What's with the loony Hillary derangement syndrome?

[RBInMaine]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Goblinmonger (a host of the 2016 Postmortem forum).

Hillary has a lifetime of service and achievement. It is real and progressive. And yet she is constantly attacked in this forum by the Bernie folks. But oh, challenge Bernie and his people on ANYTHING, and they whine and squeal and yell foul. Sorry Bernie folks, but you don't get to have it both ways.

I really like Bernie and have said it over and again. But Hillary is NOT the antiChrist, and I along with millions of other people think she is more qualified to be president and is more grounded in reality than Bernie who is proposing pie in the sky, as of yet does not have a REAL revolution going, who has trashed our party in the past and was never even a member of the party, who wanted someone to primary Obama, and who would be chewed to shreds by the Republicans in the general election campaign as an unacceptable "SOCIALISTCOMMUNIST trying to turn us into a European country."

If you want to toss endless grenades at Hillary, then don't whine when some are tossed your way. This is how the tough game of politics works.

[beam me up scottie]

1. Don't you ever get tired of red baiting?

I've never seen anyone so obsessed with communism.

OOGA BOOGA HAMMER AND SICKLE!!!

After posting dozens of ops about the evils of socialism/communism do you really think you should be accusing others of suffering from a derangement syndrome?

[hobbit709]

2. Must be what the RB in his user name stands for.

[beam me up scottie]

4. LOL! Every time I see his name that's what I'm going to hear.

Along with Archie Bunker's voice.

[orpupilofnature57]

44. I'm the juror who said " Leave it as a memorial to the posters Stupidity "

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=inbox&view=2189810

[beam me up scottie]

105. Wow, someone else sent me the results, thanks!

They've been alerting on me all morning.

Good jury!

[orpupilofnature57]

111. I can't imagine why?

[kath]

112. Good for you! BTW, that link doesn't work for others beside you, apparently. Could you please post

The results here? (Sunlight is good.)

[beam me up scottie]

115. It was 7-0, here are the results:

On Tue Feb 16, 2016, 07:50 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

LOL! Every time I see his name that's what I'm going to hear.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1246315

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Personal attack.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Feb 16, 2016, 07:56 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation:
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Leave it as a memorial to the posters stupidity .
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

Third failed alert on me this morning but at least they have to go sit in a corner for 24 hours.

[kath]

120. Thanks, bmus. Good jury!

We should post the results of failed alerts, especially the 7-0 ones. It's always fun to see one of them get put in the corner, and it would be nice to have a daily count. There were bunches of them a few days back, after some Hillary fail or something.
I do love schadenfreude!

[orpupilofnature57]

119. Notice I was the only one with a comment , Deep thinkers .

[beam me up scottie]

121. Such a ridiculous alert it was a no-brainer. Took all of 6 minutes too.

[orpupilofnature57]

122. Good explanation. Bye

[beam me up scottie]

125. Thanks again, juror #4!

[kath]

114. Speaking of which, it seems they are having a contest to see who can post the stupidest stuff, and

in the greatest tonnage. (Visualizing mile-high piles of horse manure here )

[orpupilofnature57]

118. + 1000000000000 !!!!!!!!!!!

[BeanMusical]

109. "Along with Archie Bunker's voice."

In my case I'm hearing this guy's voice:

[beam me up scottie]

117. LOL!

[bigwillq]

19. !

[Betty Karlson]

16. Red-baiting is just the latest relic from the 20th century.

Clinton's campaign is all about giving relics one last go.

One more round of Kissinger politics.
One more round of Third Way social security cuts.
One more round of private prisons and racial profilinf.
One more round for the Death Penalty.
One more round of dragging her feet on gay rights.
One more round of red-baiting.
One more round of smears (and pretending the Internet doesn't exist to debunk them).
One more round of taking votes for granted (women, minorities)
One more round of pretending Millennials are only babies who need to shut up and listen to mommy.

[beam me up scottie]

17. Good point!

[Bohemianwriter]

24. Apparently someone...

thinks that a male 4 year old is more sensible than his mother. She votes Bernie Sanders. He wanted her to vote Hillary...

Signs of sexism in the "feminist" party?

[kath]

123. really?!? Was that posted in their little playground?

[Bohemianwriter]

124. Most propbably...

Couldn't reply to it, since I was kicked out and blocked...

[MrMickeysMom]

30. Excellent point, Betty!

This pretty much explains it.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

64. ^^THIS^^

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

63. Run for your lives!!! (well said Scottie)

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[QC]

74. No. n/t

[lasttrip]

80. ..

[John Poet]

108. Sad, isn't it? I bet they check under the bed

before going to sleep, just to make sure Karl Marx isn't hiding there, waiting to whisper suggestions to them in their sleep....

"OOGA BOOGA HAMMER AND SICKLE!!!" LMAO

[7wo7rees]

3. Bait.

Hill has a lot of baggage, a number of flips.

So basically what I get from your opinion is we just have to vote for lesser of two evils. Right?

KISSINGER! GOLDMAN SACHS

That is enough for me.

[Duckhunter935]

5. I just do not trust her and support

The other candidate. I know that is not allowed as she is the anointed one.

[stonecutter357]

6. K&R!

[nc4bo]

7. Spare me. Hillary's all about Hillary. Oh and wealthy campaign and Foundation contributors. nt

[Nuclear Unicorn]

8. This whole "Bernie will be shredded by the GOP" argument seems to be codespeak for

"Hillary is acceptable to the GOP"

And after her real record of wars, corporatism and self-serving triangulation -- I BELIEVE YOU!

If, however, you wish to revise your statement to allow that the GOP would also savagely oppose Hillary what then is left to make me abandon a candidate who is not saddled with wars, corporatism and self-serving triangulation?

[WiffenPoof]

15. Nice twist...

Excellent post.

[Kittycat]

91. +1 n/t

[Katashi_itto]

9. A wee bit obsessed are you. More Red Baiting, RB.

[Android3.14]

10. Defeatism, willful ignorance and projection

Three things are certain,

1. You will not earn a living wage, fair elections and publicly funded college if you don't go for it

2. Ignoring the actual data showing Sanders can win the GE better than Hillary will not make the data disappear

3. Just because Clinton and her supporters attack Sanders using unfounded race baiting, sexism, and gender issues does not mean he and his are attacking Hillary in a similar way. Her issues of poor decision making, corporate influence and lack of trust are well documented, but certainly are not the equivalent of accusing her of being the Antichrist.

Time to get a grip.

[Dawgs]

11. Troll! n/t

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

12. Have you been under a rock for 20 years?

Better check those rose colored glasses.

The Clinton Dynasty, much like the Bush Dynasty, has fallen out of favor. They are a relic, the last hanger-ons of the Third Way. Arguably, Obama was a transition candidate who promised hope and change. He delivered the hope, but Hillary won't deliver the change. But most of all, Hillary has always been uncomfortable in her own skin. She changes her identity with the wind. It's understood that people evolve over time on certain issues. But there are limits. Eventually, it becomes a credibility issue. That's Hillary's greatest character flaw, and Bernie is giving her a free pass. As for foreign policy, she can teach a course on it at any university with Henry Kissenger, but they both exhibited shitty judgement. People are tired of Hillary's dumb wars.

2008 was a historic election, and she lost to Obama. It's 8 years on. Hillary is a relic of the Third Way and no one is taking her tack toward Bernie seriously. I'll better Bill's favorabilities are tanking, too. And Chelsea, the former hedge fund manager, is repulsive.

[MrMickeysMom]

36. Thanks for that...

I couldn't agree more.

You HAVE to have your head in the sand to have an OP like this!

[Lucky Luciano]

84. Chelsea wasn't a hedge fund manager. She worked at s hedge fund though. Huge difference.

[dchill]

103. She married a hedge fund manager.

[Lucky Luciano]

106. Fair enough, but...

...there are hedge fund managers, Hedge Fund Managers, and HEDGE FUND MOTHER FUCKING MANAGERS.

Mezvinsky is a hedge fund manager. Does ok enough for himself personally, but light years from crushing it (poor performances) and being one of the guys we complain about for paying such low taxes.

[ejbr]

13. Fair enough

but you realize we have many more grenades, as in things to criticize. This is odd, however, since he has been in public life longer.

[ebayfool]

27. If you want to toss endless grenades at Bernie, then don't whine when some are tossed your way.

This is how the tough game of politics works.

Funny how they don't think it applies both ways, huh?!

[ejbr]

28. Your

post initially confused me. But alas, you are on point!

[ebayfool]

34. Sorry. I was fresh from reading the OP - the last line irritated & stuck with me!

"If you want to toss endless grenades at Hillary, then don't whine when some are tossed your way. This is how the tough game of politics works."

Shoulda scrolled back up but your post caught my eye.

Been a long day!

[Betty Karlson]

14. The status quo is untenable. Clinton is indeed deranged to run on keeping things as they are.

(eom)

[Nonhlanhla]

56. That is ridiculous

She is NOT running on "keeping things as they are." She's running on making progress. She's just not promising to be able to start a revolution that will completely reshape the American landscape. They both desire similar outcomes. They just differ on how to get there.

[Betty Karlson]

68. No: Clinton wants Wall Street driving the car; Sanders wants democracy at the wheel.

Wall Street in the driver's seat is what we have now, it is untenable, and Clinton wants to keep it that way? Totally unrealistic. The woman lives in la-la-land (also known as the 20th century relics reservate with overprivileged and entitled one-percenters' echo-chamber).

[Nonhlanhla]

76. Predictable

and simplistic talking points do not impress me.

[Betty Karlson]

85. "Ridiculous / Predictable / Simplistic": your attempts at rebuttal are pathetic and arrogant.

See? I can use derogatory adjectives too.

[Nonhlanhla]

96. "Hillary wants Wall Street in the driver's seat"

is indeed predictable. And false.

[Betty Karlson]

127. My apologies: she wants herself in the driver's seat, and Wall Street as the GPS. n/t

[EmperorHasNoClothes]

77. The problem is,

On many of the issues that really matter, most of us just don't believe her. She triangulates and changes position so much we don't know what she really thinks. She has lost what is possibly the most important aspect of a politician: credibility.

[polly7]

100. It doesn't seem like they both desire similar outcomes.

........ On the other side of the ledger, history shows that political and social change emanate from persistent pressure—organizing and arguing for a more just world, not settling for what is deemed “realistic” before getting to the negotiating table. Remember when gay rights and gay marriage were “unrealistic”? Remember when voting rights, desegregation, and other basic justice were far from “pragmatic”? They became real through years of dedicated, principled, idealism—by insisting the unrealistic become real.

Change is not, as Clinton has claimed, a matter of “magical” thinking or waving a “wand”—it is about pushing ideas, building movements, and challenging the status quo. Even before the general election, Clinton is campaigning on a deflating and defeatist politics of half-a-loaf “pragmatism,” aiming lower on minimum wage, opposing free college, opposing single-payer health care. With Sanders, there is no question he will push for meaningful progressive change. No candidate can guarantee passage of their platform—but at least Sanders makes change possible.

On the question of leadership, Clinton’s other central campaign theme is her record of experience. As first lady, Clinton failed at health-care reform. She never pushed for single-payer health care and never built a coalition for anything beyond a compromised managed-care system. She also supported three of Bill Clinton’s signature measures, which all proved disastrous: welfare rollback, which unraveled safety-net supports for poor families, low-income women, and millions of working-class Americans; the omnibus crime bill with its three strikes and mandatory minimum sentencing, which contributed to a generation of long-term, largely African American inmates and felons; and NAFTA, which helped impoverish millions of Mexican and Central America farmers, leading to mass migration and social and economic upheaval.

Clinton’s most persistent attack—parroted by mainstream media—claims that Sanders’s agenda is perhaps laudable but unrealistic. Moderation is more effective, she claims. However, this is a misreading of American politics and factual comparisons of the candidates’ track records.

No matter where a Democratic president is on the spectrum, Republicans block and push rightward. In her campaign, as in the past, Hillary Clinton has compromised her agenda before the political battle even begins.

Full article: https://zcomm.org/znetarticle/the-pragmatic-case-for-bernie-sanders/

[John Poet]

110. Progress that does not deviate too far from the Republican party line,

I guess that is.

She's giving up the fight before it is joined, and not giving Democratic progressives much of a reason to vote for her, beyond trying to paint herself as one of them.

She isn't one of us.

If she was, she never would have praised Kissinger-- a war criminal by any reasonable assessment.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

70. Seriously, so much for "Yes We Can!"... with Hillary, it's now "No We Can't!"

I'm down with Bernie's "Damn Fuckin' Right" campaign!

The revolution is on!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[Feeling the Bern]

18. Translation: Waaaaaaaaah! People are using HRC's works, friends, actions and stances

against her and I don't like it! You're throwing bombs because you won't let her get her self-deserved coronation!!

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

73. So true... like momma used to say: if you play with matches, you're gonna get Berned.

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[sarge43]

20. Two words, RB: New Hampshire

The least SOCIALISTCOMMUNIST gang on the planet didn't have a problem with Senator Sanders. But you know that, don't you.

[Phil1934]

21. "But Hillary is NOT the antiChrist"

link, please.

[ejbr]

35. LOL!

In Austin Power accent: "oh, behave."

[Enthusiast]

49. That's what I was thinking, lol.

[Hekate]

104. The sentence is incomplete without, "But Bernie is Christ."Don't hurt me, dude! I've seen the light!

I've come to my senses after being exposed to Bernie information at DU 24/7! He's leading a Movement! It's a Revolution! I am now breathless with anticipation at how he's going to help get Obama's SCOTUS nominee through the Senate he's been a part of for so long!

JURY:
It's just parallel sentence structure! It's a literary device! I don't mean it literally, just literarily!

[kath]

116. Ha!

[Bohemianwriter]

22. Nope! Your kitchensink is just being returned to sender...

She doesn't have a single progressive bone in her body... Her record alone speaks its own loud language. So whatever achievement you are talking about to be so proud of seems to miss from your praisea and whining post in defense of smear tactics.

I find it paradoxial how you whine about attacks on your own candidate and expect Bernie supporters to shut up when you slander him with PERSONAL attacks and BS examples as "socialistcommunist!. You sound exactly like that 3rd way "democrat" who sold out the party and left the REAL progressives in the dark while taking their votes for granted when you have pushed your own corporate candidate.

She is attacked for policies. She attacks both Bernie and his supporters on a personal level while she has the entire MSNBC kissing her behind while her supporters think MSNBC is reporting on the two candidates fair and balanced somehow.

The only thing Hillary supporters have done so far is following the Karl Rove playbook and whine when their smear campaigns backfire.
I mean, if you don't want your candidate to be "smeared" by facts, then you should stop your hate campaign against Bernie and his supporters as if they were all "Berniebros" (don't Hillary's smear machine get tired of using the same tricks that did NOT work the last time?)

DEAL with your corrupt Wall Street lobbyist! Deal with your lobbyist for arms dealers and private prison industry!

If you think that the tired old meme "Bernie is going to turn us into a European country" is an insult to your European ALLIES§ As if we were inferior to American "exceptionalism" and your crony capitalism in which your candidate is deeply involved in. It makes me wonder if most Americans never leave their own country, far less their own bubble of cheap talking points given to you by the informercias on the so called cable "news.

Ever think of that?


So don't whine when your kitchensink comes in return.

If you want to play dirty against the only candidate who has never ran a negative smear campaign (something Hillary is very good at if she wants to lose elections) then it only shows yours and your candidates true nature....

[MrMickeysMom]

38. Exactly...

[Bohemianwriter]

54. Not too strong?

[MrMickeysMom]

95. Nope.... Not at all...

Next! (looking forward to it!)

[ejbr]

39. Nicely put!!

However, the "attacks" with facts may not cease if Bernie is no longer attacked for nonsense. I mean facts are facts, no?

[Bohemianwriter]

47. It's hard to argue against facts...

That's when the ad hominems and the "foul play" tactics comes into play...

If anyone thinks it's going to be easier to run against Bernie than Hillary, are sadly mistaking...Miscalculating...

[Paulie]

23. Then and now

Last edited Tue Feb 16, 2016, 09:10 AM - Edit history (1)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x114882

RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-06-08 07:50 AM
Response to Original message

13. See how she talks about how the story so "HURT" her inside? She PLAYS to the audience.

This is why she lies and distorts so much. She works very hard to PLAY to the particular audience she is with. (If it's New Yorkers, she is a "lifelong Yankee fan." If it's a group of women, she turns into the "loving mother whose own daughter was in danger on 9/11." If it's the end of a debate, she "is honored to be with Barack Obama." If it's in Ohio, then "shame on you Barack Obama." etc. etc.) She wants so much to appear "human" because so many people feel she is so cold. You just don't know which Hillary you are going to get on any given day or at any given moment. I wonder if she suffers from multiple personality syndrome

rodeodance Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 09:44 AM
Response to Reply #2

7. She is a beatiful women--and strong.

Printer Friendly | Permalink | | Top

RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #7

11. And takes more lobbyist money than the R's. Proud of that?

RBInMaine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Mar-05-08 03:05 PM
Response to Reply #3

10. Playing the gender card. Very sad.

[cherokeeprogressive]

48. These past posts deserve a thread of their own.

[Paulie]

53. All I hear is

J'accuse! J'accuse! J'accuse!

Then I

[Paulie]

57. Just collect them in the already existing thread

are own little "Media Matters"

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

75. Well well well... lookie here what the cat brung in!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[CoffeeCat]

87. Wow! It would be interesting to hear the path that this person took from THEN to NOW.

What changed their mind?

I find it hard to digest or believe. Once you've seen HRC for what she is...how could you possibly become one of her defenders?

I'd be very interested, and opened to, hearing about how that happened.

[left-of-center2012]

25. This should be in the Hillary group

[Bohemianwriter]

52. At least we can respond here...

[DonCoquixote]

62. oh come now

Because the Hillary folks know they can go anywhere, but if any one else says anything, they are banned from the Hillary group cat quick. It's about privilege, the fact that those who are supposed to have already started chilling the coronation champagne screwed up, they know they screwed up, and are trying to right things before the guillotine starts getting rolled out.

[Warren Stupidity]

26. you seriously posted this after your endless slams against Sanders and his supporters?

What the flying fuck?

[DonCoquixote]

29. For me at least, it is not that she is 666

It is the fact that, thanks to DWS, there is no other mechanism than Bernie to apply pressure on her to lean left, while there is plenty of pressure for her to lean right. Honestly, if it was not for Bernie, would she have agreed to review the TPP or the KXL? Indeed, some of us that want her to do well see her as being cocooned by the same idiots that ruined the 2008 campaign, in the exact same manner.

Let me be blunt, DWS is like a 4 time DUI drunk that has crashed her 5th car, then goes right out to buy a fifth of Jack Daniels to keep in her brand new 5XL SUV. She will not stop doing what she does until the crash that finally kills her does her in, and anyone who rides with her, in. I see Hillary getting into her car.

[m-lekktor]

31. Did you think it "loony derangement syndrome" when we criticized George Bush?

or is that precious label just for people who criticize politicians you like? Attempts to paint Hillary critics as somehow mentally disturbed is a tactic of a desperate amateur debater. Everything out of you is ad homeneim and that is why you aren't pleased with the responses that you get. You get what you give.

Hillary is just too dishonest and right wing for many of us and the tactics of her campaign are sleazy and in the sewer. We aren't deranged just because we see the obvious.

[Fuddnik]

37. S, truth is now "blasphemy".

[CentralMass]

32. Her looney derangement ? I think she just needs some rest

[Augiedog]

33. I'm beginning to think the rabid attacks on Hillary may evidence a fear of Bernie being an

empty suit. If the most prolific of attackers really believed in Bernie's message and his ability to deliver they would not need to behave so poorly, exposing their insecurities.

[MrMickeysMom]

41. ???

You lost me there...

[Fumesucker]

45. Yeah, I know what you mean about rabid attacks...

Someone with the same handle as the OP actually wonders if Hillary has multiple personality syndrome...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x114882

Post #13

See how she talks about how the story so "HURT" her inside? She PLAYS to the audience.

This is why she lies and distorts so much. She works very hard to PLAY to the particular audience she is with. (If it's New Yorkers, she is a "lifelong Yankee fan." If it's a group of women, she turns into the "loving mother whose own daughter was in danger on 9/11." If it's the end of a debate, she "is honored to be with Barack Obama." If it's in Ohio, then "shame on you Barack Obama." etc. etc.) She wants so much to appear "human" because so many people feel she is so cold. You just don't know which Hillary you are going to get on any given day or at any given moment. I wonder if she suffers from multiple personality syndrome.

[Enthusiast]

58. Those old posts should be destroyed as they could serve to mislead us.

[Fuddnik]

67. And every now and then she lapses into a South Carolina drawl.

Maybe she really is Sybil.

[NCTraveler]

40. The rights tactics over the last couple of decades...

Have been tailored to LIV's. It simply works on them. It leaves good progressives scratching their heads but it is what it is.

[ejbr]

43. That line just makes me

hungry.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

79. I don't mind, as long as it's my sister-in-law's pecan "pie in the sky"! Dee-lishhh!

Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!

[Helen Borg]

50. Zzzzzz

[Cobalt Violet]

51. Triangulation has consequences.

[Logical]

55. Lol, a whining post telling no one else to whine! nt

[marmar]

72. ^ This

[Vinca]

59. I wonder which will play better -

"SocialistCommunist trying to turn us into a European country" (your words) or, if Hillary is the nominee, "dishonest liar who caused the deaths of brave Americans in Benghazi and exposed classified American secrets to the world" (what their words will be). You seem to see the general election through rose-colored glasses when it comes to Hillary. They will destroy her.

[merrily]

60. If that's how you talk about people you like.....

I really like Bernie and have said it over and again. But Hillary is NOT the antiChrist, and I along with millions of other people think she is more qualified to be president and is more grounded in reality than Bernie who is proposing pie in the sky, as of yet does not have a REAL revolution going, who has trashed our party in the past and was never even a member of the party, who wanted someone to primary Obama, and who would be chewed to shreds by the Republicans in the general election campaign as an unacceptable "SOCIALISTCOMMUNIST trying to turn us into a European country."

[Shadowflash]

61. Again?

[asuhornets]

65. K&R N/T

[VulgarPoet]

66. The floggings will continue...

I won't vote for someone I wouldn't willingly give my life for. I don't believe she understands what sending people to die for country really means, given her foreign policy record. If we go to war again under her, I don't believe it will be a war in defense of our Constitution. If we go to war again under her, I don't believe it will be for defending our allies. And I certainly don't believe that if we go to war under her again, it won't result in either the end of the world, or the forwarding of the tired tripe about American Exceptionalism.

I raised my hand and swore an oath to protect the United States, and the Constitution. I do not believe she stands for either, and as such, I can't vote for her.

[whatchamacallit]

69. "I really like Bernie and have said it over and again"

Followed by a lame litany of reasons you don't...

[marmar]

71. "then don't whine when some are tossed your way"

Another irony-challenged, do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do OP.

[orpupilofnature57]

78. What happened to You ? Sour grapes with no Comprehensive content, Ever .

[Gene Debs]

81. The whole premise of the OP collapsed with "It is real and progressive."

[creatives4innovation]

82. No thanks

Universal healthcare, tuition-free college and strengthening Social Security aren't pie in the sky. Here's what is: politics as usual in a time when our economic system is crashing, our government does not represent the interests of our people and we're focused on empire-building abroad while our country decays from within. HRC is a primary advocate and architect of the policies that have brought us here. Also, virtually every poll indicates Bernie is the far stronger general election candidate.

[-none]

93. ^^^This^^^

Universal healthcare, tuition-free college and strengthening Social Security aren't pie in the sky. Here's what is: politics as usual in a time when our economic system is crashing, our government does not represent the interests of our people and we're focused on empire-building abroad while our country decays from within. HRC is a primary advocate and architect of the policies that have brought us here. Also, virtually every poll indicates Bernie is the far stronger general election candidate.

It is Hillary's politics I have a problem with. We've had the Hope, now it is time for the Change.

[ellennelle]

83. with all due respect

you've posed a false equivalence.

hillary's lifetime of service and achievement are precisely what is scaring people. her connections to folks like kissinger, blankfein, and larry summers are scary. even more scare are her "achievements" of lobbying to repeal welfare reform and install mass incarceration ("bringing...superpredators...to heel&quot , claw back glass-steagell, and promoting interventionism in bosnia, libya, egypt, syria, haiti (the list goes on; do research), and - most damning in my mind - founding the GD DLC!

these are not credentials in my book; quite the opposite. (and they are only a shave off the top; dig deeper and the hair stands up on the back of your progressive neck.) add to these points her history of waffling her positions - worse now than ever - along with the desperate and graceless way in which she has mismanaged her campaigns - in 08 and now - when her inevitability is threatened, and it gets harder and harder to admire her even for getting this far as a woman.

you worry about the GOP accusing bernie of being an unabashed socialist. at least he is up front about it, and supports that truth with factual data such as how much better off europe is than we are, and the truth of that does not seem to bother the millions who have flocked to support him. hillary cannot even touch that enthusiasm, and she sure won't get it from me.

moreover, and here is the kicker, if you think this thin argument against bernie - that the GOP will "chew him to shreds" with the socialist epithet, while ignoring the decades of sewage and overt ammunition they've been stockpiling against her - you are not only poorly informed, you are naive. the GOP is so eager to trot all that out against her, and can barely contain it until her "inevitable" win.

they got nothin' on bernie. he speaks truth, consistently and firmly, as he has for decades; he'll dance circles around any one of them in debates. hell, ALL of them, put together!

you cannot buy the enthusiasm and epidemic inspiration bernie generations. and the best part is, it's not about him, it's about the movement, the movement to remove all that the GOP and - sadly - hillary too have come to represent.

hillary - again sadly (i supported her and have defended her for decades) - generates no such inspiration. except some old white women.

of which i am one. but i steadfastly cannot support her. i'll only vote for her if i have to, but not with enthusiasm. and that raises such a mystery; why is the DNC leadership not stumbling all over themselves to harness that enthusiasm? that enthusiasm represents not just his profoundly crucial election (the stakes are so damn high), but the youth and future of the party! ignoring this fact seems the epitome of machinery stupidity.

in sum, the false equivalence you pose is that sanders supporters pummel hillary with complaints, but when hillary supporters hit us with complaints, we whine. the differences are listed above; we are hitting her with substance, real complaints and concerns, factual accusations and red flags (she is under FBI investigation, rightly or wrongly, ferchrissake!!!). hillary's camp has nothing but false berniebro and ... gosh, can't think of any other "equivalent" chum her team tries to stir up (rove style via david brock).

full disclosure: as i said, i have supported and defended hillary. in fact, it was not until about this time 8 years ago that i stopped; her terrible mismanagement of that campaign turned my stomach. she learned nothing. but i have since learned a lot. i've watched and researched carefully. she is, sadly, not what she seems, even if you can imaginatively formulate some stable and consistent idea of her. i will not vote for her in the GE; i'll vote against the GOP. that is as much as our side will be able to gather from all this, and to ignore these facts is just beyond insanity.

forgive me if i've stepped on toes, i know your position is closely held and means a lot to you. but please, i beg you, wake up and smell the coffee. this is NOT a damn football game prompting silly adolescent accusations of "well, your team did this, and your guy did that." knock it off. this is reality, dear friend. our democracy - AND THE PLANET - are at stake here!

[mcar]

86. K&R

[CentralMass]

89. We understand. You can't in good conscious sell or defend Hillary's flip flopping positons

anymore so you have to go negative.

[Orsino]

90. Why must threads in GD:P be devoted to sniping at DUers instead of candidates' platforms?

Childishness.

[rock]

92. Well put!

If anyone says different ... Well let's just say they don't know what they're talking about.

[AgingAmerican]

94. You mean Sanders derangement syndrome...

Which you push on a daily basis.

Pure projection

[catnhatnh]

97. If you have so much anger toward politicians who disagree with you

Why don't you stay local and attack the fascist lunatic bastard you and your cohort apparently elected pro-consul of the Great North Woods??? You know-Governor LePage....


Bio of a loon:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_LePage

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

98. Is this OP an illustration of a Hillary supporter whining, squeeling and yelling foul?

[NCTraveler]

99. Conservatives can't help it. She is simply better than they are and it drives them crazy. nt.

[PoliticAverse]

101. "Hillary is NOT the antiChrist" - Is that campaign slogan available on a T-shirt or bumper sticker?

[guillaumeb]

102. Interesting that the poster uses the same tactics of name-calling and nastiness

that he/she claims to hate, and does not respond to any of the 101 replies since the original post. This reminds me of another poster who does this (almost) on a daily basis.

[Motown_Johnny]

107. Service to Walmart and achieving great wealth.

I'm not impressed.

[kstewart33]

113. RBI, keep posting.

I agree with you. Bernie's a good guy, but the Republicans will destroy him in the general election because there are things in his biography that they will twist and use. Not only would we lose the presidency, we will lose many down ballot races at the state and even local level once the rabid Republican assassination squad successfully paints Bernie as a draft dodging Communist who honeymooned in the Soviet Union. And of course, the Supreme Court will be lost.

Fair, absolute not but that's what they'll do to him. And if they can convince the public that John Kerry is a traitor, they can do worse to Bernie.

I'm also concerned that all of the major planks in his platform are impossible to achieve, and that he has shown little leadership ability in his 25 years in Congress except sponsoring 3 passed bills and 2 renamed a post office. He is a great advocate for change; he is not a dealmaker who gets results.

Anyway, keep posting. We Hillary supporters are listening.

[EdwardBernays]

126. and here we have a perfect illustration of the divide

A Hillary support calls this all a "game," for the umpteenth time ignores all the polling that says Dems identify as socialists (even if Bernie doesn't) more than capitalists, ignores the polling that says Bernie polls better than Hillary against all the Republicans, pretends that Hillary isn't corrupt, pretends that the Dems themselves don't trust her is great numbers, ignores that Hillary can barely get a few hundred people to show up most days, while Bernie is still easily pulling in over 10K without even trying, ignores that Bernie has caucuses with the Dems and raised money with the Dems for decades, and is RUNNING in the Democratic Primary as a Democrat, laughably thinks that Hillary is proposing some sort of progressive agenda, etc., etc.

It's all just so typical.

Make-y up-y political attacks might be part of some "game" you think you are playing, but the rest of us think this isn't a game.

And that, pretty much sums it up.. your attacks are just part of some game, our criticism of Hillary is NOT. We're not playing.

[Goblinmonger]

128. Locking

Thanks.