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Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:02 PM

Dear Sanders supporters

I am sick and tired of reading people who justify saying out-of-pocket stuff with the "you shouldn't be listening to what supporters say" excuse.

It's very weak tea.

At bottom, the very PRACTICE of politics is about communication and discussion in a community context.

The discussions we have here at DU (and other places) are every bit as valid a criterion as the discussion that take place in the agora, an inner circle of royal courtiers, or in a public square.

If many (I didn't say "most) of a particular candidates supporters says racist, sexist, homophobic or otherwise inappropriate or stupid shit, chances are that it is less likely that I will support that candidate.

I'm not saying that's the ONLY factor, only that it might BE a factor.

There are an entire range of influence on a range of decisions that are made based on what someone else says or how they say it.

Political decisions are no different.

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Arrow 106 replies Author Time Post
Reply Dear Sanders supporters (Original post)
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 OP
RobertEarl Mar 2016 #1
Post removed Mar 2016 #4
RobertEarl Mar 2016 #8
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #9
RobertEarl Mar 2016 #15
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #23
RobertEarl Mar 2016 #25
snowy owl Mar 2016 #28
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #30
RobertEarl Mar 2016 #33
Ed Suspicious Mar 2016 #51
Ken Burch Mar 2016 #57
politicaljunkie41910 Mar 2016 #66
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #85
Chan790 Mar 2016 #2
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #5
jfern Mar 2016 #7
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #11
Duckhunter935 Mar 2016 #49
jfern Mar 2016 #63
Autumn Mar 2016 #98
revbones Mar 2016 #102
Chan790 Mar 2016 #16
NCTraveler Mar 2016 #36
Chan790 Mar 2016 #44
NCTraveler Mar 2016 #80
DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #75
NCTraveler Mar 2016 #82
DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #83
NCTraveler Mar 2016 #84
jfern Mar 2016 #3
NWCorona Mar 2016 #6
NWCorona Mar 2016 #10
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #13
NWCorona Mar 2016 #14
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #19
NWCorona Mar 2016 #22
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #26
NWCorona Mar 2016 #31
IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #12
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #17
IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #29
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #35
IdaBriggs Mar 2016 #38
Fairgo Mar 2016 #37
Warren DeMontague Mar 2016 #18
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #21
Warren DeMontague Mar 2016 #24
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #27
Warren DeMontague Mar 2016 #34
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #39
Warren DeMontague Mar 2016 #40
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #45
Warren DeMontague Mar 2016 #59
bravenak Mar 2016 #67
JustAnotherGen Mar 2016 #74
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #89
LexVegas Mar 2016 #20
dragonfly301 Mar 2016 #32
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #41
dragonfly301 Mar 2016 #43
noretreatnosurrender Mar 2016 #47
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #61
jfern Mar 2016 #78
DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #42
Jenny_92808 Mar 2016 #46
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #50
stonecutter357 Mar 2016 #90
Ken Burch Mar 2016 #48
Chitown Kev Mar 2016 #55
Ken Burch Mar 2016 #58
Logical Mar 2016 #52
JonLeibowitz Mar 2016 #53
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #88
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #54
Bluenorthwest Mar 2016 #64
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #65
Bluenorthwest Mar 2016 #69
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #70
melman Mar 2016 #96
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #99
DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #76
Bluenorthwest Mar 2016 #92
DisgustipatedinCA Mar 2016 #93
Amimnoch Mar 2016 #79
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #94
Amimnoch Mar 2016 #106
melman Mar 2016 #95
whatchamacallit Mar 2016 #97
SMC22307 Mar 2016 #100
libdem4life Mar 2016 #56
Bluenorthwest Mar 2016 #60
libdem4life Mar 2016 #62
Betty Karlson Mar 2016 #68
bbgrunt Mar 2016 #71
Number23 Mar 2016 #72
artislife Mar 2016 #73
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #87
joshcryer Mar 2016 #77
Vinca Mar 2016 #81
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #86
pdsimdars Mar 2016 #103
Fast Walker 52 Mar 2016 #105
stonecutter357 Mar 2016 #91
pdsimdars Mar 2016 #101
merrily Mar 2016 #104

Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:24 PM

1. I won't suppport more wars

 

One candidate is going to bring more war.

Also one has supported the incarceration of poor people for minor crimes that the police use to suppress certain populations.

Then there are the campaign financiers who didn't get rich by playing fair with the American people and who strive to get laws made in their favor. Nope can't support any of that.

But that's just me.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #1)


Response to Post removed (Reply #4)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:35 PM

8. South Carolina just took down the confederate flag

 

Yeah, that slavery mentality still exists. Do you deny that?

And why is it just 13% voted in SC? IOW, why did 87% ignore the election?

The only reason Clinton won there was because so few voted.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #8)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:39 PM

9. The overwhelming reason Clinton won Illinois

was because of black voters, primarily in Cook County in Chicago...in the land of Lincoln.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #9)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:47 PM

15. I see what you are not getting

 

Since there are far more whites in SC, it is they who mainly were the ones who ignored the election.

I look at those white people who let that flag fly so long and call shame on them, not the people they have been oppressing.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #15)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:56 PM

23. I disagree with what you are saying/excusing/justifying/rationalizing

and think that you have a severe case of amnesia but thanks for playing...

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #23)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:59 PM

25. I see this as you copping out

 

You misread me and now you have decided that I am a bad guy. There is a name for such mindsets, and such has been used to suppress people for ages. I kinda thought you might be past that but I see you are still caught in that quagmire.

My bad.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #25)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:03 PM

28. I Agree.

I'm still kind of trying to figure out her original post. It is ambiguous to me. Sounds like she has a very specific expectation for what she's willing to accept...

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Response to snowy owl (Reply #28)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:08 PM

30. He.

To be fair, the issue goes very far beyond Sanders-Clinton but the premise is simple.

People tend not to develop views about much of anything (esp. politics) in isolation although, yes, there is work that people need to do by themselves.

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Response to snowy owl (Reply #28)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:10 PM

33. It was ambiguous

 

Such discussions are tough. There is a lot of history - bad history - that most of the US has not come to grips with and anyone exposing that history can be deemed to be on the wrong side. Much empathy is required especially from those who control the history due to the historic power holders.

When I was young, I decided that I was a Democrat because of the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts. That's where I am coming from.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #9)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:37 PM

51. Her win in IL was far from overwhelming.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #9)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:43 PM

57. Never mind that she won't do a damn thing for those voters.

 

They have a right to do what they want, but is it really fair to still claim that Bernie hasn't addressed race sufficiently?

I get that he didn't say enough at the start of the campaign, but why do any POC voters still act as if nothing has changed with him on this?

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #8)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:28 PM

66. Well obviously of that 13%, more voted for Hillary than Bernie since she won. So you need to ask

Bernie supporters why so few of them chose to participate in the SC election.

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Response to RobertEarl (Reply #1)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:27 AM

85. the war issue is huge for me, and HRC is on the wrong side of it

 

No amount of happy get-along articles and whitewashing will cover that up.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:26 PM

2. I can respect this, even if I disagree with you on Clinton.

 

It's like I said last month...nothing has solidified my resolve against Clinton like her supporters. Many (I also didn't say most) of them are real vile scumbags. Classist, elitist, proudly anti-progressive; some Clinton supporters are in-their-own-stead plenty racist, sexist, homophobic, and there has been even a few instances of antisemitism out of them.

They are certainly doing Hillary no favors in the reconciliation she will need to win back Sanders supporters and win the GE. Nobody is happy to reconcile with a gloating asshole or a poor winner supporting a lesser-of-two-evils...even when they know it's the right decision because the greater-of-two-evils is pretty fucking evil.


[font size="5"]This is not the smirk of a nice person.[/font]

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #2)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:32 PM

5. How do you disagree with me on Clinton?

I didn't vote for her in my state's primary...

But on the whole, some Clinton supporters have made "swipes" at Sanders supporters but not whole demographics...that's the difference.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #5)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:34 PM

7. We've been told that Bernie supporters are mostly white male BernieBros

who have a race and sexism problems.

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Response to jfern (Reply #7)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:41 PM

11. Some Sanders supporters DO have racism and sexism issues

and it turns me (a non-Clinton voter) off.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #11)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:34 PM

49. I hope you agree it is a very small minority, right?

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #11)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 10:53 PM

63. Some Hillary supporters are too, but no one is running a campaign against them

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #11)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:44 PM

98. FYI some Clinton supporters also have racism and sexism issues and are Antisemitic too nt

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #11)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:12 PM

102. I think after today's apologies on DU, that isn't just Sanders supporters... nt

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #5)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:47 PM

16. I'm sorry, I thought you were a supporter of the Secretary.

 

That was my misunderstanding.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #16)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:12 PM

36. And there it is. The point.

 

Based off a flawed assumption it is attack mode, then apologies.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #36)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:21 PM

44. Uhh...what attack?

 

I said I disagreed with him on Hillary, but agreed with his point.

He said he wasn't a supporter of Sec. Clinton.

I apologized for the misunderstanding.

It was possibly one of the more civil exchanges on the subject all day.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #44)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:14 AM

80. My sincere apologies and thank you for elaborating...

 

And setting me straight. <- not said in snark.

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #36)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 06:31 AM

75. What the hell are you talking about? Justify the nonsense.

 

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #75)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:18 AM

82. Sometimes one just needs to apologize, not justify.

 

Please go make the same demand here.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511534089#post56

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Response to NCTraveler (Reply #82)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:20 AM

83. I still have no idea what you're trying to say. Let's leave it at nevermind.

 

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #83)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:22 AM

84. I apologized to the poster.

 

I read it wrong. I wasn't looking for your understanding. I was pointing out I apologized to the party my comment was directed at.

I also appreciated the manner in which they set me straight.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:28 PM

3. There's no shortage of Hillary supporters saying stupid shit

But no one is running a campaign to make them look bad.

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Response to jfern (Reply #3)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:34 PM

6. There actually appears to be an active campaign to protect them

Just sayin

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:39 PM

10. And you are free to hold that stance

I'm frankly tired of people acting like Hillary supporter's aren't guilty of the exact same thing.

They threw Jane Sanders to the wolves yesterday because it was politically convenient.

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Response to NWCorona (Reply #10)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:43 PM

13. Jane Sanders is playing an active role in her husband's campaign

and visited Arapiao's tent city in that capacity...she's fair game (just as Hillary Clinton was and Michelle Obama was and even Kitty Dukakis was).

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #13)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:46 PM

14. That wasn't the point at all

Her role isn't in doubt. What I'm talking about is the siding with Joe. Whether you want to admit it or not Bernie was right and Joe did ambush Jane.

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Response to NWCorona (Reply #14)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:51 PM

19. It wasn't about "siding with Joe"

Jane Sanders seemed to be unprepared for the possibility that Arapaio would show up at a place that he runs (and had every right to show up).

My critique would be that the Sanders campaign was (yet again!) caught flat-footed and unprepared in the context of running a national campaign.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #19)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:55 PM

22. Why do you gloss over the obvious intended aggression and intimidation

In his tweet and actions. Jane handled herself excellently.
How many was in his armed press posse again?

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Response to NWCorona (Reply #22)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:59 PM

26. Arapaio is a bully and a drama queen....of course he would do all of those

but the optics on that are not good...and anyway, this sub-thread is a derailment now.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #26)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:08 PM

31. But that doesn't change my point.

I'm fine with ending it as I like to stay on point as well.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:42 PM

12. Jury Results

 

I was juror #5 and voted to hide.

On Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:29 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Dear Sanders supporters
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511533688

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

The OP tried to be cute and clever, but just called DU Bernie supporters racist, sexist, homophobic stupid shits. Offensive and rude. To be clear, the op is about DUers. It is DUers they are calling those names.

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:38 PM, and the Jury voted 3-4 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: The poster might have gotten away with this if they had used a hypothetical, but they did not. They address their comments to "Sanders Supporters" and then assert that many - with a specific "I didn't say most" (as if that makes it acceptable) - make racist, sexist, homophobic, etc., comments. Putting "If" in front of this comment does not deflect from the assertion; it only makes it more obvious that the purpose of the OP was to level these accusations at "many" of Sanders' supporters on DU.
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: I went back twice: yes, it was said politely, but Sanders supporters just got called "racist, sexist, homophobic" etc. Hiding for insulting DU members. If poster sees this type of problem (which is against TOS), they need to alert instead of make blanket insults to Sanders supporters.
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Free speech.

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Response to IdaBriggs (Reply #12)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:48 PM

17. Thank you

I can appreciate both you and Juror #2...at least you were very deliberative about this and gave solid reasons for your vote (I disagree with it...I did say "otherwise inappropriate or stupid shit...)

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #17)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:04 PM

29. I support Bernie for a lot of reasons.

 

I am not a racist, homophobe or misogynist. I personally found your post insulting, but I decided to hide your post for the same reason I would hide "Hillary supporters love corruption" - inappropriate and untrue.

As I said in my (minority) opinion, I think this type of insulting people with different viewpoints is not somethings that belongs on our message board.

Have a nice evening.

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Response to IdaBriggs (Reply #29)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:12 PM

35. But black people should not find a number of posts here from some Bernie supporters

as insulting, including the OP of someone commenting in this thread right now and who continues to double-down on his thesis.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #35)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:15 PM

38. I don't care which candidate someone supports - racist,

 

Homophobic and misogynistic comments violate TOS. Hit the alert button, then alert on the jury results so the mods can take care of business.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #17)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:14 PM

37. Thanks for popping up

I am cleaning house, I was wondering who I missed.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:50 PM

18. If I let the behavior of the supporters dictate who I vote for, No way would I support HRC as nom.

I would stay home or play frisbee golf or something.

At least, the supporters ive encountered on the internet. My mom is a hillary supporter, and I suspect she is more indicative of the demographic than the drama-obsessed crowd that has spent the past 8 months in a nonstop low valence, basically incoherent ad hominem attack against those of us who dare to support a different primary candidate.

Fortunately, I'm not twelve, and I dont let the blargle of some random ginkuses on the interwebs influence that extremely important choice.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #18)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:54 PM

21. I never said that supporters "dictate" my vote

I am saying that they do influence to some degree...and I am saying that it's actually a normal thing...I said that it was ONE criterion.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #21)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:57 PM

24. Maybe. I fully concede that I may not be "normal"

Because no, I make that decision based upon specific policy positions and what I want us as a party to stand for as defined by the leadership of those we choose to represent us, not because "so and so is a poop-poster!"

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #24)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:00 PM

27. We're getting somewhere with this now

I don't develop my views on anything (including politics) in isolation. Do you?

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #27)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:11 PM

34. Define "isolation". Isolation from, say, the voting record of a Senator from 2002-2006? No.

Isolation meaning random shit which doesn't have any actual policy implications but instead are the disgruntled electronic farts of continually cranky people on the internet who would be complaining about something else if it wasn't an election year?

Yes.

So let's look at this non-isolation calculus you're doing, here, Kev. Because the vote itself is binary. Either/Or. Or maybe multiple choice. You either vote for Candidate A, Candidate B, or stay home. Right?

So if this allegedly statistically significant "widespread bad behavior", of which the people who talk about it endlessly insist is real because they're talking about it endlessly, natch, amirite-- if this is influencing your choice before you get to that binary decision, how much is it influencing it? 20%? 50%?

Are you suggesting that you honestly might have pulled the lever for Sanders instead of Hillary in your primary, "if it wasn't for...."?

Honestly?

Or is this just more of the same.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #34)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:15 PM

39. I didn't "pull the lever" for Bernie OR Hillary in my primary

There were other ballot options and there was one that fit what I wanted to communicate as a voter.

As far as "the supporter" issue...it affected it a very little bit, yes.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #39)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:16 PM

40. Really? Now we're getting somewhere.

I'm honestly curious.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #40)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:22 PM

45. I voted for Martin O'Malley

1) He was the best "none of the above" option on my ballot that also reflected my own ideological views the closest.

I wound up having to take almost all of the personalities out of my process altogether (O'malley was a real doofus when he was in the race, IMO)

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #45)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:54 PM

59. I was impressed with many of the things MO'M said during the debates.

I thought he came across well.

In a normal year, I think, he would have stood out more. But this is not a normal year.

My plan is to vote for Bernie in May, even though it likely won't make a difference. I did, honestly, give HRC a chance- if we're talking calculus, in 2008 the IWR vote was a dealbreaker for me; it precluded me from supporting Edwards, Kerry, Clinton or Biden (not that I would have supported Biden anyway, what with his record as architect of and apologist for the drug war). unfortunately my fear was the HRC would run an excessively poll-tested, light on specifics campaign, and my fears turned out to be more than justified, to my mind. In addition she has run a campaign 20 years out of date not just in terms of tactics but in terms of understanding the electorate.

Still, I'll vote for her in November, if I have to.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #45)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:35 PM

67. I'm voting for him in the first round at my caucus too

 

Then I know he will not make the cut so I will move over to the Hillary side. I want OM counted.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #45)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 06:22 AM

74. I love that vote!

I'm writing him in! There is not a single word in his white papers I disagreed with - and his humility in Baltimore was so impressive.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #18)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:35 AM

89. "I dont let the blargle of some random ginkuses on the interwebs..."

 

Great line!

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 08:53 PM

20. DU rec for truth. nt

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:09 PM

32. I don't approve of racist comment or antisemitism

the following antisemitic comment made by a Hillary supporter who participates here, on a different blog and recc'd by you Chitown Kev - before you preach you might want to clean up your own house.

I cannot stand him. His fans are racists who run around calling blacks racist and wonder why we hate him and them. I don't even LIKE Hillary but I will vote for her just so his fans can feel the sne BERN that they have been passing out. Look at the racist comments here. I did not know jews hated us blacks so much. Good to know. I will return it in kind. There are so few of them It's a wonder they have the gall to think about being racist against blacks.


All that being said, I'm not basing my vote on the actions of supporters - there is enough that I dislike about Hillary's policies that would keep me from voting for her.

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Response to dragonfly301 (Reply #32)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:18 PM

41. I gave my reasons for reccing that comment at Kos at the time

and (I thought, anyway) that I had removed my (temporary) rec.

If you want to flog and browbeat me about it, though, I can't stop you...

remember, I didn't vote for Hillary, either.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #41)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:20 PM

43. You've made us all aware of your O'malley vote

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #41)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:30 PM

47. No flogging, just recognition

“Oh what a tangled web we weave
When first we practice to deceive.”

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Response to dragonfly301 (Reply #32)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 10:24 PM

61. The calvary normally swoops in to defend that poster...

where are they? Was that anti-Semitic garbage even too much for them?

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Response to dragonfly301 (Reply #32)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 06:56 AM

78. Yeah, funny how the outrage is only against Bernie supporters?

Hillary supporters say plenty of things in very poor taste, including racism, sexism, anti-semitism, and crickets about that.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:19 PM

42. You'll do what you'll do irrespective of any of the rest of us. I'll do the same. The rest is

 

posturing.

Nice sermon about Sanders supporters. I reject every word.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:29 PM

46. So you are calling me racist, sexist, homophobic

 

because I am a Bernie supporter. To the ignore box for you. Good riddance.

Edit: Alert for calling us racist, sexist, homophobic.

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #46)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:35 PM

50. If you are not racist, sexist, or homophobic

then I am not talking about you.

There are enough Bernie Sanders supporters that have engaged in racist, sexist, and (on rarer occasions) homophobic rhetoric that it's hard NOT to notice it.

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Response to Jenny_92808 (Reply #46)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:42 AM

90. your Alert faild.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:31 PM

48. Agreed that no one's supporters should say anything offensive

 

two other things should be considered:

1) Have most of that candidates supporters condemned and called out offensive comments?(in my estimation the vast majority of Sanders supporters have done exactly that)

2) This is the Internet-can we really be sure that people who are making offensive comments while claiming to support a candidate are really supporters at all? It's likely that at least a lot of those who have said offensive things(probably a majority)were either people who were just trolls who saw a chance for fun or sabateurs in the service of other candidates. Not hard to recruit cyber-wreckers...a lot of them will post any shit someone wants them to post for the price of a month's worth of Hot Pockets.

The comments you have seen here that were offensive don't reflect the spirit of the Sanders campaign...and Bernie and the rest of us have called out the bad actors over and over. There's no way to absolutely control what people post online.

That said, as I've said elsewhere, I'm glad the particularly offensive poster who was banned yesterday got banned, whatever his motivations were.

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Response to Ken Burch (Reply #48)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:40 PM

55. I made a reference to the Athenian agora for a reason

it was a "commons" of sorts in Athens that along with being a marketplace was also a place where ideas and politics were discussed...like the public square.

Now yes, in an internet "agora" you always have to be mindful of trolls (then again, you had to be mindful of those in the agoras and public squares IRL). If it were just "trolls", I don't think there would be that big of a problem.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Reply #55)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:45 PM

58. You can't seriously think Bernie's campaign approves of the bad comments.

 

He's condemned them again and again. A lot of us have. What more can we do about this?

We can't just end the campaign...that would mean giving up working for change.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:38 PM

52. FFS, I am so tired of these lectures from people who are clueless. nt

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:39 PM

53. "Pull your head out of your ass and vote to Hillary"

To be clear, I am quoting a Hillary supporter speaking to a African American man today at a Donald Trump rally, which wasn't supposed to be about Hillary.

https://twitter.com/adamjohnsonNYC/status/711273345849946112

This is why we should be voting on the basis of what the candidates say, because there are assholes on both sides.

I concur with Warren DeMontague above.

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Response to JonLeibowitz (Reply #53)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:33 AM

88. good one!

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:39 PM

54. When I see offensive shit from a Hillary supporter like that quoted below...

it has ZERO impact on how I vote.

Quote# 117360

I cannot stand him. His fans are racists who run around calling blacks racist and wonder why we hate him and them. I don't even LIKE Hillary but I will vote for her just so his fans can feel the sne BERN that they have been passing out.

Look at the racist comments here. I did not know jews hated us blacks so much. Good to know. I will return it in kind. There are so few of them It's a wonder they have the gall to think about being racist against blacks.

Bravenak, Frontpage Mag 6 Comments
Fundie Index: 3

WTF?! || meh

http://www.fstdt.com/QuoteComment.aspx?QID=117360


Yes, let's indeed flesh out "racist, sexist, homophobic, or otherwise inappropriate or stupid shit." Start with the above.

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #54)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 10:58 PM

64. That shit should be answered for.

 

Obvious bigot is obvious. That is incredibly foul materials.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #64)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:06 PM

65. Obvious bigot should be booted from DU.

It's been an endless stream, starting way back with that gleeful "old white men are dying off" thread. Perhaps there were more offensive posts before that, but that's the one that first caught my attention.

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #65)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:44 PM

69. It's shocking to me. And the OP here is really part of the smokescreen for that reality.

 

Finger pointing to distract from the brutal truth. Transparent.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #69)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:58 PM

70. Yep. The Swarm is conspicuously absent,

but Kev did give it the ol' college try.

Who are Skinner, et al. really looking at when they speak of "division" on this board? Wait, dumb question. Never mind.

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #70)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:40 PM

96. Gave it a try

 

and then started whining about being browbeaten and headed for the hills. lol

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Response to melman (Reply #96)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:51 PM

99. There's a lot of whining on DU.

Is Kos that way? Kos's design gives me a headache so I spend very little time there. DU's design is superb.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #69)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 06:43 AM

76. They're the moral arbiters of nothing, and they can shut the fuck up with lectures.

 

WillyT just got banned for A LOT LESS than what Bravenak has done with her racist discussion post at another site.

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #76)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:57 AM

92. What WillyT did was unacceptable and also identical to what others are doing, he and they made up

 

a whole fight for everyone to have. He said 'Civil rights don't matter' and they said 'He defines Bernie Sanders'.
I called out both sides so everyone on both sides hates me and that's fine with me, I welcome hate that comes to me for telling the truth and being a bit better reader than the average poster.

On that last part, I do not read Skinner's amnesty statement as a pardon but as a lure. And people are biting pretty hard on that hook if you ask me.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #92)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:12 AM

93. For what it's worth, I don't hate you, not by a long way.

 

You have a formidable memory and a knack for calling on it at the right time.

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #54)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 07:13 AM

79. Most interesting. Especially your selecting a response to other posts

 

And failure to even consider what that reply was on. Let me fix that oopsie for you. Here are some of the other posts for reference of what this post was about:


Pssst. Daniel: FORBIDDEN TRUTH ALERT - Check the most recent Gallup Poll on anti-Semitism. Blacks hate Jews. The group officially designated as being Victims Of Bigotry also despises gays and is by far the most misogynistic sector of American society (although apparently the anti-Semitism trumps the misogyny). The preceding has been an unauthorized departure from the approved societal narrative


Blacks in America are turning into our 'palestinians'. They're always angry about everything all the time forever.


They can always repatriate themselves with their ancestral homelands if they wish. I hear Zaire is nice.


Those are a few of the responses to which Bravenak was responding.
But yeah, Bravenak was soooo out of line. I guess you think she should know her place.

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Response to Amimnoch (Reply #79)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:09 PM

94. So the other posters made her make that vile comment?

ALWAYS someone else's fault... even the fan club buys into it.

The words came out of her mouth and she knows she fucked up, for there are at least two apologies on this board. Knowing her posting history, I doubt the sincerity.

Don't pull the "she should know her place" crap with me... it rolls right off. Trust me on that one.

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #94)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 05:36 PM

106. Obviously. It rolled right off.

 

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Response to Amimnoch (Reply #79)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:38 PM

95. No

 

It looks like you are the one that made an "oopsie". Those are comments she didn't respond to.

As the person in this Kos thread points out, the only comment she made was the one quoted here.

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/1497565/60170036#comment_60170036

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Response to SMC22307 (Reply #54)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:44 PM

97. And thus ends Chitown's participation in his own thread

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Response to whatchamacallit (Reply #97)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:03 PM

100. Wonder if he'll run to Thom Hartmann.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:41 PM

56. Sorry...someone who doesn't think for themselves...meh....Sanders or Clinton.

 

If someone says a bunch of really nice things about Trump...???? Doesn't pass the smell test. Give me a freaking break.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 10:03 PM

60. Gotta say Kev, ever since Hillary put Ronald Reagan's foot in her mouth we've seen an endless stream

 

of lecturing, condescending and exploitative attempts by straight Hillary supporters. Insulting, transparent and the exact same sort of shit you find fault with on the other side. But you only find the other's fault. You don't call them out for doing this. And that's not fair play at all.

Your own candidate said insanely false things to praise a Republican villain for doing the exact things he did not do at all. Then her supporters here went on a lecture tour instead of making a round of apologies.

So really at the end of the day, let the Supporters who are without sin cast stones. And Hillary's Team on DU is no more fucking sinless than Bernie's. And that's that. Fair is fair. Equal is equal.

I'm pretty sick of the posturing. I've read some really ugly antisemitism out of people who affect that they are the judge and the jury of others. I think that is very, very fucked up. Those who play along with that are a bunch of bigoted creeps. That's right, bigoted creeps who are a slim toupee's hair in difference from Trump supporters or the recently departed Stockholm Man.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 10:45 PM

62. Pure poppycock. Be a big boy/girl...make an intelligent decision based on facts,

 

not emotion and least of all on some random, anonymous internet posts.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sat Mar 19, 2016, 11:43 PM

68. unrec to the max.

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 12:19 AM

71. The game is up. quit while you're still standing.

I support BLM and I support civil rights for all. If, indeed, I were a homophobe or racist, your lectures are not going to change my opinions, especially after what I've seen around here the last week.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 01:47 AM

72. Apparently, you are being taken to task for not responding to something bravenak wrote on another

board. Because apparently it's our job as black posters to police each other. I'm sure you catch the irony of that as much as I do.

Never mind that many of the same folks that are demanding that every black poster here atone for bravenak were the main ones who were quiet as farts in church when BBI or Manny or WillyT were taken to task or perversely, actually loudly and clearly SUPPORTED these individuals when black posters and clued in white folks repeatedly called them out for their racist and/or offensive posts.

This place has lost its mind. And I just saw your hidden post so I know you can't respond anyway. But I know you see these people every bit as clearly as the rest of us do. Their unending obsession with shutting bravenak up is sure as hell bringing out the most astonishing, ILLUMINATING reactions.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:01 AM

73. When one candidate votes and kills people around the world, I won't support that candidate.

 

You see, to me, cluster bombs and regime changes hurt a lot more than words.

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Response to artislife (Reply #73)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:32 AM

87. Exactly. Just once-- ONCE!-- I would like to hear an HRC supporter justify that shit

 

All I ever get is crickets.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 06:54 AM

77. I think anyone can vote for or support anyone for any reason.

While I put "supporter antics" on an extremely low list of priorities for me (I still am a huge fan of Sanders despite disagreeing with the antics of a huge number of his "supporters" on this site and other sites), it's still a valid reason.

People seem to think that they can only support or vote for someone over strict issues. That's not the case. People might chose Clinton solely because of her Planned Parenthood endorsement. Who cares. Sanders could get support from F35 ops people in Vermont. Who cares. That's their right.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:18 AM

81. You call this "discussion?"

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:31 AM

86. As a Sanders supporter, it really frustrating getting tagged with something i've never done

 

any certainly only a small fraction of his supporters have done.

Given the nature of anonymous discussion boards, it wouldn't even surprise me if some of these bad actors were agents provocateurs of a sort.

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Response to Fast Walker 52 (Reply #86)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:14 PM

103. Dont' take their criticism to heart. . . every day they make up this nonsense to blame everyone for

 

their failures. Ignore their criticism. . .it is the criticism of hypocrites. . . calling out others as they lie, cheat, swift boat and smear Bernie every day. . . .and then plead with Bernie supporters to cut it out. They need to cut it out themselves, then they might have SOME credibility.

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Response to pdsimdars (Reply #103)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:44 PM

105. thanks... they really don't do a good job of trying to sway anyone to their side though...

 

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 08:44 AM

91. K&R!

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:11 PM

101. How lopsided . . .

 

Every day there is a new round of articles coming out from the Hillary campaign and supporters on some new theme, some latest strategy to smear Bernie, lie about his record or diss his supporters.
Look in the mirror for once. She is running the dirtiest campaign in recent history. If you don't like it, then talk to the Clinton campaign and her supporters and have them knock of all the lies and swift boating.
Until then, stop insulting us with your one sided equality. Start changing your tactics and then many you have any kind of standing to talk about others.

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Response to Chitown Kev (Original post)

Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:19 PM

104. Listen to whatever you want, and, of course, you will. No one should choose a President based on

what some of his millions of supporters do or say, though.

BTW, I say the same thing to those disgusted with Hillary's supporters, all of whom are by no means angels, despite all the self-righteous and holier than thou.

You have millions of people in any group, her supporters, his supporters, Americans in general, you will get bad apples.

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