If you don't like the DNC's rules on choosing the nominee you can start your own party

[hill2016]

with your own rules.

Why do you think the superdelegates support Clinton? Because she has raised money and campaigned for them. Went on the rubber chicken circuits.

Bernie has always been an outsider and was never part of the DNC. Never raised a dime for anyone.

So don't complain that caucuses or superdelegates are undemocratic.

[Matariki]

1. Flamebait

You are a very divisive presence.

[leftofcool]

6. No she isn't. We're just sick of the whining about super delegates.

If Bernie and his supporters don't like the rules, he can drop out any time.

[Matariki]

12. Willful ignorance.

[leftofcool]

22. Nope, just that Bernie is not a good candidate.

Sorry, he does not meet my needs.

[Voice for Peace]

65. Can you clarify which of your needs are met by Hilary?

Thanks

[choie]

70. He/she must work on Wall Street...

n/t

[leftofcool]

88. Oh gee, no. Retired school teacher

Thank you for playing though.

[Ed Suspicious]

82. Great question.

[leftofcool]

89. I could but I am not interested in doing so.

[riversedge]

68. The op is spot on.

[Red Knight]

16. It's a pattern.

But anyway-- it's MY party too.

Clinton supporters don't own it.

They can leave.

I'd rather change it --for the better.

Getting a third party started is next to impossible anyway.

And we don't need two Republican parties. So there is a part of this base that will choose to fight for the soul of the party.

It's that simple.

[NowSam]

51. Well said. nt

[Matt_in_STL]

37. You're right. He should drop out and run as an Independent.

Then, when Hillary loses the GE, Bill would at least have someone to call a bastard at 2am.

[kristopher]

44. What the hell makes you think you have more rights than anyone else?

[Politicalboi]

53. Cause they support The Queen

Votes be damned.

[leftofcool]

90. My, you sound angry.

Pity.

[Red Knight]

8. Yep...lot of that going on.

It feels like an agenda to burn it all down.

[kristopher]

45. The term is "TAKE IT BACK". Thanks for listening.

[tarheelsunc]

76. What makes the truth so divisive? eom

[Matariki]

77. Telling other Democrats to bugger off

and let the current dysfunctional DNC run roughshod over democracy isn't remotely 'truth'. It's an opinion. And a bad one at that.

[tarheelsunc]

80. So... Bernie actually was a Democrat supporting Democrats all these years?

Hill2016 is right. Clinton earned the support of superdelegates by helping to get Democrats elected at all levels, while Sanders has been critical of the party for decades and only joined it out of political convenience.

[Matariki]

84. I'VE been a Democrat since I could first vote. Years and years ago.

Hill2016 is trying to provoke a fight. It's what they do. If Sanders wins the majority of pledged delegates and super delegates override that, the party is going to have a civil war on it's hands.

Everything else is posturing.

[Warren Stupidity]

2. If the "DNC" chooses the nominee using super delegates that is likely to happen.

Is that what you want?

[leftofcool]

3. Exactly!

[PonyUp]

4. And you'll be crying and blaming Bernie supporters when Hillary loses. n/t

[leftofcool]

9. Nope, because Hillary isn't going to lose.

[Merryland]

15. She will if some keep up the hate against Bernie going.

[leftofcool]

92. LMAO

Nobody outside of DU gives a shit.

[MohRokTah]

10. The Left is ALWAYS to blame any time the Democratic candidate loses the presidency.

This is historically how it happens. If a Democratic candidate loses a presidential race, the party ALWAYS moves right.

So Sanders supporters should be the most motivated people on the planet to insure the Democratic nominee wins, otherwise the entire political landscape will shift to the right as it has always done.

[kristopher]

46. You have the tense wrong - The left is always blamed...

That doesn't make the attempt to place the blame on us valid.

[Politicalboi]

58. And we will insure Bernie wins

HilLIARy is sure to lose. The GOP hate her, and will use all they can which won't take much to destroy her. They not only have HilLIARy to go after, but Big Bubba too. Bill and HilLIARy did this all by themselves. I voted for Bill twice.

[MohRokTah]

5. The time to change things started right after Obama locked up the nomination.

Members of the DNC have EARNED their positions through hard work and effort on the behalf of Democratic candidates nationwide.

So if some interloper comes along and starts whining about how the system is unfair simply because he never put in the effort and hard grueling work, like Hillary has for 40 years, well, I've got no sympathy.

[kristopher]

47. That "interloper" is taking it to the people what ARE the party.

Fuck the money machine you seem to embrace.

[Politicalboi]

62. So those owed favors rule the majority

Sounds rather Republican to me. Go ahead and play by the "rules" and lose half your team. Hello President Dump.

[MohRokTah]

67. You're the one who didn't get involed enough to alter things.

Its not my fault or Hillary's fault you do not understand how party politics works.

[NurseJackie]

7. Thank you! This needed to be said. And ...

... it will probably need to be repeated often as things continue forward.

[Politicalboi]

63. Ain't gonna help if Bernie has popular vote

[democrattotheend]

11. I have no problem with people who want to change the system

We are the Democratic Party and the party ought to welcome input from the rank and file about how to make the nomination process more democratic in the future. But I agree that trying to delegitimize the results of a primary or caucus when your candidate doesn't win is petty and unproductive.

That said, I remember a lot of complaints from Hillary supporters the last time around about the caucuses being undemocratic.

[MoonRiver]

36. I have never liked them because I think a lot of people simply cannot get to them.

This means those people are disenfranchised. I am currently severely disabled and cannot sit through a caucus. I also have two hip replacements coming up, which I have to recover from. So even if I could stay through a caucus I may be recovering when the caucus happens. This wouldn't happen if we had a primary. I could just vote early.

[democrattotheend]

39. I sympathize, and agree with you

In an ideal world, we either would not have caucuses or would have a way to participate on your own time. What bothered me in 2008 though was Clinton supporters trying to delegitimize Obama's victories in the caucuses. If she wanted to try to change the system she should have done so before the primaries. So as a Bernie supporter I will not do what she did in 2008 and try to delegitimize her caucus wins. She won them fair and square (as far as we know). But I do think the party should reevaluate them going forward.

[MoonRiver]

43. Well, I never did anything like that. What's the point?

Although there may, or may not, have been something fishy going on in the Nevada caucus, I won't get involved with that either. I prefer to let party officials sort those things out.

[cali]

13. It doesn't.get more puerile than your op.

You truly are... something.

[Avalux]

14. LOL who do you think you're talking to?

I am a Democrat, I have been my entire life, and I have every right to criticize the DNC for any reason I see fit. Your dictatorial posts are really disturbing.

[cali]

19. A lot of her supporters are much like the op. Bless their hearts

[UglyGreed]

38. Sounds just like when people

opposed the Iraq war, if you don't like it you can just leave the USA!!!!! Funny how that happens huh?

[kristopher]

48. +1

[vi5]

17. O.K.

As long as we don't have to hear from the remaining members of the Hillacratic party that it was our fault that President Trump or Rubio got elected.

Maybe Bernie wasn't, but I've been a donating, working, canvassing, straight Dem ticket voting member of the party for 35 years and I think our current DNC and our process stinks to high heaven, especially since Howard Dean was kicked to the curb and the DNC became more concerned with getting Hillary elected than with the long term health and wellness of the Democratic party as a whole. If you want people like me to leave the party then you're doing a bang up job of it.

[whatchamacallit]

18. Depending on the result of this election

I believe you will see the formation of a third party that will dwarf the other two. The jig is up. The party has destroyed its reputation with its base. You loyalists better pray that your suggestion goes unheeded.

[SheenaR]

20. Not the first time you have posted

The exact same wording.


You need us. We wont need you if she is the nominee. When you come crying for our support in November we may just be too busy following your directions.

People are like you are why my post with 300 recommendations is accurate. She will never be President.


Edit: fortunately there are one or two people like DSB who are not such a poor representation of your side like yourself.

[2pooped2pop]

21. Actually we might have to. Pretty sure its going to be torn all to hell

If super delegates puts Clinton in over a winner. I don't think there will be a recovery. The party will split. Period.

[SusanCalvin]

26. If they do that (I hopefully doubt they will), the party will be dead. nt

[DrDan]

85. not to worry - the voters will speak in her favor

[Karma13612]

91. And it might be time. We would make history, on the way to finally

improving this country.

I won't see the results since I am already 62, but it would be great to see things beginning to turn for the better.

Our current Democratic party, and their management really needs to do some soul-searching.

There is a need to get back to the roots and to what is meant to be democratic. To be the party to the middle-class and the poor and the young and the infirmed.

Basically, the 99%.

[mak3cats]

23. And another HRC supporter slammed Bernie for fundraising for the party...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511153641

You guys really need to get your stories straight. Otherwise, you all just sound hypocritical.

[TTUBatfan2008]

30. Well said.

Rip him for fundraising. Rip him for not fundraising. Get the story straight HRC people.

[2pooped2pop]

24. The party will split but since we had it first we may invite the republican lite branch

To form their own party. Depends on how damaged we feel you have left the democratic party. I think its time for more than two parties now anyway. We need one that leans left.

[SusanCalvin]

25. I will complain all I wish to. You may have your opinion, of course.

My view is that if one doesn't like the rules, one can work to change them.

And if Bernie does win the popular vote delegates, those super delegates should flip. I imagine they will, because the alternative wouldn't be pretty.

In other words, they are irrelevant except as a talking point (which I'm frankly getting kind of tired of, but that's just my opinion.....) and as campaign surrogates. Or should be.

[Karmadillo]

27. Way to build that coalition! Obey! Shut up!

[HooptieWagon]

28. Probably will happen.

[villager]

29. Have you ever considered not axiomatically alienating people with your posts? Ahead of fall?

When, presumably, a broader coalition will actually be needed?

[LWolf]

31. Thanks for this perfect demonstration of why,

should Clinton win the nomination, Democrats will lose in November.

[islandmkl]

32. is this like 1968 or 1970 or 1972...deja vu all over again...and from OUR side..

"IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, LEAVE IT!!"

you don't even see the irony, let alone the historical reference, in what you are saying...

no...we don't like all the rules in place, they weren't always there, and they can be changed...

then YOU can decide what party you want to belong to...

[frylock]

33. That's probably what's going to happen. Meanwhile, good luck in the GE.

Indys are deciding this election. Deal.

[Kip Humphrey]

34. Don't tell me... there is NOTHING democratic about superdelegates unless you think being

3/5th of a human is legitimate.

[Vinca]

35. There is no doubt the time is long overdue for a viable third party.

If election outcomes are based on who got the most money, it's not a fair election. It's called being bought and paid for. What's the going rate for a superdelegate anyway?

[Broward]

40. Or perhaps we can take the Party back from the right wingers and corporatists.

This isn't your Party.

[Jefferson23]

41. Then she'll lose and lose BIG. Why would you want that?

Your OP's are funny.

[cascadiance]

42. Who do super delegates like Jeff Berman, Joanne Dowdell, etc. represent? They aren't even elected!

https://theintercept.com/2016/02/17/voters-be-damned/

They representing corporate money lobbyists, etc. INSTEAD of THOUSANDS of real voters as pledged delegates do, corrupt our system of democracy which this party has its name come from, even if a lot of Hillary Clinton supporters appear to hate this system in practice when they would like to use these delegates instead of those elected by democratic processes to select our president.

Now, if we had instant runoff voting, I might be a member of another party and leverage that system of voting to help put forth candidates that won't have to worry about being spoilers or being bought off by big money people wanting to "buy the field" of the two parties in every race with the winner take all system we have in place now.

Those of us who believe in the Democratic Party that FDR made great, and had a leader that someone like Bernie Sanders works harder to emulate than the Koch created DLC members of today have, want us to find ways to get rid of that Koch Brothers enabled cancer that has made the corrupt system we have now that almost destroyed our country in 2008, and still may yet if we don't change direction soon.

Yes, the same PTB tried to launch a TREASONOUS coup against FDR in his days that fortunately Smedley Butler stopped, but ultimately those involved weren't brought down to the point that they and their descendants couldn't wreak havoc later again in our days now.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

49. "Democratic" party = false advertising.

Appointments, rather than votes, are not democratic.

[Dawgs]

50. Be careful what you wish for.

There are a lot more Indys than Dems and Republicans.

[Politicalboi]

52. Then those Supers should be primaried

They better be for the people, or they will all be out of a job soon.

[bunnies]

59. kinda hard to primary a bunch of lobbyists.

[Purveyor]

54. K&R for exposure. I hope a whole lot of people see this, indeed. eom

[HassleCat]

55. I realize you just intended this to provoke people

But more and more of us are thinking about it. Closer to the point, more and more of us are considering giving up on the Democratic Party, bothering to vote only when there are ballot measures or interesting candidates down the ballot.

[aikoaiko]

56. So you're saying the superdelegates are bought and paid for. Nice admission.

[grntuscarora]

57. Really, this is disgusting.

The ptb have made it damn near impossible for third parties to be anything more than spoilers, and you know that perfectly well. Would you prefer Bernie run third party and hand the election to the R's?

I hope Bernie can revitalize Dem Party, and give it credibility again. It's in sore need of both.

[RiverLover]

86. +1 Well said. /nt

[earthside]

60. Got that Sanders supporters, you're being invited to leave ...

... the Democratic Party.

Be careful what you insist upon, Hillarians.
You may just get it.

[dana_b]

61. +1 n/t

[Jbradshaw120]

79. Indeed!

+1

[silenttigersong]

64. Bookmarking for the general election

Bernie has leverage,might want to play nice don't you think?

[TIME TO PANIC]

66. What a great way to alienate voters you might need.

[cherokeeprogressive]

69. 4 parts bullshit, 1 part warm spit. Mix well, spread thin, bake til crusty. Remove from heat...

and sprinkle with cold vomit. Tasty like this OP.

Never raised a dime for anyone? That's the fucking stupidest nonsense I've ever read anywhere sober, stoned, or pissy drunk. I guess you missed the fucking bullshit about Bernie Sanders attending the posh Democratic fundraisers that put to bed the idiocy of claiming just what you're claiming.

In retrospect... you ARE right about something. She raised money for unelected superdelegates who are nothing more than DNC members with champagne taste.

[Buns_of_Fire]

71. I can see a situation where they could muck up the works, but I don't think it'll happen.

Most likely, they'll be given their VIP goodie bag (with credentials that have their name in gold, of course, a few 8x10 glossies of Debbie Schultz, a PEZ dispenser in the likeness of Hillary, and a $5 gift certificate at McDonalds), and then aimlessly wander the convention floor looking suitably important. They'll probably just spend their time schmoozing with their buddies, scarfing down free drinks in the hospitality suites, and generally being totally useless -- you know, just like in their everyday lives...

...UNLESS a situation arises where their services are needed. THEN things might get interesting, and some serious individual decisions will have to be made, with no really good options either way. But then, that's why they get the Big Bucks.

[FloridaBlues]

72. Bernie knows the rules of the democratic primary delegates

This is nothing new been this way since 1984.
If you Dont like this way join up with another party

[markpkessinger]

74. Hey, now THERE's a great way to bring the party together for November . . .

. . . NOT!

[bigwillq]

75. I think caucuses are undemocratic

I am not a big fan of caucuses. I am glad I live in a primary state because, if I didn't, I probably would never vote in a caucus. I work second shift and weekends and probably wouldn't have time.

This has nothing to do with this year's results; I have always felt this way.

[Eric J in MN]

94. I've been against caucuses since 2008, when I was stuck in a traffic jam after the MN Caucus

...because everyone leaves at the same time.

It's better to have primaries, where people come-and-go at different times and there aren't traffic jams.

My opposition to caucuses also isn't about this year's results.

[jfern]

81. We are just worthless peons for you superior Hillary supporters

to talk down to

[DrDan]

83. thumbs up!

[GoneFishin]

87. It's a great idea. Bernie should, but he already said he wouldn't. And he is a pretty honest guy.

Considering all of the cheating, dirty tricks, and phony attacks by Hillary surrogates I think he would be completely entitled to run as an independent.

Shit, Joe Lieberman ran as an independent and even endorsed John McCain for President, and still the Senate Democratic Caucus let Lieberman keep the chairmanship of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs.

So I am sure there would be no hard feelings if Bernie did it.

[Eric J in MN]

93. The people who started the Super Delegate system didn't accept the status quo of the time.

Supporters of democracy shouldn't accept the status quo of today.

The DEMOCRATIC Party should have one-person-one-vote.

No Super Delegates and no caucuses.

[mgmaggiemg]

95. great point

[NanceGreggs]

96. Well, it's like this ...

The DNC's rules should have been changed - to accommodate Bernie.

The scheduling of debates should have been changed - to accommodate Bernie.

The choice of topics that debate moderators are permitted to explore should have been changed - to accommodate Bernie.

The idea of Superdelegates should be changed - to accommodate Bernie.

The long-standing rules governing individual state's caucuses should have been changed - to accommodate Bernie.

The equally long-standing rules whereby states settle ties via coin-tosses or the drawing of cards should have been abolished - to accommodate Bernie.

The way by which Democrats are allowed to raise money to fund their campaigns should have been changed - to accommodate Bernie.

When Senator "I'm an Outsider" Sanders chose to run on the Democratic ticket, he should have realized - at the very least - that long-standing rules and procedures were not about to be altered in order to accommodate HIM.

When Bernie chose to run for the nomination of the Democratic party, he should have known that having demeaned that Party for decades was going to come back back to bite him in the ass, and that long-time Democrats were not going to be bending over backwards to welcome his anti-Democrat ass into the party he's still "too pure" to be a member of.

That's not Politics 101 - that's just plain common sense.

[noamnety]

97. The superdelegates support clinton because she raised money for them.

I don't think any of the Bernie supporters are arguing otherwise.

We are suggesting that might not be the most democratic way to get votes.

[John Poet]

98. KICKING your party-wrecking post because

I want more Bernie supporters to see it.

[DefenseLawyer]

99. I don't need anything! But this ashtray!