The attempted destruction of two US civil rights icons recalls to mind the Cultural Revolution.

[Hekate]

Scatter the Old world, build the New!
Smash the Four Olds!
Smash the Gang of Four!

Eventually they'll get around to Have fewer Children, raise more Pigs -- but in the meantime, pupil is turning against teacher, the white hairs of age garner no respect, and the survivors of the Long March are suspect. We didn't even get to try letting 100 flowers bloom.

JURY: I did consider whether this belonged in GD instead of GDP, but it really does relate to the Democratic Primaries, so there you have it.

[Merryland]

1. When icons lie or misrepresent, they deserve to be called out.

[99th_Monkey]

3. THIS ^ Lying is lying, period. nt

[kristopher]

399. 30 Million People Died in the Cultural Revolution and an untold number more...

...in the decades of Asian wars that preceded it.

The Chinese cultural revolution caused the death of 30 million people (according to the current Chinese government), but many died of hunger and ordinary Chinese (who, unlike us, were there) blame Mao's wife rather than Mao himself.

The worst genocides of the 20th and 21st Century
www.scaruffi.com/politics/dictat.html

[TDale313]

16. Yes. The lying and smears are not ok, no matter who.

[Roy Ellefson]

30. exactly

exactly...they're not fucking gods...they're humans and when they lie they deserve to be called out.

[Jarqui]

58. +1 +1 +1 +1 nt

[MADem]

136. Who, precisely, is LYING? nt

[Hekate]

143. That indeed is the question. Thank you, MADem.

[forest444]

197. That much we already know: it's Ms. Huerta.

They were clearly shouting "Neutral" - not "English only."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511290075

Once this footage came out (of course), Huerta herself was quick to walk back her earlier claims: https://www.rawstory.com/2016/02/civil-rights-activist-dolores-huerta-sanders-backers-shut-me-down-for-offering-spanish-translation/

[MADem]

211. You are accusing Dolores Huerta of LYING? Really? Deliberately telling a falsehood? Making shit

up?

You seriously BELIEVE THAT?

She offers to translate and a bunch of people start screaming at her. But you call her a LIAR?


MAYBE...just maybe, you might want to have a peek at this article:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/21/why-neither-side-is-quite-right-in-their-reads-on-that-dolores-huerta-english-only-shout-down/

Here's a wee taste:

News is a developing, living thing. As new information becomes available, previous insights can be shown to be wrong or at least incomplete. And that -- not some grand conspiracy against Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) and his ardent supporters -- is what appears to be at the root of a fierce online battle about labor and civil rights activist Dolores Huerta's claim that she was shouted off a caucus stage with chants of "English only!"

On Saturday evening, as the Nevada caucuses drew to a close and Hillary Clinton was pronounced the winner, Huerta tweeted out a message indicating she had been barred from providing English-to-Spanish interpretation services at Las Vegas caucus gathering in Harrah's Casino on the Las Vegas Strip. Her observations were seconded in a tweet dispatched by the actress America Ferrera. Huerta and Ferrera are Clinton supporters and have made no attempt to hide that fact. And at the caucus event in question, Huerta was wearing a Clinton campaign T-shirt.

But in the hours that followed those tweets, Sanders supporters -- in many cases using the very language that had given rise to the idea that some Sanders voters are rowdy to outright rude -- set certain corners of the progressive Internet on fire. There were allegations of media bias and of deliberate attempts by the Clinton campaign and/or its supporters to besmirch the liberal credentials of Sanders voters or cast them as frothy-mouthed racists....The plain truth about what happened is that no one seems to have described events quite accurately. Here's the video Sarandon shared in her tweet. The key section runs from about the 53:35 minute mark to around 56:46.

If you watch the Sarandon video, you will note that some of what is said and done is not audible or clear. But this much is:

Around 53:35, there is a call from the back of the room for a Spanish translator, because some in the room do not speak English.
There is a lot of cross talk, yelling, hissing and complaining around the 53:55 mark, as Huerta comes to the stage.
There are people shouting, "She's with Hillary" and "No," around the 54:12 mark.
At around 54:30, the permanent chair (the man speaking into the microphone) asks people to settle down, stop yelling and observe.
Then, the permanent chair says at around the 55:21 mark, "We're going forward in English only."

This statement was followed immediately by much applause and cheers of "Thank you." All of this together would indicate that the people pleased by the permanent chair's English-only decision were probably Sanders voters.

[kiva]

240. Do you not see the difference between

a bunch of people shouting "English only!", and people cheering that transparency was being enforced? If that was my caucus site, I would also have complained if an obviously partisan Huerta would have been allowed to translate.

If Huerta and others are unhappy that the Democratic Party didn't provide a translator - personally I think they should have - then take it up with the Democratic Party and quit complaining that people who were there disagreed.

[MADem]

360. They could have chosen a translator from each side--you're not going to find a "non-partisan" at a

frigging caucus. That's just not realistic. Two translators, taking turns, and checking each other if they disagreed with the translation.

Instead the caucus moderator delivered a hearty F U to the Spanish speakers in the caucus crowd, decided that the event would be an ENGLISH ONLY one, and a large cadre in the audience shamed themselves....by CHEERING this pronouncement.

This isn't a DNC issue. Doesn't anyone realize that the STATE PARTIES control these things?

smh!!!! And "quit complaining" is a superb outreach to the Hispanic community!!

[kiva]

364. You don't think that the state party

could have hired a translator? Anyone who lives here knows very well that there are a large number of Hispanic workers on the Strip and could have predicted that a translator would be helpful to many at the caucus, but the party decided not to bother...this is on them.

And the Bernie cheered the idea that someone who clearly supported Hillary wouldn't be allowed to translate? Quick, hand me my smelling salts

[Laughing Mirror]

335. Thank you for that sterling WaPo propaganda piece

As usual with this sort of thing, the comments section is quite illuminating.

[MADem]

361. Ah, the WAPO says something you don't like, so it is now a purveyor of propaganda.

And of course, they're responsible for the views of their readers, of course!

LOL!

Those "English Only" cheerleaders were violating federal law--still feeling happy?

The Voting Rights Act requires that translated voting materials and language assistance or interpretation services be made available in areas with a certain concentration of voters with limited English proficiency. Clark County, Nev., which includes Las Vegas, is one of those places. It has been since the 2000 Census.

Voting is serious, and goodness knows that the caucus process is unique. So making sure that people fully understand what is going on at a given event and don't have the added burden of rapid personal interpretation is only common sense. Federal funds were provided to states to do so under the Help America Vote Act and to study the best methods. Nevada is not an exception.

The reasons for these laws are clear -- so clear that the applause and excitement as the English-only decision was made at the Harrah's Casino caucus Saturday perhaps did strike some people, including Huerta, as highly inappropriate.

Whether intended or not, those applauding effectively sanctioned a process that allowed qualified voters who do not speak English, or who are Spanish-dominant, limited insight and influence in the evening's events.

That's from that "propaganda" WAPO link. Way to 'do' Hispanic outreach! Break the law AND crap on the founder of the Farm Workers Union, a national icon.

[Laughing Mirror]

367. The readers are taking their shoddy propaganda

and ripping it to shreds. Just an observation.

[MADem]

373. Guess what? Those readers might want to know it is a violation of Federal Election Law to NOT

provide translation services.

Not a good look for that caucus moderator at all--or the cheerleaders for an "English Only" caucus.

That's the definition of disenfranchisement.

[George II]

219. And the "lie" was?

[840high]

229. Yes they do.

[HubertHeaver]

237. Or when they allow themselves to be manipulated.

Years past it would be months, if not years, before the truth came out. With the internet, <12 hours.

[MaeScott]

332. They lied and willingly crawled under...

.....the yellow thing on four wheels.

[Z_California]

366. Who is doing the detroying?

It's obvious to those who aren't blind with bias.

Two feminist icons. A black civil rights icon. A latina immigration rights icon. All trotted out to make dishonest attacks.

Yes, someone is destroying these icons.

[Ferd Berfel]

390. YES! YOu don't get a pass just because you were an 'icon'

[bravenak]

2. Losing proposition to attack our icons

We love THEM. We don't care about Bernie too much so we choose our icons

[tk2kewl]

23. I expect honesty from everyone

I expect more from heroes

[bravenak]

34. Too bad you'll be dissappointed.

Heroes are HUMANS

[tk2kewl]

50. Indeed, and thus are not above criticism when they fail

[bravenak]

51. But the response needs be PROPORTIONATE

Otherwise? Bullying

[tk2kewl]

85. It's hard to make the case for bullying if the alleged victims use their well eared respect

To promote falsehoods. Bullies are generally the ones with the power in any relationship. That said, calling out people like Lewis an Huerta does require a firm, but respectful approach.

[bravenak]

90. I follow her on twitter

Disgusting the bullying
Racialized attacks
Hispanics are reading
I read spanish language news to see
It's a big scandal
And not in bernies favor
Might LOSE HIM votes
Let me shut up now. Please continue telling Dolores Huerta about herself. It helps hillary.

[frylock]

99. I've been on her feed for two days.

Feel free to post some screeners of the bullying and racial attacks. Hint: they're not there.

[bravenak]

102. Really? Ha!

[frylock]

104. Yep. Got those screens yet?

[bravenak]

107. I don't work for you

[frylock]

111. Ah, here we go again. Ever the victim.

Pardon me, and I hate to trouble you, but might I kindly ask if you can provide graphic evidence of this bullying that you've alluded to? Trust but verify, that's what they say, right right?

[bravenak]

112. I need my paycheck first

[frylock]

116. So no evidence of bullying then?

I'm Jack's absolute sense of shock.

[bravenak]

117. Can I get my monies?

[frylock]

119. Where are the pretzel monies?

[Marr]

246. Oh, brother.

[brush]

245. Try reading post 211 on this very thread and you might stop spreading the liar story

You seem to be the one doing this the most.

[frylock]

249. Post #211 shows zero evidence of what I'm discussing here.

It's just another appeal to authority. Get me some screens. Chop-chop.

[MADem]

132. """Please continue telling Dolores Huerta about herself. """ Creo que sí!!!!!!! nt

[bravenak]

134. Esta bien.

I keep wanting to stop people from screwing up but wtf? WHY? My bad. They can proceed.

[SunSeeker]

204. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink it.

You tried to warn them about the stupidity of using Obama haters like Cornell West as their outreach ambassadors to the African American community. They did not listen to you, they just alert stalked you. After a while, you realize there is no point in leading this horse to water.

[bravenak]

205. Bingo

I tried like a damn FOOL to lead that hardheaded horse. Died of thirst, it was that stubborn.

[azurnoir]

209. there may well be a good deal of influence in who gets the Democratic nomination

but that same influence falls very short when it comes to the GE and who wins

[bravenak]

213. That makes no difference in the primary

Nobody listens to people who give real advice, they get mad and attack. This is the other side of it. I was right. Period. Often am. Prescient. It was easy to see this outcome from all the variables in place since summer. I have no emotional connection to either candidate. Makes it easy to SEE.

[azurnoir]

221. summed up the technique being used yesterday before the Huerta thing even happened

Star Member azurnoir (42,672 posts)
53. yep that seems the case never ever use the "R" word however

pony up blogs like "Berniesoblack"

impune his civil rights record-claim that's not him it's some dead guy

claim well maybe he's a good guy and all but he left Brooklyn and moved to Vt to be around his own kind meaning white folks albeit that's a joke too because Bernies a Jew and if he really wanted to move somewhere he'd be around "his own kind" I seriously doubt Vt would have been his first choice

then claim after attacking him about race any attempt by his supporters to defend him is "whitesplaining" racist, you name it

oh and then claim his supporters are racist are the racists and they're mean to us on twitter


all of this started within hours of his announced candidacy on behalf of his opponent who ran an openly racist campaign 8 years ago against Barack Obama and lost

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1282817

[bravenak]

225. He never came to us until after Netroots

His bad

[azurnoir]

231. he came to everybody all of us in the 2 months of campaign prior in the ensuing 8 months since

he has corrected that

[bravenak]

234. Afterhoughts

[azurnoir]

239. so 8 months of campaigning is an after thought

ya know you claim to not be for either candidate but yet you seem quite invested in only condemning one of them

[bobbobbins01]

305. You're wasting your time with her.

This is what she does. She's a self admitted disruptor.

[azurnoir]

306. Thanks and I know but sometimes just drawing someone out getting them to enlatge on their opinion is

worth it

[UglyGreed]

191. Just accept the lies

we can not hope for honesty in this day and age it seems......

[George II]

217. So why doesn't one of you who has been parroting "lies" actually tell us what some of those "lies"..

...are? Please.

[UglyGreed]

220. Well for one Hillary admitted not telling the

truth all the time...........

[George II]

224. Nice deflection - but, have YOU or anyone you know ever NOT "lied"? If you were watching Sanders...

....before yesterday, he said that "we will win in Nevada". That didn't happen.

Was it a "lie", did he "not tell the truth", or was he just wrong?

Now, back to the point - could one of you who has been parroting "lies" actually tell us what some of those "lies" are? You didn't the first time I asked, and I said "please".

[UglyGreed]

241. No deflection

I went right to the top of the pyramid you choose to deflect........

[George II]

294. And yet no specific "lies".

[UglyGreed]

341. Her own words

what's the matter you don't trust what Hillary said to the interviewer????

[George II]

342. Still nothing?

[Art_from_Ark]

409. So the "special place in hell" comment by Albright was not a lie?

The "girls are for Bernie because they're looking for boys" comment by Steinem wasn't a lie?

[George II]

411. Neither of those are "lies", they're extreme comments and both have apologized.

[okasha]

291. I can think of a lie.

"We didn't breach the data. It just jumped right out of the server all by itself--we were all scared to death--and landed in our printer. Terrified we were, but we tried to catch it and put it back. Honest, we did.

"And speaking of things that just flung themselves at our computers, there were those scary AARP and lcv logos. We were just helpless victims."

[Duckhunter935]

52. and they lie and need to be called out on it

[bravenak]

54. But not bullied NOR TRASHED

[MADem]

158. Please tell us who, precisely is LYING, and what these awful LIES are. nt

[azurnoir]

235. Delores Huerta's tweet claiming Bernie supporters yelled English only at her

apparently you haven't read about that yet?

[MADem]

365. I invite your attention the WAPO article I have posted above.

Apparently there's a ton of error of fact to go around.

The most important take away, though, is that translation services were not provided at that caucus, IN VIOLATION OF FEDERAL LAW, and a particular group of "supporters" at that caucus actually CHEERED when the moderator declared "English Only."

Way to do that HIspanic Outreach!!! Heckuvajob!!!!!!

[MelissaB]

27. YOU don't care about Berine too much.

Don't try to speak for the rest of us.

[bravenak]

31. I'll speak HOWEVER I PLEASE

[MelissaB]

42. So will I.

Nanny nanny boo boo.

Yes, your post deserved this childish response.

[bravenak]

47. Good for you

That how its supposed to be

[SheenaR]

150. I gotta say

Ever since you admitted you were going to troll this thing from start to finish I thought maybe you'd crack here and there. But you have stuck to your word that you would pretend to be a Hillary supporter to the end. Works out well when she supports icons of issues that matter to you. Rock on bravenak. Speak however you please. This is going really well for you.

I can cut and paste your quote of you forgot.

[bravenak]

153. Very nice thank you.

[Roy Ellefson]

35. icons

you're goddamn icons are human and capable of the same human failings as you and I. They are not beyond reproach.

[bravenak]

49. They do not DESERVE THIS

[MelissaB]

75. Anyone who misrepresents, misspeaks or lies doesn't deserve to be called on it?

What are people supposed to do? Just let it pass and stand as the truth? I think not.

[bravenak]

77. Not bully her!!! Thats what!

[MelissaB]

80. I don't think she has been bullied. Asking for something incorrect to be corrected is not bullying.

[bravenak]

81. I follow her on twitter

[frylock]

101. She is not being bullied on Twitter.

[bravenak]

105. Like you'd be my judge of what bullying is

I Remember those graphics you posted to me like yesterday. I do not accept yr judgement

[frylock]

109. Provide some examples of her being bullied.

You'll forgive me if I don't trust your judgment.

[bravenak]

110. I dont work for you

[frylock]

113. I don't know you!

[bravenak]

115. My favorite episode

[Don Draper]

210. She hasn't been bullied

She's been called out on her lies. Icons are not above criticism when they are being dishonest.

[bravenak]

214. Bull

[brush]

252. Read post 211 on this thread and you might stop spreading this liar story.

[bravenak]

310. Oh please!! People were yelling

[bravenak]

312. So?

[bravenak]

314. The reaction was worse than what she did

[bravenak]

317. Gotta watch the reactions

Loses votes

[bravenak]

319. They see her getting bullied

[bravenak]

321. How do you know?

[bravenak]

323. In spanish like I do?

You learn more if you se habla espanol, lol

[bravenak]

326. Cuantos anos?

[bravenak]

329. That musta been awesome

I think they will split the latino vote for the Dem party from what I hear from family and friends. Depends on the region they came from too. My family originates from spain on our spanish side so we are just being black now. Except for the spanish speaking, we need that. But we lived in Los Angeles, and they are leaning Hillary but open to bernie. Black voters? Forget about it!! Too late. Takes to long to get us, we have to be comfortable with a candidate.

[bravenak]

331. I wont need anything

I'm used to this

[MADem]

362. Looks like "Name Removed" lost both the battle AND the war! nt

[Hekate]

369. That is what I call a refreshing outcome

For a change. One might also say it gives me hope.

[bravenak]

371. Darn! We had decided to be buddies'

He lived in Peru for cuatro anos. I wanted to know mas!
They ban the good ones too quick these days.
He might have been a returnee.

[MADem]

372. Hmmm, Peru. I seem to remember we had a DUer years ago from Peru.

Whenever I saw the name, my mind's eye saw Peruvian national dress and my mind's ear heard Peruvian flutes!

[bravenak]

374. Hey!! My minds eye ALSO saw peruvian dress!

Plus alpacas.

[MADem]

375. Yep!!!

[brush]

250. Read post 211 on this thread and you might stop spreading this liar story.

[Live and Learn]

227. +10,000 nt

[Hekate]

62. "Which side are you on?" isn't just an old labor rights song, is it?

Solidarity forever! isn't just a slogan -- not when people bled and died for their rights. We stand on the shoulders of giants.

[bravenak]

76. Amen

I can disagree with Respect. Respect I have for the thing they did FOR ME. Being black with a hispanic name and spanish descent is a difficult thing to navigate. A little less color and a bit straighter hair? I'd be called hispanic (which happens all the time anywayz), so I study the history and feel a connection even though I'm not out of latin america but spain. It actually hurt my feelings reading what they said about her. No respect.

[treestar]

121. so even if she misheard

the desire to jump right into "lying" and doing it for money are OTT. It seems characteristic of Bernie supporters to think the worst of every person and every exchange of money. I bet if Hillary paid for her coffee she'd be said to be attempting to get the barista to vote for her.

[Hekate]

126. Totally a barista bribe, especially if at Starbucks, which everybody knows is a horrible corporation

[Live and Learn]

230. I think your icons are the ones that changed sides. nt

[melman]

137. Yes

You love your icons so much and your outrage is not fake at all. I'm sure one could find plenty of mentions of Huerta in a search your 23,000 posts.



*cough*

[bravenak]

141. I bet you can since I posted about her yesterday

Have a wonderful day now!! Ta ta!

[Gothmog]

140. I stand with Congressmen John Lewis and James Clyburn

[bravenak]

145. Me too

[Hekate]

171. Make that three Civil Rights and Labor icons in my OP. I lost count.

I'm sure there will be more under that bus by the end of today.

[brush]

255. Seems if a certain candidate doesn't win, everybody goes under the bus.

[okasha]

292. So do I.

And with Dolores Huerta and Leonard Peltier, and in spirit with Martin and Coretta King, Cesar Chavez, Harvey Milk, Matthew Shepherd, Frank Fools Crow, the martyrs of El Salvador and all that great cloud of witnesses who have spoken truth and suffered for it.

[840high]

232. You made that very clear

with your post yesterday. Shame on you.

[bravenak]

233. I care so much what you think

Tell me more

[840high]

248. You'll care in November.

[Voice for Peace]

4. Dishonesty invalidates iconism.

Our homegrown revolution is about honesty.

[riversedge]

8. I see it is not about compassion.

[Matariki]

19. Hello non sequitur.

[Voice for Peace]

24. Maybe you don't understand what honesty is.

Or truth? Integrity?

[Bluenorthwest]

133. Opposing marriage equality for 20 years while shouting 'God' makes any talk of compassion

look pathetically ironic.

[geek tragedy]

22. if people don't show up it's not a revolution. it's just a failed primary bid nt

[Voice for Peace]

70. So much time gets wasted misunderstanding each other.

What revolution means to one may not be called revolution by others. What "Democrat" means has many interpretations. Arguments are generated over semantics.

My entire life I have been part of this exact revolution. Bernie is a very big deal in that regard. It is not confined to politics. It is about the human heart asserting itself -- against ignorance, cheat & deceit -- on an ever-growing scale. It is happening.

[Hoyt]

41. You can tell something about a candidate's honesty by the lack of honesty among supporters.

[Voice for Peace]

97. I can't judge Hilary's supporters, or Bernie's

But I have judged the character and trustworthiness of a candidate -- simply from watching and listening thru 2 primaries -- which included her silent assent to surrogates' lies on her behalf. Her own words, choices, and alliances have been adequate for me to decide.

Didn't need lying surrogates for that -- but it certainly reaffirms. Didn't need any RW input either -- alas, alas -- have heard and seen enough first-hand.

[frylock]

103. Ain't that the truth.

[MohRokTah]

123. Didn't Mao say something similar? eom

[Voice for Peace]

274. OMG NO I'm sure it was either Stalin or more likely Hitler

[Hekate]

147. Smash the Four Olds! History never happened!

[Voice for Peace]

276. Are you comfortable with trusting those who are

comfortable lying in order to manipulate voters?

[brush]

256. Read post 211 on this thread and you might stop spreading this liar story.

[Voice for Peace]

277. No idea what story you say I'm spreading

[Wilms]

5. "Destroying" sounds pretty bad.

I would not approve.

What we do have here, hekate, are two icons who made questionable statements that they have subsequently walked-back. Do we agree on that much?

[Matariki]

21. Good luck with that.

It's more convenient to latch onto a falsehood and run with it. Beats discussing issues.

[SusanCalvin]

56. I agree that's what the icons did.

And I appreciated it.

As far as comments here, I can't claim to read absolutely everything.

[LexVegas]

6. The attacks on Huerta are going to cost Sanders dearly. nt

[jillan]

11. In what way? Pointing out that she misspoke, which she admits when she makes a statement that it was

the moderators that told her to step down, is going to hurt Bernie in what way?

[Matariki]

28. Keep lying about 'attacks'

just keep doing that. You know what's going to cost Clinton *dearly*. Her dishonesty. Which her supporters seem to have adopted with glee. It's really getting disgusting.

[Hekate]

149. The absolute assertion that Huerta took bribes from the Clinton Foundation is as attack

Of course it was framed as a "question" the same way "Have you stopped beating your wife?" is framed as a question, and people in that thread ran with it like there was a big prize at the other end.

Mighty classy, mighty classy.

Did Dolores Huerta get $100,000 from the Clinton Foundation?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511293322

[Matariki]

151. If anyone used the word 'bribe' they are wrong

However it isn't wrong to state the fact that she received money from the Clinton foundation. That's a matter of record.

[Hekate]

161. Look at how it was received. It's pretty clear a lot of BS supporters believe it was a bribe....

They are wrong, and they are doubling down, and they are unwilling to allow any other interpretation of events.

Other interpretations might include an aged woman's hearing -- Bernie himself, more than a decade younger, holds his hand to his ear all the time. Other interpretations might include a contribution from a large and legitimate foundation (Clinton's) to a smaller and very worthy foundation (Huerta's).

But you read through that thread I linked to and tell me if any Bernie supporters are willing to allow for that, or if it is all variations on (to refer back to my classic instance) wife-beating.

[Matariki]

193. Look, I agree with you that there's no good reason to assert it's a 'bribe'

Her foundation does good work.

It's possible that she misheard and/or misinterpreted the crowd. It that's the case, the responsible thing to do would be to delete her tweet or at least tender an explanation or apology. What she wrote was clearly intended to make Sander's supporters look like racists. You should not be surprised that we find that upsetting.

[bravenak]

37. Damn straight! Like we care for self righteous talk more that our icons! Please...

[mariawr]

177. SNOPES says nuh uh, nope, no way, FALSE. Just another artful smear ala Hillary. nt

[azmom]

7. Attempted destruction?

woooo boy! Aren't you the funny one? Wowza!

[MelissaB]

32. Yep. A whole mouth full.

They seem to be trying way too hard.

[brush]

258. Read post 211 on this thread and you might stop spreading this liar story.

[azmom]

261. Get a grip. This op is over the top.

If you can't see it, you're beyond help.

[jillan]

9. In other words, civil rights icons should be given a pass when they misspeak.

[geek tragedy]

20. they should be corrected, but gutter level claims that they're being paid to

engage in dirty tricks is not only repulsive but counterproductive and will inevitably alienate key parts of the Democratic coalition.

And if that's how the Bernie 'revolution' is going to play out, yeah no thanks.

[jillan]

33. Dolores tweeted out the falsehoods all over twitter. You are so right about this alienating key part

of the democratic coalition tho.

It already has, and not in the way you think.

[Duckhunter935]

60. did she bother to delete her

Charge thar has proven to be incorrect even by her?

[geek tragedy]

69. who fucking cares? Bernie supporters have a lot more important stuff to worry about

other than trying to win a stare down with Dolores Huerta.

[MelissaB]

78. Ok. I care. If it isn't walked back it stands as the truth.

[geek tragedy]

84. nobody is going to know exactly what Huerta heard, what she thought she heard, etc.

What is the truth is that Bernie Sanders and his supporters are not going to win over Latino voters by calling her a corrupt liar.

[Duckhunter935]

89. so she can lie with impunity?

Typical of Hillary surrogates. Put out the statement, walk it back after the damage has been done. Sad.

[geek tragedy]

94. going on the warpath and assuming the very worst about her character

is a trait Bernie supporters pull on everyone who criticizes Bernie. After a while, people begin to realize that it's because bernie supporters are really out of control and can't be reasoned with.

they'd rather attack Dolores Huerta and call her a liar than say "it was confusing, it's very possible she just got confused."

Dolores Huerta plays politics in a rough way. It's what she learned when dealing with plutocrats trying to treat her people like slaves.

Bernie's followers are not going to win a fight with her. The only way to win is to back the fuck off.

[riversedge]

142. Thank you geek. So far--so many Sanders fans seem to be doubling down on the vile.

[Duckhunter935]

264. of course she did not say she was confused

She stated it as outright fact and tweeted said such. Only after the video was played and she was found to be in error did she adjust her initial story to no, no, no. Of course she left the original tweet up when she could have deleted it. She did not and left the lie out there.

[geek tragedy]

265. good luck finding anyone outside the Bernie Bubble who has any interest in your

claims that mean old Dolores Huerta victimized you.

[Duckhunter935]

267. she is not mean

She is a brilliant lady

[brush]

259. Read post 211 on this thread and you might stop spreading this liar story.

[Blue_Tires]

95. No, but nice try

[PeaceNikki]

10. Anyone who uses this to disparage one of the most influential women of our lifetimes is an asshole.

She's an honorable woman who has worked her entire life for civil and worker's rights. She was trying to make sure those who spoke Spanish knew what the fuck was going on.

If you find yourself questioning her integrity or accomplishments look them up.

She's a smart, honorable woman whose opinion I and all of us should respect.

If you start questioning where she "went wrong", wondering how she could ever support HRC, maybe instead you should question your own beliefs. Maybe you should examine what right wing bullshit you're buying into.

Maybe it's you.

[Armstead]

25. Did she have to go on social media and spread falsehoods to characterize ...

Sanders supporters as bullying racists?

[PeaceNikki]

39. She went on social media and related her experience as she heard and felt it.

[Armstead]

55. To make sanders and campaign look bad and score points.

[PeaceNikki]

67. I don't buy into that skepticism. She told of her experience.

She has an honorable history going back decades and earned enough capital of virtuism to be given the benefit of the doubt here. I think it's a dire mistake to tear her to shreds over this.

[Chakab]

199. ...and she might have gotten that from some if she hadn't pulled the exact same shit with Obama

supporters in '08.

She has track record of lying to foment hatred among different factions of the party in order to support Hillary.

Given her track record, this behavior should invite more intense scrutiny rather than less.

[Duckhunter935]

65. did she delete it when she admitted it was not true?

[PeaceNikki]

82. She experienced what she experienced.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/20/dolores-huerta-says-she-was-shouted-down-with-english-only-chants-from-a-sanders-crowd/

[Duckhunter935]

86. and has been shown as being not true

[PeaceNikki]

92. The video doesn't prove that she didn't hear what she says she heard.

http://crooksandliars.com/2016/02/sanders-supporters-shout-down-delores

If anything, it shows how heated and aggressive it got which increases the likelihood someone or some people said some stupid shit.

[thomservo]

12. "attempted destruction''?

Project much?

[geek tragedy]

13. it's a cult of personality that judges all other people by how they relate

to Bernie Sanders.

I finally had to check out.

[bravenak]

40. +1

[Hekate]

44. Geek...

These are rough times. I look forward to better.

[George II]

88. .

[BooScout]

135. ...

[stevenleser]

268. it really is and it is the most toxic campaign by anyone on the American left in history

I really hope Hillary closes him out because I don't think I can support that superfund site of a campaign

[geek tragedy]

270. his name will be put forward at the convention, which is his right as it was Hillary's in 2016.

but this insurgency has outlived its usefulness

[stevenleser]

286. Yep. And this is all so unnecessary. Sanders should have taken his supporters to task long ago.

It wouldn't have taken much. I could have written it in 30 seconds:

"I love how you all support and defend me, but don't attack other people to do so. Refute their arguments, our campaign has the best arguments anyway. Don't turn off people to our campaign"

If he had said that back in May, this wouldn't be like this.

[bravenak]

296. +1

[DesertRat]

343. Well said

It's out of control

[brer cat]

351. very well said!

[stevenleser]

377. You might be right but I like the chances if a real leader of a candidate laid down the law early

and as often as necessary.

[Number23]

300. It really has become toxic. And like you said, if he'd addressed half of this crap back in MAY when

this revolting, counter productive nastiness first reared its ugly head, I think alot of things would be alot different.

[Bradical79]

338. That's complete bullshit

I wish more Hillary supporters on this site would stop being so disgustingly dishonest.

[polly7]

346. +1,000,000. nt.

[stevenleser]

376. Take it up with Bernie. He has acknowledged these issues twice now.

Spend some time in GDP, read the comments on any article where someone in the press criticizes Bernie or has positive things to say about Hillary.

It's so obviously NOT bullshit.

[Starry Messenger]

287. Sorry geek.

You've always been a good egg.

[Number23]

298. Even to the point where people who love to race around DU "reminding" everyone that they are

Hispanic have thrown her overboard because of this idiotic, insignificant slight.

If the day ever comes that I would toss somebody aside who was worked their ass off for my community for years because they said something I didn't like about my long shot presidential candidate, I'd be seriously thinking about where the fuck my head was at. But that's just me.

[geek tragedy]

299. Just wait until they get blown out in South Carolina because of black voters.

Some really awful stuff will be splattered all over DU then, like a burst pimple.

[Number23]

301. Geek, we've been bracing for that for months. We already had some mouth breather come into

the AA forum and tell us lowly Negroes that we "OWE" white progressives to vote for Bernie Sanders because white progressives gave us lowly Negroes Obama.

Never mind that Obama built up one of the most diverse coalitions in American history (if ANYBODY put Obama in the White House, it was black women) and never mind that according to every single measure, his white support dropped the quickest and the steepest during his first term. According to some, Obama wouldn't even exist without white progressives so black folks and presumably every other minority "owes" white progressives and they've come to collect by demanding that we vote for Sanders.

Somebody actually posted this foolishness in the AA forum. And what's sad is that I don't believe for ONE DAMN SECOND that they are even close to the only person who feels that way.

[geek tragedy]

302. Regular poster or MIRT bait troll? nt

[Number23]

303. MIRT nuked him/her five minutes after they posted that garbage

[geek tragedy]

304. hard to say with drive by trolls what their real agenda is

ugly stuff any way you cut it though

[Marr]

355. Uh, Hispanic people are not a homogenous group that thinks in lockstep.

I realize you've got some infantile personal bullying campaign against a certain poster, but do try to leave your racist shit outside while you're doing it.

[Number23]

380. I thought you'd left? Or maybe that was just my wishful thinking

In fact, I hadn't even realized that I hadn't seen you in forever until you just posted this stupid, completely unnecessary response to me. Why you have chosen to come back is one thing, why you have chosen to respond to me and with your typical unadulterated, bullying bullshit that has lead me to ask you probably 3 dozen times to leave me the hell alone is another thing entirely.

You still offer nothing but insults and bullying and still somehow manage to be completely boring. I don't know what "campaign" you think I'm lodging against anyone here and I truly could not give the first shit what or who you are talking about. Stop following me around and worrying about what I'm posting. I've told you this before a hundred times and Skinner has the numerous PM's to back me up.

If my three entire posts on the Huerta situation upset you so much, don't read them. Whoever or whatever you think I'm "campaigning" against could do a hell of alot better than having you as an advocate.

[Marr]

382. I thought the reason for my response would have been obvious to anyone.

I guess I overestimate 'anyone'.

Anyway, just for you, I will repeat. I responded to your post to say 1) Hispanics are not a homogeneous group and 2) I find your relentless, often race-centered bullying of one particular poster here to be utterly repulsive.

By the way, the reason you 'thought I'd left' is because I got tired of your predictable freak-outs every time I responded to one of your posts, so I just sort of stopped responding to you. I didn't realize you missed me. I'll be sure to respond more often.

[Number23]

383. You don't need to respond to me about ANYTHING. And a white person telling a black person

that groups aren't homogenous is about the dumbest thing here. I have not posted about anyone here so your BULLSHIT about my "relentless race based bullying" of somebody is the typical shit that you spew in order to justify your endless fascination with me and my posts. Even after I have REPEATEDLY asked you to leave me the hell alone.

By the way, the reason you 'thought I'd left' is because I got tired of your predictable freak-outs every time I responded to one of your posts, so I just sort of stopped responding to you.

Call them freak outs, melt downs, call them whatever the hell you want. Whatever it takes to get you to LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE. You have obviously been tracking my posts judging by your stupid comment about my "campaign" against somebody else. Whether you pulled that our of your head or behind makes no difference because you have no idea what you are talking about and never do.

But the bottom line is that you don't need to respond to me about anything. ANYTHING at all. I could ask about your fucking neighborhood and you still wouldn't need to respond. I was sick of your crap years ago and that is never going to change. For the last time, LEAVE ME ALONE.

[Marr]

386. Blah, blah, blah.

I honestly didn't read a damn word you wrote. All you do is scream and insult.

Again, you need to knock off the stalking and bullying and racist attacks. If you've learned that, and can prove it to me, perhaps we can be friends.

[Number23]

394. If all I do is scream and insult then why do I have to ask you every damn calendar year to

LEAVE ME THE HELL ALONE?

You got a little playpal down thread. Why don't you make some other friends and stop chasing after people who want nothing to do with you and find YOU, not just your posts, absolutely revolting?

I have posted exactly three times about the Huestra situation. And somehow you have concluded in my three posts that I am conducting some "race based campaign" against somebody as if you are not lying through your teeth or if any of this has anything to do with you. For someone who does nothing but bully and harass people here, especially those of us with melanin, your trying to pretend that I'm conducting some campaign against somebody is the dumbest thing I've seen all day. This isn't merely projection. This is something entirely different altogether.

[Marr]

397. Because I feel like it.

If you don't want me to respond to any of your posts ever again, here's an easy method: don't ever post.

Post on a public forum-- especially if you're posting your particular brand of bullying bullshit, and I'll respond anytime I god damned feel like it.

Cope.

[Number23]

398. I'm making sure that I copy this shit down

Marr
397. Because I feel like it.
View profile
If you don't want me to respond to any of your posts ever again, here's an easy method: don't ever post.

Post on a public forum-- especially if you're posting your particular brand of bullying bullshit, and I'll respond anytime I god damned feel like it.

Cope.

You have deep and profound issues. I have seldom seen someone stupid enough to come out and OPENLY admit that they are trying to shut someone up. Thanks for putting it out there. That is probably the first honest thing you've ever posted on this entire web site.

[Marr]

400. Yes, yes, I've heard that from you before, directed towards at least five different people.

The accusations of mental issues, the bizarre claims of being bullied in the middle of your own desperate attempts to bully and harass others... it's old hat now. Type it again if you find it therapeutic, but don't think for a second I take it, or you, seriously.

[Number23]

403. Five people out of the thousands that post here and you think that *I* am the one with the problem??

And the vast majority of those five only had to be asked ONCE. But then, they are probably healthy and well. I know you're feeling beleaguered because the crew that usually harasses the minority posters here have all been tombstoned or are on time out so I guess you're just trying to pick up the slack.

You are pulling this "bullying somebody" crap squarely out of your ass. Where is this coming from? Who the hell am I "bullying?" What is wrong with you??? This is what you do every few months in order to justify your unending and now OPENLY ADMITTED campaign to run me off of DU. I'd be flattered by the attention if it came from someone I found interesting or at least even the tiniest bit decent and well.

[polly7]

385. Heh .....

[Marr]

387. Hey, hope you're doing well.

[polly7]

389. Very well, thank you!

I hope you are also! The birds are singing and the sun is smiling down ..... couldn't be better.

[Marr]

391. I am good, thanks. :D

Feeling much better. I recently took some time off from the internet, as a mutual friend so recently noted, because my little brother was killed by a rampage shooter. No reason whatsoever. Totally crazy, out of nowhere thing.

[polly7]

392. Omg Marr ........ how horrible. I am so, so sorry.

Unimaginable loss .... strength and love to you.

[Marr]

393. Thank you. It's much appreciated.

[brer cat]

352. Absolutely!

You would have to sell your soul to stay.

[Marr]

353. Talk about projection. HRC supporters right here in this thread are saying

that they're siding with Huerta not because they think she told the truth, but because they don't like Sanders.

[Matariki]

14. Oh Bullshit - we will NOT allow our candidate to be smeared by falsehoods.

Nice try though. You keep using people as a cudgel - for all you claim to respect them.

[Broward]

15. Of course, past deeds give some people a license to lie.

Makes perfect sense.

[Armstead]

17. I wish I could type my honest response to your post

Suffice it to say it would not be a compliment.

[Hekate]

173. Be my guest. Someone else sure did.

[Armstead]

262. I'd rather not risk a hide

But for some reason the word reprehensible comes to mind.

[madfloridian]

18. Oh thank you. You so beautifully made my point for me.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511291715

[MelissaB]

36. Amen!

[mak3cats]

46. ^^ +1,000!!! ^^

What disgusts and angers me the most is the unfairness of it all.

(And, for the record, I have posted AGAINST attacks on HRC regarding her defense of a rapist years ago. Since she was doing her job, this was also unfair.)

[AtomicKitten]

129. madf ftw

[ornotna]

195. The truth matters not to the people doing this

They are on a mission, duty calls.

[CajunBlazer]

26. If we have no respect for those upon whose shoulders we climbed to get here....

...how can we we possibly make our way forward.

[bravenak]

43. +1

[Warren Stupidity]

368. Standing on the shoulders of giants ...

Issac Newton famously used that phrase to praise Hooke, a person who he actually despised and thought was beneath him. None of you actually give two shits about this woman. She was a useful tool for your relentless attempts to destroy Sanders and to alienate Sanders supporters here. The fact that she was "mistaken" about the alleged incident is irrelevant. You all have moved right on from the original attack to the how dare you impugn the messenger gambit. What vile horseshit. What's the endgame for the camp? The triumphant post primary purge? Good luck.

President Trump. That is where your efforts are leading.

[malletgirl02]

29. So now Bernie Sanders is Chairman Mao?

Redbaiting

[polly7]

396. and it's fucking revolting. nt.

[Starry Messenger]

38. Snopes should fire whoever did the work on their "verification."

They took the bare word of two Bernie supporters over Huerta. I'm sure they were unbiased too. One was a nurse from the union that claimed that HRC caucus goers stole the color red, so I'm sure that was a totally neutral report.

[bravenak]

45. It looked pink anyways

I mix that pink all the time

[Starry Messenger]

59. I agree.

I couldn't believe it when I saw their tweet from national. If my union did something like that, I'd die of shame.

[bravenak]

61. It looked stupid

[mak3cats]

57. Don't forget the actual video, and Huerta herself walking back her accusation... (eom)

[Starry Messenger]

66. Huerta did no such thing, she made the same statement to WaPo.

And let's talk about those videos a lot, lots of people so proud of themselves a roomful of adults thuggishly screamed at an old lady.

[treestar]

74. This walking back claim has been made a lot

with no link on any of the posts making the claim.

[Starry Messenger]

83. That same nurse, Erin Cruz, tweeted that same talking point

a million times on her TL too. The memo must have gone out. I've seen no link either.

[joshcryer]

63. And, Twitter, a paragon of truth that site is.

[Starry Messenger]

71. I'm kind of shocked by that.

Snopes was a gold standard. No more.

[Kentonio]

212. How convenient..

Snopes have an unrivaled reputation because they don't take people's words for things and instead rely on evidence, in this case primarily video. The idea that they've acted any differently this time is pure paranoia.

[Starry Messenger]

223. They did no due diligence.

Erin Cruz and Susan Sarandon are complete Bernie partisans and Sarandon was harassing Huerta so badly earlier in the day that the Caucus Chair yelled at her for breaking the rules. Evidence, my ass.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110752344

[Kentonio]

236. There is video footage of the event for Christs sake!

What she said happened, didn't happen! Watch the tape, it's right there!

What the hell has happened to this party? People are now denying documented evidence in favor of just making up their own version, it's bizarre.

[Starry Messenger]

238. I watched the footage, and I believe Huerta.

Believe what you want to believe. But keep it up. Trashing Huerta only helps my candidate.

[Kentonio]

243. What are you talking about?!

It's not a matter of opinion, or a debate you get to chose a side for, it's video footage of an actual event! What she said did not happen! Are you so wrapped up in the race that you're just writing your own version of reality now?

[Starry Messenger]

247. Speak for yourself.

The video shows a lot of disgusting people shouting at an old lady in rage. I watched the whole thing.

[Kentonio]

251. None of which changes a single thing about the claim in question.

It was not true. It did not happen.

If you want to be mad at their behavior in general then fine, but they did not chant 'English only'.

[Starry Messenger]

253. Bye.

[Bradical79]

339. Clearly you didn't

This is the kind of dishonesty that bothers me about so many active Clinton supporters on this site. Just one blatant lie after another along with a complete refusal to actually discuss any issue in a rational manner. It's worse than talking to Republicans. Can't say I've ever come across anything like it. I suppose I should just save myself the agrivation of reading these and load up my ignore list.

[Starry Messenger]

340. Omfg, the drama.

If seeing octogenarians harassed is the hill you want to die on, be my guest. By all means, put me on ignore. Huge loss for me, I'm sure.

[Bradical79]

345. Oh, quit the bullshit

If you want to keep perpetuating a lie, go right ahead. That's how the drama started in the first place, multiple people lying on this message board to score a political point. I gave Delores Huerta benefit of the doubt considering her age and history, but most of you don't have that excuse. If you actually cared about the issues you wouldn't feel the need to use an octogenarian to spread lies for cheap political points. I don't think people who revel in drama get to whine about others being dramatic. If there were no drama, Clinton supporters would have little to talk about, going by what I've seen of their "contributions". Maybe if most of you were more willing to engage in actual exchange of ideas and discussion, this board would be less ugly. Instead I see red scare tactics, outright fabrications, willful ignorance, and outright direct refusal to engage in discussion.

[Starry Messenger]

347. Whine more.

Keep it up. Everyone just loves this classless approach. Can't wait until Super Tuesday! Keep calling Dolores Huerta a liar--tell all of your friends!

[Bradical79]

348. Lol, sure -nt

[yardwork]

336. I saw the video too, and it fully supports Huerta.

The moderator yelled "English only" and the crowd cheered. THAT is what Huerta is talking about. That happened.

[Kentonio]

350. That is not the same as the crowd 'chanting English only'.

[yardwork]

379. Actually, what happened was worse. The crowd shut down translation.

The crowd made sure that the proceedings were "English only." That is appalling. Talk about disenfranchisement.

[Kentonio]

381. The crowd did not shut down translation

They shut down translation by a Clinton surrogate. Something which is also prohibited in the caucus rules.

[yardwork]

384. Go right on shouting all that - it's losing Sanders the nomination.

This is a big mistake and Sabders' supporters are making it worse and worse.

[Kentonio]

388. We'll see. I just want a little fairness around here.

[treestar]

72. +1

somebody there is using the reputation to advance their agenda - not good and now I'll vet future claims from them. They are not after all the barometer of all truth. That was an advocacy job.

[Starry Messenger]

79. I'll be vetting their claims from now on too.

[okasha]

295. The video was apparently provided by Sarandon

and is therefore tainted. I can't do links on my mobile, But Buzz feed had two politically unaffiliated reporters on the scene, and they corroborate Dolores Huerta's statement .

[Starry Messenger]

308. Wow, they've really gone downhill.

There is no excuse for that kind of sloppy work.

[Duckhunter935]

48. pointing out false and misleading statements

Is not destroying anyone. The said the false and misleading words themselves. They are not gods.

[Koinos]

165. Nor is Sanders a god.

[Duckhunter935]

202. Very true and I disagree

on several things. I like the fact that he has not evolved on almost every issue in the last couple of years and tends to be strait and not lie like "I am looking into it", that is bull and we all knew it at the time.

[Koinos]

284. Actually, I am a firm believer that evolution is a good thing.

In human experience, it is called learning from experience or growth. We change the way we think or behave in the light of experience of new realities. We adapt.

Intelligent human beings evolve and adapt and grow constantly. They understand things better than they did before. Sanders would be the first to say that he has learned a lot during this campaign.

Never changing one's mind is more ossification than wisdom. Sanders changes his mind all the time, in a good sense.

[Duckhunter935]

285. oh, I agree

some evolving can be good. But Hillary has evolved on almost every core belief in the last couple of years since she decided to run for president. I do not trust her to stay with these new found positions.

[Koinos]

289. Growth versus Superficial Change

If you change positions the way you change clothes, then it is not really growth. Growth has to do with character. Genuine evolution is not "skin-deep."

On the other hand, it is hard for me to see into others' hearts; so I prefer to judge as little as possible. Many of Clinton's changes may be quite sincere, for all I know.

In politics, people can be quite sincere about some things and quite insincere about others. That goes for all candidates, without exception.

That's not a bad thing; it's just the way it is for human all-too-human beings.

[matt819]

53. Nonsense

The incidents you refer to involve icons lying. Being an icon doesn't absolve one from lying. Well it does if you're a republican. Guess dems have crossed that line now.

[cascadiance]

157. Ralph Nader was an icon who saved many people's lives through his activism on regulation practices..

... that have helped us get things like customer saving measures like seat belts, etc. over the years.

Does that mean he was immune from criticism when he ran for president for the Greens? Hell no! Probably many here who would like to put up other icons as untouchable for any kind of critique such as Dolores Huerta, John Lewis, etc. when they've supported Clinton would be the first ones in many cases calling Nader evil.

If Nader were to endorse Clinton, then suddenly he would be a hero to them, and if he were to endorse Bernie, then he would be another subject to even more current critique.

I personally regard a lot of these people like Huerta, Lewis, Nader, etc. as heroes for what they've done in their lives. But as others have noted, they are all human beings, and have made mistakes. Sometimes a bit unfairly criticized for their mistakes, but sometimes being protected too much when they should have some degree of criticism too.

Nader I think could have run better as an independent candidate and perhaps run as a one issue candidate to do Instant Runoff Voting, which would allow third parties to better compete for office in the future without being spoilers. But most don't criticize him for that. But I will always be thankful for what he's done to make this country a safer place and the many lives he's saved in doing so.

Huerta and Lewis I have enormous respect for them and their efforts in civil rights, that many benefit from today. But by endorsing a candidate and even with subtlety putting forth comments that can be interpreted as falsely characterizing the other candidate, owe it to us to correct mistakes they may have made if they later feel that they've misspoke. Both Huerta and Lewis have provided later statements to walk back some of their initial statements, which I can respect. I can also respect that as human beings, they might not have been as in command the message of what they provide us on every topic.

Personally, I think we are getting too sidetracked with these discussions on who's wrong and who's not in either the initial statements or who is lying or who is correcting who. I think that is by design by those behind the scenes that want us distracted from the real issues of this election, that if we spent more time on, we'd have a lot more unity on, and would demand more from our candidates to address them, and help us decide to put in power the right person that has the best answers in addressing them.

Let's not lose track of getting the best person in charge who will fix these problems. I personally feel Bernie is that person, but I'm open to conversations from others who can make a case for a different person too, if it is based on the issues, and not just on personal smears, etc. that try to keep us from looking at those issues as criteria.

[Kentonio]

218. Good post.

[madfloridian]

64. Let me reiterate my appreciation to you for making my point so very well.

Even better than I could.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511291715

[treestar]

68. Bernie thinks economics are more important

so civil rights icons are apparently not sacred! That's Bernie for ya!

[1StrongBlackMan]

174. That's Bernie's fans for you.

I suspect Bernie is feeling a lot like the gop with its teaparty army ... He needs them, even as he may, hate what they do.

[Kentonio]

222. Civil rights icons shouldn't be 'sacred'.

They're human beings with the same human flaws as the rest of us. The drive and courage to achieve amazing things does not mean these people are saints. You can feel incredible gratitude and appreciation for what they achieved without deifying them.

[FrenchieCat]

73. Time will tell what price will be to pay

for those calling John Louis, Dolores Huerta and other Icons vile names throughout the Internet,
for the sake of some old White guy calling for Revolution, considering that it is they, the Icons
who led successful movements that paved the way for millions who have been
oppressed.

We shall see if Sanders' revolution yields oppressed minorities similar benefits beyond reproach
via history.

Till then, Sanders' folks should continue to do as they wish, and if that be calling legendary progressive Icons
liars, paid stooges, etc., etc., etc..., then so be it, and sooner than later, we shall see if disrespecting those
who clearly paved the way was worth it.

[Hekate]

152. In the end, I think the price will be very high. It's as if the Long March did not exist...

... because Millenials were not there to witness it and experience it themselves.

Thanks, Frenchie.

[BlueMTexpat]

198. This ...

so true.

[DefenseLawyer]

87. I'm sorry, but being an "icon" doesn't give you a free pass for the rest of your life.

If you're going to play bare knuckle politics, you may get punched. Buy the ticket, take the ride.

[CajunBlazer]

108. Sure our icons get punched all the time,...

now figuratively, but in the past literally; I'm sure they are quite used to it. But usually it was racist rednecks and Republicans doing the punching, not people who are supposed to be their allies.

[DefenseLawyer]

125. I am not a redneck, I am not a racist and I am not a Republican

John Lewis knew exactly what he was doing when he made his statement. He had every right to say it. But call it what it was- a cheap shot. Bare knuckle politics. And there's nothing wrong with that. That's how the game is played, and he chose to suit up. More power to him. I never called him names. I never questioned his legacy. But I can called out ugly politics when I see it. If you don't approve, trust me when I tell you I do not care. I'll be damned if I have to give him a pass on his stunt because he's an "icon".

[CajunBlazer]

279. It was probably a true statement.

While John Lewis was one of the leaders of the civil rights movement, as best I can tell Bernie was a foot solder. (Every movement needs foot solders to succeed.) It is quite possible that Lewis never met Bernie or he doesn't remember him. I took Lewis remarks to mean that Sanders certainly wasn't in a leadership role. Had I been part of the movement, I don't think that the leaders would remember me either.

Further more I think that Lewis was not happy that Bernie Sanders was (in Lewis' mind) trying to claim that he was on par with Hillary in his support of the black community and Lewis obviously didn't think that was true. So he teed off on Sanders in the interview. Hey, as you said, that's politics. And he got is point across very clearly.

[Blue_Tires]

91. Well, it was certainly eye opening to see

The Dudebros smear Lewis relentlessly, among others (and a special FUCK YOU to Lee Fang and the rest of Greenwald's pigheaded junta)...

I've been racking my brain to learn what they think they'll accomplish with this, and I still can't figure it out.

[1StrongBlackMan]

179. To bern down the entire system ...

so the socialist/libertarian system can rise from its ashes! Taht's what they are attempting to accomplish.

[Hekate]

370. That's my take-away from his supporters here. ...

And gods help anyone who stands in the way or begs to differ.

[nadinbrzezinski]

93. And this folks is classic red baiting

[Hekate]

154. You think so? I think not.

[nadinbrzezinski]

156. Yup I do

All the way to the not so veiled reference to Chairman Mao

Classic.

[malletgirl02]

163. Yes, it was a reference to Chair Mao.

Also I don't think it was veiled it was a clear reference. I think the OP thinks we are all stupid, she thought the reference would go over our heads.

[nadinbrzezinski]

164. I know, I wanted to be nice

and of course the red guards.

[Hekate]

96. Which Side Are You On?

[Beowulf]

167. Oh, that's just rich!

You claiming Pete Seeger would support Hillary? I can't say he'd support Bernie, because he'd probably want someone much further left.

Huerta and Lewis have been heroes of mine for 45 + years. I was pained by their actions the past weeks. But I don't blame them. I blame the Clintons for exploiting their legacies to advance an agenda that serves the 1%. So our attention is turned on each other rather than the elite who have long been stealing from the 99%. We are all suckers in this game.

[Hekate]

180. That was for Dolores Huerta, specifically. Here's a Campesino song for her...

(I'd appreciate anyone who finds the music being played.)

https://libraries.ucsd.edu/farmworkermovement/category/commentary/francisco-garcia-farm-worker-troubadour/

Song #1: Ballad of the National Lettuce Boycott/Corrido del Boicoteo de Lechuga

In this song written by Francisco Garcia, he recounts the story of the 1970 lettuce strike in Salinas, California where the growers have had a history of exploiting and humiliating workers and of buying-off politicians who pass laws that favor the rich.

Voy a recorder a todos
Todo lo que ha sucedido,
Estado de California.
En los Estados Unidos,
Los ricos compran la ley,
A contra del campesino.

I’m going to remind everyone
Everything that happened
In the state of California
In the United States of America
The rich buy the law
Aimed against farm workers

En el Valle de Salinas,
Donde al pobre han explotado,
Dicen que son millonarios
Y al pueblo han humillado
Con el dinero del pobre
Hasta el gobierno han comprado

In the Salinas Valley
Where the poor has been exploited
It is said it is the millionaires
Who have degraded the farm workers.
With money rightfully belonging to the poor
They have even bought the powers-that-be

Viva la unión campesina
Viva la revolución
El boicoteo nacional
En todita la nación

Long-live the farm worker’s union
Long-live the revolution
The national boycott
Throughout the entire land.

Cesar Chavez es el lider
De la gente pobre humilde,
Desde que llego a Salinas
Los ricos parecen viles.
Por eso nuestra gente unida
Que ahora trabaja en los files.

Cesar Chavez is the leader
Of the poor and humble people
Since he arrived in Salinas
The rich act despicably
That is why our people are united
Who now organize in the fields.

Cesar Chavez es el lider
Todo mundo lo ha notado
Que ha luchado por el pueblo
Que el rico siempre ha explotado
Prefiero ser prisionero
Que ver el pueblo humillado.

Cesar Chavez is the leader
Everybody recognizes
Who has fought for farm workers
Whom the rich always have exploited.
I prefer to be a prisoner
Than to see the farm worker humiliated.

Viva la unión campesina
Viva la revolución
El boicoteo nacional
En todita la nación

Long-live the farm worker’s union
Long-live the revolution
The national boycott
Throughout the entire land

Nuestra cause no es injusta
Todo mundo ha respetado
Lideres de todo el mundo
Nuestra causa han apoyado
A boicotear los productos
De los ricos desalmados

Our cause is not unjust
Everybody respects it
Leaders throughout the world
Have endorsed our cause
To boycott the produce
Of the heartless rich growers

Viva la unión campesina
Viva la revolución
El boicoteo nacional
En todita la nación

Long-live the farm worker’s union
Long-live the revolution
The national boycott
Throughout the entire land

[Beowulf]

208. OK

Of course. And appropriate. I heard Pete perform in 1970 and later got to talk with him, leaning on his Volkswagen Beetle.

I really do believe we are all being distracted by the political and economic elite to turn on each other so we don't cast our vision on what they are doing. The study published two years ago by two Princeton political scientists argued that in terms of government responsiveness, unless you were a billionaire or a large corporation, the chances of having political leaders address your problems is pretty much nil. They stated that the elite allow regular elections, allow most but certainly not all to vote, and provide a degree of freedom of speech and assembly. But not much else. I'm beginning to think our inspiration ought to come from the young John Lewis, the young Dolores Huerta, even the young Bernie Sanders, crossing the Edmund Pettus Bridges of today, striking against the bosses who exploit our labor, deny us health care and a living wage, and block us from affordable, decent housing.

Oh, and anyone who likes Terry Pratchett is ok by me.

Namaste

[frylock]

98. cough*bullshit*cough

[DemocratSinceBirth]

100. Moral certainty can be a good or bad thing...

It all depends on who is harboring it.

[Autumn]

106. Here's the thing. One may be an icon but when one decides to campaign for a politician

and one misspeaks, lie or whatever little sterilized word you want to use, they and you can damn well fucking expect to get called out on it if one fucks up.

[malletgirl02]

114. Agreed no one is above criticism

I agree no one no matter how big is above criticism, I actually find in scary that some people think there are people above criticism, it is a very authoritarian mindset.

[Cheese Sandwich]

118. omg :O

[farleftlib]

120. *snort*

[MohRokTah]

122. BRILLIANT ANALOGY!

Spot on given the leanings of Sanders and his ego.

And very softly presented, considering how the Republicans will be defining him.

[Spazito]

124. The heroes of the 'revolution' are now....

Susan Sarandon and Killer Mike, whose scars from fighting for civil rights and the rights of workers will be marked in history....or not.

[SidDithers]

128. DU rec. The bile directed toward Dolores Huerta has been awful...

And all the accusations that she's lying are just plain wrong.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/02/20/dolores-huerta-says-she-was-shouted-down-with-english-only-chants-from-a-sanders-crowd/

The Washington Post's Abby Phillip caught up with Huerta to find out what happened next.

"The person who was running the caucus ... people were saying we need a translator, so he said the first person that comes to the stage can be the translator," Huerta said. "So I went up to the front to be the translator."

The video above shows that her appearance onstage wasn't so well received. Some Sanders supporters may have been disturbed by the idea of a Clinton supporter interpreting events for the entire crowd. But that doesn't explain everything Huerta said she heard from the crowd.

"It was mostly the organizers," Huerta continued. "The Bernie organizers were shouting, 'No, no, no.' Then a Bernie person stood up and said said, 'No, we need to have it, I can also do translation' or whatever. The person who ran the caucus said, 'Well, we won’t have a translator.' The sad thing about this is that some of the organizers were shouting, 'English only! English only!' The Bernie organizers."

Again, this is what Huerta says happened when she tried to interpret from English to Spanish at a Nevada caucus site. The crowd apparently included a large number of Bernie Sanders supporters. And given that much of the Las Vegas strip's workforce is made up of Latino Americans and Latino immigrants, one would expect that some people in the crowd might have wanted to hear Huerta.

Instead, Huerta and actress America Ferrera, an on-the-record Hillary Clinton supporter, both tweeted that Huerta was shouted down with chants of, "English only!"

It sounds like Huerta heard exactly what she said she heard. She's pretty damn clear on that.

Sid

[MADem]

130. And the irony isn't lost, given the big picture, either, is it? nt

[Hekate]

139. Drama? I clutch at my pearls and seek my fainting couch!

Where's my fainting couch smilie when I need it???

I've been here a looooooong time, and generally do not seek drama. But thanks for your input nonetheless.

[MADem]

144. Are you serious? You're first, insulting a DUer with the "drama" charge, and secondly, you're

Last edited Sun Feb 21, 2016, 08:37 PM - Edit history (1)

rather obtusely calling attention to YOURSELF as a

--self-appointed CENSOR;

--Net nanny

--Name caller.

And to wrap it all up, you give orders to the "folks" like you're some kind of field marshall!!! LOL!!!

"Eyes on the Prize" was and is an invocation that brings to mind the struggle for justice for racial minorities. It is rather ironic--and not in a GOOD way--that you drag that term out to put down a poster trying to discuss the treatment of Dolores Huerta at the NV caucuses.

I'd say you sure DO have work to do. Maybe you should start by taking your lead from your leader, and not act like a bully.

And--on edit--since "someone" alerted on this post--you might want to stop telling people what to do by cutting and pasting your exhortations to more than one thread--sooner or later, someone (like me) will notice: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1301171

[JustAnotherGen]

168. You were alerted on for this

No jury results yet.

[ablamj]

169. I voted

To leave it. Don't have results yet though.

[MADem]

203. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. nt

[MADem]

200. The alert should have been on the individual spamming the board with the same post.

This is a cut-and-paste attempt at censorship.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1301171

Here's the SAME post in a completely different thread, telling the "folks" to not participate.

Trying to censor people on a discussion board is a lame thing to do.

[JustAnotherGen]

216. I'm just glad it stayed

[Bobbie Jo]

189. Well said. nt

[Bluenorthwest]

138. Nothing gets to be both sacred and political, not your religion and not your heroes.

No person has a pass issued allowing them to dissemble without contest. The minute anyone steps into the campaign arena they are just another voter, not someone with royal powers of iconic status. It's not fair to play rough politics then say 'but you must not answer back for I an an icon wrapped in images of the poor and needy'. That's exploitation. A misuse of the role you have been trusted with.

[JonLeibowitz]

146. This is hilarious.

[zappaman]

148. Kick and Rec.

[PatrickforO]

155. Oh, gee. That's a little far! They are being called on the carpet for fibbing. Leave it at that.

You know, back in the old days of the Roman Empire, when the Emperor would come into Rome in his chariot he would always have someone beside him saying, "Thou art mortal. Thou art mortal."

The moral of this story is that our civil rights people, our president, the politicians and others we love and know as 'icons' are also human. Thus they are not and should never be above legitimate criticism.

Honestly, wouldn't you rather have that than a bunch of 'yes' people? Kim Jong Il has those. We don't want that here.

[Hekate]

170. Responding to every post with the words "she lied" isn't quite that, is it?

Just look through the OPs in GDP and see all the threads about Dolores Huerta, age 85.

[MADem]

159. Look--someone took a cheap shot at you...in a protected group, no less!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1280123072

They're even misrepresenting your objections!

Now, I've seen it all.

[Hekate]

166. No sense of history or proportion. When I refer to the Long March in context of US Civil Rights....

...how is this "classic Red-baiting"?

I'd laugh if it wasn't so effing sad to have these wars at DU.

[MADem]

207. Most people with a good or even fair grasp of world history got it.

The ones that didn't, well--says more about them, really, doesn't it?

[malletgirl02]

273. Grasp of history

Just because I disagree with your conclusion does make by grasp of history weak.

[malletgirl02]

272. I admit that is my post

Actually I responded to your post before I posted that one. I did not misrepresent you, you compared Bernie Sander supporters to the Red Guard, that is red baiting.

[malletgirl02]

271. How is that a cheap shot?

I admit I posted that thread. Actually before I posted that thread I actually responded to this one. The OP of this thread compared Bernie Sander's supporters to the Red Guard how can you say I misrepresented that?

[tabasco]

160. Jesus Fucking Christ.

Now I've heard it all.

[monicaangela]

162. I'm just happy

the "icons" after realizing just how awful it was, the misspeaking and whatever caused the rigmarole were at least willing to walk back their statements. Good on them for that. Maybe they will think twice before speaking in the future.

[Hekate]

182. "Maybe they will think twice before speaking in the future." That sounds like an injunction...

...to be silent while their betters speak.

I'm sure you couldn't possibly have meant it that way.

[monicaangela]

192. Don't you think you're getting a bit

carried away with assumption. I believe we all think twice the next time if we find we have spoken too soon or without thinking something through before we make a comment. At least I do, and I would hope any thinking human being would do the same.

[litlbilly]

172. you sound like a drama queen with that headline

[Hekate]

184. I already addressed that issue. However, I would hope I sound like someone who studied History.

History can be pretty dramatic.

[Kentonio]

228. You don't sound like you studied history very well

If this ridiculous nonsense was what you came away with.

[A Little Weird]

175. Regarding your note to the Jury

Red-baiting doesn't belong on DU at all. You should be ashamed.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution

[Hekate]

181. See my post #166

166. No sense of history or proportion. When I refer to the Long March in context of US Civil Rights....

...how is this "classic Red-baiting"?

I'd laugh if it wasn't so effing sad to have these wars at DU.

[A Little Weird]

187. Cultural Revolution

We see what you're doing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution

It's especially sad to me because you were a poster I respected and admired.

[nadinbrzezinski]

359. The list of people I no longer respect is growing

It is a direct relationship with who they support

[mariawr]

176. Apparently even revered icons have their price. I used to be young once too.

I totally understand what Clyburn meant. He knew Sanders is a better candidate, but hey, so much for youthful idealism. Money talks, etcetera walks. Go Hillary.

And revered icons are a great get, because they are well thought of. Still won't help her high negatives and drags them with her.

[Ed Suspicious]

178. Boo hoo. Bernistas are making the coronation so messy!

[BlueCaliDem]

183. Wow.

Beautiful and passionate poetry!

You can write, Hekate!



to you!

[noamnety]

185. This cuts to the core of one of our problems in education.

I've seen it referred to as the Disneyfication of history - where everyone is reduced to a caricature of a hero or villain, instead of individuals who are capable of both heroic deeds and personal faults.

We teach history this way in our schools, so it's not a surprise that people expect it to work this way in real life, I suppose.

Having done great heroic things is not be a free pass for all future actions. And having fucked up on something and being held accountable for it does not negate all past accomplishments and turn someone into a villain.

[Chakab]

201. Excellent post.

[californiabernin]

257. Yes, absolutely. Heroes are human, too. nt

[Chakab]

186. Dear God, you people are pathetic.

Just when I thought that this couldn't get anymore absurd.

Keep this dishonest shit up, and you're going to drive the left wing right of the party.

[Warren DeMontague]

188. Oh, the drama.

Really, it brings to mind nothing so much as the collapse of the galactic republic, or loki's theft of thor's hammer.

Why, I dont think Ive seen such an apt use of metaphor since PETA drew an equivalence between thanksgiving turkeys and Nazi concentration camp victims.

[merrily]

190. Just no end to the bullshit accusations, is there?

[shawn703]

194. So are W.E.B. Du Bois and Nelson Mandela also above criticism?

Both were great men and civil right leaders. Both also did things which are deserving of criticism, much like Lewis and Huerta.

[SunSeeker]

196. K & R

[sheshe2]

206. K&R

Thanks Hekate.

[LittleBlue]

215. Right

[TexasTowelie]

226. K&R

[mhatrw]

242. LOL. Except the Old world has ALL the power, ALL the money, ALL of corporate media, and

ALL the police and military might behind them.

And they still are resorting to dirty tricks against progressive activists who are asking only to slightly ameliorate our current historic level of wealth inequality and to break the complete stranglehold of oligarchy that is our current corrupt political system.

[DefenseLawyer]

244. So what you're saying is that if we go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao

We ain't gonna make it with anyone any how? How insightful.

[californiabernin]

254. They both misspoke. Nobody is trying to destroy them.

Yes, they are both heroes, and human.

[Karmadillo]

260. Too long within the Clinton Reality Distortion Field

A faithful brain fed with spin and empty promises
The People become the enemy
Lies become the path to Truth
Running dog lackeys of the socialist roader everywhere
Speed up the car, darling, run them down.

[geek tragedy]

266. indeed.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x3707609

[McCamy Taylor]

263. Interesting point. When does "progress" actually become reactionary?

[alcibiades_mystery]

269. I see a lot of comments and analysis that are terrifying

The sincere and fervent belief that your opponents are EVIL is a very dangerous politics. It's coming from one side these primaries. And when you note it, they say "Well it's the TRUTH."

Puts a chill down my spine.

[hobbit709]

275. you wouldn't recognize a CULTURAL REVOLUTION if it bit you.

What a stupid analogy.

[blackspade]

278. Cultural Revolution?! Seriously?

What utter horseshit.

Two US civil rights icons made some ill thought out partisan attacks on the challenger to the candidate they support.
That's it.
What they said doesn't invalidate all that they have done for civil rights.
By the same token, critics who are pointing out the partisan attacks are not invalidating all they have done either.

[ScreamingMeemie]

280. One more time... I DON'T CARE IF YOU FIND A CURE FOR AIDS...

IF YOU LIE TO ME, I'M GOING TO CALL YOU ON IT. The two are separate, and to try to tie them together says more about the person trying to tie them together than it will about the people who have the guts to call it out. Enough already people.

[Dems to Win]

281. Elderly icons trying to kill the hopes and dreams of young activists. Astonishing and sad.

It's insane that the Democratic leadership believes this is the path to victory in the fall.

[polly7]

344. It is sad. And shows those people they're trying to kill the hopes and dreams of

are being USED here to score ugly political points.

Sad OP.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

282. "the white hairs of age garner no respect,"

That explains the attacks on Bernie from Hillary supporters.

Do you think he should dye his like she does?

[Half-Century Man]

283. Are you implying that having a specfic selection of their words questioned

taint the entire history of negate their deeds?
How fragile do you think these people are?

In both cases the speakers corrected or offered deeper details to clarify themselves. In both cases angry words from here did nothing to the psyches of either person. The only ones butt hurt, are the people who thrive here on the anger.

Hyperbole is how DU exhales.

[Cha]

288. Here's to John Lewis and Delores Huerta who will forever be in our Hearts!

Gracias, Hekate

[Fearless]

290. They did it themselves.

[dimple]

293. The Gang of Four were the leaders of the Cultural Revolution

which is why that period ends in 1976. Because they got arrested as soon as Mao died.

[That Guy 888]

297. Kick and Recommended - for the hyperbole lulz n/t

[melman]

316. Fake phony outrage

Just another thing for the trolls to latch onto. They think they are clever but they're not.

[Hekate]

378. Socio-psychological observations, actually. But thanks for the kick to the thread.

[Beacool]

325. They can attack anyone they want, it still won't make a bit of difference.

I see it as nothing more than the lashing out of people who know, in their heart of hearts, that their candidate will not be the nominee.

[cali]

327. Drifting people is a sickness that runs deep in humans.

[malletgirl02]

333. I will remember this if Hillary Clinton the primary

How you compared Bernie Sanders supporters to members of the Red Guard during the Cultural Revolution, and how you and another Clinton supporter said I was cowardly and that I misrepresented your post when I was right about it. You do your candidate no favors.

[polly7]

354. That's who they are.

No matter what happens, just be glad you're not like that, imo.

[yardwork]

334. It's sickening.

[Bucky]

337. What icons? Cesar Chavez? Rosa Parks? Which icons are you vaguing about?

[NastyRiffraff]

349. And another K&R

Thanks Hekate, for speaking the truth. Today, Dolores Huerta, yesterday, John Lewis, tomorrow...?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

356. When ritual arises the Tao is absent. Lao Tzu

Memento mori. (Remember, you are mortal).

[The Second Stone]

357. The candidate who just joined the party has the right thinking

and the establishment people who were with us for more than a half-century have betrayed these new principles. All the liars are lying liars and must be reeducated and removed from their positions of respect to be newly humbled. This is socialism, which has finally joined the Democratic Party. All who do not have the new expertise will be purged.

[Orsino]

363. Civil rights icons that back the Establishment are gonna get called out.

Attempts to quash that debate, however, do recall the Cultural Revolution.

[AtomicKitten]

395. You're confused. The two ICONS lied in an attempted destruction of Bernie's candidacy.

Proof you say? They both walked it back.

[Hekate]

405. Actually, they did not.

Your wrath is duly noted.

[AtomicKitten]

408. Yes, I'm a stickler for the truth.

John Lewis Walks Back Criticism Of Bernie Sanders' Civil Rights Record
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/john-lewis-berne-sanders-soften

WASHINGTON (AP) — Civil rights leader John Lewis is softening his dismissal of Bernie Sanders' work in the 1960s on behalf of racial equality. Lewis — who's endorsed Hillary Clinton over Sanders in the Democratic presidential race — said this on Thursday about Sanders' role in the movement: "I never saw him. I never met him."

Now, Lewis says that "in the interest of unity," he's clarifying his remarks. Lewis says "the fact that I did not meet him in the movement does not mean that I doubted" Sanders' involvement. Lewis says he wasn't trying to "disparage his activism."

Sanders says on his campaign website that he has a "long history of fighting for social equality and the rights of black Americans — a record that goes back to the early 1960s."

So, in The Think Progress interview, Huerta kinda, sorta walks back by not mentioning the chanting.
She uses the same condescending tone that Lewis used in slandering Sanders. She says she didn’t see him so he did nothing.
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2016/02/20/3751830/dolores-huerta-interview/

Dolores Huerta did the same thing to Obama in 2008
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/2/21/1488535/-Dolores-Huerta-did-the-same-thing-to-Obama-in-2008

Democracy Now: This is what she does. She has a pattern of lying to promote Hillary. She did the same to Obama in 2008. She actually questioned his judgment in reference to being against the war in 2002.

FEDERICO PENA: And lastly, in terms of foreign policy, I want a president who will look to the world from the future and not the perspective of the past. Barack Obama’s early years, the way he was raised, his whole personal experience gives him good judgment about the world, and that’s why, unlike Hillary Clinton, he opposed the war in 2002. He has been steadfast about that. And I think it’s that kind of good judgment that the American people want, and I certainly want, in the next president.

DOLORES HUERTA: Well, I don’t know about his judgment. I just want to mention one thing in particular.

AMY GOODMAN: Dolores Huerta.

DOLORES HUERTA: Yeah. There was a big issue, if you will recall, where we had a woman who — in Chicago, Elvira Arellano, who refused to be deported, and she was undocumented. She was in sanctuary for twelve months, for an entire year, right there in Chicago, where Obama lives. The people who did that campaign, these were the same ones that organized the big marches in Chicago, went to see Obama to get some support for Elvira Arellano. He not only refused to help them, but he didn’t even bother to go see Elvira. I went from California four times to be there with her. We had a large delegation from Mexico from all the political parties that went to see Elvira. Five ambassadors, they all flew to Washington, D.C. to plead on her behalf. Obama never, never lifted a finger to help her, as he never did when we had two Latinos that had been unjustly incarcerated for a murder that they did not commit. Again, a big campaign to free these two young men from prison. They were ultimately freed. But when they went to see Senator Obama, he refused to help them.

I have been a civil rights activist like this all of my life, and I have been to Chicago many times for many different campaigns that the community there —- the Latino community was there. I have, to this day, to meet Mr. Obama. I have never encountered him in any of these big campaigns that we have done in Chicago on different issues. And, as I say, I have never yet to meet the man. And so, I don’t know about his -—

There seems to be a pattern here.

FEDERICO PENA: First of all, I didn’t know that this morning’s call was going to give an opportunity for each of us to criticize the other candidate. I am happy to do the same thing as respect to Hillary Clinton, but let me interrupt and correct the misimpression that my good friend Dolores just left. I’ve spoken to the senator about this case and his staff. His staff met with this woman twice. The reason she got special exemption years ago with Senator Durbin’s help was because she had a special medical condition. That special medical condition went away. She was no longer subject to a unique law that had to be passed specifically on her behalf, and that’s why it wasn’t done. So it’s clearly not the case.

But let me get back to this issue of who has been most involved in the Hispanic community. Now, Dolores just said that she’s been to Chicago a number of times — by the way, Dolores, I go to Chicago a lot myself — and that she’s never seen Barack in the community. Well, Barack Obama was the only person who participated in the massive marches by immigrants who were protesting the inappropriate immigration laws being considered in Congress. Hillary Clinton did not. It was Barack Obama who has been strongly supporting immigration reform in the Congress, introducing amendments with Senator Menendez, Congressman Gutierrez. And it was Barack Obama who said that he supports states having drivers’ licenses for undocumented citizens, whereas Hillary — and you saw her during the debate — at first she said she was for it, then she’s against it. And now she’s definitely against it.

[dchill]

401. So, like Hillary, they're untouchable...

regardless of how craven they've become? Thought so.

[stupidicus]

402. your support for their dishonesty while amusing

is really little more than a self-indictment we're all accustomed to outta HC supporters

thanks

[Hekate]

406. Huerta, Lewis, and Clyburn are not dishonest and they did not lie.

Sorry if that aggravates you.

[rurallib]

404. talk about a way over the top OP

two cultural icons put their accumulated integrity on the line and lied for what they thought was a good.
What I hope they learned is that the ends do no justify the means.

And with an over the top OP like that I hope you learn that also.

Try to persuade people with legitimate arguments from your candidates speeches and voting record and deeds.

When the Hillary campaign trots out Bill and Chelsea and Dolores Huerta to spread crap, the Hillary campaign loses so much good will

[Hekate]

407. They didn't lie. Lotta people got their knickers in a twist, but they did not lie.

Sorry about that.

[nsd]

410. So, liberalism has been reduced to a cult of personality?

Attain the status of "icon" and it doesn't matter any longer whether you're being fair or whether what you're saying is true?

[Hekate]

412. So, "liberals" have joined the GOP in having no sense of history before their own lifetimes?

No sense that they are standing on the shoulders of giants? No sense of what the living representatives of previous generations have donefor them?

Maybe I should have used the word "heroes" rather than "icons," but on the whole I think the result would have been the same in this time and this place.

Congressman John Lewis had his skull bashed in crossing the Pettus Bridge. Tiny Dolores Huerta had her spleen ruptured and her ribs stove in by cops' batons for leading a protest outside a hotel where Vice President GHW Bush was holding a fancy fundraiser.

These people are WARRIORS. They are warriors for you and me and generations to come. They are not plaster saints. They have spent their entire lives doing the work they do. They do not lie, they do not take bribes or payoffs, and they are VERY clear about why they are supporting Hillary Clinton for president.