I look forward to the end of the primaries so that we can all work together in a common cause.

[rusty quoin]

[Joe the Revelator]

1. Electing a corporate war monger?

Yay!

[PowerToThePeople]

2. Bernie 2016!

eom

[Barack_America]

3. And what would that common cause be?

[rusty quoin]

4. To elect a Democrat.

[jfern]

6. Regardless of their views on the issues?

[Barack_America]

7. Hopefully one will be running.

[Joe the Revelator]

21. here here

[Autumn Colors]

80. If that Democrat is HRC

I expect there will be a large exodus from DU and the Dem. party.

Myself among them.

[Logical]

5. My vote will not be for Hillary but against the GOP. nt

[ybbor]

52. Don't worry.

You'll be voting for Bernie.

[BeyondGeography]

58. Absolutely nothing wrong with that

Really. There's a lot to vote against.

[Lizzie Poppet]

79. Fortunately, I need not make that Faustian bargain.

My winner-take-all-electors state is never going to tip for the Republican. I'm free to reject the "Republican Lite" without a single pang of conscience. And to continue voting for liberals downballot..

[PowerToThePeople]

81. Your geography should not be a factor

Even in a swing state, one should vote their conscience.

[angstlessk]

8. I too want the division to come to a conclusion

I truly hope for a Bernie President....but to end the fighting will be fine.

[rusty quoin]

11. +1

[mmonk]

9. I will be working to fight policies that increase income

inequality. That's probably going to be my cause for many years to come. And work to get money out of politics. I don't expect help from political parties. It's something we as people have to do.

[angstlessk]

16. You trickster..you will fight the increase of income

then you put inequality in the message text...

[jwirr]

71. Thank you because that is the overall message that we are

getting from Bernie. To fight the long fight against corruption.

[Codeine]

10. I do believe that ship has sailed, for DU at least. nt

[rusty quoin]

13. I hope not.

[2banon]

12. ....

[d_b]

14. shit

[monicaangela]

15. Some of us will be busy with the revolution after the primaries are over, no matter

what the outcome is. I intend to continue working to promote the ideas of Bernie Sanders.

[rusty quoin]

18. Yes, and it comes with winning the house in years to come.

BTW, Bernie has already won in moving the Nation left. I hope he wins It too.

[monicaangela]

20. Exactly rusty quoin

I am beginning to see that involvement in politics can't be an every two or four year project, it is something we need to do every day of our lives. I plan to devote as much time as I can from this day forward trying to move the country in a better direction. I know I am only one person, but with a little help from family and friends I'm sure we, together can make a difference. Yes Bernie has moved Clinton to the left for the moment, but I'm afraid that if she wins the nomination and the general she will revert back to her center right positions. This will cause a lot of voters to become disheartened and sit out the elections that will determine who runs the House and Senate. We need to remain vigilant. I also plan to get involved in local and state elections, they make a great difference in what we can get done on the federal level. We need more democratic or Independent Governors, Mayors, and legislators that actually write their own legislation. We need to get rid of citizens united, and the over abundance of paid lobbyist that are helping the wealthy ruin this nation. I'm happy to see you are a Bernie supporter and hope you will also join the fight.

[bobbobbins01]

24. Agreed. I'm working on something similar to DU to keep up momentum.

Without the stupid party pledges and kicking people out for going against the party. More just a place to push progressive positions, with a big focus on organizing at the state/county/city level. Start at the base and work up. I have a lot of experience running websites, so that part isn't the problem, I just worry people won't be interested.

[monicaangela]

29. I'm sure I would visit your site

and if I do I can guarantee you I can bring others along with me. Keep me informed as to what you decide, how you are doing, and if you need anything once you are set up.

[seaglass]

55. There is already a website that has been created exactly for that. It was heavily promoted at DU

by both current and ex-DUers. Why re-invent the wheel:

http://jackpineradicals.org/showthread.php?5081-Since-I-m-in-a-safe-place-can-I-just-say-this

[giftedgirl77]

62. Oh good, so you'll be leaving soon?

[bobbobbins01]

19. Same here, I'm with Bernie after the primary.

Hopefully as the democratic nominee. But if not, my focus goes to fighting for his ideas.

[monicaangela]

23. I'm happy to see we are in agreement bobbobbins01

See my reply above, it lays out some of the plans my family, friends and I have been discussing to keep the fight for implementation of the ideas of Bernie Sanders.

[Adrahil]

40. Frankly, you're better off doing that....

Than trying to get Bernie nominated. In order for ANY Democratic president to affect change, we need to change the composition of Congress. Go for it!

[monicaangela]

47. Getting Bernie nominated

is my first goal for now. If he doesn't get the nomination, I suppose I will be really busy because with a republican in the White House we will be going down hill really fast. I don't believe HC can win against even the poor caliber of republicans that are running.

[Samantha]

41. I was thinking that exact same thing earlier this evening

Regardless of the outcome of the election, those of us who believe in the economic revolution should remain together. I am thinking we should start a state-by-state list of contacts that is not shared with the DNC.

Sam

[monicaangela]

46. I agree Samantha

As you consider what you plan to do to get the list together let me know if there is something I can do. I would be happy to help with such a worthy cause. It is clear to see the democratic party no longer works in the best interest of the people of this nation. We need a new organization in this nation. An organization of for and by the people.

[jwirr]

73. Many of us are at the other site mentioned above already but

I would hope that we can keep the Bernie Group going here on DU also.

[BernieforPres2016]

17. Oh boy, another loyalty oath thread

I'm not voting for Hillary Nixon under any circumstances.

[Larkspur]

22. If Hillary is the Dem nominee, I'll basically be a spectator, at best, for the Prez race in the GE

I despise the Clintons and the Republicans, so I will have no enthusiasm for that race.

I live in CT, which is a blue state. That's not where Hillary's problem is. She is currently losing FL to Trump and struggles in many swing states.

I would not underestimate Trump. He took down the Bush Dynasty with Jeb's help. He can certainly take down the Clinton Dynasty with Hillary's help. Hillary will be a tougher nut to crack for Trump, but people are angry at the Establishment and Hillary reeks of being The Establishment.

Saw Chris Hayes interview a Republican caucus goer in Nevada. She told Chris that she voted for Obama in 2008 and 2012 and is now voting for Trump. A friend in CT said she had a friend who was a Democrat her whole life and is voting Trump in 2016.

[rusty quoin]

26. Yeah, the part about the Democrat voting for Trump makes little sense to me.

What would make more sense would be not voting. The more I know about politics, it seems the less I know.

[Kall]

33. It should make sense to you if you think it through.

For the better part of 30 years, the Democratic Party has been running for office railing against lousy trade deals that undermine the average American (but which the US Chamber of Commerce loves) and corporate money in politics, then once in office passing and/or doing nothing to remedy unfair trade deals that undermine the average American. NAFTA, MFN for China, Colombia, now the TPP. All while gorging on corporate money. You can't do that forever and expect people to be scared of the corporate Republicans.

Along comes Donald Trump who, along with his horrible campaign tactics, is self-funding his campaign, can honestly say he owes nothing to anyone, and calls the latest lousy trade deal (the TPP) the job-sucking agreement written by lobbyists that it is. If Donald Trump is the Republican candidate, and Hillary Clinton is the Democrats', he'll be running to Hillary Clinton's left on Iraq, money in politics, and trade. That should scare the living day lights out of the Democratic Party, and if you think campaigning on the ACA is going to do the trick, you're wrong. The ACA has been underwater in public opinion since Day One, and the Republican Party, contrary to what Democratic strategists were forecasting at the time it was passed (that it would be political suicide for the Republicans to move to repeal it because people would be so impressed with the benefits once they got to experience them) has paid no political price for trying to repeal it 60 times for that very reason.

It did not come as a surprise to me, and should not come as a surprise to you, that Hillary Clinton's emails reveal that she lobbied members of Congress as Secretary of State to pass trade deals that she campaigned against, rather than press Obama to renegotiate NAFTA like he pledged. It should also come as no surprise to you that the US Chamber of Commerce has openly said that Hillary will go back to being in favor of the "gold standard" TPP once it is no longer politically convenient to pretend she is against it - and Hillary Clinton has taken no offence at the statement.

How many times do you think the Democratic Party can do that and a lot of fed up people throw in their lot with even a candidate who's seriously flawed in other ways, like Donald Trump, warts and all?

[rusty quoin]

36. Trump has stolen true Democrats' thunder.

He's a celebrity, and those other people never had the ear for true Democrats. We have always been here, but we are not fans of reality shows.

[Fumesucker]

44. Only because the Democrats gave Trump a gift wrapped opportunity

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

63. Donald Trump will be Obama's legacy.

Having enthused so many, then delivered 80s style Republicanism, he paved the way for a charismatic RWer who actually will move left on a few issues.

[Contrary1]

43. But you are assuming that Trump wants to take down Clinton...

I'm not convinced that is his end goal.

[Larkspur]

50. I think Trump started his campaign on a lark, but as he kept beating

the other Rethugs in the polls and then in the primaries and caucuses, he got to like winning and believing that he can win the Rethug nomination and the WH.

Trump hates losing and he has a good shot to beat Hillary in the GE. Hillary will struggle in the "swing" states. She's already losing to Trump in FL.

[Erich Bloodaxe BSN]

64. She'll lose Ohio too.

Most folks here can't stand her.

[Live and Learn]

51. +1000 nt

[CrispyQ]

68. Also, the repubs have enthusiasm on their side, this election.

After 8 years of a black man in the White House, they are primed & ready to go. If HRC is the dem candidate, it will only fire them up more & dampen the already lack luster enthusiasm of the left. HRC is not the shoe in dem leadership thinks she is.

[Hydra]

25. Regardless of how this primary ends

Our party has been split. It doesn't matter if it is over tomorrow or after convention.

The rift between what we were and what our current leadership want is too great to bridge.

"There cannot be two skies."

[cantbeserious]

27. Yes, There Are Effectively Five Parties In America - The Oligarchs, Corporations And Banks Own Three

Republican - Corporate - Ownership Obvious

Republican - Teaparty - Funded by O, C, B

Democratic - Corporate - Compromised by O, C, B Through Efforts Of The DNC, DWS, DLC and Third Way

Democratic - Progressive - Sick and Tired of The DNC, DWS, DLC and Third Way

Independent - Sick and Tired of Both Establishment Parties

[ybbor]

59. Agreed

Maybe even a sixth, the apathetic. Those who see the system so rigged that they never even consider participating.

[cantbeserious]

60. Nice Addition To The Paradigm

eom

[rusty quoin]

28. 2008 was like it is now. The difference was Obama. At least we all ended up liking him in the end.

I don't know what will happen in the future.

[Hydra]

31. The difference was that we were more or less united in erasing the Bush Admin's influence on us

Obama ran on a platform of changing direction and removing the cancer they had become on our very narrative and outlook.

We had an utterly historic moment, a chance to shine as the party that repaired the damage of almost 30 years of RW misrule, including by Bill Clinton.

Somehow we graduated to this point, where social and economic progress is deemed impossible or undesirable. We've tolerated that...but now we have climate change to deal with. Something that will probably kill us all...and our party leadership is scrambling to keep everything in place that will hasten our demise.

Oops.

[rusty quoin]

32. Yeah, the oops is not voting.

[Hydra]

35. No, the oops is that our party leadership isn't reprisenting our values

A lot of people here on DU mocked core Bush supporters during his Admin for blindly supporting policies that were bad for all of us. Are you asking us to do the same? My President, right or wrong?

Mind you, this is me idealizing. Our party no longer wants our votes or our values, which is why the rift has opened.

I will happily vote in the GE just as I did in previous years for the current party if that's all that is offered- As they destroy our party, they give rise to actual people oriented movements. As I'm so found of telling Team Hill, "You're doing my work for me."

[rusty quoin]

39. Only by voting will you make the party more left.

It's the direction it's going, and I am happy. This stuff is a long and hard fought. So many times I believed others who said it's the end of Republicans for a generation, or at least wanted to believe.

Republican big wigs think long term. It's about time we do the same.

[Fumesucker]

45. Voting for Hillary will not make the party "more left"

If by some stroke of fate Hillary is elected she will spend the next four years punishing the Berniebros for insufficient loyalty, that's in the Clinton playbook.

[chillfactor]

30. same here....

I am really tired of all the back-biting going on in DU..I thought we were better people than that.

[Armstead]

34. Other than hold the nose time in Nov, I'm going to be disengaged from the sports match

Except as a possible firewall against the GOP, Clinton has nothing to offer as far as I'm concerned.

Give her the extorted vote, ok. Otherwise, meh.

[That Guy 888]

37. In that case I hope Sanders wins, because I don't see that happening with a Clinton win.

I caught part of her speech, could have sworn I heard something about people uniting? That can't be right given her scorched earth, take no prisoners campaign against Democratic candidates and voters who don't back her of course.

[Samantha]

42. I was not a Clinton fan to begin with since in 2003 I said I would never vote for anyone

for President who signed the authorization to allow Bush* to declare a preeminent war on Iraq. There were many people here at that time that agreed. I personally thought Hillary knew there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, but she planned on a future Presidential run and did not want to be perceived as weak when it came to war. But what I never expected would be that the day would come when I could respect her less than what I did in 2003. I am at the point now where I feel stunned by the type of campaign she has run, and I cannot believe so many are okay with it.

Yes, it is politics but it is also potentially our future government Executive Branch leader. And there should be a line drawn which serious candidates do not cross within their own parties, but evidently that is not the case. That being said, how can one assume those very same tactics will not appear from within the White House should one using them now prevail?

It is mindboggling to me that people who have witnessed this think that we will all be working together during the General Election because the political earth within this party has just been too scorched to heal that soon -- if ever.

The Third Way proponents need to leave the Democratic party and form their own party. The FDR Dems, the people I think of as classic Dems, were here first, and we are not interchangeable with the Third-Way.

Sam

[RiverLover]

49. Very well said. However while Traditional Dems were here first, between the Moneyed Interests' $$$ &

Consolidated media(5 corporations now, thanks Reagan & Clinton1!), I think this rigged election shows that maybe we need a new start & a new party. I don't see how we can get it back. Unless Clinton2 loses. Maybe.

But all we've got now is one corporate party. Blue or Red, which color do you prefer?

[Samantha]

69. We hammered the DLC until it folded, so I think we should at least try

Yes, I know some of the DLC waded into the Third Way waters and are still around. But I have the feeling there are more of us FDR Dems than Third-Way Dems. I think if we joined together and hit back, and especially give a lot of publicity to the difference between them and us, we can make progress. I am just not the type of person to roll over and start again. We should never have let the Bill Clinton influence get this far, and I think we should at least brainstorm on how to get our party back. After all, many of the programs we heartily embraced were passed by the Democratic party. How can we leave our heritage behind? And better yet, why should we?

Kick the Third Way out by constantly hammering their positions which are not the positions of many, many Americans, not just the FDR Dems but many Republicans as well.


JMHO
Sam

[monicaangela]

74. I agree RiverLover

Although I feel it will be very difficult to fight the two political machines that have a monopoly on our political system, I believe enough people are interested in joining that battle. The millennials have shown they are not satisfied with the status quo, and I believe that is where we need to begin making in roads if we are ever going to form this new political party.

[AgadorSparticus]

38. Me too. I don't think DU has ever gotten THIS nasty in the primaries before.

It is quite a drag to come onto DU these days with all the bickering.

[Le Taz Hot]

48. What common cause?

I don't sell out to oligarchs.

[Broward]

53. Exactly, there is no common cause with the oligarchs.

The delusion is mind boggling.

[Depaysement]

54. Not sure what I'll do if HRC wins

At my own expense, I usually do voter protection/gotv in black or mixed race working class precincts in Florida or Ohio. Definitely not doing that for Hillary.

[PonyUp]

56. 'You take Sally and I'll take Sue. Ain't no difference between the two.' nt

[Vinca]

57. I'll be closing the wallet and healing the wounds.

This election is proof positive to me the 2 party system doesn't work. True liberals will never have a chance to change this country for the better.

[monicaangela]

75. I agree Vinca

We are definitely not going to change the country or even get half of the issues we care about addressed by giving in and voting for someone we already know does not have our best interest at heart. If we are going to hold our noses and vote for a stooge of the Oligarch, we might as well just sit this one out and let the dedicated party members vote to give the country to those that are more rapidly now destroying it and the planet.

[Vinca]

77. I won't sit the election out, but my vote will be against something and not for something.

The old lesser of two evils thing. Since we don't have a parliamentary system, we empower the crackpots on the far right if we don't attempt to keep a millimeter of a slant on the scale to the left. Hillary is half a Republican, but that's better than the nuts on the far right would love to turn this country into a theocracy.

[monicaangela]

78. I never sit an election out

because there is more on the ballot than just the category of the run for President. I will be voting, but I won't hold my nose and vote for someone I vehemently disagree with. If the nation is going down the tubes with a republican or a democrat that I disapprove of, I refuse to help pull the chain that begins the flush. I will vote, but it will be a protest vote.

[auntpurl]

61. I look forward to the common cause bit, but...

I'd rather the primaries play out as they should, with as many voters as possible having their say before it becomes a mathematical inevitability. I don't think there's any need to rush this. Particularly if we want as many Dems as possible to come out in November, we should give their votes a voice in the primary.

I'm a Hillary supporter, but as far as I'm concerned, Democrats in this country need to choose our nominee - as many and as diverse a number of them as possible. A longer primary process will also strengthen the eventual nominee as it did for Obama in 2008.

[Gothmog]

65. I am also looking forward to the end of the primary process

[CrispyQ]

66. Yes, I'm looking forward to changing my affiliation back to Green.

She may get my vote, but I will never send a dime to or spend one minute on her campaign.

[Mufaddal]

72. I expect to be following you

[NurseJackie]

67. A very nice sentiment indeed!

(I wish I could be as optimistic as you. I hope I'm wrong.)

[MisterP]

70. privatizing Medicare and invading Denmark! whoo!

[McCamy Taylor]

76. So do Sanders and Clinton who will return to being BFFs.

Remember the story of the Tar Baby and Brer Rabbit? Apparently, the RNC forgot it when they put their money on Sanders. I wish I could watch as their heads explodes when Sanders and Clinton make kissey-kissey at the Convention this summer.