If You're Liberal and You Think Hillary Clinton Is Corrupt and Untrustworthy,

[upaloopa]

You're Rewarding 25 Years of GOP Smears

Obviously, Clinton carries with her more than 25 years in the white-hot public spotlight that Sanders doesn't -- despite his career in the Senate -- and over that length of time people have been able to form opinions of her and they're ones not likely to change at this point. What you know about Hillary is what you know about Hillary. There aren't a lot of surprises. Maybe you figure this is bad for her, but in truth it can be argued that this is a positive rather than a negative because there's nothing the Republicans can throw at her that we haven't already been fed to death. And when you take a step back and look at Clinton objectively -- which is admittedly difficult for many, even, or maybe particularly, on the left -- that's exactly the point. Hillary Clinton's reputation is largely the result of a quarter century of visceral GOP hatred.

Bernie Sanders will never be president. Let's just get that out of the way right now. He stands very little chance of pulling down the Democratic nomination and no chance at all of winning a general election. His rabid acolytes can argue with this all they want but they'll be wrong for several inarguable reasons: because the "political revolution" Bernie Sanders needs to advance his campaign and agenda is pie-in-the-sky thinking that simply doesn't occur in representative democracies like ours, where change always comes incrementally and our entire system is designed so it can't be remade in one fell swoop; because he's a one-note candidate who concerns himself with nothing other than his admittedly noble lifelong obsession with wealth inequality; because America isn't evolved enough to elect an avowed socialist, democratic or otherwise, and it unfortunately won't get near someone who openly eschews religion; and maybe most importantly because once the GOP considered Bernie a sworn enemy rather than the perfect foil it can use to destroy Hillary Clinton, it would eat him alive. Eat. Him. Alive.

There's one more reason Bernie won't succeed -- a very big one -- and it has to do with something I just mentioned. The fact is, he's up against a very formidable candidate for the nomination in Hillary Clinton. Now maybe you doubt this is an insurmountable obstacle because you've seen a flurry of reports over the past couple of weeks of Clinton struggling while Bernie is surging. And you almost certainly have friends clogging up your Facebook feed with impassioned screeds about how Clinton just can't be trusted, how she's an establishment shill with too little integrity and too much scandal and baggage attached to her, how she might even be the embodiment of pure political evil. Obviously, Clinton carries with her more than 25 years in the white-hot public spotlight that Sanders doesn't -- despite his career in the Senate -- and over that length of time people have been able to form opinions of her and they're ones not likely to change at this point. What you know about Hillary is what you know about Hillary. There aren't a lot of surprises. Maybe you figure this is bad for her, but in truth it can be argued that this is a positive rather than a negative because there's nothing the Republicans can throw at her that we haven't already been fed to death.

http://thedailybanter.com/2016/01/hillary-gop-smears/

[Arugula Latte]

1. So now her own documented actions and recorded statements are "smears"?

How convenient for Hillary.

[Shadowflash]

2. +1000

nt

[boomer55]

8. [phone]

[UglyGreed]

9. +100000000000000000

[Matariki]

14. Exactly. Criticize her ACTUAL record

the things she has actually really said, and the actual associates she keeps and you're 'sexist' or 'repeating right wing smears'. How utterly fucking convenient for her.

[vintx]

16. LOL yep - facts have always had a liberal bias

don'tchaknow

[HooptieWagon]

19. That mean ol' GOP FORCED her to put a server in her basement.

...and FORCED her to accept bribes from the Saudis just before signing off on an arms deal. Those mean old Republicans!

[kath]

81. And they forced her to push fracking around the world! She didn't really wanna do it - honest!

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. I cannot wait for the actual smears

the guns already opened, and that one was cute and mild. Cannot wait for the full cannonade of actual, well smears and worst to open up. I will just sit back and enjoy the outrage.

[Logical]

35. Lol, great point! Nt

[Betty Karlson]

43. ^this^ and +1000

[840high]

59. .^that

She should have been honest and not corrupt.

[Generic Other]

62. I am willing to concede that she has endured hell because of rightwing attacks on her

In fact, I would even confess to be weary of the idea of mounting a defense on her behalf given the sheer animosity she faces. They wear me down in terms of trying to defend her actions over the years.

That's why it makes it doubly hard when I feel as though she has been too conciliatory to them when all they do is spit on her gestures.

She should have voted against Bush's wars. She should have fought harder for our side where Wall Street was concerned. She should have stood against TPP and fracking. These are the things I have had issues with. I'm trying to come to grips with them. It is hard because my lines in the sand are the ones that have been shifted so often by Hillary herself. If I have to get over that, so be it. So far, I have not though.

And it may be my reluctance to have to fight her battles that continues to stand in my way when it comes to throwing my support to her.

[Mad-in-Mo]

64. Agreed!

nt

[nc4bo]

68. +1. No kidding! She'd win gold if lying was an Olympic event!

She's ON RECORD. That's no damn smear, that's the pure, unadulterated truth.

[truedelphi]

82. If she were to become President, perhaps lying will be an Olympic Event.

OF COURSE, poll after poll now shows she cannot beat Trump, if it comes down to her and the Donald.

[Raine]

92. Exactly! nt

[revbones]

3. Yeah, sure. She's a paragon of virtue and it's all just lies.

Ridiculous.

[amborin]

4. "the very concept of objective truth is fading out of the world." Orwell

[eggman67]

6. But..but...she's doubleplusgood n/t

[Hiraeth]

52. its her turn, line forms to the right.

[casperthegm]

5. HRC is corrupt and untrustworthy

And I'm not a naive Sanders supporter. I'm an informed voter. I've reviewed their records and there are real issues here, not rhetoric. Am I making any of the following up?

Clinton’s position on Keystone (or lack of one). She waited until the same week that Obama made his decision before announcing where she stood. That's not standing up for the environment. That's politics.

Wall Street money. Whether it's impression or reality, it's there and it can't help but make me wonder. Generally speaking, it's hard to imagine the banks and Wall Street throwing all of that money at her and saying "here you go, we don't expect anything in return."

Where are the transcripts?

Her opposition to Glass Stegall. Though I do recall her telling the banks to "cut it out." Thanks Hillary.

She supports fracking.

Her Iraq vote. You may be sick of hearing about it but it's a big deal. It was poor judgement and lack of foresight. Sanders saw that it would destabilize the region. And it did. Now we not have the legacy of the Iraq war, we have the current ISIS situation.

Speaking of that, there is the no-fly zone proposal. Another poor foreign policy decision. What happens when Russian jets cross that line? You have to be prepared for that and I don't see it.

The email and server investigation by the FBI. Sorry, it's real. It very well could end up being nothing in the end, but what if it's not? What if it drags on until the general election and then she gets indicted? Then you end up with a republican in the White House.

Gay marriage. You can see how she has flip flopped over the years, as confirmed via politifact. Another change based on the political winds.

Her support of the TPP – before she changed and now opposes it.

Her auto bailout lie regarding Sanders

Her Koch brothers smear

Her one issue candidate smear

This is the kind of record I expect to see from Ted Cruz, not a Democratic nominee for president. Come on...

[vintx]

17. +1 to all of that

[casperthegm]

21. thank you

I swear, the HRC supporters act like all of these very important issues are just window dressing. "Keep moving, nothing to see here."

[Armstead]

26. Yep. facts are stubborn things

[casperthegm]

28. And go unaddressed by Clinton supporters

But then again, when there is no defense, what can HRC supporters do?

[truedelphi]

84. Oh apparently if the results of a recent

Alert can be believed, the HRC folks are glad to respond to our facts.

They simply call them lies!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1513368

This got hidden for supposedly repeating Bernie Sanders's supporters' lies about Hillary!

[casperthegm]

86. Thank you, thank you, thank you

These things are real, not things I'm just making up. If someone has an issue with it, use big boy words and let's have a discussion.

[Lizzie Poppet]

7. If you're a liberal and think Hillary is corrupt and untrustworthy...

...it means you're free from cranio-rectal inversion. Congratulations!

The GOP could not even exist, to say nothing of pointing out Hillary's faults, and she'd still be a corrupt, bought-off, warmongering disaster.

[SamKnause]

27. ...

[NurseJackie]

10. Also, it's important to note how well she's doing IN SPITE OF the years of endless attacks & smears.

It demonstrates what a STRONG candidate she is if she's able to overcome all these obstacles that have been placed in her path, and to withstand all the lies and smears (and other shit) that's continually hurled at her.

Her vote-count, her delegate-count, her union endorsements, her political endorsements, her celeb endorsements, her newspaper endorsements are ALL OUTWEIGHING (almost to an embarrassing degree) those that Bernie has managed to cobble together. All of these things are INCLUSIVE of the negativity that's thrown her way.

There can be no doubt that she's impressively strong NOW, but just imagine how much more impressive things would be if those negative aspects weren't part of the equation.

She's on track to become a president that outshines Obama in accomplishments and historical significance. I can't wait!

Go, Hillary! We love you!

[Politicalboi]

33. How well she's doing?

When they're losing half the party over her. Whatever. We all don't love her.

[Jarqui]

50. "it's important to note how well she's doing IN SPITE OF the years of endless attacks & smears"

Yep, she did a lot of dishonest attacks against and smears of Bernie, lying her way to the nomination. That's true. Can't argue with that.

Let's bookmark this thread and see how you feel about "endless attacks & smears" a couple of months into the general election, when the Koch brothers and Crossroads, etc have weighed in. I think you're going to find how Bernie treated her to be quite a bit different.

[pandr32]

80. She has a lot of support

And she has earned it all.
Proud to be with her!

[Waiting For Everyman]

11. Denial is not working.

In case the writer hadn't noticed.

[hellofromreddit]

12. Hello from reddit. I've seen quite a few posters from here over there.

I wanted to pop in and talk to you guys about the tone of supporters. I've collected links to the two major subs:
/r/SandersForPresident and /r/HillaryClinton. These links span the day before the respective primary/caucus to the day after and are all at the end of this comment. Feel free to peruse them and take note of the tone in OPs and comments.

The general pattern in the Sanders group has been to focus on participation. There is certainly some negative stuff towards Clinton, but it only gets traction after a loss, and even then it's not much. Really vile stuff gets downvoted into oblivion or removed. The bulk of the posts are positive: here's why we vote FOR Sanders, here's what you can do to participate, here's how you can amplify your own voice. Voter turnout is a big deal. That message comes from the top.

OTOH, in the Hillary sub the general tone is more geared towards shaming people out of voting for anyone but Hillary. Actually there was a top post that explicitly discussed shaming anyone who'd vote Trump. But there is far less discussion of positively influencing the election. It mostly turns on an air of inevitability and calling Sanders' supporters misguided. That message also comes from the top.

And then there's "BernieBros." Now, it has nowhere near the stigma of actual racist slander, but it's still being used in exactly the same way--it's a name that emphasizes the worst part of a group and tries to paint all other members of that group as equivalent. It gets used as a verbal weapon to shut down conversations all the time. I see lots of that around here, too.

The latest talking point appears to be telling Sanders’ supporters that solicitations for donations are usurious at this point and that donating to his campaign is a waste of money. More of the shaming/calling people stupid angle.

Hillary’s campaign is looking like the Wendy Davis campaign in Texas. And you Hillary people should really be worried about this if you’re as afraid of Trump as you let on.

Wendy Davis ran a campaign of “I am not.” What she wasn’t was a conservative, and while that’s a workable way to campaign to democrats, it gets zero traction among conservatives. So, in the conservative state of Texas, she went nowhere.

As to how this compares to Hillary, her campaign to this point is largely built on “I am not.” She caricatures her opponent and then points and says, “I am not that.” And that works fine for people who already support her. But it goes nowhere fast for people who oppose her. That’s part of the reason you see so many comments to the effect of “Sanders or bust.” Her campaign has done nothing to appeal to them, and then the supporters come in to heap on the shame for failing to comply (eg. “Not voting for Hillary is the same as voting for Trump.”)

I’ve got bad news. Many of the Sanders base would otherwise be in the Trump base (Trump has a whole lot of disaffected democrats), so comments like that only energize them. Now, I know there’s a lot of confusion as to why there would be any overlap between Trump and sanders people, so let me explain what I’ve seen from canvassing. It goes back to Hillary’s “I am not,” campaign. Most of the failed republican field has run similar campaigns of “I am not” (the only other republicans left in the race are the two who got away from that). Trump and Sanders are both running campaigns built on “We can be.” Sure, Trump is full of crap, but that doesn’t matter to a lot of people because they think lying is an integral part of politics and he’s just beating the rest at their own game. However, some are turned off by him and instead have turned to Sanders’ positive message and his long reputation for honest work. If Sanders leaves the race, they won’t abandon their dream of a better future and Hillary simply isn’t articulating one. She just talks about her past and keeping us on the same track we’re on today—which doesn’t look very appealing to the people sliding into poverty. No amount of insulting and shaming them will change that.

When I see folks try to say the two parties are just two sides of the same coin there are always people who decry the false equivalency and adamantly assert that the two parties are fundamentally different. But if those people get called out on negative campaigning from Hillary, then equivalency is just fine. Fact is that the Sanders campaign is positive, the Clinton campaign is negative, and the Trump campaign is utterly immune to the negative. Just as the Abbott campaign was in Texas.

Inspired voters vote, browbeaten voters don’t.

I’ll be backing the Sanders campaign all the way to the convention. I work for people who actually work FOR my vote.


Iowa, Clinton: link

Iowa, Sanders: link

New Hampshire, Clinton: link

New Hampshire, Sanders: link

Nevada, Clinton: link

Nevada, Sanders: link

South Carolina, Clinton: link

South carolina, Sanders: link

Super Tuesday, Clinton: link

Super Tuesday, Sanders: link

March 5th, Clinton: link

March 5th, Sanders: link

Maine, Clinton: link

Maine, Sanders: link

Michigan & Mississippi, Clinton: link

Michigan & Mississippi, Sanders: link

Marianas Islands, Clinton: link

Marianas Islands, Sanders: link

Second Super Tuesday, Clinton: link

Second Super Tuesday, Sanders : link

[marions ghost]

18. excellent post!

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. Thanks, not from Reddit

but other social media, I have the same exact observations

[Fumesucker]

25. Thanks for sharing and welcome..

[Turn CO Blue]

32. ^THIS^. ONE THOUSAND TIMES ^THIS^ n/t

[BreakfastClub]

54. I hang out at reddit all the time, and the BernieBros are vicious over there. nt

[SheilaT]

60. Thank you for that insightful

analysis. I need to figure out how to be on reddit effectively. I'm signed up but when I go there I can't figure out how to navigate the site. No worries, as I have a son coming to visit tomorrow who promises he'll help me with it.

[hellofromreddit]

65. There is no centralized directory

You'll have to find the various areas by links or by searching. For politics, go to http://www.reddit.com/r/Democrats . On the right hand column will be a description of the sub (subreddit) and some links to other subs you can explore. /r/politics is ostensibly the political sub, but it gets attacked by brigaders regularly, so not a good place to start. Terrible signal/noise ratio.

Welcome!

[obamanut2012]

71. It's apparently Opposite Day on DU

[Starry Messenger]

72. This is the first page of Hillary's sub.

There is exactly one thread about the consequences of not voting for HRC, and it is an article from the Guardian.

Hillary Clinton was liberal. Hillary Clinton is liberal. (538) (fivethirtyeight.com)
submitted 4 hours ago by Spudmiester
55 commentssharesavehidereport
•

Obama Privately Tells Donors That Time is Coming to Unite Behind Hillary Clinton (nytimes.com)
submitted an hour ago by dangzal
21 commentssharesavehidereport
85

Take ActionIf you can't make it to the Washington caucus next week, please submit your Absentee Ballot Information before this Friday. Make your vote count! (dailykos.com)
submitted 5 hours ago by Craterdome#ImWithHer
2 commentssharesavehidereport
56

538 Updated & Shows Hillary at 110% of Targets! (projects.fivethirtyeight.com)
submitted 3 hours ago by swww2198#ImWithHer
14 commentssharesavehidereport
52

Obama is increasingly involved in the 2016 presidential campaign (washingtonpost.com)
submitted 3 hours ago by wenchette
33 commentssharesavehidereport
•

Senator @brianschatz endorses @HillaryClinton for president (twitter.com)
submitted an hour ago by HFA_Observer#ShesWithUs
4 commentssharesavehidereport
61

Off-TopicNone of the Top 10 Highest-Paid Bernie Sanders Staffers Are Women (nymag.com)
submitted 5 hours ago by orek74Newbie
50 commentssharesavehidereport
51

Broad City - Hello, Hillary (youtu.be)
submitted 4 hours ago by ZiapoliticsLove & Kindness
10 commentssharesavehidereport
31

Review: Hillary Clinton’s Broad City Appearance Was a Win, for Her and the Show (time.com)
submitted 2 hours ago by shrob86Gay Jewish Hillennial[🍰]
5 commentssharesavehidereport
55

Cyndi Lauper Endorses Hillary Clinton for President (billboard.com)
submitted 5 hours ago by OrnaMint#ImWithHer
3 commentssharesavehidereport
28

Off-TopicElijah Cummings annihilates Michigan governor Rick Snyder during Flint hearing (rawstory.com)
submitted 2 hours ago by progress18I'm with her - ॐ
1 commentsharesavehidereport
•

President Obama to donors: the time is coming to unite behind Hillary Clinton (nytimes.com)
submitted 59 minutes ago by burritoman12Establishment Hundredaire
1 commentsharesavehidereport
27
Off-TopicTrump considered a "Global Risk", ranked higher than oil shock or war with China in the South Sea. (gfs.eiu.com)
submitted 2 hours ago by wyldcraftHillionaire
1 commentsharesavehidereport
37
I can't resubmit the link but Clinton's FULL Broad City cameo is now available on the CC website! (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 4 hours ago by somethingratherother
19 commentssharesavehidereport
•

Hillary Clinton’s Sisterhood of Comedy: With allies like the women of “Broad City”—and Kate McKinnon, Ellen DeGeneres, Amy Poehler, and Amy Schumer—the candidate doesn't have to be funny. (bloomberg.com)
submitted an hour ago by piede#ImWithHer
3 commentssharesavehidereport
•

"People who refuse to vote for Hillary Clinton on principle may be able to ride out the storm of a Republican administration. Many of us can’t" (theguardian.com)
submitted 57 minutes ago by ZeOppositeOfProgress
commentsharesavehidereport
39
Take ActionNeed your help phonebanking to Idaho (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 5 hours ago by ItWillBeMine
4 commentssharesavehidereport
45

Clinton super PAC won't spend more on primary (politico.com)
submitted 6 hours ago by brownearsSenior
17 commentssharesavehidereport
38
Arizona1st Arizona Poll (Merrill Poll) has Hillary at 50% and Bernie at just 24% (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 5 hours ago * by vartraxMM Establishment Donor
14 commentssharesavehidereport
•

Progressive Democrats of America says that Hillary "won the Confederacy" (twitter.com)
submitted an hour ago by joina4uNY/FR
23 commentssharesavehidereport
59
Who's it going to be?Most likely running mate? (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 8 hours ago by the_diamond
212 commentssharesavehidereport
32
WashingtonAny Hillary supporters in the Portland area? We're in Vancouver, WA organizing for the upcoming Washington caucus on March 26, come join us! (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 5 hours ago * by Craterdome#ImWithHer
10 commentssharesavehidereport
22
New YorkReceived my NY absentee ballot. Question? (self.hillaryclinton)
submitted 3 hours ago * by captainamericasbutt
9 commentssharesavehidereport
27

Clinton's bold vision, hidden in plain sight? (nytimes.com)
submitted 4 hours ago by LadyBrett_Ashley
7 commentssharesavehidereport

[DianaForRussFeingold]

75. K&R "If Sanders leaves the race, they won’t abandon their dream of a better future"

Trump as President would be our worst nightmare.. I can't understand why any Democrat would even think of voting for Trump--the total opposite of Bernie Sanders.

I blame the media--They shut down progressive talk...
We need to get the "Fairness Doctrine" back.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairness_Doctrine

[AtomicKitten]

76. Interesting analysis. Thanks. k/r

[HooptieWagon]

88. [phone]

[marions ghost]

13. Hillary has earned her negatives

Sure she has had to put up with a lot of hell from the opposition but so have all the Dems.

Doesn't make her a good presidential candidate. Certainly not for anyone who really cares about the direction this country is going.

[truedelphi]

77. Great Answer Number One.

And thank you!

[Autumn]

15. Here's another take on that.

If You're Liberal and You Think Hillary Clinton Is Corrupt and Untrustworthy... Well that's her fault .She's responsible for her own action.

[truedelphi]

79. And yours is great answer Number Two.

From some of the crap that the entrenched DLC types are spinning, you would think that we held a gun to her head and made her do the bidding of her Corporate Overlords.

[IndyV0te]

23. Why keep the Establishment in power?

All of them are corrupt.

Have you ever seen a poor politician? Some may get into politics for a genuinely good reason (wanting to help people), but the concentration of power and money corrupts everyone eventually. Geezus...the Clintons are one of the WORST examples of this.

Vote for Hillary? Are you crazy?

The Clintons, Bushes, Obamas, Cheneys, Fords, ...they are all the ESTABLISHMENT. They are the PROBLEM. They are the OLIGARCHY.

I say again: Why the He11 do I want to keep them in power?

[MohRokTah]

24. K&R

The delusions of the extreme left border on being equivalent to the delusions of the extreme right.

[Armstead]

29. Surpassed only by the delusions of those who think Corporate Conservatism equals Liberalism

[BillZBubb]

34. Bingo!

[MohRokTah]

36. OLIGARCHY!!! CORPORATIST!!!! BANKSTER!!!!!!

[Armstead]

46. Yeah really funny that almost all of out economy resides in the top 10 percent

The demise of the Middle Class is a real scream!

Whenever I hear of new foreclosure I laugh my ass off.

I get a real scream of delight when I see single mothers having to feed their kids Chef Boyardee everyday because that's all she can afford.


I'm glad we share the same sense of humor.

[MohRokTah]

49. The exteme left rhetorical bullshit CRACKS ME UP!!!

[Armstead]

53. To quote an old saying...Denial is not a river in Egypt

I have the feeling some here think Paul Ryan is a leftist

[white_wolf]

93. Okay, I keep hearing Sanders and his suppoters being called the "extreme Left" and I'm sick of it.

Because it's not true! Communists, Marxists, anarchists are the extreme left. Sanders is, or at least his platform is, Social-Democrat like they have in Europe. While I'm sure there are some Marxists and other far-leftists that support Sanders, most of them do not. Most of the far-left views Sanders as, at best, a well-intentioned reformist who doesn't understand the power of capital in society and whose campaign is harmful to the left because it gives the working class false hope that electoral politics can accomplish real change. And that's being generous, the more critical elements of the far-left consider him an opportunist.

So stop calling Sanders and the vast majority of his supporters part of the "extreme left" because its clear that you have no clue what the actual far-left is.

[vintx]

39. Never thought I'd see people trying to spin neolib free trade bills as being progressive -

at least not without being paid to do so - but I've seen it here.

[Armstead]

55. Screwing Americans is some people's version of Liberalism

[Politicalboi]

30. Blame the GOP

I remember when they held a gun to her head and made her lie about sniper fire. She's a pathological LIAR. Yes some GOP stuff is bogus, but she's done this all to HERSELF. Poll visiting on election day is CHEATING. Don't blame the GOP for your weak candidate.

[leveymg]

31. It's on bumper stickers -- If you're not appalled, you haven't been paying attention -- but, true

enough to describe those who still support Hillary. Not all are Low Information Voters, some here simply fall into the Verification Bias category of hardening their positions when confronted with unwanted information. True believers.

[BillZBubb]

40. Like the right wing on climate change,

when confronted with more scientific evidence, their level of denial only increases.

With Hillary fanatics the more they are exposed to her dishonesty and deceptive tactics the more rigid they become in their support.

[ibegurpard]

37. my judgement is based on her records and statements

The GOP smears are irrelevant.

[jalan48]

38. Has she released those Goldman Sachs transcripts yet?

[BillZBubb]

41. That's just a right wing smear!

[jalan48]

47. It's a big conspiracy!

[mcar]

42. Exactly right!

[sufrommich]

44. They're not just rewarding GOP smears,they're embracing

and repeating them.

[felix_numinous]

45. I know I should just cut it out

cut out my frontal lobe and obey what others order me to do. Because that is how I experience being told not to think. I would never tell anyone else what to think, just that people THINK for themselves and watch out for being manipulated, because there is a lot of that going on.

I recognize RW tactics being used by a candidate who claims it's being used against her. It's called projection, and if you can't see it, won't see it, this will sound like Greek to you. But please don't fool yourself into pretending you can tell adults not to believe their lying eyes, it is insulting.

[Nanjeanne]

48. RW Smears? No idea which ones you are talking about but they don't affect my feelings about

Hillary.

What does?

TPP, death penalty, war, fracking, money in politics, private prisons, lying and smear campaign, GMOs, ACA give-away to insurance companies . . .

I'm sure I could add to the list but why bother? This OP was another in the shame on you - "you have to support the chosen one because she's Hillary and she's a DEMOCRAT" thread.

[phleshdef]

51. I think "corrupt" is hyperbole. I don't find her to be particularly authentic. But not corrupt.

[peace13]

56. OK this is totally out of line.

If we explain the error in your reasoning ...boom..another hide. Suffice it to say that I am actually old enough to have watched and listened to the subject. Her actions speak for themselves.

[global1]

57. Well Maybe There Is Something That They Can Throw At Her That Hasn't Been Totally Fed To Death Yet..

I saw this post this a.m. and was taken aback. Check this link out: http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511509720

[nichomachus]

58. Actually the right-wing smears have saved the Clintons -- both of them

I'm not sure whether this is accidental or on purpose.

Remember when Bill was caught having sex in the oval office with a 21-year-old intern? The left rallied around him and supported him. They also supported him through all the other right-wing smears.

However, the left has its complaints against both Clintons. They're well-documented and they would be enough to remove them from public life forever. But there were always the wackadoodle right-wing smears that brought the left together to support the two of them.

Had right and left combined and pursued the same complaints -- the legitimate and well-documented ones -- the Clintons and Clintonism would, at this point, be a sordid footnote to history.

But as it stands, the legitimate complaints took a back seat to the crazy ones, and by doing that, the right has saved both their asses.

[hollowdweller]

61. Republicans rejected royal family Bush, Dems support royal family Clinton.

I'm not sure what that means.

[tokenlib]

63. BS! The Third Way/ New Dems are corrupt and untrustworthy..

Perhaps not criminally. But in doing the bidding of Wall Street and the corporations on public policy and trade, they can not be trusted by the masses. They do the bidding of the few and we know it. It is the POLICIES stupid!! She is bought and paid for.

[Bluenorthwest]

66. She said Ron and Nancy were AIDS heroes, that was Hillary spouting Republican propaganda.

She used to know better. But anyone who would say that is not worthy of my trust at all. She's out to serve villains while attempting to wipe out the history of activism and courage in the LGBT community. I do not know why, can't fathom any Democrat ever saying or even thinking that way. But she did that all by herself, she volunteered.

Until she did that, it was a normal cycle with two candidates I could accept, one I like better the other no so bad. Now I'd really rather not see her as President. Ron and Nancy were genocidal ghouls. What Hillary said about them was in fact GOP propaganda.

[One_Life_To_Give]

67. Depends upon what the meaning of "is" is.

I might have to vote for someone who claims to have dodged sniper fire in Boznia. That doesn't mean I agree there was an actual sniper and rounds flying near somebodies person. Nor does it mean I will assume that every nominee put forward necessarily has our interests ahead of Lloyd Blankfein.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

69. I don't need the GOP. I have my own eyes, and I've seen what I've seen.

I understand my own rationale; this satisfies all requirements around the matter.

[obamanut2012]

70. Great piece -- read it earlier today!

[Bluenorthwest]

73. Hillary Clinton Shockingly Praises Nancy Reagan's 'AIDS Activism'

[LAS14]

74. Excellent statement!!! I wish...

... you could find a broader audience. I'll post the link on my Facebook page.

Just one little nit-pick.

"and it unfortunately won't get near someone who openly eschews religion;"

This ignores the mystery of evangelicals flocking to Trump. When I think of the honest, caring, loving-their-neighbor evangelicals I know, I can only feel for them, having to put up with the hi-jacking of their identity.

p.s. Oops, I just noticed it was a post from elsewhere. But anyway, thanks for posting!

[Firebrand Gary]

78. Kicked and recommended

[whatchamacallit]

83. If You're Liberal and You DON'T Think Hillary Clinton Is Corrupt and Untrustworthy

You're rewarding 25 years of Clinton third way deception and propaganda.

[John Poet]

85. It isn't the GOP criticizing her neo-con actions. They mostly like it.

Her vote for the Iraq war, pushing militaristic meddling in Libya and Syria, pushing for escalation in Afghanistan, helping legitimize a right-wing coup in Honduras (at the behest of two right-wing Republican US Senators)--

She's a neo-conservative, for Christ sake!

THESE are NOT "GOP SMEARS" !

Hell, she's been endorsed by one of the neocon godfathers himself (Kagen?)
over all of the Republican candidates, because he LIKES
her militaristic, neo-conservative foreign policy.


THESE are the actions that make me find her "UNTRUSTWORTHY"!


I don't trust her to be commander-in-chief because of the things she's done,
not because of some "GOP smears".


BTW, Hillary isn't that formidable. If an old, grumpy independent socialist curmudgeon can give her this much of a run for her money, I think some more established Democrat could have taken her down, and are kicking themselves now, because they were too cowardly to take her on.

Corruption? Well, I mostly don't believe any of the old smears,
but I am very interested in what the F.B.I. will have to say.

[Zen Democrat]

87. Really? I think George W. Bush brought in radical change that almost demolished the USA.

We need radical change to get back on a track that's not absolutely crazy.

[Live and Learn]

89. Nope, Hillary earned that reputation herself. nt

[cherokeeprogressive]

90. I'm afraid if I vote for Hillary the stench will be near impossible to wash off my fingers.

I don't believe for a single moment she's in this for any reason other than to satisfy her ego and be remembered throughout history as the first female President of the United States of America.

[Odin2005]

91. Was supporting a coup in Hondouras a "RW smear"?

Was her calling inner city black kids "superpredators" a "RW snear"?