Blacks And Browns Being Led Into Committing Political Hara-kiri - MWCNews

[WillyT]

Last edited Mon Feb 22, 2016, 10:32 PM - Edit history (1)

Blacks and Browns Being Led into Committing Political Hara-kiri
By Ben Tanosborn - MWCNews
Monday, 22 February 2016 11:35

Bernie Sanders’ call for a political revolution will not come to pass if blacks and browns fail to join in the battle. Nevada just gave us a likely scenario of future primary results in elections to come. That is... unless leaders in B&B communities, churches and other organizations rethink their committed personal loyalties in order to attain any and all defined common goals of their followers.

Hillary Clinton just managed to pull a close victory in Nevada’s caucuses with her steady and balanced tripod of “in-the-bag” voters: blacks, browns and Local 226 of UNITE HERE. Given the economic realities in a Nevada still struggling after deep recession – a bona fide depression for those in lower economic strata, Bernie’s message, delivered with passion and authenticity, should have translated to a landslide victory for him. But it did not. And almost catching up to a 30, 40 or 50 point deficit of a few months back, no matter the Herculean effort involved, just wasn’t enough. Unfortunately, in grammarian politics a moral victory yielding fewer votes continues to be spelled d-e-f-e-a-t.

It was a close call for Bernie’s dedicated legions, and the senator’s significant inroads in the Latino vote, exceeding 50 percent, almost won the day for “El Viejito,” or The Lovable Old Man, as Sanders came to be affectionately known by Hispanics. But he was denied most of the black vote; and Local 226, although not endorsing either Clinton or Sanders, also gave Clinton the upper hand by default. And what should have been an easy 60-40 state-wide victory tally, similar to that in New Hampshire, ended up as a 47-53 defeat; a sad but explainable 13-point eradication courtesy of the old guard loyal to Hillary’s Democratic Political Machine. But that’s expected quid pro quo in the world of politics.

More than an old fashion ideological revolution, with or without the tentacles of civil disobedience or discord, Bernie’s so-called revolution is but a call to arms, a demand for fast track transformation of a society which for well over a generation seems to have evolved in reverse: economically, negatively affecting 80-plus percent of the population; and socially, denying opportunity and social justice to the weakest amongst us. Not a new thing to Bernie, these economic and human rights advocacies to which he has dedicated most of his adult life; it’s just that his messianic hourglass took over half century to empty, the last grains of sand being his exhausted patience, the time for this transforming revolution to start.

And...

And, whether Hillary wins or loses the election, the folks at Goldman Sachs et al need not ring any alarms on Wall Street. But, of course, that entails the Democratic crowning of Hillary as the nominee.

Never mind the primaries in Iowa, New Hampshire and Nevada! As of February 22, Hillary Clinton has an unmerited running start with 431 party superdelegates (vs. 16 for Bernie) of a 712 total, who have declared for her – and which include 10 distinguished party leaders, 13 governors, 39 senators, 159 representatives and 210 DNC members. An undemocratic but legal way of stacking the deck against the gentleman from Vermont!

But the political machine doesn’t just stop there; much of the tenured leadership in the Democratic Party, particularly that which represents the strong black and brown “components” of the party’s membership, appears beholden to favoritism which often leads to bad decisions… which in this presidential election represents a truly revolutionary and transformational change

One gets the feeling, however, that the best interests of both blacks and browns would not be served as well under a Clinton presidency, as they would be with Sanders in charge. And that much of the leadership in minority communities might be unintendingly promoting a continuance of the undesirable status quo… which for all effects and purposes would be committing political hara-kiri.

Keep the faith, Honest Bernie… on to South Carolina and beyond!

Link: http://mwcnews.net/focus/editorial/57413-political-hara-kiri.html



OnEdit: More from the author: http://www.tanosborn.com/articulos

[bravenak]

1. This is shameful

[bravenak]

12. And there you are. The plain and honest truth

I feel uncomfortable

[CorporatistNation]

79. You Should!

!

[DemocratSinceBirth]

128. Not as much as you.

[rbrnmw]

134. you should feel uncomfortable

even talking to her that way

[one_voice]

139. Why?

The OP tells her how to think, you tell her how to feel. WTH?

[Recursion]

243. Who the fuck are you to tell bravenak she should feel uncomfortable?

"Sit down, shut up, don't ask questions, and wait for the Great White Liberal Old Man to bring about the rising tide that will lift all boats, even your benighted rafts!"

Americans of color have heard that since the 1600s. It's not their fault if they're skeptical at this point.

[AgingAmerican]

253. He isn't 'white'

He is Jewish

[Recursion]

259. The "whiteness" of Jewish people, Italians, and the Irish is a fascinating question

However, as Jon Stewart pointed out, when two people named "O'Reilly" and "Goldberg" publicly lament the death of "white America", that line has clearly been crossed.

Now, even more interesting: Hispanic persons can be of any race, and in the US most are "white".

[AgingAmerican]

260. He is still Jewish

[Recursion]

266. Like Hispanic people, Jewish people can be of any race

Both "Hispanic" and "Jewish" are ethnicities, not races.

For that matter I live right near a very, very old Indian Jewish community, which is not visibly different (other than their clothes) from other Maharashtrans.

[AgingAmerican]

280. He is Jewish

Wouldn't surprise me if at least some of the hate directed at him had to do with his 'ethnicity'.

[nadinbrzezinski]

281. I am positive of that

[AgingAmerican]

287. So am I

[Recursion]

282. Oh hell we've seen that on DU itself; no need to speculate

Remember the concern trolling OP about "what do we do when the Republicans call Bernie a 'communist Jew'"?

I have literally zero doubt that some opposition to Sanders is anti-semitic.

[AgingAmerican]

294. Check out this article

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2014/02/19/entrenched-anti-semitic-views-very-rare-among-whites-and-asian-americans-common-among-blacks-and-latinos/

My AA brother in law and his friends rant about Sanders ethnicity, according to my sister in law. I had an eye opening conversation with her on that subject last week.

[yardwork]

337. How do we know? Down thread somebody says the OP is Latino.

[okasha]

396. He is Ashkenazi.

Jews of European descent are generally light-skinned and frequently indistinguishable from other Danes, Brits, Germans or Poles. Bernie Sanders looks pretty much like an Eastern European. White.

[nadinbrzezinski]

263. As a Jew I can tell you

We are really not white. And if things get interesting, Jews who believe that will be reminded of it, with a vengeance.

[vdogg]

380. Honest question

What would you say you are then? Sammy Davis Jr. was black and a Jew, the are many white Jews as well. There are Jews of all shades and ethnicities just like there are Christians of all shades and ethnicities.

[nadinbrzezinski]

381. The UN classifies it as an ethnic minority

But history is filled with examples when we are reminded we are actually a "race." I use it in quotation marks because that is not in any biological sense. But the view that Jews are different and separate is pervasive. We are living in a golden age when American Jews, and many do, can pretend that will not happen again. Myself, I always have a passport and money to get the hell out of dodge. One reason, I am the daughter of a holocaust survivor and that is something we do

By the way, the UN also classifies groups like the Mnong in South East Asia, who are Asian, the same exact way. I learned that from them, they are a small ethnic minority in town.

[sheshe2]

317. Jewish is a religion not a color.

[nadinbrzezinski]

323. Then there is the holocaust

that contradicts that ignorant statement and 2000 years (if not longer) of anti semitism.

[sheshe2]

330. ?????

Yes there was a holocaust.

I am part German. What is your point?

[nadinbrzezinski]

373. Maybe them you should do some reading into what led

To the death of 50 of my relatives.

You might want to start with the Nuremberg laws.

Then you might want to follow that with genetics...and how Jews, due or that anti semitism, have a higher incidence of Tay Sachs and Bracha 1 and 2 gene anomaly (breast cancer)

You might consider it a religion but it is much more. And in the right circumstances American Jews will be reminded of that. In fact in the past they have. There were quotas of a max number of Jews at universities, and just up the road, property deeds prevent the sale to Jews, Blacks (they used the N word), Irish and Mexicans.

I crack me up at times when I read this crap on DU. I am going to be nice and give you the benefit of ignorance

OH and for the rest, Jews are considered part of a cultural distinct group, same exact status as for example the Mnong people from South East Asia. Both, it goes well beyond who or what people pray to.

[AgingAmerican]

400. Judaism is a religion

Jews are an ethnic minority.

[marble falls]

364. It totally gobsmacks me anytime someone else feels comfortable enough to tell a PoC where they're...

going wrong as a PoC. I should make the mistakes that Bravenak makes being true to herself. It'd make me a better person. I am sorry Bravenak ended up the lighting rod for idiots, racists and "well-meaning" bleeding hearts but in the end it only further sets off the truth I see daily coming from her.

[nadinbrzezinski]

392. So what if I told you the author of this piece

whether you agree with it or not, is PoC? Does a PoC have a right to his view, even if you do not agree?

by the way, I have heard the sentiments expressed in that essay in the streets here in san diego, and the term black and blown is locally interchangeable with PoC.

By the way, I do not expect the poster you are talking about to know this.

[merrily]

268. Jury results.

oster should be PPR'd for suggesting that a person of color, one who has actually been stalked and recieved threatening mail at her home because of DU, should feel "uncomfortable" in context here.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Feb 23, 2016, 01:30 AM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: bravenak seems to be holding her own in this thread and hasn't replied to this post.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: A new low in alerting.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given

[Cha]

292. you should

[sheshe2]

315. What!?

[leftofcool]

117. This is just more of the same coming from certain people, hon.

Did you ever think you would see the day when stuff like this would be posted to a Democratic Forum?

[bravenak]

123. I am almost completely unable to type words in

[bravenak]

166. Oh God! Please! No more!!nt

[bravenak]

169. Welcome New Person

[rbrnmw]

173. Or welcome back

[bravenak]

175. For real

[Cha]

289. Jury results on name removed.. I was #7

On Mon Feb 22, 2016, 08:46 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Big Pharma has pills for that.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1313897

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Rude comment from a new one that attacks like a pro. Twelve posts and bravenak is targeted, then slyly called sick and in need of medication We get it black people are no longer welcome here. Hide it. I will notify MIRT.

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Mon Feb 22, 2016, 09:05 PM, and the Jury voted 5-2 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Sneaky troll may be tombstoned soon. Sockee say g'day, caio mate.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Given that this is a new poster, such abrasive comments have to be viewed with a measure of suspicion. Were this a more seasoned poster, I might feel differently.
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Juvenile. This post adds nothing and seems designed only to offend.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Alerter has a penchant for drama, to be sure.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: This poster is insinuating that bravenak has "mental" problems and needs meds. This is disgusting.. just because she doesn't bow down at the altar of berni is no excuse to personally attack her.

Implying people need "pills" is also an insult to the people who actually are helped by them.



What?!! #2

[sheshe2]

321. Bwahahahahahhahahahahaha

That was my alert!!!!!

Funny, never got a confirmation. Unless someone quoted me those are my words! '


High Five Kiddo!

[Cha]

329. Excellent alert, she! I see you got Cyborg MIRTED, too.

That's weird you didn't get a notification.. but, you know it happens.. then there's the full Moon and all.

[sheshe2]

332. This jury ruled!

Great jury!





Ha!

[Agschmid]

197. Yup.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

275. Why

The Cyborg
168. Take a break from DU then.
View profile
It won't help your blood pressure.

Have a nice evening, madame.

Why would you join a site just to tell a long time member to leave?


Thank you in advance.

[Hekate]

278. No, Cyborg, YOU take a break from DU. Or another break, as the case may be.

[Hekate]

276. Go away

[vdogg]

376. Lol

That one got hidden quick!

[Uncle Joe]

26. Do you believe that white people can be mislead? n/t

[politicaljunkie41910]

46. I don't play twenty questions; so what's your point?

The OP posted some BS that Blacks and Browns were committing political Hari Kari is we don't vote for Bernie Sanders as if we either don't know enough or aren't smart enough to make informed decisions regarding what is or is not in our interests. The article was condescending to people of color and I stated so. Enough said.

[Uncle Joe]

48. It was a simple question, yes or no. n/t

[Uncle Joe]

64. P. S. It wasn't 20 questions, it was only one and you know what my point is. n/t

[Fawke Em]

250. What's sad is that you're gonna keep us all back coz you scared.

Fuck, I'm scared.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

283. Nowhere...

Fawke Em
250. What's sad is that you're gonna keep us all back coz you scared.
View profile
Fuck, I'm scared.

Nowhere did the poster you are referring to say he or she is scared...

So why would you suggest he or she is pusillanimous?

I would ask that you peer into your conscience, do the right thing, and apologize to him or her.

Thank you in advance.

[cali]

17. Why? So only minorities that support Hillary should have an opinion?

Gad. You post shit much worse than this slamming Bernie. Don like it when it's turned around? That's just too bad.

[bravenak]

19. Whatever, Cali.

[PeaceNikki]

83. You're so cool.

[bravenak]

89. Hey!! You are too!

I'm a loligarch!

[PeaceNikki]

92. Today we are all loligarchs.

[bravenak]

95. Yay!!

[Fawke Em]

252. You like Nikki.

Girl... I stood with a young black man from GTech for three hours.

Your opinion is your own. And not right.

[bravenak]

258. Oh please! Holla after super tuesday and we will see

[Fawke Em]

308. Sadly, we'll be packing to leave this country.

No real working person wants to live here anymore if it's Hillary or GOP.

[MADem]

395. Make sure you check all the drawers and closets--don't want to leave anything behind!

Where ya headed?

Unless you're a dual national, don't expect Canada to open the door wide--they're getting VERY picky, lately!

[NCTraveler]

403. Where are you headed? nt.

[sheshe2]

30. Read

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511312465#post21

Read the next post as well.

[one_voice]

136. This OP is shameful.

it's nasty and condescending.

The glaring headline: People of color unable to know when they're being duped. They can't think for themselves. They have no common sense. I could go on and on.

All those things is exactly what the Republicans say. the. exact. same. thing. If Bernie is the nominee get ready for the same headline that you're defending right here, right now.

It's gross and has no business here.

[Arazi]

154. It's written by a POC - a Latino man fyi eom

[kwassa]

176. It doesn't mean he has a clue.

[kwassa]

193. I didn't say that. You are attempting to stick words in my mouth.

This is dishonest.

Any person from any ethnicity can be ignorant. God knows that so many of my fellow white peoples be ignorant.

and, not all viewpoints are equal. Some are better informed than others. This piece is nothing more than one person's opinion, and not an informed opinion.

[Arazi]

195. So you, white person, gets to declare whose POC opinion matters most?

I know that's the meme du jour - a solo DUer gets to declare they "speak" for an entire population but that is actually a false meme.

[kwassa]

199. Indeed I do ....

since I've been married to a black woman for the last twenty years, live and work in a very multicultural environment with many Latinos, and actually study the issues.

[Arazi]

203. Ok so yeah, you're a white guy

[kwassa]

204. and you are dismissing my argument for any valid reason?

You don't have an argument, do you?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

284. I am white guy too and I would walk through a wall for bravenak.

[yardwork]

336. How do we know?

An anonymous poster in the Internet can claim to be anything.

[nadinbrzezinski]

387. Because he is well known in Los Angeles

As a community organizer who mostly addresses his people in Spanish and has been writing for over ten years.

Jesus, at times DU does indeed crack me up. I guess since he is not writing something you approve off he is a poser. You really went there.

By the way, in my town, and at Figueroa Street and Aukland, this use is interchangeable with PoC.

I really crack me up.

Oh and his sentiments are not that rare either locally. I have read, mind you less polished, essays on FB echoing his sentiments to a T from my local PoC leaders.

[YCHDT]

422. That does not mean that it's not shameful

[AgingAmerican]

254. A subset of PoC are being duped, yes

And it's glaringly obvious.

[yardwork]

412. If a person doesn't vote the way you think they should, they're being duped.

Did you ever consider that you might be wrong and they might be right?

[AgingAmerican]

417. Duped into voting for a candidate they admit is the lesser of the two

Duped.

[Live and Learn]

206. That seems to be the gist of their argument. nt

[CorporatistNation]

96. Only Thing In Error Here Is The Repetition Of The FALSE Notion Of SUPER DELEGATES...

SUPER DELEGATES do NOT count until the END of the process.

IF at the conclusion of the primary process Bernie is AHEAD in PLEDGED DELEGATES (The ones gained from the voters)... The SUPER DELEGATES have to go along not legally but from a political standpoint or risk... REBELLION.

REBELLION DEFINED AS:

ALL you MOTHERFUCKERS who went against the will of the voters will be unceremoniously OUSTED from your elected position (CONGRESS/SENATE/ETC. in the general election!

[bravenak]

98. You seem angry

[CorporatistNation]

113. Friend, THAT IS HOW The Delegate "Thing" Works!

Quite simple actually....

[bravenak]

122. .

[etherealtruth]

152. Yes it is

[bravenak]

159. So sad. It really is.

[etherealtruth]

160. Not sad, disgusting

[bravenak]

163. And shameless.

I imagine snickering

[bobbobbins01]

237. Please tell us all what you know about shame.

[Hekate]

299. You first

[giftedgirl77]

2. Disgusting bullshit.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

3. Blacks and Browns?

Who talks like that?

[StevieM]

40. Donald Trump. (eom)

[1StrongBlackMan]

202. And all those rec'ING the OP.

[Beacool]

244. Well, he's a person of color too.

His color is orange.

[yourpaljoey]

109. real people do not talk that way

[nadinbrzezinski]

262. You might want to tell

The very real local PoC who use this as a phrase to denote racial pride they are not real.

I admit, the phrase is very limited in use geographically, and it is also class related. But real people use it. This would be in So Cal as far as my experience is concerned. To be very specific south of the I-8. It is also used in Los Angeles, where the author resides, and in NorCal, like Aukland.

[nadinbrzezinski]

247. Southern California activists.

And the author is not just Latino, but from Los Angeles.

That is your answer.

Granted, this was going to go national. A phrase not familiar outside this area should not have been used. I literally have it on tape. And for precisely this reaction I do not quote it. If I ever do, I will have to add a couple paragraphs explaining the use, and where it is used. It is also class related.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

351. Thanks, I couldn't tell from his bio on the linked site.

With the name and photo and "Vancouver", it looked like an older white guy.

[HooptieWagon]

4. They must be content with the status quo.

Who is MCWNews?

[WillyT]

8. MWC = Media With A Conscience - Out Of Canada... Author Is From Vancouver...

There's a hyper link at his name at article.

[FSogol]

21. The owner of MWC (Shahram Vahdany) is a writer for Veterans Today which

has connections to the Iranian Propaganda outlet: Press TV.
MWC, Veterans Today and Press TV are hugely anti-Semitic.

Congrats Willy. A new low!

[FSogol]

24. Here's what the SPLC says about the sources:

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2011/01/06/buyer-beware-veterans-today-and-its-anti-israel-agenda

[dragonfly301]

80. Great Terp win yesterday! eom

[w4rma]

106. So they are "anti-Semitic", yet they are supporting the Jew? That makes no sense. (nt)

[FSogol]

108. Someone's getting played.

Wonder who?

[w4rma]

119. Considering that Clinton is well known as a pathological liar

While Sanders is well known for his honesty.

I'd say it's the Clinton supporters getting played.

[Hekate]

302. You just keep telling yourself that

[lovemydog]

272. Great job there Willy.

Make you wonder how he found the article. Maybe just googling around looking for right wing hate groups. LOL.

[MADem]

393. The source of the OP is a VIRULENTLY anti-semitic website-why is this allowed to stand?

We're talking STORMFRONT FOR THE INTERNATIONAL SET.

The poster of this slop should just self-delete and slink.

[FSogol]

394. Completely agree. n/t

[1StrongBlackMan]

205. I wonder if that is the outfit ...

Behind "Blacks4Bernie" ... also out of Vancouver?

[Number23]

228. Was that the Facebook page that some here were waving it around like

"YEAH! BerNieS' Got the BLacK vote sealed UP!!!" because it had a whole 150 members???

[okasha]

144. Stockholm Syndrome! Stockholm Syndrome!

[joshcryer]

5. Detestable.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

34. Execrable .

[Metric System]

53. Unconscionable.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

59. Deplorable.

[PeaceNikki]

90. Fucking gross.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

94. abominable.

[PeaceNikki]

100. Shameful.

And a jury let the OP stand 1-6.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

112. repugnant

[PeaceNikki]

115. Vile.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

126. loathsome

[okasha]

146. A colony of gonococci.

[Hekate]

303. Unsavory

[Rose Siding]

188. Vomitous

To be sure

[etherealtruth]

155. That is more disturbing than the OP

[one_voice]

162. Yes.

[bettyellen]

390. I think it's a tie!

[joshcryer]

192. If that isn't evidence DU has a problem I don't know what is.

[greatauntoftriplets]

102. Swill.

[Beacool]

186. Abhorrent.

Hey, I wanted to play too.

[JI7]

6. how about the majority of white people support in republicans

With a large number supporting trump and cruz

[zappaman]

9. Yup, that's what Stockholm Syndrome can do.

[bravenak]

13. This is 2.0

[ismnotwasm]

114. I noticed this.

Kinda speechless.

[bravenak]

120. Me too

I can only gif

[rbrnmw]

158. yep like this

[bravenak]

161. Yep

[Hekate]

286. Gee, brave, I wish I could gif a damn like you!

[Matariki]

10. Please don't post stuff like this

Do you need an explanation?

[yardwork]

338. Oh, you don't like it? It's shining a light on the Sanders campaign.

All I see is bullying. Attacking people of color, citing antiSemitic sources, it looks like StormFront here lately.

[MADem]

398. This is a big chunk of your BASE. And the guy posting it is one of the most active

flingers of this sort of propaganda at this site.

Police your own, that's all I can say.

He doesn't need an explanation--he knows what he's doing. This is purposeful. When will you see that?

[AtomicKitten]

11. But they're serving fries with that shit sandwich.

[TNProfessor]

14. Condescending crap. nm

[demmiblue]

15. Blacks and browns... are you kidding me?

[Recursion]

105. That's a big phrase in some activist circles

I think of it as mostly a west coast term, though. It also antagonizes some actually "brown" people, south Asians, because it generally isn't used to include them.

[obamanut2012]

131. I can tell you for sure it isn't a Southern term

Not for liberals, anyway.

Wow. Just wow.

[Arazi]

170. Agreed. The article's author is an LA based Latino

Willy just pasted the article's title

And ignited a firestorm. I'm thinking nobody actually read the article

[Recursion]

174. This ain't Willy's first trip to the rodeo

See my question downthread...

[Barack_America]

184. I read it. But could not fend off a visceral reaction to "blacks and browns"...

...each time I read it.

A pre-post disclaimer with the information you brought to the thread would have helped.

[nadinbrzezinski]

238. That was an editorial foopah

In San Diego, another day, another march, rally, what have you. I have many instances of the phrase on tape issued by local young community leaders. There is a reason I would not transcribe it and if I have no choice, it will come with heavy editorial explanation. After all, it might be read in New York Dallas Texas and other points east. Hell, in Imperial County where it is not used.

This piece was going to go national. And most people outside the area are far from familiar. It is a term of pride, pure and simple. It could even be compared to PoC, which is also used. I hope this helps to put it in context. Oh and the first time I heard it, was jarring. It is also about class. You will not hear it north of the I-8 either

[brush]

225. He seems to get a kick out of just throwing stuff up on the wall to get a reaction

Not very evolved if you ask me. I mean what genuinely progressive POC or any progressive at all for that matter, continually posts such reactionary, patronizing crap?

[Recursion]

233. Like I said: this ain't Willy's first trip to the rodeo

I would totally give a lot of posters the benefit of the doubt here, but not in this case.

[Hekate]

290. +1

[lovemydog]

249. Perhaps someone who wants to divide

progressives by race. Or really is reactionary & patronizing. I don't know. I'm more disturbed by the folks who recced and voted not to hide it. To me, it has no place on a site whose stated goal is help elect more democrats.

[Hekate]

291. +2

[Recursion]

293. At least operationally, that's clearly not DU's point anymore (nt)

[Hekate]

305. +3

[yardwork]

340. Yeah, Willy had nothing to do with it. Poor Willy.

[nadinbrzezinski]

212. You are correct, this is a mostly Southern California term

And it is one of racial pride. I can understand why it does not play well outside of So Cal or the west coast. It is also used by leaders in certain pockets in NorCal (Aukland, not so much across the bay. There are clear class distinctions )

[Recursion]

213. Yeah, I've heard it in the Bay Area and San Diego

I associate it even more specifically with Latino activists looking for African American support.

[nadinbrzezinski]

217. My local AA kids use it all the time now.

But my local kids are working together with the Latino brothers and sisters. Update your reference, the semantic shift is occurring to include Native Americans and Asians, at least in San Diego. This is why my local power elite is terrified.

[Recursion]

218. Glad to hear that; a decade ago in the Bay Area my South Asian friends didn't like it

But then again NoCal and SoCal are very different animals...

[nadinbrzezinski]

223. Yes they are

Why I am that specific. I could even be more specific as to neighborhoods.

[Recursion]

257. Hey, did you ever see the movie "La Mission"?

It gets into a lot of this (including "blacks and browns&quot , as well as being an LGBT coming-of-age story and having some of the most absolutely fucking amazing tricked-out lowrider car "porn" (not actually porn, just saints painted in silkscreen on amazing old cars) I've seen in a movie.

[nadinbrzezinski]

261. Nope, but perhaps one to watch in a flight

[sheshe2]

16. WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!

Is this like your Stockholm Syndrome thread?

Now they will be disemboweling themselves if they don't vote for Sanders?

What are you doing? Stop, just stop!

[bravenak]

22. .

[AtomicKitten]

25. "Not Good Enough, Bernie" by sheshe2

---> http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026737025

[bravenak]

28. He is still not

[PeaceNikki]

37. What the fuck??

[sheshe2]

42. Out of context with no link.

Believe what you wish of me. I believe my standing is well know here especially in the AA Group.

[PeaceNikki]

45. I meant "WTF" that is was reposted here, sheshe

[sheshe2]

49. Thanks PeaceNikki

[PeaceNikki]

52. Anydamntime.

This whole thread is disgusting. I was on a jury for that post I replied to.

[sheshe2]

55. My guess?

It was a leave.

[PeaceNikki]

60. Jury is still out.

[greatauntoftriplets]

72. Hidden.

[sheshe2]

74. Thank you.

Will you post the results elsewhere please.

Love you.

[greatauntoftriplets]

81. Sorry, I don't have results.

[Hekate]

306. Hey you. What a thread.

[kath]

75. For anyone who gives a damn about facts, that photo was first posted here by **sheshe**, in

this disgusting thread: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026737025

[bravenak]

54. .

?w=320&h=180

[sheshe2]

76. ...

[bravenak]

78. What was that even, tho?

Smh.

[sheshe2]

84. I borrowed your yard stare on them.

Guess it worked.

[bravenak]

87. Good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sheshe2]

33. ...

[malokvale77]

138. Because I can't reply to a hidden post.

That person was proud of that post at the time.

Your post should not have been hidden.

[Hekate]

295. Totally

F'gods'sake

[99th_Monkey]

18. Supporting an establishment business-as-usual candidate will get us more of the same. Who knew?

Filthy-Rich keep getting more, the rest poorer and poorer. Check.

Endless ME wars, sucking the Treasury dry. Check.

Unchecked institutional racism & filling privatized prisons with PoC. Check.

College unaffordable for all except the rich. Check.

and so it goes ...

[Waiting For Everyman]

20. If the PoC vote for "same old" with HRC

the talk about needing "big change right now" will be shown up to be nothing but another lie, with few taking it seriously anymore.

It can't be both ways.

And pushing that pablum about the patriarchy isn't going to be credible while insisting on voting for it from the very people who created the crime bill, and who take money from the private prison system.

You can't fight it by supporting it.

There won't be the excuse of having no reasonable alternative, because there sure as heck is one.

This election will separate the real from the fake in lots of ways.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

44. Why are you depriving non-whites of their agency?

Would you please post your curriculum vitae or resume, with your name redacted, of course. so us plebeians can decide if you have the authority to bestow your counsel on the rest of us.


Thank you in advance.

[Waiting For Everyman]

70. You can't vote for the architect of mass incarceration

while claiming an urgency to end it.

All that needs is a minimum of logic. One position or the other is bullshit.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

91. To be an expert in a court of law one must establish his or her credentials.

Now I know this is an online community, but before a person arrogates to himself or herself the right to tell others what to do, it would behoove himself or herself to establish their credentials, am I right?

It seems as if you are holding yourself out as a life coach to entire races.

[grasswire]

124. and you can't argue against free college...

.....while taking 17.5 million bucks from the for-profit college chain.....without revealing yourself as a cynical profiteer.

[wyldwolf]

23. Them blacks and browns need to be edumacated by us smart white progressives.

[bravenak]

27. .

[leftofcool]

110. I am just in shock! I thought the Stockholm Syndrome was bad!

[sufrommich]

29. Why won't those blacks and browns do what

they're told by their superiors?

[workinclasszero]

50. Education education education

When all thoughtful and caring people get to know Bernie and his plans well.....

[DemocratSinceBirth]

32. If I wasn't concerned about a hide I would say what I think of this thread....

If I wasn't concerned about a hide I would say what I think of this thread ... It is to the eternal discredit of the administrators that I can't and some posters on this site can speak their mind while others can't.

" I know there is a God, and that He hates injustice..."

-Abraham Lincon

[Uncle Joe]

36. Do you believe that white people can be mislead? n/t

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

35. Here we go again

Didn't you get burned on a similar topic months ago?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

39. I have a question...

How is this less offensive than Republicans arguing that African Americans live on the Democratic plantation?

[Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin]

97. It's not in my opinion

I'm white and I find it offensive.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

107. For the record I'm white too...

If anything would have prevented the seminal poster from starting this thread , you would think a sense of empathy and common courtesy would have...

Maybe his better angels will speak to him and he will delete it.

[ieoeja]

399. And the entire "White Supremecist Liberal" meme by Clinton supporters this election?

I have noted before that Hillary supporters on this issue have been using the exact same rhetoric as Republicans arguing that African Americans live on the Democratic plantation.

Republicans also say AA just vote for "free stuff". Who on this site keeps accusing DUers of just wanting "free stuff"?

[uponit7771]

38. What about Women, gays, non white millennial and non white poor and cute puppies and...

... democrats?

They all committing the same?

[shenmue]

333. He better not mess with the puppies!!

[brush]

41. Is there a disconnect? Stockholm Syndrome and now political hara-kiri.

Insulting POC does not convert to Sanders votes.

Reverse hara-kiri maybe for the BS campaign.

[workinclasszero]

43. Putrid source

Is this alert bait?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

57. Only if you support the "wrong" candidate.

[workinclasszero]

69. Right but

A change gonna come, and soon.

Like that great Sam Cooke song

[Arazi]

47. He's Latino. He's published 300+ hundred articles in Spanish in the past 10 years

http://www.tanosborn.com/articulos

Please note I'm not commenting on this article , just giving some background

[WillyT]

61. Thank You... One Wonders If Anybody Bothered To Read The Article...

[w4rma]

133. It's hard to tell if many Clinton supporters are following Clinton's example and lying.

Or are actually ignorant of what they are saying.

[Hekate]

327. You just keep telling yourself that

[PonyUp]

371. Could it be both? n/t

[kwassa]

178. Does prolific equal truthful?

[Arazi]

185. Are you advocating squashing this Latinos voice? eom

[kwassa]

189. no, but he is probably unrepresentative of Latino viewpoints.

as Clarence Thomas is unrepresentative of African-American viewpoints.

[nadinbrzezinski]

208. Translation if a PoC does not agree with me

They have no right to an opinion.

This is the second time I see this in two days. It is quite telling.

[kwassa]

216. He has a perfect right to his opinion. He is still wrong.

and I wonder at the motivation of white people on DU quoting minorities lecturing other minorities to vote for Bernie.

That is all.

Bernie has picked up a sizable amount of Latino vote in NeVAAda. He did not pick up much of the black vote.

[nadinbrzezinski]

222. I am a PoC who'se identity and personal history has been denied

By a few (more than a few) on your side. So whatever.

It is quite telling nonetheless. Like if they are not saying what we like, shut the hell up. That is quite a message you guys are sending.

Of course, given I live where that phrase is used regularly as a matter of racial pride...I am far less horrified than you are. Where are we? Balboa park? At a BLM event?

[kwassa]

240. and what PoC are you?

and who exactly is denying you?

[nadinbrzezinski]

245. Latina, Jewish immigrant from Mexico

And that was done. I got them screen shots. And it was quite...ahem revealing. So there you have it. And with that ...I guess time for you to go back to soft ignore.

After all you deflected from what you were told. This term you object to, is a matter of pride where I live. Live with it, or not. And this piece was written by a PoC. Live with it, or not, I really do not give a shit

I just consider it extremely telling

[kwassa]

367. I literally have no idea of what you are talking about.

What deflection? I said he was wrong. What is deflecting about that?

I don't object to the term Person of Color, I use it myself. I don't know where you got that idea. I lived in Los Angeles for 17 years, and now live in the DC suburbs, which is just as diverse. We have a huge Hispanic population here, too.

It would be disingenuous to say, however, that all persons of colors have the exact same issues.

[1StrongBlackMan]

389. I suspect, if you continue to engage ...

this DUer, you will find that she hears what she wants to hear in order to make herself the victim.

[kwassa]

413. Thanks.

[Cali_Democrat]

51. Please proceed, Bernie supporters. nt

[sheshe2]

58. ;)

[uponit7771]

211. ;-)

[yardwork]

341. They really are showing their true colors now.

[lunamagica]

56. Disgustin OP. You never cease to amaze

[DemocratSinceBirth]

63. Nevada really has some people shook...

I did tell you not to worry...

[lunamagica]

67. I know. It's just that I'm a worrywart

worrywart

[Blue_In_AK]

62. I love ya, Willy,

but this one probably isn't helpful.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

65. I know you like him but there is a pattern

[WillyT]

71. The Article Is Pretty Well Thought Out.. And I Didn't Write The Headline.

This is the crux of the fight within the party right now, and I don't think self-censoring serves anyone well.

[Blue_In_AK]

86. I know you didn't write the headline,

and the article has food for thought, but I can see how some might feel it's inflammatory.

[WillyT]

116. Oh I Agree...

Hopefully some were able to get past the headline and actually read the article.

Funny how this one gets almost no response from the same people complaining: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511242187

[Quayblue]

66. seriously wtf

give it a rest already.

[Recursion]

68. I'm curious, did you take classes for racial tone deafness, or does it come naturally? (nt)

[joshcryer]

73. +1

[PeaceNikki]

101. Valid question.

[sheshe2]

196. RECs.

[Starry Messenger]

229. I think he writes the syllabus.

[Recursion]

230. I'm even fairly familiar with the "blacks and browns" rhetoric, and this blew me away

Most people learn after the first time they touch the burner.

[Starry Messenger]

234. Some folks just can't help themselves, I guess.

/

[Recursion]

236. What *really* got me was the use of "hara-kiri"

And actually I'll even go past Willy to call out Tansborn on that. In an article literally about the exploitation of black and brown people for political ends, are you really going to appropriate a rare form of ritual suicide of great religious and social importance in some brown cultures?

[betsuni]

270. I know! That bugged me. Guess the author doesn't know what it is. Bad writing. nt

[Recursion]

271. I was literally wondering what you thought of that but didn't want to bug you with a PM

[betsuni]

273. Heh (PM's always welcome, never bugged about THAT)

[obamanut2012]

346. This phrase would NEVER fly on the East Coast

Especially in the South. Apparently it's a regional Latino activist phrase in California. It might fall gently on ears there, but it sure as hell doesn't here.

[Recursion]

349. My wife grew up in the East Bay and that's where I heard it first

If you're a Latino leader in Hayward or Fremont trying to bridge a decades-old divide, that's one thing; if you're a poster with a history of a disastrously tin ear on racial issues, that's another. And this is not Willy's first time at the rodeo.

[obamanut2012]

386. Stockholm Syndrome

I haven't posted on here for a long time until recently, but have been reading GDP.

[Starry Messenger]

361. I've honestly never come across it, and I do some activist

work in SF and Oakland, but I'm usually with an older crowd of people of color.

[nadinbrzezinski]

388. Here is a serious question

Class status. Because here in San Diego it is limited to South of the I-8 mostly. Why the first time I heard it at a rally I had the reaction many posters here are having. It was a really big WTF over. My local activists, they are younger, explained it.

[obamanut2012]

344. +1

[NuclearDem]

77. What the fuck is this shit?

You guys aren't even pretending anymore, are you?

[MuseRider]

82. I hate this kind of crap.

I love me some Bernie but frankly what makes anyone think they have the right to tell other people how to think? Over and over and over again. I truly believe that "blacks and browns" (wtf is that all about?) can think for themselves and do not need to be addressed like they need it all 'splained to them again.

[nadinbrzezinski]

267. That phrase is a term of racial pride

Used often by community activists in San Diego, Los Angeles (author is Latino from LA) and Aukland.

There is your context...so does a PoC have a right to his views or not?

[MuseRider]

314. Thank you for explaining that

I had no idea.

My beef is people trying to tell PoC what they should think. I believe they are perfectly able to determine what is best for them and for others to try to tell them "what the real deal is" is offensive as can be.

[nadinbrzezinski]

319. My beef is far more specific

To this place. We have a concerted effort by some PoC to serve as gatekeepers of what other PoC should think.

That said, this story was going to go national...bad, bad editor, no cookie for you.

I got many instances of this on tape. I won't use it in a story, since outside these very limited areas...it is explosive.

[yardwork]

348. How do you feel about Dolores Huerta being smeared?

The Sanders campaign has gone all out racist in the last three days.

[PonyUp]

352. She lied. n/t

[yardwork]

358. Just keep saying that and lead your candidate to losing.

Keep attacking civil rights icons and yelling at minorities to vote for Bernie or else and see how well that works.

[one_voice]

85. .

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

88. Too true. K&R

[Spazito]

93. And here I was thinking the "Stockholm Syndrome" OP was the lowest...

I guess not.

[leftofcool]

99. Holy Moly!

I can't believe anyone would actually post this.

[brooklynite]

103. Translation: African-American and Latino voters are too stupid to know who to vote for...

...but -I- do.

[Uncle Joe]

118. Do you believe that white people can be mislead? n/t

[w4rma]

130. The author is Latino and has hundreds of Spanish articles.

Why would he call *himself* stupid?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

135. I never got this argument...

My mom was Jewish...My dad was Italian...

Does that mean I speak for all of them or in the alternative I can speak ill of them with impunity?

[w4rma]

137. I don't think he's insulting them, so much as taking them to task for making a mistake. (nt)

[sheshe2]

198. He is taking them to task for making a mistake???

That is indeed insulting.

[obamanut2012]

347. The racial tone deafness on DU is sometimes astounding

I don't know anyone who does this IRL, as in my personal circles, so this just slays me.

Disclaimer: Proud Southerner

[okasha]

153. A rare fit of honesty?

[one_voice]

182. Who knows..

Rubio and Cruz do it too--call PoC stupid for voting for Dems.

Maybe he thinks he's better than everyone else.

Doesn't make it any less gross and condescending.

Does this mean when the right does it, it will be okay?

[nadinbrzezinski]

239. Given the author is a Latino activist in Los Angeles

Where this is a term of racial pride, your mileage will vary.

[PeaceNikki]

104. You should delete this disgusting shit, Willy.

[Uncle Joe]

111. Do you believe that white people can be mislead? n/t

[onenote]

140. Sorry, but I have to ask: Do you know the difference between misled and mislead?

[Uncle Joe]

143. I stand corrected what is your answer, do you believe that white people can be misled?

[onenote]

147. I believe anyone can be misled.

Which makes the OP even more inexplicable to me since it seems to single out "blacks and browns" as somehow uniquely being misled.

As a Bernie supporter I think that many of my fellow supporters are being misled into thinking that if Bernie doesn't get the nomination (and I'll be voting for Bernie in Virginia next month) the "right" thing to do is sit back and let a republican get elected. Fortunately, I'm confident that Bernie, should it come to that, will forcefully attempt to disabuse people of that. And because I believe Bernie has great leadership qualities, I fully expect a lot of people who are saying one thing now to reconsider. At least I hope so. If it comes to that.

(And it goes equally for the other side -- I would fully expect Clinton to throw her support to Bernie if he wins the nomination and for her to lead her supporters into fighting the repub maniacs as hard as they can.)

[Uncle Joe]

151. The you can argue against his points on the merits, what do you object to in regards to his points?

[ieoeja]

401. Have you and all the other offended people in this thread not seen a thousand ...

... "why do poor, White people keep voting against their own best interests" threads at DU? Why is okay for us to point out that White people are voting against their own best interest, but it is not right for a Latino to point out the same thing about Hispanics and African-Americans?

[nadinbrzezinski]

409. Latinos who speak in ways we don't aprove

should just sit by the corner and shut up.

That is now a pattern. And a very disturbing pattern at that.

Whether I agree with the writer or not, does not mean he should not be allowed to speak.

[PatrickforO]

121. Great article. It perfectly describes the racial divide and conquer

strategy being implemented by the corporate funded political establishment against Bernie. I'm shedding tears now because I did not think the American people were that stupid. But alas...we'll get the government we deserve come January 2017.

Good luck with that. To all of us. Because the monied elites that actually call the shots don't give a shit about any of us, regardless of race or ethnicity. And by falling prey to racial divide and conquer politics, we are basically letting guys like Shkreli and Blankfein and Diamon off scot free so they can continue to screw ALL of us.

So like I said, good luck with that. We'll need it.



BUT on a MUCH more cheerful note, Bernie might still win. His is an insurgency campaign and he has changed the dialog by making demands that weren't even being acknowledged by the establishment wings of either party before. So good can still come of it.

[rbrnmw]

125. keep this up it is really helping Bernie

[tularetom]

127. For years I've watched people on DU ridicule the stupid white hillbillies

who constantly vote republican against their own self interest. And have you ever heard one peep of outrage? I haven't. Nobody has ever accused anybody of condescension.

And yet here you have somebody basically making the same statement about minority group members. And you'd think the OP advocated killing puppies.

I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with either of these generalizations. But I do see sort of a double standard at play.

[ms liberty]

142. As a southerner I must say you've made a good point

And almost no one appears to have read the article itself.

[nadinbrzezinski]

241. Worst, this is a term of racial pride

In so cal, that a Latino activist is using.

And you made a good point

[yardwork]

343. Actually, you complain about it all the time, Tom.

For years I've seen your posts complaining about how badly white people are treated, just like you're doing now.

As a white person, I suggest you listen instead. Listen to what other people - especially nonwhite people - are saying. You might learn something.

[obamanut2012]

350. Preach it, Yardie

We both know what it's like to live in an area where you should listen, and where people do listen.

[JackInGreen]

359. With all due respect

Whether or not the poster has complained isn't in question at core. The point is we can say 'those stupid rednecks are voting against their self interest' and there's a sea of nodding heads. Say 'The african american and latino population appears to be voting against it's self interest' and there's a hue and cry far and wide of racism. I'm not saying that the scales are entirely balanced historically or culturally. I do not see, however, how it's fair that we can state one racial/socioeconomic group is foolishly shooting themselves in the foot and we can't say same objectively about others. If you want to state it's not fair, that's fine, but then it's not fair across the board.

[72DejaVu]

129. Man, if you aren't Duke Ellington

back off on the "Black and Brown" stuff.

[w4rma]

132. I wouldn't pick the terminology, but apparently it's common and accepted elsewhere.

The author is Latino and has written hundreds of Spanish articles. You should probably just let it slide as a cultural difference.

[PeaceNikki]

141. So.... You edit it to link to an article where the same author trashes Obama?

Adorable.

[Arazi]

148. Pathetic. Its a call to social justice with links to his Spanish language articles

heres the translation

Over a decade ago I started writing a weekly sociopolitical column, “Behind the Mirror,” hoping to bring new perspectives that would allow us to see ourselves with borrowed eyes… not just our American eyes.

Those new perspectives have proven to be a bit raw at times for an American readership unaccustomed to self-criticism and the challenges which most often accompany the truth. And nowhere can the truth be more obfuscated than in matters concerning international relations. To counter our perceived American obstinacy in the perpetuation of myths and ideas of an idyllic, fairy-tale America, we have tried to provide information and discussion to help bring clarity in both domestic and international fronts; our hope that in the latter we would find some opportunity for a more reasonable and impartial evaluation of our foreign policy.

Since early in 2003 we have observed, and challenged, the hawkish actions and policies enacted during one-and-one-half terms of a misguided Bush presidency in both domestic and international arenas which left the United States bankrupt and depression-bound… after helping to widen the great abyss between rich and poor; while maintaining an imperial military-might serving as police force for multi-flag global capitalism… or, as many political analysts will contend, as the raison d’être for terrorism.

But Bush’s exit from American politics, contrary to the ballooned expectations of some and the unrealistic hopes of many did not change much in the way the US is governed. Not much… Not at all! After six years in office, Mr. Obama has become living proof that he is Commander-In-Continuity… and absolutely nothing else. Although showing a contained displeasure in his relationship with Israel’s “Bibi” Natanyahu, this American president has shown a mastery of the political moment by waiting until his last two years in office to initiate talks that could bring about the normalization of relations with Cuba, and the closing of the prison at Guantanamo. A minuscule feat, however, when measured against what could prove out to be the biggest blunder in US foreign policy: capriciously pushing Russia into a wall… and a new cold war.

Necessary changes in foreign policy – the principal cause for all OUR wars; and in domestic economic policy – the reason for grouping Americans in two camps of rich and poor, are not about to change until there is an upheaval in all aspects of American society: social, political and economic. Until that day comes, we shall continue challenging American politics with our progressive voice… heralding, as loudly as we are allowed, our cry for social justice.

Ben Tanosborn
February 1, 2015

[PeaceNikki]

149. Yes, I read it. It is pathetic.

[Arazi]

150. Ah, my mistake. I thought you were serious about discussing

instead of silly knee jerk reactions

Carry on.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

288. As a fair and impartial observer I have to award this round to Nikki.

[Bobbie Jo]

145. Don't even.

Absolutely shameless.

[etherealtruth]

156. "shameless" is far too mild a word

[Matariki]

157. Willy, I like you and you know I support Sanders

But please, delete this post.

I know you mean well, but this article is so insulting and condescending. Suggesting that Latinos and African Americans as a group are somehow politically naive and "don't know what's good for them" is really awful.

No on assumes that white voters vote as some sort of borg-like bloc. No one should assume that of non-white voters. It's insulting.

Please, focus on the issues. People will decide for themselves who to vote for. The best we can do is put the case forward that Sanders is the best choice based on the issues.

[bravenak]

165. How do you manage to find this stuff?

[Tarc]

167. These posts insinuate that persons of color aren't smart enough

to vote for what's best for them, that they are easily swayed or duped.

[rbrnmw]

171. SMH

[bravenak]

172. Last post

SMH

[davidthegnome]

177. I politely request that you delete this OP

I agree with you about a number of things Willy, but this article should never have been posted here. Whether the condescension on the part of the author is intentional or not, it IS condescending. It is suggesting that people of color cannot make up their own minds about who to vote for/are not intelligent enough to avoid being misled.

I'm not fond of Clinton. I think we'd all be better off with a President Sanders - but a lot of people are clearly offended by this article and find it condescending and racist. Delete it, you can write better stuff than that yourself - much better -.

[still_one]

179. are you working for or against Bernie, because to be honest, it isn't clear

[Barack_America]

181. "Blacks and Browns?" WTF is this?

[Uncle Joe]

183. What's wrong with saying blacks, browns or for that matter whites?

[Barack_America]

187. Everything.

An individual may be white or black or brown, but that should lead to no assumption about another individual of the same.

[Uncle Joe]

190. This isn't about individuals, it's about group psychology and manipulation from the oligarchs. n/t

[uponit7771]

215. In this context everything

[Uncle Joe]

224. No explanation, "everything" doesn't cut it, if you can't rebut point by point. n/t

[Recursion]

248. If you're a neighborhood activist in the East Bay, bridging a decades-old divide?

Nothing, in fact it's generally pretty good there (with the caveat that many South Asians, who are also brown, feel excluded by your rhetoric, or at least used to in the past -- nadin upthread suggests at least that divide is also being bridged, which I'm happy to hear).

If you're a DU poster with a history of having a tin ear on race? Well, that's more complicated.

[Uncle Joe]

296. Tin ear can be complicated.

[Recursion]

298. Yeah, well, you're going to need to offer the black community more than that

She's the devil they know. Sanders is the devil they don't.

Here's what white progressives don't get: people of color are absolutely used to being screwed over by the US political system (white progressives think they are, but they aren't). If you're saying "Hillary Clinton wants to make your life worse", well, yeah: people know that. All white politicians do, because that's what white constituents want. Sanders is no different in that sense.

[Uncle Joe]

300. Much of that has to do with the corporate media conglomerations infatuation with promoting Trump

and either blacking out or downplaying Bernie.

[Recursion]

301. No, it doesn't. African Americans aren't brainwashed masses.

Starting in the 1970s, black wages and incomes started to rise at unprecedented rates.

At that same time, white wages started to fall. Black people were competing for their jobs for the first time.

Sanders is running against that fall in wages. Is it really that crazy to you that black people distrust that?

[Uncle Joe]

307. Women and African Americans' wages and incomes gained in the 1970s because they were so far behind

but that only carried so far into the 80s and onward when family incomes stagnated compared to the less than 1% gains.

Bernie isn't campaigning against lost "white men" income or wages being reduced, he's fighting for all the average workers wages to increase regardless of race as compared to CEOs who in 1989 made approximately 29 times their average worker's salary and which dramatically increased beginning in the 90s to the point of CEOs now making 200-300 times their average employees wages of all races.

In the beginning women coming into the workforce was a luxury for the family, extra income, now it has increasingly become a necessity and in too many cases that doesn't even pay the bills.

[nadinbrzezinski]

311. Well having spent many hours at his site

Reading policy, that is not precisely right. He would like to bring good paying jobs, many of them factory jobs, back to the US. He would like to rebuild the middle class (I hope we can agree this includes AA who were hit disproportionally hard by the Great Recession). Many of these jobs used to be in urban cores and nafta (and the rest) have hit working class AA particularly hard as well.

He speaks often of how there is a need to increase jobs, good jobs to be exact, in African American communities.

I get it if people distrust him, but hey, I have spent hours reading websites...it's my job. And this is a good summary of his position. He is actually horrified, and so am I, by AA unemployment, in particular youth unemployment.

So just putting this here as what is actually in his positions.

By the way, do I think anybody who gets elected will get anything done? Nope, I gave up the fantasy that elections actually matter and change countries. Oh and that includes the Rs by the way. That is for entirely different reasons by the way.

[Recursion]

312. "Factory jobs" aren't good paying. They were; they aren't now.

How much does a factory worker in Bangladesh make?

That's the labor cost of a "factory job".

[nadinbrzezinski]

316. What he is talking about is good union jobs in the US

Not poverty jobs in Bangladesh.

As I said, mistrust him, I get it...but don't misrepresent the position. We got the Google, for the moment...

And as to media, yes, our RW media will do all it can, like move away from Sanders when he speaks against TPP...and give him less time. That is not CT. That is reality. They have reasons not to want this man anywhere close to the office of the Presidency. What I have yet to figure out is what us the Trump angle?

They are not just propagandizing one community. They are running a 24/7 propaganda operation on the American people. So they are deceiving everybody...

[Recursion]

318. No politician can stop a factory from relocating production

It's crazy to me how people completely misunderstand this. Zenith moved all of its production to Mexico a decade before NAFTA.

Good Union Jobs in the US are service jobs, not manufacturing jobs. Manufacturing is dead as an employment source; we're still a manufacturing powerhouse but we just don't employ any people doing it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

320. Policies can change how you do your production of goods and services

Have you read the Rise and Fall of Great Powers by Doctor Paul Kennedy? We will rue the day we deindustrialized the county. And by the way, that started with Reagan on steroids.

[Recursion]

324. I have, and it started in the 1960s

It started once the rest of the world got up from the devastation WWII had wreaked on it.

We'll always be one of the world's top manufacturers. We'll never employ as many people as we used to doing it.

[nadinbrzezinski]

328. And this is where we disagree

But also why I think policies that speak of gasp strengthening the middle class are not white only. They include all. And I personally wish the campaign, too late by the way for that, had actual honest discussions on policy. This includes industrial and trade policy.


Instead...we are seeing a disaster...and you know what? I hope some day all our politicians and media start treating Americans (and that is everybody) like adults.

[obamanut2012]

354. Yup, and Levi's and Nike before NAFTA, too

Quite a few other ones, too. Wal-Mart had outsourced vendors way before NAFTA.

[Recursion]

355. Which is my point: NAFTA was an attempt to exert some control over that, not its cause

And I'm not a huge fan of NAFTA, though as the history turned out the late 90s immediately after its passage were kind of unprecedentedly good years (mostly because Bill Clinton held firm on keeping taxes up).

[obamanut2012]

385. Oh, I know

Not arguing, just commenting.

[obamanut2012]

353. "Good union" factory jobs in the US are rare

Very rare. They are either relocated out of the country, or relocated into areas of the US where they pay a little over minimum and bad benefits.

Look at the area between Hickory, NC, and High Point, NC. The furniture industry which thrived there, and gave good NON union lives to workers is almost all gone overseas, and there's a bunch of people encouraged to drop out of high school for these jobs left uneducated and poor in an area with no other real industry.

VW had to fight to bring a union into US factories.

Almost all of the textile jobs are also gone from NC.

Urging people to get a good union factory job isn't realistic.

[Beacool]

191. This is patronizing as all get out.

Saying that "Blacks and Browns" are committing political suicide is insulting to POC. The writer is acting as if millions of people are too stupid to see the wonder that is Sanders.

I think that people, of all races and ethnicities, are savvy enough to decide who they want to represent them. To treat them as if they are dolts who need to be told what's good for them is not a smart way to try to garner votes for Sanders.

[LexVegas]

194. Jesus...this tops your other legendary thread. nt

[Bobbie Jo]

201. I'm sure that was intentional.

Mission Accomplished.

[Recursion]

246. I'm starting to think it's performance art (nt)

[Hekate]

334. It's great to be legendary for something, right?

[Agschmid]

200. You should self delete this.

It's very patronizing and doesn't do anything to further any kind of debate on the issues.

[JonLeibowitz]

207. Please consider deleting this post, willyT. I think it makes some thoughtful points,

but unfortunately is so inflammatory it does more harm than good.

[yardwork]

342. Oh no. I hope he leaves it up. It shows the Bernie Sanders campaign for what it is.

[JonLeibowitz]

366. As if willyT speaks for the Sanders campaign or most Sanders supporters

I thought the Hillary lot didn't like one person speaking for entire groups?

[nadinbrzezinski]

378. That is the dissonance we have here

Though we do have some PoC who claim to talk for all and want to silence PoC who do not agree with them.

I read the piece. I have heard the exact same sentiment in the streets, and my ears did not burn at the term, but I know the provenance of it. I admit, the first time it was jarring.

[JonLeibowitz]

382. Heck, I remember watching candidate forums called

&quot state X) black and brown forum"

[nadinbrzezinski]

384. True

[Godhumor]

209. *Checks OP, Checks who posted the OP*

Not surprised.

[Stand and Fight]

210. Naturally this shit is allowed to stand on DU...

Nothing worse than when certain Whites can't stand when so-called "Blacks" and "Browns" make up their own minds. As an American of African descent, I find your posting of this disgusting WillyT. Shame on you and shame on the people who recommended this racially divisive nonsense.

PS: I read the article.

[Number23]

235. "Shame on you and shame on the people who recommended this racially divisive nonsense"

Well said.

And the funny part is, is that when black posters object to this type of patronizing, ignorant, offensive, fuckwittery, WE are the ones accused of "race baiting" and "playing the race card."

[workinclasszero]

255. Naturally this shit is allowed to stand on DU...

Of course.

I recommend printing the thread and showing it to all of your friends that are PoC.

Let them see what the average Bernie supporter really thinks about them.

Or just send a link to this steaming pile of latent racist bullshit because its not going anywhere sad to say.

[nadinbrzezinski]

274. Just a question do you realize this was written by a Latino

I would not have used the phrase myself by the way. But literally I have many instances of it's use as a matter of racial pride here in San Diego. It is kind of build bridges between communities. It is in common use in my town, Los Angeles, and Aukland.

So can a minority, who has been active in his community, have a right to his opinion and views even if you obviously do not agree with it?

What troubles me is that this is literally the second piece written by a PoC, the other was a letter to John Lewis, that apparently has no right to an opinion since it seems to reject the idea that all PoC are behind one of the two candidates.

First nope, that is not what is happening. Many are, but others are behind Berne, so that is a fallacy.

Second, I agree that this is shameful, that be silencing the PoC you do not agree with.

I will give you this, bad editorial choice, since that term of racial pride is extremely limited geographically. By the by, it is also directly tied to class.

[obamanut2012]

356. LOts of minorities love insulting one other

Camilia Paglia (lately lauded in GDP), Log Cabin Republicans, etc.

It doesn't mean you're right.

[nadinbrzezinski]

375. I think I will take the word of both black and brown leaders

In my town that this is a term of racial pride for both, and not an insult, over yours.

We cool on that one?

[uponit7771]

214. Willy T is a Bernie Sanders supporter

[Major Hogwash]

219. Kicked and recommended.

Just for using the nickname of "El Viejito,” if for nothing else.
There's a lot of good information in that article.

[virgogal]

220. What is a brown person? Indian or Mid Eastern or what?

I never can get a definition.

[nadinbrzezinski]

269. I told you already

Hispanic, Latino. These days in my town it includes native Americans and Asians. This is a somewhat late semantic shift

[obamanut2012]

357. Why aren't South Asian Indians and Persioans and Arabs included?

They are "brown," too.

[nadinbrzezinski]

379. In San Diego I suspect that will happen within a generation

It is organically evolving and we have large immigrant communities, especially from Iraq...though I am not sure Chaldeans will mostly join the kids in the streets of Mt Hope...but Arabs have already, and our Indian community is quite tiny so see what I said about the Chaldeans.

It is also related to class.

[lovemydog]

221. Stockholm Syndrome Part Two:

Electric Boogaloo.

[bravenak]

227. .

[Recursion]

242. There's gonna be a dog-whistle war...

You know I actually broke a rib trying some of the moves in the first one?

[nadinbrzezinski]

226. Will I love you

But that headline, while very much in vogue (the term is a matter of racial pride in So Cal) was not going to play well with people outside my hood, barrio, whatever term you chose to use. So many of these people are of course outraged somebody used a term of racial pride they are quite unfamiliar with.

So, while I have it in plenty of tape, there is a reason I stick to PoC in my pieces. It goes kind of national.

That said, the fact that some folks would love to silence a minority that does not share their views is also kind of telling brother.

[one_voice]

231. Ew...

Other prophets have appeared in the past unveiling the truth to economic and social conditions, Ralph Nader, most recent among them, but circumstances or their timing proved unpropitious for them. Have we, then, entered an era of civic enlightenment with Bernie; or is his head going to be served to Hillary on a plate just as John the Baptist’s head was served to Herodias? And, if Bernie does make it to the general election will our ruling elite have him crucified by either Trump or Bloomberg? -

[Starry Messenger]

232. Keep showing everyone who you really are.

[AgingAmerican]

251. I have been saying this since Spring

Be careful what you wish for...

[desmiller]

256. Hmmm

[amborin]

264. that's a great article! pretty much the same thing is happening w/ union leaders

the article mentioned the crucial union in the nevada outcome, but union leaders
across the US tend to align more with capital than with the real interests of rank and file

the iron law of oligarchy

[Hekate]

265. "Blacks and Browns" need to be "led"? And Bernie's followers (obviously led themselves....

....hence the term follower) are aggrieved because "Blacks and Browns" don't want to be led by Bernie?

Oh. My. Gods.

[bettyellen]

277. Hara-kiri, Stolckholm Syndrome. Interesting.

[sheshe2]

310. Part 3 What will it be!

[greatauntoftriplets]

365. Reign of Terror Redux?

Fill the tumbrils with those who disagree with us!

[betsuni]

279. I just came here for the gif-viewing.

[PonyUp]

372. Here's a nice one:

[SidDithers]

285. ...

Sid

[delrem]

297. You've been told not to do this by good people.

Why do you persist in using "color" divisive language in this incendiary way?
Wny?

[nadinbrzezinski]

304. It has been posted repeteadly

The author of the piece is a Latino from Los Angeles, Calufornia. The term is a term of racial pride in San Diego, LA and Auklamd. It is also quite class related. It comes from years of activists working across communities of color, and in my town these days it includes black (well duh) Latino, Asian (this is new) and Native American (again new)

I have many instances of this use at marches and rallies, now here is where the editor of that publication made a mistake. I will not use it in print. Not because there is anything wrong when you understand the context, and it matters. But because it has a very limited geographic use. I will be nice, people are reacting because it sounds horrible. But where I live...it is as much a term of pride as PoC.

So can a Latino activist who speaks mostly to his community in Spanish, have a right to speak even if you heavily disagree with him I suspect? By the way, his views are actually not that unusual in certain quarters. I have heard them from many other local leaders...most of them just post them on Facebook.

[delrem]

309. I agree that the usage is well established.

But "Blacks and Browns Being Led Into Committing Political Hara-kiri" isn't.

This OP was simply dropped as a bomb. No editorial as to why.
But it was dropped as a bomb in a context, nadin.

It is fucking incendiary use of neutral color-word "black" "green" "blue" "white" "yellow" and so on, to use them this way.

I think if the author meant "US citizens with African lines of descent", then the author should have said so in those specific words, not like "black or brown". Color me sensitive.

Then the author might distinguish from those of Latino descent, and Mid Eastern descent, and so on. Then, just for fun, the author might start explaining how all these distinct groups are either sucked in or not, according as the author judges these things.

[nadinbrzezinski]

313. As I said I have a boatload of black and brown on tape

I will not use it in a piece due to its limited use. My pieces, some do go national. But that is exactly how it is used, a term of self identity and racial pride.

I explained it. That is all I can do. And since I hear it often, forgive me, but knowing the context this is hardly explosive to my ears. It is...another day at Balboa Park recording speeches by community activists

[delrem]

322. Actually, it's the headline of a post to DU. n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

325. Chosen by the editor of the publication

Exhibit A of why I have yet to directly quote it. But if I ever do, it will have to have a contextual explanation. That is bad, bad editor, no cookie for you.

[delrem]

331. Reproduced as-is, as an OP to DU.

Which is what I complained about.

It isn't fucking helpful!

excuse:
"But I only re-tweeted it, verbatim"

People up here needed some time to get their heads around the reasons why intelligent and socially aware Canadians refer to the First Nation peoples as First Nations. The reason is, it's a term of reference chosen by the First Nation peoples.

That kind of "choice" is a thing that descriptives like "brown" and "black" know nothing of.

So I don't like them - I don't like hearing them. I'm not the only one. A lot of people who write on issues of discrimination agree that "black" and "brown" and "white" and "yellow" are unscientific and are prone to rhetorical abuse. Like, during a US election.

[nadinbrzezinski]

391. You know what

I would not have posted it on DU. I would have added it to the collection of notes, because I have read and heard that exact sentiment from my local community leaders. But I would not have posted it on DU (and told that to Willy by the way) because I have found people here are not going to get out of their comfort zones and ask why somebody, not Willy, the author, would feel that way. Nor are people willing to understand this was written by a PoC.

What I find disturbing is not the essay. As I said, it reflects something I know exists under the surface. It is the gate keeping of who is and is not PoC and whether PoC who do not agree with a certain faction on this board even have a right to their voices.

That is what I find truly disturbing. This is the second piece from a PoC that the usual suspects have gone out of their way to try to discredit. The other was posted by Polly7 and was a letter from an older AA woman to John Lewis, respectful and all, but took him to task.

That is what I truly find disturbing.

[delrem]

419. Yes, I agree with you.

Brock has been all over this primary from the start - at least I'm guessing it's a coordinated effort - to attack "Bernie supporters" along race/color/sex/orientation lines. It's the attack on "supporters" that's the tell. But after 8 months of it, the lines of attack are embedded. There're now a couple "baiting" OPs a day.

Perhaps I was wrong to chastise WillyT.

p.s.: I read your note under Barack America's "As an early primary campaigner..." OP where you said "So I can now fully ignore her pearls of wisdom. With the other Canadian." Which I imagine is me. Not polly7 who you cited above (also canadian). I believe Nance is an expat living in Canada, I don't think she's Canadian. I could be wrong. There are US expats across the world. Most of us Canadians are up front about it. Why not be? The US system is very different from ours (no shit!) and hard to grok. Canada has tight military/NATO ties with the US - and a lot of us are alarmed, esp after Harper. Our focus tends to be toward foreign policy / military issues. After all, we've already got Universal Health care so nobody can say it won't ever, ever come to pass for us. Thanks to Tommy Douglas, Saskatchewan and the CCF for paving the way and defining how it should be done. I posted an OP comparing Harper to Hillary (same on SO MANY issues - differing on nothing). It wasn't well received by Hillary's crowd, who pretended that they're aligned with Justin Trudeau (which is to laugh).

[nadinbrzezinski]

420. Neither of you

He usually posts one word, emoji answers

[nadinbrzezinski]

421. And Justin Trudeau HRC

I needed a laugh....that is hysterical.

[yardwork]

345. Gee, I wonder why?

[BainsBane]

326. "He was denied" the vote

As though it's rightfully his. No. He has not EARNED their votes.

And this continual lecturing of people of color for not doing the bidding of Sanders supporters certainly isn't helping him earn it. It's insulting and disrespectful. If you want someone to support your candidate, try treating them as equals, respecting them rather than complaining how they owe you something. They owe you nothing.
They have every right to vote in their own interests rather than yours. Sanders supporters get one vote each, just like every other citizen. That they can't accept that basic fact and feel entitled to lecture and insult everyone who doesn't obey them is itself a compelling case for not voting for their candidate.

[yardwork]

335. Nice anti-Semitic source you got there.

Racist and anti-Semitic. Did Trump's campaign send you this?

[obamanut2012]

360. Just coming to post this -- wtf?

I read some of the stuff at the source, and was

[leftofcool]

339. Kicking this thread

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

362. Saturday and next Tuesday can't come quickly enough! Sigh...

[forjusticethunders]

363. the more time passes

the more I start to understand the whole "I'm not voting for Bernie" because of his supporters. They don't understand why POC aren't voting for Sanders even though his platform is better, and thus are making no attempts to speak to it and screaming at them that they're voting against their own interests doesn't work in getting them to consider what you have to offer.

I think Sanders is better for everyone, white or POC. Posting an article with zero context about how POC are committing suicide by supporting Hillary (as someone who believes that supporting Hillary isn't the best choice) isn't the way to get that message across and just plays into Clinton's strategy of making Bernie sound like an angry old racist guy who doesn't think POC matter to his vision.

[kwassa]

368. Excellent post.

Posting an article with zero context about how POC are committing suicide by supporting Hillary (as someone who believes that supporting Hillary isn't the best choice) isn't the way to get that message across and just plays into Clinton's strategy of making Bernie sound like an angry old racist guy who doesn't think POC matter to his vision.

[stevil]

369. Wow

Tone deaf.

[Bobbie Jo]

370. In the extreme. nt

[NastyRiffraff]

374. So this is what DU has become

This is vomit-inducing. I don't know who this "writer" is but telling "Blacks and Browns" how they should vote is the height of condescending racism. I can't believe this garbage has been posted, and allowed to stand.

[Avalux]

377. I can't believe the manipulation tactics your candidate uses to get their votes.

THAT is disgusting. Diving us by race IS racism, and that's what Hillary's campaign does.

[nadinbrzezinski]

383. He is a Latino from Los Angeles

Where the term is one of racial pride among both blacks and Latinos, of mostly lower class provenance.

I know this since they are my beat.

That said, bad editor, no cookie for you. I have this on tape, but given my pieces at times go national, I don't use it. If I ever have to, it will have to have a long explanation because it is very limited geographically in use. This would be San. diego, Los Angeles and Aukland.

[randome]

405. And Cornel West is black.

That doesn't mean he isn't an intellectual dullard when he descends to gutter language. This writer is the same. It's vulgarity masking as information. Sour grapes from the "I'm with Bernie!" crowd.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[nadinbrzezinski]

406. Of course, PoC who don't agree with us

should just be good boys and girls and shut up

That pattern is actually quite disturbing from your side, and by the way I do not support sanders. This gate keeping is astounding in fact.

I will add, this is not considered gutter language, but pride language, interchangeable with PoC... I suspect that this will not matter to you anyway. This is also linguistic gate keeping.

[randome]

407. "My" side. I don't take sides.

Sorry, Cornell West is an ass and so is this writer. Talk up race all you want. But mixing metaphors like 'n*****ized' or 'hari-kari' or 'Stockholm Syndrome' just shows off someone's dearth of intelligence, not street cred. And they're not even smart enough to be embarrassed by it.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[nadinbrzezinski]

408. Sorry, but this is a pattern I have now observed that has taken shape

own it... or most likely not.

And this guy has far more street cred than you will ever have in the nail of your little finger.

Of course getting this pointed out, that this is a LATINO writing this, so now you go after him for not having street cred.

That is over me in the corner, what you hearing is some real raucus laughter. And with that, bak to soft ignore with you.... we have nothing to say to each other.

[bravenak]

410. Why is that Latino speaking for blacks? That is not acceptable.

Unlike myself he is not Hispanic AND black and as such does not live the black experience. Therefore, it is very presumptuous for him or any latino/hispanic to try to tell us BLACK PEOPLE what is best for us. Best if he spoke for his own group rather then attempting to dress us down as well. He is not black.

[randome]

414. Are you saying I don't have the right to defend Obama when he's insulted?

I have the right to point out how despicable it is to throw incendiary language about -like 'Stockholm Syndrome' or 'hara-kiri'- too. This is not an intellectual discussion, it is anger and insult. And it's embarrassing that some want to celebrate this type of discourse and think they are 'wise' in some way.

Why aren't you and yours celebrating what Carson said today about Obama not being 'black enough'? That sounds like it's right up your alley but I guess I'm not supposed to have an opinion about that, either.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[nadinbrzezinski]

415. Do MINORITIES you obviously have no agreement with

have a right to speak their mind.

Simple answer, yes or no. From your answer, I say no. Sad.

[randome]

416. I'm calling out the insults for what they are -tripe.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[randome]

397. Trying too hard to be clever again, aren't you?

Why not post some of what Ted Nugent says, too? After all, it's on the Internet, why blame anyone for posting it here?
[hr][font color="blue"][center]There is nothing you can't do if you put your mind to it.
Nothing.[/center][/font][hr]

[zappaman]

402. This is the kind of talk I would expect to hear at a pub called THE TARRED AND FEATHERED.

[NCTraveler]

404. While I'm all for transparency...

You have already earned your du cred in this area and no one is going to forget. Please stop.

[yardwork]

411. 68 recs but very few positive comments in the thread itself.

I'm wondering why the folks who applaud this are so silent.

[Ron Green]

418. Upon careful consideration, I've decided to recommend this OP.

I read the article, of course, and then read some things by and about Ben Tansoborn. And I read through this thread, filled with posts from those who obviously haven't done either, and probably weren't even alive when I first hung out with self-described "browns" in the U.S. Southwest in 1972.

Yeah, the article in question could be construed to be racially divisive, insensitive, stealing "agency" from people of color, or just crude in its use of the term "hara-kiri." But it's none of those, really, in the context of this author and this campaign. He's right on target with his message about a big, smooth marketing job being run upon not only rank-and-file people of color, but also (and especially) upon those leaders who've let their Beltway connections cloud their clear vision of the black and brown struggle.

[YCHDT]

423. It doesn't matter if the person who wrote this article is a person of color to intimate that

.... certain groups or ethnicities or cultures are not discerning is racist and bigoted it at the least

[Ron Green]

424. I believe that voting against one's own interests is not restricted

to working-class white people. Anyone can do it if the game is rigged.

[YCHDT]

426. Blacks have already indicated many times why they are voting for HRC

It's condescending to dismiss their reasoning as invalid or in this case not even address it at all.

It is not the fault of blacks or Latinos or gays or women or black Millennials that Bernie Sanders message does not resonate with them

[Ron Green]

427. Some have indicated why they're voting for Bernie, as well.

I agree with their reasoning, and disagree with the Clinton supporters.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

425. SMH

[Cali_Democrat]

428. Same here. nt