480 posts)We are not all the same.
Ter
(4,281 posts)Rand Paul takes this all the way to the White House. No way an NDAA supporter can win anything by 2016. Republicans are turning against it. He's a fake tea bagger and FR knows it.
Sekhmets Daughter
(7,515 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)
KaryninMiami
(3,073 posts)With Jeb's Hispanic wife and Rubio being Rubio- the GOP could see this as the way to win the Latino vote and serve the tea party.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)The GOP are racists, and racists always assume everyone else is, too.
They should look at the sort of black support their black candidates get; very little. it's not the race, it's the ideas the candidate has, and no matter the color, all of the GOP ideas are bad.
Ter
(4,281 posts)They especially can't stand any Bush.
Scootaloo
(25,699 posts)Four years is like two decades, politically. We'll have to wait until 2015 to get a glimmer of the field ahead.
DonCoquixote
(13,961 posts)As much as Joe Scab gives me Hives, he is someone that can distance himself from the Tea Party and Mitt Romney. He also has a built in podium, which I think he is already using.
Proud Public Servant
(2,097 posts)likes to test-drive its candidates and so nominates previous losers. Romney, McCain, Dole, Daddy Bush, Reagan -- all took a run at the nomination and lost before getting it on the second go-'round. W is the only exception. They might break tradition again, but that's the pattern -- and if they stick with it, my money's on Huckabee.
doccraig67
(86 posts)
Auntie Bush
(17,528 posts)I couldn't stand it...hate then both...but especially Haley. 
I couldn't stand to listen to him so I'd only hear half the election. But that's OK...I don't need or want to.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)Rubio has a lot of ethics skeletons in his closet.
BlueStater
(7,596 posts)If Jeb runs, I believe the nomination is pretty much his.
Rosco T.
(6,496 posts)tjdee
(18,048 posts)Never gonna happen.
They might do a VP thing, to like, appeal to Hispanics, but I find it EXTREMELY hard to believe that large chunks of the Republican faithful will want another "other" as President.
smorkingapple
(827 posts)
gkhouston
(21,642 posts)
Sunlei
(22,651 posts)The Governess and state politicans wouldn't be in their offices without that corporation doing the work for them.
People may notice by then they will need a Federal Gov to save them from their State and local Gov.
fun n serious
(4,451 posts)
MjolnirTime
(1,800 posts)Ter
(4,281 posts)He's a Caucasian of Cuban descent, and even the most filthy white nationalist would not have a problem with that. It's his positions on immigration that would bother the far-right.
Danmel
(5,778 posts)Dont want to jinx anything by the sin of presumption.
(or as we say in Yiddish- kenahora)
sofa king
(10,857 posts)Just think for one moment about the fact that the Shrub Administration had to lie and cover up every single day of their reign in order to keep themselves from prison.
Law and precedent prevents President Obama from throwing open the books on the Bush Administration, but the next President can do it. If half of what I think is in there hasn't been perfectly wiped, then dozens of Republicans will have their careers and their lives utterly destroyed. Fraud, financial crimes, document destruction, election theft, murder, mass murder, they are potentially open to all of those charges if those records ever see the light of day.
Jeb Bush is going to kill or destroy anyone who gets in his way in 2016. His party, his life, and his family depends on it, and he doesn't give a fuck if some Cuban is more popular.
TBF
(36,678 posts)I used to think they'd run Rubio this time but then the skeletons came falling out of his closet (and who better to rattle that closet than the Bush/Rove machine)? I think it'll be Jeb.