I am sorry but i just don't see the same vitriol coming from the Hillary camp that i do from the

[Jitter65]

Sanders camp. Just look here and around the Internet. Just listen to their spokespeople during their TV interviews. If people can't see the huge difference it is baffling. They are just worlds apart and the media pundits seem to always give the BS camp a pass (except for Tamara today.)

There is never a positive thing said from the Sanders camp about Hillary. Yet her camp always finds at least one positive thing to say about Sanders. I really find it all baffling. The Sanders camp rarely, if ever, talks about what must be done to bring us together for the GE no matter who wins the primary.

[hrmjustin]

1. I don't expect much from Sanders or his keyboard warriors.

[daleanime]

4. I imagine not...

[Baobab]

58. You don't have a problem with somebody who lies so much?

being President?

or with the Democratic Party nominating somebody who is so divisive ?

See http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/hillary-clinton-favorable-rating#!smoothing=less&estimate=custom

Such a controversial and painfully arrogant person?

[Hortensis]

137. Bernie lies significantly more than Hillary.

Simple truth -- check the watchdogs.

[Baobab]

145. Nope - check the facts.

Hillary doesnt know how to tell the truth. Perhaps you have not noticed her overstatements of her 'qualifications' ?

its so consistent.

[Hortensis]

148. Every time you say qualifications you remind

people of Bernie Sanders' ignorance of how to carry out his own promises. Sanders not only has no genuine plans even now for how to make it happen, but he clearly spent 25 years in Congress without planning for how to make it happen.

HOW could Bernie, a professional legislator, not know what laws are in place that he could put to use? Unbelievable.

As for grades for truth-telling/fudging/lying, check the fact-checkers. Neither are angels, both have told the truth or half-truth more than mislead and far than any on the GOP side, but Bernie has lied to you and mislead you more than she has.

[Baobab]

149. Nope, he's being nice to Hillary to not being something really ugly up.

Bill's 1990s trade deeal.

That's the obstacle to just about everything, my dear.

[uponit7771]

140. Sanders doesn't lie not more than anyone else so no I don't have a problem with his lying

[Democrats Ascendant]

154. Hunh?

"Sanders doesn't lie...I don't have a problem with his lying"

[SheenaR]

69. "Keyboard warriors"

says the guy who talks a boastful game here daily...

[Hortensis]

138. Would you prefer Bernie's "true believers"?

“Mass movements can rise and spread without belief in a god, but never without belief in a devil. Usually, the strength of a mass movement is proportionate to the vividness and tangibility of its devil.” Eric Hoffer

"It's not a lie if you believe it." George Costanza

[pinebox]

72. Says the guy with 66,247 posts posts

[Prism]

83. What's that old adage?

I'm not a jerk. Everyone else is!

[zappaman]

96. say the guy with 3706 posts, but only 1 for the first few years..

[Rob H.]

97. ...including seven hidden posts in a single day. nt

[SMC22307]

110. Three cheers for amnesty!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=281267&sub=trans

There's some real beauts in there, the majority hidden 7-0 and 6-1. Alert-stalking my ass.

[Rob H.]

116. One of 'em's up to 17(!) with no signs of slowing down

He's flagged for review at the moment but he'll no doubt get back to posting as usual as soon as he comes back. The entire amnesty has been a farce on top of being a laugh-out-loud stupid idea in the first place.

[SMC22307]

130. Well, someone's gotta be the first to hit 20.

We can have a little .

[zigby]

125. and a Sanders-hater website too, from what I hear?

[bvf]

111. Shouldn't you be canvassing?

Oh wait. It's probably partly cloudy outside, or maybe a bit too windy.

[Bonobo]

139. Is that like a keyboard pastor? nt

[wendylaroux]

2. you're forgiven.

[daleanime]

3. Might want to have that....

ear and eye checkup, you may have put it off too long. Maybe once we push through universal health care, you won't have to skip such important things.

[Protalker]

34. You're right it needs pushed!

Why isn't Bernie helping congressional candidates who will be his front line? One Democrat helping another
Is that too much to ask?

[Sky Masterson]

5. You don't see it because you agree with it.

I see rabid Hillary fans rushing us toward defeat during the next election.
Hillary supporters see a magical land where all the people in this country who don't like her are going to Catch the Hillary Magic and just fall in love.

[mythology]

71. This. Both sides have people who have behaved poorly

Pretending otherwise is foolish.

[revbones]

102. Wow, you sound just like the media that says both Republicans & Democrats do it... nt

[ibegurpard]

6. lol

A big chunk of the most recent shit is coming from YOU!
You're unbelievable...

[ebayfool]

161. That. Right there. ^^^ I couldn't believe my eyes at first! n/t

[NWCorona]

7. Where were you when Hillary supporters sided with Joe Arpaio rather than Jane Sanders?

Both sides are equally guilty.

[Thinkingabout]

30. Broad brush, eh?

[NWCorona]

47. How was that broad?

[polly7]

8. .........

[astrophuss42]

9. The satire here is rich. Oh no, you don't mean....

Look, I've been brusque a time or two but it's not out of hatred or bitterness. I find the Hillary PR people pretty smarmy, but all politicians have positive and negative attributes. At this point, culturally, I could compare Hillary to Cosby. I really grew up with her and now it's like an icon lost.

[nichomachus]

10. Check out the Hillary Group on DU

It's a mish-mash of spurious poll results, fawning pieces from Hillary sycophants, and Bernie bashing, mostly Bernie bashing. Almost nothing from the group is in line with its stated terms of service.

[AgerolanAmerican]

13. ^this

I had to hide the Hillary group because every single post was at best disingenuous, stuff they wouldn't dare to post in parts of the site that they can't unilaterally and heavy-handedly ban dissent.

[azmom]

84. I did the same thing for the same reasons.

[Thinkingabout]

32. Like this post is doing to the Hillary group and hillary supporters?

[AlbertCat]

120. Like this post is doing to the Hillary group and hillary supporters?

You mean debunking BS? That isn't "vitriol".

[KPN]

11. Are you serious?

I guess you just have a strong bias for Hillary. I see the opposite -- not that I don't have a bias.

As for bringing the two together, I've seen plenty of posts from Bernie supporters asking what Hillary will do to actually try to bring Berners on board should she get the nomination. But not a peep in response.

You got any thoughts on that? How's the Hillary camp going to win us over? Because only Hillary can do that. It makes no sense to expect Berners to just chuck their interests and concerns out the window for the status quo, i.e., a Party that in their view has not really represented their economic issues going on 30 years now.

[pampango]

12. That is at least partly because I feel and remember the vitriol directed at MY candidate more than

I do the vitriol directed at the OTHER candidate.

I have seen plenty of posts from both sides expressing the feeling that the other side's vitriol is over the top towards their candidate, while they themselves are just objectively expressing their differences with the other candidate.

I am not sure if there is an objective way to measure vitriol from the respective sides.

[MineralMan]

14. The Sanders campaign appeals strongly to the

dissatisfied and disgruntled. While that adds to his support somewhat, it also leads to dissatisfied and disgruntled people acting in toxic ways in their effort to support his candidacy. From posting ugly things on Internet forums and social media venues to defacing public property with "campaign" words and images, they sometimes harm the campaign.

Hillary Clinton, on the other hand, tends to attract long-time Democratic voters who eschew such activities. While that leads to a more sedate campaign style by her supporters, it can also lead to less devoted support.

Angry, unhappy people are somewhat more likely to take action, which includes attending caucuses and voting. That's really why Clinton isn't dominating the primary season, although she continues to maintain a lead in pledged delegates and the popular vote.

If, as I expect, she becomes the Democratic nominee, many of the most strident Sanders supporters will disappear from most online venues and retreat back into their silent outrage. Following the convention, I think you can expect to see the rhetoric calm down and a more reasonable level of discussion.

In the meantime, we can only wait to see what happens and support the candidate we prefer.

[wendylaroux]

16. so what you're saying is "I got mine,fuck you!"

[MineralMan]

20. Had I wanted to say that, I would have done so.

Please reread the reply. I said nothing of the sort. I'm not sure what it is you think "I got," but if you knew me, you'd know that it's not much. Also, I would never say "fuck you" to anyone. That's not my style at all. What I did say was my opinion, as is everything I post on DU. You apparently disagree with my opinion.

However, you have failed to explain how you disagree. Trying to put words in my mouth does not help me understand your disagreement. It only points out that you disagree.

In any case, thank you for taking the time to write a reply. If you have any other comments, I'll be glad to read them.

[Armstead]

33. "If you're not angry you're not paying attention"

Even if one's personal life and finances are totally hunky dory anyone with a conscience and sense of morality should be angry at what is being done to their neighbors, to democracy, to "opportunity capitalism" and the way our government is bought and sold.

[MineralMan]

41. Yes, well, that's a nice slogan and all, but.

we will have a Democratic nominee after the convention. That's the next step for me. Whoever it is will have my full support.

My state's primary event has already occurred, so I'm a spectator now. There are legislative races in my state to focus on. Next Saturday, I'll be a delegate at our state senate and house convention. We'll be endorsing candidates. After that, I'll probably be a delegate to our congressional district convention, where we will endorse our House representative and choose delegates to the State Convention. I probably won't be going to the State Convention, though. It's in another city, and I don't have the funds or time to attend.

I'll be waiting for the national convention. Following that, I'll be working for all Democratic candidates on the ballot here in Minnesota. That's what I do.

[Armstead]

45. I was responding to your dismissive characterization

[wendylaroux]

39. When I think of a Clinton supporter,I thunk of a privileged person.

or maybe a person who thinks the American dream is just around the corner for them.

When I think of a Bernie supporter,I think of a financialy strapped person,or,a

person who is doing just fine,but CARES about others not doing well.

Bernie is the only one I have heard even mention the word "poor" or "needy


The best way to judge what a person will do in the future,is by looking at their past.


Bernie has the best record,

[MineralMan]

49. Hmm...well, I'm a Clinton supporter,

and I'm 70 years old, living on Social Security and still working at my trade of writing. Am I financially strapped? That depends. If my hot water heater fails, then I will be. If I need an expensive auto repair, then, yes, I'll be financially strapped. If I can't work, I'll also be financially strapped.

Do I care how others are doing? Of course. Does Hillary? Of course. Do Republicans? Of course not.

I no longer have "an American dream." I'm hoping to live for another decade or two and survive. What I do not want is a Republican administration in the White House next year. That's why I'll be supporting the Democratic nominee, regardless of who that is. I'm not going to call either of them vile names. I'll be supporting one of them for the general election.

Thank you for your additional response. I hope my reply helps you understand me better.

[wendylaroux]

55. Oh it does indeed,thank you.

I just want things to be better for my kids and their kids.If things continue going the way they are,well,

they will probably be struggling all their lives too,worrying about their water heater going out.

Hillary is more of the same.To close to wall street,that one is.

[brush]

40. Now that's what I call a "comeback" . . . courteous and reasoned. Beautiful.

[wendylaroux]

43. oh please! lol

[brush]

63. Oh please, what? That was quite well handled.

[pkdu]

103. Exactly. Well said . Nt

[Jackie Wilson Said]

35. So you are saying that some mainstream dems are well enough off to not care about

supporting the aggressive policies of Bernie's which would help those who are not so well off?

That they would be selfish if they didn't support that which would help those with less than them?

[wendylaroux]

42. Exactly,Bernie is the only one I have heard even

talk about the" poor and needy." He has that goodness in him,I see that trait in no one else running.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

46. Right, agreed. So would you extend that logic to, oh I dont know

let's say women's healthcare, minority rights, voting rights?

I dont know if you are one of the Bern or Bust folks, so I am trying to make a point.

[wendylaroux]

50. Bernie's concerns focus on the people,that includes

women,minority rights.voting rights. The things that affect all the people.

Things have been messed up for along time,he sees that,something has got to change.

Too many pissed off people running around.Not good.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

53. No question, but Bernie might lose. And no rational, thinking person can allege

Hillary isn't much much better on those issues than you know who (gop)

[wendylaroux]

61. We shall continue to watch the polls,but right now,Bernie polls better,

against the other side right now.

And remember,people who are hurting,struggling,scared are not rational all the time.

Their way to a better life is Bernie,not Hillary.

Something has got to give in this country.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

65. But what if it doesn't? What if she is the nominee?

If you are one of those people hurting, you have to know it would get way worse under the GOP, I know you know that.

[wendylaroux]

74. I just don't know. I may just work on my state elections,from here on out.

and wait for another Democratic Socialist to come along to run for prez.,if

Bernie loses.But I doubt I will see another Bernie type in my life.

[Jackie Wilson Said]

75. So you will not help the millions who will be deported or the women who will die

self aborting?

[wendylaroux]

86. I would have to vote H in that case.

[JudyM]

18. Keep pretending you understand. You're entitled to your opinion, and you certainly post more

than a fair share of them here, but you are confusing rejection of a corrupt political system that has massively destructive economic and social results, with random, unwarranted, presumably, dissatisfaction as a way of being... Your assessment is not even remotely accurate.

But please, go on with your righteous complacency with the status quo.

[MineralMan]

22. Thank you for encourage me to continue posting my opinion

here. You can be assured that I will do that. No worries.

[JudyM]

26. How typical. No response to the substance of the response.

[anotherproletariat]

21. EXACTLY!! This is just politics 101 nt

[JoePhilly]

62. + 1

[Kentonio]

70. Bernie Sander's campaign is one of hope, not disgruntlement.

If you don't understand that, you don't understand this primary at all.

[MineralMan]

76. I'm not talking about his official campaign.

I talking about some of his supporters. They are not necessarily connected to his actual, official campaign.

Most people are not connected directly to a campaign, but support a candidate. I understand presidential campaigns very well, through decades of participating in them.

[Kentonio]

89. Yet clearly your familiarity has caused you to miss the wood for the trees.

The context of the campaign is dissatisfaction with the current state of affairs, but the core that runs through it and which draws the supporters to it, is hope and love. That sounds incredibly hokey when its written down, but that's what it is. He draws people not through anger but through kindness, and despite how vitriolic things here can get, the desire for a kinder world comes out of most of his supporters here too. It's the one big thing the Hillary supporters seem to generally miss when they look at the Bernie supporters, they see derision or naivety instead of genuine compassion.

[nadinbrzezinski]

126. This is comedy gold... I am serious.

[Jitter65]

135. Yes. You are correct. I guess I'll wait. I enjoy meaninful discussion and debate.

It is really hard to find today. Few want to exchange thoughts, most just want to rant and not listen. Thanks for your thoughtful exchanges.

[uponit7771]

141. 2 million more votes = dominating primary season

[IdaBriggs]

15. I believe that is called "selection bias".

Vitriol from the Hillary camp has included -

1) He doesn't like black people.
2) He lied about his civil rights record.
3) He is a horrible husband.
4) He isn't a Democrat.
5) He doesn't support other Democrats.
6) He doesn't raise money for Democrats.
7) He is not as "experienced" as his opponent.
8) He doesn't understand how banking works.
9) He's mean.
10) He's a misogynist.
11) He's a liar.
12) He needs to quit because his ideas are stupid.
13) He can't do math (electoral or budget).
14) He is not grounded in reality.
15) His coworkers hate him.
16) He is really bad as a Congressman/never accomplished anything.
17) He never cared about Healthcare.
18) He is responsible for the Sandy Hook murders.
19) His state is why there is an illegal gun problem in New York.
20) He is really just like Hillary, except she's better.

And then we get to the attitudes about his supporters...

21) His supporters are all white men who act like Trump.
22) His female supporters are just there because they like to be with boys.
23) His young supporters just like to party at protests and don't do research.
24) His supporters all just want free stuff.
25) His supporters aren't really Democrats and will vote Trump.

Those are the ones I have seen right off the top of my head in the last month.

The fun part is, every single one is a LIE.

And "Team Hillary" doesn't understand why no one believes a word out of their lying mouths....

[anotherproletariat]

23. You have to be careful to separate 'the Clinton camp' from random people posting on the internet

If one were to attribute all of the things said hear by Bernie supporters to the campaign, it would be an even longer and more over-the-top list.

[IdaBriggs]

31. I believe the list is from her and/or her campaign surrogates.

Random trolls on the Internet don't start this nonsense, but they definitely carry the water.

[TCJ70]

25. That's a solid summary n/t

[WhiteTara]

82. #23...

They allowed the republicans take the supreme court in Wisconsin by not voting down ticket. By 11%. Of course when they finish school they'll leave Wisconsin and won't have to live with the effects of not doing research and only wanting to make that protest vote. Of course, I'm sure you'll vilify me for noticing that, but hey, it's primary season.

[shadowandblossom]

159. 15%

was what I heard. I just figured those ones were closet Republicans...

[4Q2u2]

85. You Forgot

He is a Commie and Best Friend to Fidel Castro

His people engage in McCarthy like tactics.

[oldandhappy]

17. funny how we do not read the same posts

[Bobbie Jo]

19. You're about to get a live demonstration.

[leftynyc]

24. Neither do I

I see on other left leaning boards that people are getting sick of Bernie and his tactics. But don't expect DU to believe it without shrieking about them being secret right wingers. He'll get my vote if he's the nominee but that's it - no money, no phonebanking, no knocks on any doors and I wont buy any buttons or tshirts as I usually always do (I STILL have my President Quayle tshirt with an image of the painting The Scream on it). His supporters are to blame for my lukewarm support but he's done nothing to rein them in so he's to blame as well.

[MineralMan]

37. I take a different approach if Bernie Sanders becomes

the Democratic nominee. I will do as I do in every presidential election campaign and strongly support and campaign for him. I'll behave exactly as I would if Hillary were the nominee. I take presidential elections very seriously, because I've seen what Republican Presidents have done to this country.

As a lifelong Democrat, I actively support Democratic presidential candidates, because the alternative always leads to poor results and regressive actions.

I'm supporting Hillary Clinton in the primaries, but my primary event has passed, and I've turned my attention to legislative races in my own state. Once the convention has been held, I'll be out there as I am every election year, knocking on doors and trying to get Democrats to go to the polling place in November.

Whoever is the candidate of our party will get my full, enthusiastic support. We need to elect a Democrat as President in 2016. Failure to do that will be a very bad thing, I believe, since it could lead to the Republicans being in control of all three branches of federal government at a time when much harm could be done.

I hope you'll change your mind, if Bernie is the nominee. I think the nominee will be Hillary, but I'm prepared for the other eventuality, too.

[leftynyc]

44. Right now, he just gets my vote

If he does anything to rein in his supporters and try and unify the party, I may change my mind. But as of now, I see no evidence of that. NY will go to Hillary or Bernie regardless of what I do but I used to very much enjoy the phonebanking and collecting the fun buttons I wore every single day and covered my back pack. Maybe I should just stay off GD-P - that way his most vile supporters wont be swaying me.

[MineralMan]

51. I'm completely outcome oriented when it comes to

presidential elections. I have a stake in those elections and concerns about Republicans. I don't care who the Democratic nominee ends up being. Whoever it is will have my enthusiastic support. The nominee will need all the support available, so I'll be there.

[leftynyc]

54. I wish I could

I was a Hillary supporter in 2008 and THE DAY she suspended her campaign I was online buying the buttons and tshirts (all of which I still have) for then Senator Obama. The Bernie supporters have so turned me off him that I can't help but wonder what it is in him that brings that much ugly out. Like I said, it's up to him to earn the kind of support you're talking about. So far, he hasn't.

Edited to add: I'm also very sour on his refusal to help downticket candidates because he would lose street cred. I find that fucking nauseating.

[Jitter65]

136. Yep. But his is what happens when the focus of a voter is simply on defeating an opponent.

http://www.wpr.org/bradley-wins-full-term-wisconsin-supreme-court

It was nearly impossible to get the millennials to think about down ticket or local elections because their focus was only on voting for Bernie. No amount of discussion with my own young adults is allowed unless you are praising Bernie and demeaning Hillary. For the life of me, I don't know where they got that from. Talking about Hillary supporting down ticket candidates and the importance of studying the issues and voting in the local contests just goes over their heads. I live in Maryland but the outcome of the WI court election is an important issue for all of us. Fully 15% of Sanders' supporters only voted for him and no one else while only 4% of Clinton voters neglected voting for others. I can get the source for this if you like. But the point is, if Democrats don't do a better job of informing our voters about all the issues and what is at stake in state and local elections, no matter who wins at the top, things will remain the same.

I think all my family, even my Bernie supporting children, will be able to make good choices for our other races when it comes time to vote in our primary. But it has been a struggle. The loss of so many local newspapers is really hurting the communities. At least they would contain information and discussion about local elections. Now we are stuck with the Washington Post and two conservative local papers because they are the ones with the funds to publish.

[revbones]

27. What could we say that was positive about her? nt

[tabasco]

28. You ain't looking very hard, then, n/t

[Armstead]

29. Perhaps this will help your vision

[libtodeath]

36. I see the Hillary camp pushing endless rw talking points here.

[uponit7771]

38. +1

[Blue_In_AK]

48. Each of us operates from our own unique perspective.

From mine, it's the Hillary supporters who are hard to take.

[polichick]

52. The Clinton camp is just sneakier, using the media and surrogates to slime Bernie.

[riversedge]

60. After Bernie quoted a WaPo headline as a HRC quote, she has a point

What "leader" calls out another Dem Presidential Candidate based on a headline??



DemsAgainstBernie ?@DemsAgainstBern 2h2 hours ago

Hillary said Bernie hadn't done his homework, not that he's unqualified. After Bernie quoted a WaPo headline as a HRC quote, she has a point

[Bluenorthwest]

66. Hillary's not done her homework but that does not keep her from speaking falsehoods:

"It may be hard for your viewers to remember how difficult it was for people to talk about HIV/AIDS back in the 1980s and because of both president and Mrs. Reagan — in particular Mrs. Reagan — we started a national conversation, when before nobody would talk about it, nobody wanted to do anything about it, and that too is something I really appreciate with her very effective low-key advocacy. It penetrated the public conscience and people began to say, hey, we have to do something about this too."

I still can't believe any Democrat would say such a thing or believe such myths about our own times. Those who support that worldview are cold and heartless.

[riversedge]

88. ah--you are changing the focus. It is on Sanders lie. bye

[Bluenorthwest]

108. None of her DU supporters had the decency to speak agasint that bullshit and you have the nerve

to talk about 'not doing homework'. That's not changing focus, that's putting a spotlight on your hypocrisy and Hillary's lack of honesty about important issues. She claimed the people who sounded the alarms back then did nothing, the Reagans did it all. They did nothing.
But her supporters do not care about that at all, they all defended it and excused it. They agree with her because they are Reagan Democrats, conservatives.

[Skwmom]

56. Bernie has a MUCH different history than Hillary Clinton. The media constantly smears and lies

about Sanders while protecting their corporate candidate.

The Clinton surrogates go on and speak lies and smears that have already been debunked but are allowed to spew the lies and smears unchallenged by the corporate hacks.

[DesertRat]

57. Many of us see it too.

If a public person expresses their support of Hillary on social media, they are often attacked with hateful comments and/or threats. I'm not sure what's behind it, but that kind of behavior isn't changing hearts and minds of anyone.

[Beacool]

59. He's a protest candidate who only joined the Democratic party out of self interest.

In the last stretch of the primary season, he and his team, seem intent on tarnishing the person that in all likelihood will be the party's standard bearer in the GE. Not cool.

[Yurovsky]

87. Maybe some folks think Goldman Sachs is "not cool"...

I'm sorry but the Democratic standard bearer should NOT be in the pocket of forces that are hell bent on crushing poor and working-class Americans. There is more than enough money elsewhere to fund a campaign that can win (see Bernie's donor base if you don't believe me).

Hillary made the choice to take all of that dirty money. And if you don't think that Wall Street money is dirty, you simply don't understand progressive Americans and why Senator Sanders has continued to exceed the expectations of the media and the status-quo-loving party establishment. Heck, even the right wing nuts are fed up with the status quo, although they're too stupid to figure out who it is that is screwing them... They're just taking it out on their own party establishment.

Progressives, OTOH, know exactly who is putting the screws to them. And Hillary is in bed with many of those same forces. Ain't no way, ain't no how many of us can support her until she distances herself from evil bastards like the CEOs of the investment banks who have stroked her fat checks.

I won't surrender to those monsters, nor will I "play nice" or believe the nonsense that they are a necessary evil in our economy. Hillary ought to know better. The fact that she doesn't makes her unfit for office IMO.

[Bluenorthwest]

64. Hillary supporters on DU have been relentlessly negative and vitriolic starting in the summer and

it has not ended. Their transparency pages and the fact that so many are 'flagged for review' moments after being given an amnesty for their nastiness supports my assessment that the Clinton Camp is the source of most of the venom on DU. Even when admins personally protect them, they still get in trouble for being mean and rude. What does that tell us?

[LuckyTheDog]

67. Go to Twitter

It's vicious.

[AgingAmerican]

68. Visible transparency pages tell the story

Of where the true vitriol is coming from

[SheenaR]

73. If you don't see it

let me direct you to this man

[Hiraeth]

77. seek and ye shall find

The Bible

[Madam Mossfern]

78. ....and this OP

is what?

[Lil Missy]

79. You are right. Objectivity (and reality) has a pro-Hillary bias. n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

80. My personal experience tells me otherwise

It has been nasty.

[Betty Karlson]

81. He or she is a very sorry person indeed, who sees the world with rose-tinted bias.

[Gothmog]

90. The Sanders camp knows that Sanders has no chance of being the nominee and are frustrated

[winter is coming]

91. I've seen this movie before. Attack Bernie, and when that starts to crumble,

repeat the same bullshit about his supporters.

[QC]

92. Confirmation bias

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

[Rob H.]

93. A quick perusal of your fellow HRC supporters' transparency pages

...blows a giant hole in your claim of less vitriol, unless you consider between 10 and 17 hidden posts normal.

Edited to add: a DU member also started a pro-Hillary site where he and other current DU members bash Bernie-supporting DUers. Not only is he still a member here--some others are, too, and didn't even bother to choose different user names for the other site--he's a member of MIRT, too. I would've PPRed the lot of them if I were an admin here, and their behavior makes me like her even less.

[basselope]

94. You forgot the sarcasm tag.

[RiverLover]

95. That's because Hillary is too republican to want to rally around should she get the nom.

We're fighting repubs here, make no mistake.

Pro-war for profit
Pro-monopolies
Pro-fracking
Pro-off shore drilling
Pro-outsourcing
Pro-off shoring
Pro-BigAg
Pro-deregulating the financial industry
Pro-insurance industry
Pro-charter schools & defunding public schools
Pro-corrupt campaign finance


She's a repub DINO conning us with the help of her corrupt corporate media buddies.

[Rob H.]

99. ^^This. A million times this. nt

[Turin_C3PO]

98. Vitriol seems to be coming from both sides equally.

I hate the divisiveness on DU right now.

[Bill USA]

100. much of their material comes from GOP anti-Hillary propaganda mills. They may even believe it.

That's what's kinda scary. People with little knowledge of a complex subject often resort to the argument that they have enthusiasm. What they mean is, because they don't know enough about the subject, they think the answers are simple. .. and anyone who says otherwise is obviously in league with the Devil .. just like evil Hillary.

[Katashi_itto]

112. See #95. No talking points there. Just her stances.

[Bill USA]

129. a lot of patent bullshit... misrepresenting HRC's positions. not worthy of comment

just a couple of examples:

"Pro-war for profit"...this is just propaganda..this is obvious.

"Pro-deregulating the financial industry" ...she was for Dodd-Frank..By saying she is Pro-deregutaion of Financial Industry you are admitting you are just shovelling bullshit, or you only read propaganda on her ... probably from a Right wing source.

[Katashi_itto]

131. Lol..!

[Bill USA]

156. I rest my case.

[Katashi_itto]

157. You never had one in the first for your corporate lackey.

[Squinch]

101. I think they have been being fed right wing talking points against her

for a long time, and they have come to actually believe them. I think they truly do think she is the incarnation of evil, like the Republicans do.

It's absurd, of course, and it's sad that they are buying it, but it explains the vitriol.

[DrDan]

117. I agree - all this Benghazi and email vitriol has had an impact on the BS supporters

they want so much to believe it

[Katashi_itto]

158. Not as nearly as much as what is spewed by the Clintonistas.

[ViseGrip]

104. She has upset parents of dead children for her benefit with a LIE.

I'll be they feel she's disqualified now too.

[PowerToThePeople]

105. Loyalty oath test, take 2000.

[betsuni]

106. K&R

[DrDan]

107. spot on

[rock]

109. My fault

I'm not trying hard enough.

[hobbit709]

113. Must be that one way glass you're looking through.

and a pretty bad memory of some of your own posts.

[smiley]

114. pro...

jection.
eom

[NurseJackie]

115. As annoying as it can be, I'm LOVING it!! It lets me know that they ALSO see and understand ...

... that Bernie has ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE of ever becoming the nominee.

[aikoaiko]

118. You must be a HRC supporter.

It's a common cognitive bias to see the person on your side as better than the other side. Google Us versus Them
Bias.

negative comments sting more when from the other side and it's easier to see the kernel of truth when your side hits hard.

I found HRCs campaign and many of her supporters to be despicable. Even DUers created Bernie hate websites.

[AlbertCat]

119. Yet her camp always finds at least one positive thing to say about Sanders.

Yeah... like "He's toast"?

Hillary's campers don't have to even say anything to show her/ their arrogance. Just some gif with her brushing off her shoulder, like she brushes off so many progressives, is enough. Her people here mostly laugh and talk about polls and how she's "the most respected woman in the world!" ....anything but talk issues. Any talk of issues is considered "vitriol" because Clinton is usually on the wrong side of them.

[kdmorris]

122. Or POS snake oil salesman?

Yeah, that's positive...

[bvf]

123. "Any talk of issues is considered 'vitriol'

because Clinton is usually on the wrong side of them."

Nicely put!

The victim card has been the Clinton campaign's first tool of choice since forever.

[asuhornets]

121. Don't you get it?

they love it this way... The all day anti-Hillary fest - they love it.

[99Forever]

124. I'd hazard to guess...

... that your field of vision is mostly colon.

[matt819]

127. This is a joke, right?

I've thought just the opposite.

[Earth_First]

128. Sniffles... nt

[mhatrw]

132. Clinton and her supporters are ever persecuted and always victims.

The victim card is strong in this one.

[scioto99]

133. I like both candidates. Prefer her; but would be happy with him.

I think the majority of her supporters feel just the same. I've seen him criticized - sometimes fairly, often not - but I haven't seen outright venom against him on DU except for that one bizarre and revolting Jew-hating poster who came over from the Breitbart site.

The hatred of Hillary Clinton, OTOH, really amazes me. This is a person long considered "too liberal" by republicans - yet look at her being villified as too conservative by democrats.

A recent BBC article (possibly still available; look under the "US elections" tab) compares policies among her, Obama, Sanders, and JFK on several fronts, and basically she ranks close to obama in just about everything, is well left of center, though generally to the right of sanders except on gun stuff. And is placed well left of the beloved JFK on foreign policy. That's the BBC, which has no dog in the fight.

But whatever. In just a few months we'll have the fun of seeing what happens.

I don't know if others feel the same but - I find it hard to care as much as I used to. I'll cast my vote I guess - but I don't want to be an active campaigner in the Dem camp (and certainly not in any other camp). An atmosphere of virulent hatred is one I will happily steer clear of.

I've decided to stand back and grimace in amusement, no matter what. Fortunately, I'm too old to need an abortion, and I've got the money and connections to get one for my daughters if the need arises.

Sauve qui peut.

[potone]

134. You have contributed greatly to it.

So why don't you set an example and stop attacking Bernie's supporters?

[SidDithers]

142. It's a sign of desperation...

Sanders and his supporters know they're losing.

They're flailing about, hoping desperately to score a hit on Hillary.

It's the final death throes of a nearly dead campaign.

Sid

[mainer]

143. Hillary insults opponent's voters. Sanders doesn't.

When the candidate HERSELF calls Sanders voters naive and uninformed, and her close surrogate Steinem says Sanders voters just want to be "where the boys are", it's gonna be hard for those same voters to support Hillary in the GE.

[LAS14]

147. Maybe it's because Hillary's voters are for the most part civil.

[mainer]

151. HILLARY is the uncivil one. Insulting and demeaning Sanders supporters.

I'm not talking about the supporters themselves.

[unc70]

144. If you could serve on juries, you might see things differently

I now serve on a lot of juries each day. Thus I see a lot of bad behavior. While I have my biases, I try to treat all sides fairly when on a jury. I prefer in general to leave posts and let them be handled within the discussions.

Lately, I have been seeing a lot cases where the whole thread is offensive but the alerted post is no worse than the rest. Usually, it just misses violating the TOS because it is in a protected group. Even though I vote to leave those posts, I and 1-2 others are likely to comment against the post and thread.

A quick scan of my jury results emails shows the majority of the vitriol
(irrespective of my vote) seems to be coming from the Clinton side, though there are too many from all all sides. A lot of the problems all around are from a small group of posters. Things have gotten much worse since amnesty and since Sanders has been winning more states.

I don't have anyone on ignore, haven't trashed any groups, so I see it all. Most of those who complain about other DUers are themselves the least civil and least honest among us.

[LAS14]

146. Well said and true! I would except Sanders himself from this.

He does sweep her up in his rant against wall street. (She, like everyone else in the "established" political parties and government maintain their ties to all parts of our country/economy). But even in his muddled response to Charlie Rose last night you could see him try to walk back the "unqualified" remark which he, himself, obviously recognized as a childish lashing out in response to some effective criticism.

But his talking heads and the majority of supporters here in DU are just appalling. That's why I posted a question here a few weeks ago about whether some Sanders supporters might switch to Trump. The same vitriolic mind set.

E.g., two or three times I've gotten my facts wrong in posts here. I correct them when I'm alerted to the problem. But the Sanders people accuse me of lying. You lie! they yell. I've suggested that "You are mistaken" would be a better approach. Hah!

[Lizzie Poppet]

150. I see the exact opposite.

Both in the tone and attitudes of the opposing supporter groups and in the media.

[Rebkeh]

152. I see the same from both sides, with one exception

The vitriol from one side, while ugly and unacceptable to me, is fact based.

On the other side, it's dirty tricks, lies, innuendo, sometimes bigotry and just plain nastiness with no semblance of actual truth telling. There seems to only be an effort to control outcomes by controlling the narrative. Elevating false equivalencies, false perceptions and influencing low/no information voters for their own agenda: win, no matter the cost.

Both sides are bad, one is devious though. And considerably worse.

The intensity is equal coming from both and I have no desire to engage with either one.

[HumanityExperiment]

153. No need to look further than DU's own 'backyard'...

You don't? Really? talk about putting the blinders on

Took me a few seconds to get an answer for your 'point'...

the "We are done with Bernie" thread...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/110793009

[Sheepshank]

155. Best to be careful with op's like this. The nasty swarming will confirm the OP

....and the irony of it all will "WOOOOSH" right over their heads.

[Demnorth]

160. Obviously it's like watching tennis,

there's a back-and-forth - but from my point of view, I agree with you.

On this site, you can see it just scrolling through a few pages of subject lines. Some use caps in their titles, although it's one person who does this frequently.

The name-calling stands out. Sanders isn't called nasty names the way Clinton is.

Both sides do this, but I've seen it moreso with those who support Sanders: instead of replying to a statement, criticize the candidate on a different topic.

Overall, there's an anger against Clinton that I just don't see against Sanders.

I think the individual forums should be discounted, it's expected that those groups are in agreement and would be praising their own candidate and critiquing the opposition.