Thu Mar 24, 2016, 11:46 AM

Cal33 (7,018 posts)

Things are coming to a head. I believe vast changes are coming, whether we want them to, or not:

From the way I view it, there seem to be two Democratic factions: 1. Those who are
beholden to the Corporate Power people, and 2. Those who are fighting against the
corrupt Corporations.

Hillary is the leader of the Corporate-beholden Democrats, and Bernie is leading the
Progressive or Liberal Democrats.

Hillary sometimes refers to herself as a Progressive. I don't think she is one. The
Democratic Party seems to be splitting up, and the same thing is going on with
the Republicans -- they have their Establishment people and Donald Trump is leading
his own faction. Of course they have several other factions in addition. The Republicans
seem to be even more split than the Democrats are.

The Corporate Power people, of course, will do their best to have a strong hold in
every faction -- as usual -- and control things from behind the scenes.

Somehow things are coming to a head: Large numbers are sick and tired of their same old
Establishment policies, and are leaving their Parties -- both Republican and Democratic.
Changes are probably coming, whether we want them to, or not.

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92 replies	Author	Time	Post
Things are coming to a head. I believe vast changes are coming, whether we want them to, or not: (Original post)	Cal33	Mar 2016	OP
You are treating the issues of the right as if they are legitimate. Most of their issues	Jackie Wilson Said	Mar 2016	#1
I'm sure people on the right feel their issues are just as legitimate as yours	revbones	Mar 2016	#3
It doesnt surprise me AT ALL you are sympathizing with rightwing racists and bigots.	Jackie Wilson Said	Mar 2016	#5
I sympathize with people in general and tend to call out hypocrisy like that in your comment.	revbones	Mar 2016	#12
That's wrong. People are not automatically evil....	Armstead	Mar 2016	#13
Ugh and sigh	Jackie Wilson Said	Mar 2016	#26
And you are using that.....	daleanime	Mar 2016	#6
All democrats or almost all are pro corporate. Bernie isnt, a couple others.	Jackie Wilson Said	Mar 2016	#8
Most 'elected democrats' are pro corporate....	daleanime	Mar 2016	#11
"All democrats or almost all are pro corporate." Really? I think Hillary is winning at this point	Cal33	Mar 2016	#14
They debates where not rigged!!	Gwhittey	Mar 2016	#58
And schedule those few debates during major sports events	Art_from_Ark	Mar 2016	#60
"Issues of the right??" The OP doesn't even touch "issues of the right."	senz	Mar 2016	#67
Those on the Right? Their issues are just as legitimate to them as yours are to you.	Autumn	Mar 2016	#68
I knew it, I knew it	Jackie Wilson Said	Mar 2016	#82
HRC is a Camp all unto herself. Many of her currrent positions fall	libdem4life	Mar 2016	#86
Your choice: Corporate Socialism or Democratic Socialism. Choose wisely.	Kip Humphrey	Mar 2016	#2
Oh.....I like that. That would make a great teashirt.	yourout	Mar 2016	#52
K&R	Scuba	Mar 2016	#4
I agree...	DemocracyDirect	Mar 2016	#7
We need that in my district.	JEB	Mar 2016	#15
Hillary is a "Progressive" in the same way many corporatists believe that this	Lorien	Mar 2016	#9
...	senz	Mar 2016	#69
Like the movement conservative on the right, Bernie Sanders is a movement progressive on the right	BlueStateLib	Mar 2016	#92
Change is ALWAYS coming. This isn't some overly dramatic transformation going on, it's a sea change.	randome	Mar 2016	#10
Examples of Corporate Power people: The banks that took part in the financial scandals of 2007	Cal33	Mar 2016	#16
I'd be more satisfied if we aimed at the correct targets: Congress.	randome	Mar 2016	#19
About "a presidential bully pulpit," Pres. Obama is not only not using it - he, in fact, is	Cal33	Mar 2016	#22
When Obama uses the bully pulpit ... the disgruntled left screams ...	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#27
Obama uses the bully pulpit	ibegurpard	Mar 2016	#32
Bernie should run against Obama then.	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#34
You've noticed "a bunch of DU members who only appear when the general election is approaching."	Cal33	Mar 2016	#44
Eh, I've been here all along	Fumesucker	Mar 2016	#70
"DU might but what does that mean in the vast scheme of things? Not much."	floppyboo	Mar 2016	#80
I'd prefer that a great transformation take place.	randome	Mar 2016	#85
Soon Bernie will endorse Hillary, and then there will be the Democratic party and a few	DanTex	Mar 2016	#17
That's when Bernie will get his spot under the bus	CorkySt.Clair	Mar 2016	#21
True that. It will be hilarious.	DanTex	Mar 2016	#50
<> -- you hope. Only vindictive people think	Cal33	Mar 2016	#89
No more vindictive	CorkySt.Clair	Mar 2016	#90
Yes, Bernie would be the type to endorse his opponent should he lose. I wouldn't	Cal33	Mar 2016	#24
Did you miss this?	Autumn	Mar 2016	#72
I totally agree	coyote	Mar 2016	#18
Donald Trump is using much the same criticisms.	procon	Mar 2016	#20
I do not think Hillary would even try to influence any changes in the system we have now.	djean111	Mar 2016	#37
Yes, I agree that many of the "old bulls" in Congress should have already retired. You can be	Cal33	Mar 2016	#48
And how do think that might actually happen in the real world?	procon	Mar 2016	#56
Since 90% of the news media is Republican-owned, the Democrats are at a horrendous disadvantage.	Cal33	Mar 2016	#59
Clout and influence are meaningless	AgerolanAmerican	Mar 2016	#65
That's illogical.	procon	Mar 2016	#71
Yeap, the marginalized and left out are coming to power... inside the DNC. The DNC establishment...	uponit7771	Mar 2016	#23
Sorry, don't see it.	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#25
At the moment both Democrats and Republicans are simply rebelling against their own	Cal33	Mar 2016	#30
Well ... Trump is killing the GOP establishment ...	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#31
You are partially right, Bernie is not killing the Dem. Establishment the way Trump is	Cal33	Mar 2016	#49
The divisions with the dems are just as serious as the	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#28
Nonsense ...	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#33
Historical realignment. Sixth in fact	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#35
Ahhh ... argument from imagined authority.	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#39
Nope. It is happening	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#40
You babble a great deal as you make assumptions about who you think ...	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#41
It is your online persona	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#42
Another great non response.	JoePhilly	Mar 2016	#43
Use the google or not	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#46
All I can reply to this is thank whoever that Bernie will not be	upaloopa	Mar 2016	#29
The latest national poll shows that Sanders continues to increase his lead over Clinton. He	Cal33	Mar 2016	#73
It's still not translating into	leftynyc	Mar 2016	#81
You're right. At this point, it looks more likely that Hillary would win in the Primaries -- all	Cal33	Mar 2016	#88
The guy who bowed down to gun corporations and lockheed martin isnt a corporatist?	JaneyVee	Mar 2016	#36
If you're talking about Bernie, he voted against the Iraq War. He is definitely not a Corporatist,	Cal33	Mar 2016	#87
Message auto-removed	Name removed	Mar 2016	#38
Bernie is setting the table for Elizabeth Warren.	Octafish	Mar 2016	#45
That would certainly be a good idea. Warren has the integrity, brains and good-will to	Cal33	Mar 2016	#54
Elizabeth Warren is almost 67 years "young".	procon	Mar 2016	#57
Some people retain their health and vigor - both physically and mentally - longer than	Cal33	Mar 2016	#91
Many Many Thanks	SoLeftIAmRight	Mar 2016	#84
I call clinton a repub. Definitely not a progressive. What laugh!	oldandhappy	Mar 2016	#47
Yet Republicans loathe her with a vengeance	Zambero	Mar 2016	#79
Maybe she is too far right for me and not far right enough for the far right?	oldandhappy	Mar 2016	#83
I agree with your intuitions. nt	ladjf	Mar 2016	#51
Climate change means politics as we know it will be irrevocably changed	riderinthestorm	Mar 2016	#53
I think this is really what's in play	Hydra	Mar 2016	#61
I actually agree with you	riderinthestorm	Mar 2016	#62
:)	Hydra	Mar 2016	#63
Obama's legacy will soon be badly tarnished as the full-scale of the disaster begins to unfold	riderinthestorm	Mar 2016	#64
I will take the average... 5 years	nadinbrzezinski	Mar 2016	#66
Starting to think a UK style politics might emerge in the USA	Califonz	Mar 2016	#55
One is the face of the system, the other is facing the system.	raouldukelives	Mar 2016	#74
I suppose there are some who believe the Republican propaganda that what is happening	Cal33	Mar 2016	#75
Or great big children!	raging moderate	Mar 2016	#77
When the party is mostly co-opted,	Rebkeh	Mar 2016	#76
Meh	CorkySt.Clair	Mar 2016	#78

Response to Cal33 (Original post)

Thu Mar 24, 2016, 11:50 AM

Jackie Wilson Said (4,176 posts)

1. You are treating the issues of the right as if they are legitimate. Most of their issues

simply are not.

The issues we have in common, economics mainly, yes, but almost every factor which drives them to the polls is based in hatred and fear.

Your thinly veiled attempt to throw Hillary into the same camp as the rightwing, is part of the problem.

Things are coming to a head. I believe vast changes are coming, whether we want them to, or not:

1. You are treating the issues of the right as if they are legitimate. Most of their issues

3. I'm sure people on the right feel their issues are just as legitimate as yours

5. It doesnt surprise me AT ALL you are sympathizing with rightwing racists and bigots.

12. I sympathize with people in general and tend to call out hypocrisy like that in your comment.

13. That's wrong. People are not automatically evil....

26. Ugh and sigh

6. And you are using that.....

8. All democrats or almost all are pro corporate. Bernie isnt, a couple others.

11. Most 'elected democrats' are pro corporate....

14. "All democrats or almost all are pro corporate." Really? I think Hillary is winning at this point

58. They debates where not rigged!!

60. And schedule those few debates during major sports events

67. "Issues of the right??" The OP doesn't even touch "issues of the right."

68. Those on the Right? Their issues are just as legitimate to them as yours are to you.

82. I knew it, I knew it

86. HRC is a Camp all unto herself. Many of her currrent positions fall

2. Your choice: Corporate Socialism or Democratic Socialism. Choose wisely.

52. Oh.....I like that. That would make a great teashirt.

4. K&R

7. I agree...

15. We need that in my district.

9. Hillary is a "Progressive" in the same way many corporatists believe that this

69. ...

92. Like the movement conservative on the right, Bernie Sanders is a movement progressive on the right

10. Change is ALWAYS coming. This isn't some overly dramatic transformation going on, it's a sea change.

16. Examples of Corporate Power people: The banks that took part in the financial scandals of 2007

19. I'd be more satisfied if we aimed at the correct targets: Congress.

22. About "a presidential bully pulpit," Pres. Obama is not only not using it - he, in fact, is

27. When Obama uses the bully pulpit ... the disgruntled left screams ...

32. Obama uses the bully pulpit

34. Bernie should run against Obama then.

44. You've noticed "a bunch of DU members who only appear when the general election is approaching."

70. Eh, I've been here all along

80. "DU might but what does that mean in the vast scheme of things? Not much."

85. I'd prefer that a great transformation take place.

17. Soon Bernie will endorse Hillary, and then there will be the Democratic party and a few

21. That's when Bernie will get his spot under the bus

50. True that. It will be hilarious.

89. <> -- you hope. Only vindictive people think

90. No more vindictive

24. Yes, Bernie would be the type to endorse his opponent should he lose. I wouldn't

72. Did you miss this?

18. I totally agree

20. Donald Trump is using much the same criticisms.

37. I do not think Hillary would even try to influence any changes in the system we have now.

48. Yes, I agree that many of the "old bulls" in Congress should have already retired. You can be

56. And how do think that might actually happen in the real world?

59. Since 90% of the news media is Republican-owned, the Democrats are at a horrendous disadvantage.

65. Clout and influence are meaningless

71. That's illogical.

23. Yeap, the marginalized and left out are coming to power... inside the DNC. The DNC establishment...

25. Sorry, don't see it.

30. At the moment both Democrats and Republicans are simply rebelling against their own

31. Well ... Trump is killing the GOP establishment ...

49. You are partially right, Bernie is not killing the Dem. Establishment the way Trump is

28. The divisions with the dems are just as serious as the

33. Nonsense ...

35. Historical realignment. Sixth in fact

39. Ahhh ... argument from imagined authority.

40. Nope. It is happening

41. You babble a great deal as you make assumptions about who you think ...

42. It is your online persona

43. Another great non response.

46. Use the google or not

29. All I can reply to this is thank whoever that Bernie will not be

73. The latest national poll shows that Sanders continues to increase his lead over Clinton. He

81. It's still not translating into

88. You're right. At this point, it looks more likely that Hillary would win in the Primaries -- all

36. The guy who bowed down to gun corporations and lockheed martin isnt a corporatist?

87. If you're talking about Bernie, he voted against the Iraq War. He is definitely not a Corporatist,

45. Bernie is setting the table for Elizabeth Warren.

54. That would certainly be a good idea. Warren has the integrity, brains and good-will to

57. Elizabeth Warren is almost 67 years "young".

91. Some people retain their health and vigor - both physically and mentally - longer than

84. Many Many Thanks

47. I call clinton a repub. Definitely not a progressive. What laugh!

79. Yet Republicans loathe her with a vengeance

83. Maybe she is too far right for me and not far right enough for the far right?

51. I agree with your intuitions. nt