Hillary is accused of voter fraud on Democratic Underground and the

[Jackie Wilson Said]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by EarlG (a host of the 2016 Postmortem forum).

majority of you here have no problem with that.




http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1456458

Yes, after confirming with the OP that the intent of the thread was to accuse the Clinton campaign of voter fraud, I alerted on it.

Guilty as charged.

The results of the alert are amazing to me.

Makes me think maybe that poll that 33% of Bernie supporters wont vote for Hillary is true.

Nothing more selfish and scary than that.

I see now that the message is deleted? Not sure how that works.

What is disgusting is the majority of jurors see no problem accusing a Democrat of voter fraud.


Just so there is NO confusion, the allegation was made then doubled down on, before I alerted.

[arcane1]

1. I never saw the post, how can you say the majority of DU is okay with it?

Then again, you just got here. Eventually you'll figure out that there are more than 10 people posting here, and opinions are like assholes.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

2. Well, a jury had two hides and 5 let it stays. So I did the math.

uror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Had the slur against the Clinton campaign been omitted, I would have allowed this to stand. With it, not a chance.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Debate it in the thread! Stop these ridiculous alerts
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Meh......
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Refute it or move along.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Meh!
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Yes it can be allowed to stand...I don't know why you think it not.
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given

one person called it a RIDICULOUS alert to say we dont want people here accusing Democrats of voter fraud....I am or was under the impression DU was a place for democrats and liberals, obviously not.

[Maedhros]

14. Why does being a Democrat or Liberal mean that we have to handle Hillary with kid gloves?[n/t]

[Jackie Wilson Said]

17. So you too would like to accuse the Clintons of election or voter fraud?

[fun n serious]

41. Have you read the TOS here?

You would not want us to go full on FREEPER on you and we don't. We wouldn't.

[riversedge]

16. Thanks. I do not like what DU has become. It is shameful.

[bvf]

34. And yet, here you are,

working within the system. Good on you, I say.

[arcane1]

32. This isn't North Korea, we are allowed to criticize politicians no matter what party they are in.

Again, having not seen the post, I can't comment on its contents.

This OP is nothing more than an excuse to shit on DU, and it's a lame one.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

37. It was deleted but it was a very long post about how maybe Clinton was committing

election fraud.

The poster admitted that was the intent of the thread, which is when I alerted.

No, not NK, but DU has rules.

They no longer apply, I know.

[arcane1]

43. You know nothing, apparently, about DU rules.

You're just here to shit on the site. We've seen this tactic many times over the years.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

52. I know nothing about the rules?

This is one of them, tell me how you can accuse a Democrat, maybe the leading Democrat for the WH of election fraud and

Vote for Democrats.

At the same time?

Then there is this one, how can you accuse the Democratic Party and leading candidate Hillary Clinton of election fraud and not be

Don't be a wingnut (right-wing or extreme-fringe).

a wingnut?

[arcane1]

62. Thank you for proving my point n/t

[Lizzie Poppet]

33. You realize that a sample set of that size is statistically useless, right?

It tells you two things about DU'ers as a whole. One of those things is "jack."

[Jackie Wilson Said]

35. Look at this thread, I am absolutely correct.

[Lizzie Poppet]

42. A sample set of 36 (as I write this) is only slightly more valid.

No, you are not even remotely correct, to say nothing of "absolutely." No one who knows even the most basic things about how statistical analysis works would agree with you.

[FarPoint]

39. Thank you for sharing.

Yes, DU is intolerable at this phase of Primary Wars... Hillary will once again survive... March 15 will deflate the false rhetoric...that said...you are very perceptive.

[Armstead]

40. I agree with Jurors 2 and 4

[ibegurpard]

3. the problem with that OP

Is casting aspersions upon absentee balloting or vote by mail. It is a proven method of increasing voter turnout and is no more susceptible to fraud than any other method of voting.

[Wilms]

8. You got the turnout part right.

But absentee and vote by mail are inherently more vulnerable. Think chain of command issues, for one.

It's a very awkward subject.

[ibegurpard]

19. the State of Oregon is entirely vote by mail

With no voting irregularities. There are checks in place to verify ballots. Peoples' opinions about it being inherently more open to fraud are not grounded in reality.

[Wilms]

29. Believe me, I believe you mean it.

I've heard it over and over since I began studying voting systems 10 years ago. It is quite possible for that system to work perfectly, but it is not invulnerable.

Again, it's a sore subject for the geeks who have to mention what they know about election management.

[FogerRox]

45. Then you should know that Oregon has an above average record when it comes to vote by mail.

Did you know that the Sequoia Advantage DRE is run off a Z-80 Zilog chip?

[Wilms]

60. Yo, Foger! Where you've been?

And how are you??

And for goodness sake, precinct voting doesn't require DREs. You know that.

What you might point out is that the ballots are OpScanned. I've seen Oregonians post that since they vote on PAPER there's no computers involved.

All that understandable effort to ban DREs led to some exaggerated claims about the virtue of OpScan.

[mooseprime]

4. isn't the question one of election fraud

rather than voter fraud?

[FogerRox]

47. 100% correct.

[TheCowsCameHome]

5. You really should self-delete your post.

That's pretty broad accusation you've made there, newbie.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

6. No accusation, fact. Look at the results.

Whether I have been here one day or ten years, math is math

[TheCowsCameHome]

7. Read your first sentence.

S L O W L Y, if necessary.

This site has what? 150,000 members? And you pick FIVE?

[Jackie Wilson Said]

10. What part of 2 hides and 5 stays is confusing to you?

[TheCowsCameHome]

15. Aw, sour grapes,

make some whine.........

[Jackie Wilson Said]

20. Sour god damn grapes? Accusing one of the Democratic candidates of electiion or voter fraud

is good with you?

[TheCowsCameHome]

24. So you blanket-insult the entire DU group based on that?

Enjoy your stay.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

26. I will gladly have you and others come here and denounce the allegation, have you done that yet?

Oh, no, you havent.

[yawnmaster]

27. except for the slur, during election season, candidates can be targets. eom

[Maedhros]

18. Out of 150K members, you base your assertion on a sample size of 7.

Not statistically significant by a long stretch.

You know what? It's not worth it.

/ignore list.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

21. Yes, please do ignore me if you are good with accusing Democrats of election and

voter fraud.

[Lizzie Poppet]

36. What part of Statistics 101 is confusing you you?

Never took that course? Trust me, that's obvious.

[hobbit709]

9. Stirring the pot.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

12. You mean the person who accused the Clintons of voter or election fraud or me.

Surely you cant possibly mean me.

[hobbit709]

23. ...

[Jackie Wilson Said]

28. Got it, the person alleging voter fraud by a Democrat, good with you, the person upset about that

you dont have time for.

Good to know.

[BlueMTexpat]

11. I am glad that the poster deleted the OP.

I was on the Jury and voted to hide. I would have had no problem with the post other than the fact that it included the slur.

But 5 out of 7 saw no problem at all with it. That reinforces my belief that some here are much more interested in bashing Hillary than in electing their candidate.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

13. Thank you. You speak the truth, sadly.

[yawnmaster]

22. why would it be an alertable post? were there member callouts? eom

[hobbit709]

25. There are many easily offended among us.

[yawnmaster]

30. It is easier to hit the alert than to make a rational argument, sadly...

I'm all for hiding callouts, direct attacks on members, and a few other limited things (explicit racism, for example). But if something is arguable, one should rationally argue!

[Jackie Wilson Said]

31. So alleging voter and election fraud by a Democrat is good to do here?

By the way, you are all proving my point about the numbers here at Democratic Underground.

[Le Taz Hot]

38. Atomic Kitten is a long-time, respected DUer.

You? Who are you again?

[Jackie Wilson Said]

44. And that has WHAT IN THE HELL to do with accusing the Clintons of election fraud?

Each post in this thread PROVES my original statement.

Almost every post in this thread SUPPORTS the idea that the Clintons should be accused of this.

[Le Taz Hot]

48. You're embarrassing yourself, there, son.

Stop while you're behind.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

61. ...

Since 9 out of ten posts on this thread see NO problem

accusing Clinton of election fraud, my work is done here.

[Le Taz Hot]

68. And he runs off with his tail between his legs.

You should have exited sooner.

[arcane1]

51. Fail. Respecting one's right to their opinion is not the same as agreeing with them.

You know better than that, don't you?

[CorkySt.Clair]

46. No slur is too low for some in that crowd

and Bernie fans don't get hides here so not sure what you were expecting.

Be careful though, their alert squads have been very active today silencing dissent.

[Le Taz Hot]

50. And another "newbie."

You don't even have comic relief value -- unlike the OP.

[CorkySt.Clair]

54. Ohhh middle school taunts

I'm so intimidated. If I don't comply will you seize my lunch money and not let me in the cool kids club?

[arcane1]

66. And they all think they are SO original and SO smooth.

[TheCowsCameHome]

57. C'mon Corky, be original for once.

[noamnety]

49. Hi Jackie,

Without commenting on the rest of your post, this line in your OP doesn't make sense to me:

"What is disgusting is the majority of jurors see no problem accusing a Democrat of voter fraud."

and the reason it doesn't make sense is that the thread you are referring to documents an irrefutable case of a democrat committing voter fraud. From that thread: "Former Pennsylvania Democrat congressman Austin Murphy was convicted in 1998 of visiting nursing homes and improperly “assisting” the filling out of absentee ballots. "

And there are a fair amount of other examples - for instance, from last year: http://www.dothaneagle.com/news/crime_court/olivia-reynolds-found-guilty-of-counts-of-voter-fraud/article_f1e41832-51ab-11e5-b6fc-dfcad6ddb7db.html

[Jackie Wilson Said]

55. And then the OP admitted the point of the thread was to accuse Clinton of election fraud.

[noamnety]

63. Can you clarify your OP?

"What is disgusting is the majority of jurors see no problem accusing a Democrat of voter fraud."

Do you think it's disgusting to accuse any democrats of voter fraud? Or it's okay to accuse other democrats, just not Hillary?

[arcane1]

71. Her Royal Highness must NEVER be questioned, it seems.

I won't be missing this ingenuous one.

[Hoyt]

53. At least when Clinton loses, we don't have endless conspiracy theories about fraud, coin tosses,

Bill Clinton chasing off all the Sanders' voters, and crazier stuff.

[CorkySt.Clair]

59. They're already pumping the Illinois meme

If Bernie loses it will be because of the all powerful Rahm Emmanuel.

[Hoyt]

69. I don't doubt it. Pre- as well as post-primary conspiracy theories just crack me up.

[giftedgirl77]

56. This place has been invaded by angry little independents.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

58. It really is amazing. Since 9 out of ten posts on this thread see NO problem

accusing Clinton of election fraud, my work is done here.

[TheCowsCameHome]

70. Nice job.

Where are you playing this weekend?

[Le Taz Hot]

65. Yeah, not like the good old days

when DU was populated buy unthinking blind party loyalists. Give me a break.

[cannabis_flower]

64. Democrats

over the years have been known to commit voter fraud. I remember hearing stories of Lyndon Johnson's first Senate election being accused of ballot stuffing. Democrats and Republicans have both been known to do it over the years. It happens. Both sides and within Democratic and Republican primaries. Don't be naive and think it doesn't happen.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

74. That is election fraud, not voter fraud. And You have just approved of the GOP attack

on the Democratic party and given a reason for voter ID.

I cant believe I am having this discussion here, but I am and many here are with you on that.

[KingFlorez]

67. Fraud is an easy excuse

Pay posts like that no attention. They absurd.

[boomer55]

72. I wonder if its because its indicative of her being seen by so many as untrustworthy?

I'm not trying to make an attack on her its just that her numbers reflect a very high number of people find her untrustworthy and/or unfavorable in polls.

[riderinthestorm]

73. Since none of us can see the post, why should we take your word for it?

Atomic Kitten's been here a long time and has a long history of being interested in election fraud. She's not a shit stirrer on this topic and if she had links, I for one would have wanted to see them.

Furthermore, there's plenty of DUers who now won't vote to hide any posts in GDP since POC are being shamefully alert stalked.

You have no idea why some folks vote to hide or not. Some DUers believe the debate should continue in the thread, not shut down points of view you just happen to disagree with.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

76. How about this...please respond to this, it is in the thread, you can find it yourself

me

Please tell me you are not promoting the idea that Clinton is having voter fraud committed on

her behalf in anyway.

Please tell me this is not what you are doing.

atomic kitten

I'm considering it.

There is video of Clinton supporters buzzing registration lines and going in to vote in Nevada's caucuses without registering. There is video of Pres Bill Clinton violating election law/skirting the rules in Massachusetts by electioneering at four precincts. And the list goes on. Documented. There is huge disparity between Bernie's and Hillary's absentee voters. So, yes, I think this is worthy of consideration.

[UglyGreed]

75. Guess what??? Fraud

can be perpetrated by both parties...... get over it.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

77. And another who accuses the Clintons of election fraud.