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[KingFlorez]

This message was self-deleted by its author (KingFlorez) on Fri Apr 8, 2016, 02:53 PM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

[Blue_Adept]

1. He's just shaking up the establishment

it's a-ok.

[GreatGazoo]

2. spin

[geek tragedy]

3. Bernocchio strikes again. This is like Romney in 2008. nt

[roguevalley]

4. it will take the pope to say so for me to believe it

[Kelvin Mace]

32. So, the Pope is easily intimidated and gives out invitations

he doesn't want to?

[morningfog]

33. We do have our own Romney candidate in the Democratic Party, and it ain't Bernie.

[riderinthestorm]

44. Unless there's more than one outlier report on this, I'm going with the rest

From the BBC

From the BBC  


Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders has accepted an invitation from the Pope to the Vatican. 
Mr Sanders, who is Jewish, accepted an invitation to Rome for a conference at the end of next week.  
The Vatican visit is four days before the primary contest in New York, a competitive battle between him and front-runner Hillary Clinton.   
"I am a big, big fan of the pope," Mr Sanders told MSNBC, saying they share the same views on inequality.   
"He's trying to inject this sense of morality into how we do economics... and we need that absolutely desperately."   
He will attend a conference on social, economic and environmental issues and give a speech on 15 April, his campaign said.   

Mr Sanders and Pope Francis have similar views on fighting income inequality, he said, and he was "very moved" by the invitation from the Vatican.   
He said he and the pope disagree on women's rights and gay rights, but Pope Francis has "injected a moral consequence into the economy".  
The senator from Vermont is trailing Mrs Clinton but gaining momentum after a strong of wins, most recently in the Wisconsin primary.   
In the last few days, a mostly civil fight between the two became more personal as Mr Sanders accused his rival of not being "qualified" to be president.   
Pope Francis said on Friday that the Catholic Church should be less strict and show more compassion to "imperfect" Catholics.   
He called on the Church to be welcoming to gay Catholics but did not change the Church's views on LGBT families and marriage.  


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-35999269 

[B Calm]

5. A senior Vatican official, would be nice to know who that senior Vatican official is. Makes one

not believe in the truth of the article.

[Nanjeanne]

7. THey name the person in the article, Margaret Archer - and if she is

the President of the organization hosting the conference. Couldn't she just have said No to his "lobbying"?

[morningfog]

9. She's not even the one quoted as saying "monumental discourtesy"

[B Calm]

16. She's not a Vatican official.

[Nanjeanne]

21. No. She is President of the organization hosting the conference. I guess the Pope really

wants him there. That's good enough for me.

[geek tragedy]

37. the Pope appointed this woman. It is a Vatican organization hosting it. nt

[bobbobbins01]

19. She is not a vatican official

I think this story is BS.

[Nanjeanne]

24. I agree. But they are quoting her saying that Sanders strongly requested an invite. Whole story

is extremely weird.

Usually the President of the organizing group can stop someone they don't want at their conference from speaking. So the Pope must really have wanted him there . . . or someone high up sure did. That's good enough for me! I don't fault Sanders for asking. Why not?

[Armstead]

15. She's a British academic and social activist

Margaret Scotford Archer (born 20 January 1943) spent most of her academic career at the University of Warwick, UK, where she was for many years Professor of Sociology. She is now a professor at l'Ecole Polytechnique Fédérale de Lausanne, Switzerland. She is best known for coining the term elisionism in her 1995 book Realist Social Theory: The Morphogenetic Approach. In April 2014, Professor Archer was named by Pope Francis to succeed former Harvard law professor and U.S. Ambassador to the Holy See Mary Ann Glendon as President of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences.[1]

She studied at the University of London, graduating B.Sc. in 1964 and Ph.D. in 1967 with a thesis on The Educational Aspirations of English Working Class Parents. She was a lecturer at the University of Reading from 1966 to 1973.

She is one of the most influential theorists in the critical realist tradition. At the 12th World Congress of Sociology, she was elected as the first woman President of the International Sociological Association, is a founder member of both the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences and the Academy of Learned Societies in the Social Sciences. She is a Trustee of the Centre for Critical Realism.

She has supervised many Ph.D students, many of whom have gone on to contribute towards the substantive development of critical realism in the social sciences, including Rob Willmott, author of Education Policy and Realist Social Theory and Justin Cruickshank, senior lecturer at the University of Birmingham.[citation needed]

[Viva_La_Revolution]

26. i bet that 'official' didn't vote for this pope

[greatauntoftriplets]

50. Only cardinals vote for the pope.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

55. true. but i bet she had an opinion if not a vote

[greatauntoftriplets]

57. The College of Cardinals meets behind closed doors.

No women are allowed.

[Viva_La_Revolution]

58. and that preludes her from having an opinion?

[greatauntoftriplets]

60. Of course not.

But it does preclude her from having any role in the selection of popes.

[Nanjeanne]

6. Um . . . if she's the head of this conference - couldn't she just say No to Sanders request?

So very odd. How'd he get the invitation? He asked? So what? They don't want him - they don't have to ask him.

[Jitter65]

11. Sorry, we don't control the Vatican...or their press office. nt

[Nanjeanne]

14. WTF? The person who said he lobbied for the invite is the President of the organization that

is hosting the conference. Uh . . . you asked for an invite? Sorry, we don't want you there. End of story.

I have no idea what you are talking about - but perhaps that's not unusual.

[oberliner]

61. The invitation came from over her head

He was invited by the bishop who is the chancellor of both academies, outranking her.

[Nanjeanne]

74. Exactly. And she probably didn't like that fact

And assumed it was a political ploy. Sorry her feelings were hurt!

[Jitter65]

8. Is Bernie going to accuse them of lying?

[morningfog]

23. No, he was invited.

[B Calm]

25. Accuse Bloomberg of lying? Why not, if they can't prove this!

[awake]

10. Spin spin spin....

[fun n serious]

12. Brainwaashed

They pick and chose what they will believe.. always in favor of Sanders..

” Margaret Archer, president of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences, which is hosting the conference Sanders will attend, said in a telephone interview. "

She must be in the TANK with Hillary.....

[hollowdweller]

13. Weird

If they felt he was lobbying for political purposes why didn't they just tell him he couldn't come??

This seems a bit like the Kim Davis thing.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

17. So, why did they invite him?

[global1]

18. Hillary Would Have Made A Speech At The Vatican But They Refused To Pay Her $225,000 ....

speaking fee. She also wanted to bar the press and not allow any recording devices except for the lady that produces the transcripts of her speeches. Also the Vatican wouldn't let her people use 'white noise' to prevent others from hearing what she was saying.

She thought long and hard and decided to meet with Goldman Sachs instead.

Come on people - if you can sling it - we can sling it back. Why don't you wait and see what Bernie says at the Vatican before you start taking him down on this.

Remember Bernie is not going to just sit back and take it like Al Gore and John Kerry did and not fight back. President Obama didn't roll over when Hillary went negative on him and he won.

[EndElectoral]

34. Global1..love your post...nails it.

[Lodestar]

35. Hahaha! Yes she has certainly displayed her 'economic morals' many times over.

[Tom Rinaldo]

20. It would have been easy to quietly decine to invite Sanders if this were the whole story

It would have been easy to decline to invite him simply because of our presidential elections, using the logic offered here. No biggie. But Sanders DID receive an invitation so some one or group of some ones decided they wanted him to attend. No one forced the conference to extend an invitation, unless it was the Pope or a majority of it's leadership structure despite what the President of the hosting Academy has to say about it.

I find no fault in Sanders wanting to be present. I would find no fault had the Vatican not offered to invite him regardless, due to a desire to avoid political implications. This looks like another political schism in the Vatican. There have been many since Francis became Pope.

[riderinthestorm]

43. Agreed. I too think we're seeing papal politics spilling out in the open nt

[morningfog]

22. And he was invited. For fucks sake, its not like he crashing a party uninvited.

[Csainvestor]

27. They knew he was running.

They did not have to invite him in the first place.

I wonder if the pope invited Bernie and overrode what Margaret Archer wanted.

[EndElectoral]

36. Apparently, he's a fan. God forgive he ask to meet the man. Prefer the pope over meeting Kissinger.

[killbotfactory]

28. Yep, nothing political about economic justice.

[Lodestar]

29. Bernie has devoted his entire life to the issues covered at this conference.

It makes total sense that he'd want to be there with those grappling with
these issues, and of course he would be invited for the same reason.
You can't push your way into this type of meeting. You have to be invited.

[Joob]

30. Please continue to make articles like this. I can feel the desperation. nt

[RiverLover]

31. Ask & ye shall recieve.

Pope Francis rocks.

[salinsky]

38. If this story proves to be true ...

... you're going to see the Bernie supporters going from the invitation being a divine sign from the heavens putting God's mark of approval on Sanders' forehead, to the Vatican being nothing but a bunch of no good anti-Semitic pedophiles so fast that you'll need a neck-brace.

[B Calm]

39. Better yet, why don't you just tell us who the senior Vatican official is so we can hide

our heads in shame!

[salinsky]

40. Margaret Archer ...

... appointed by Francis himself.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margaret_Archer

You're welcome.

[B Calm]

41. Uh no. . . As stated above she is NOT a Vatican Official.

[salinsky]

45. Well, I'll concede that this article needs some fleshing out ...

... but, I think you're fundamentally misinterpreting what it says.

They are obviously referring to Ms. Archer when they wrote "senior Vatican official".

That's a broad term, she is the president of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences, and she is the only person quoted in the article.

We will find out soon enough.

This story is blowing up all over the internet.

Ruh roh ...

[B Calm]

49. Bloomberg is a business and financial news company. Bernie is not their favorite

candidate and the way they wrote this article makes it perfectly clear who they do support on the democratic ticket.

[salinsky]

53. Blaming the messenger is really kind of silly in this case ...

... you have Margaret Archer, president of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences whose conference he will be attending, directly quoted saying he requested the invitation and is displaying "monumental discourtesy" by politicizing the event.

And now even worse, you have the Pope's official spokesperson saying that the Pope didn't invite Sanders and there are no plans for a personal meeting, directly contradicting what Sanders claimed.

This may be a case of Vatican inside politics, but it's also looking like an unforced error by Bernie ...

... maybe a HUUUGE one.

[riderinthestorm]

42. One outlier report out of the hundreds of others saying it was the Pope

From the BBC  


Democratic presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders has accepted an invitation from the Pope to the Vatican. 
Mr Sanders, who is Jewish, accepted an invitation to Rome for a conference at the end of next week.  
The Vatican visit is four days before the primary contest in New York, a competitive battle between him and front-runner Hillary Clinton.   
"I am a big, big fan of the pope," Mr Sanders told MSNBC, saying they share the same views on inequality.   
"He's trying to inject this sense of morality into how we do economics... and we need that absolutely desperately."   
He will attend a conference on social, economic and environmental issues and give a speech on 15 April, his campaign said.   

Mr Sanders and Pope Francis have similar views on fighting income inequality, he said, and he was "very moved" by the invitation from the Vatican.   
He said he and the pope disagree on women's rights and gay rights, but Pope Francis has "injected a moral consequence into the economy".  
The senator from Vermont is trailing Mrs Clinton but gaining momentum after a strong of wins, most recently in the Wisconsin primary.   
In the last few days, a mostly civil fight between the two became more personal as Mr Sanders accused his rival of not being "qualified" to be president.   
Pope Francis said on Friday that the Catholic Church should be less strict and show more compassion to "imperfect" Catholics.   
He called on the Church to be welcoming to gay Catholics but did not change the Church's views on LGBT families and marriage.  


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-us-2016-35999269 

[oberliner]

62. How about looking at the actual invitation?

[riderinthestorm]

64. Yep, I see the invite actually came from a Vatican chancellor

Chancellor's are higher than Presidents in these types of organizations.

Clearly the President is miffed and is taking a private spat public.

Papal politics.

I'm just glad its cleared up that he was invited.



Edited to add the text of the press release and Coffeecat's commentary on this.

From CoffeeCat:

You had to apply to be invited to this important event. Bernie obviously applied. Many important world leaders and scholars applied. Bernie was personally invited. 

The press release from the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences touts Bernie's name FIRST on the list of attendees. Obviously, this organization is very proud to have him attend. Firstly, they invited him. Secondly, the are using his name prominently in their press materials that promote the event. 

It appears that the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences is very happy to have Bernie there and is promoting his involvement. I think all is well. 

There is one person, a conservative Bishop, who has come out to criticize Bernie, after this exciting announcement was made. She can have her opinion. She sounds politically motivated to me. 

It is undeniable that the organization, as a whole, wants Bernie there. They invited him above many other applicants and he's a part of their publicity effort to spark interest in this important event. 

I work in public relations, and have done so for many years. I've written hundreds of press releases--and clearly the organization as a whole is very happy with Bernie! 

Heres the text of press release/statement: 

We're delighted to host this conference to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Centesimus Annus, bringing together world leaders, including US Senator Sanders, Ecuadorean President Rafael Correa, Bolivian President Evo Morales, Academicians of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences such as its President Margaret Archer, and leading scholars such as Professor Daniel Finn, Professor Jeffrey Sachs etc., to examine and discuss changes in politics, economics, and culture in the world these last 25 years in the light of Pope Francis' new encyclical Laudato si'. Our intention is socio-political in the highest sense of the term, because according to art. 1 of our Statutes, the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences was established by the Holy Father John Paul II on 1 January 1994 with the aim of promoting the study and progress of the social sciences, primarily economics, sociology, law and political science. 
Title I - Constitution and Aims of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences 
Art. 1 
The Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences was established by the Holy Father John Paul II on 1 January 1994 (AAS 86 , 213), with the aim of promoting the study and progress of the social sciences, primarily economics, sociology, law and political science. The Academy, through an appropriate dialogue, thus offers the Church the elements which she can use in the development of her social doctrine, and reflects on the application of that doctrine in contemporary society. The Academy, which is autonomous, maintains a close relationship with the Pontifical Council for Justice and Peace. 
✠ Marcelo Sánchez Sorondo 

https://berniesanders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/Bernie-Sanders-Vatican.pdf

[oberliner]

69. No argument here

We must remember, though, that the BBC is not infallible (unlike the Pope, supposedly).

Anyway, I agree that the President is obviously ticked off about the way it went down for whatever reason.

[riderinthestorm]

75. Agreed. Here's my theory

Bernie was invited by the Chancellor who outranks the President.

Chancellor gets Bernie into the conference over her objections.

She's miffed and is seizing on a protocol point - his invite should have gone through her office.

I'm thinking this is papal politics that's escaped the backrooms and into the public.

And you're right, the BBC botched this. I myself posted their article everywhere as an authority.

[beedle]

46. Strange attack. What's that all about?

She seems to have a built in bias against Sanders. Not sure what that might be. Looking at her background she seems to support an economic philosophy that of all American politicians aligns most closely to Sanders. She's British, lives and works in the UK, so maybe it's just a general distain for American politicians?

Not sure what protocol error is being made by requesting to attend a conference that also aligns closely to Sanders stance on economics and environment.

“Sanders made the first move, for the obvious reasons,” Margaret Archer, president of the Pontifical Academy of Social Sciences, which is hosting the conference Sanders will attend, said in a telephone interview. “I think in a sense he may be going for the Catholic vote but this is not the Catholic vote and he should remember that and act accordingly -- not that he will.”

[frylock]

47. This has to be a stinging blow to Camp Weathervain.

I expect there to be much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

[beedle]

48. WTF??

What's with all the criticism from Hillary supporters?

You defend Hillary having secret meetings with Financial lobbyist, in the name of getting money from them, but meeting the Pope at an economic and environmental justice conference is hurting your sensibilities?

The Pope? Jamie Dimon? Not even fucking close.

[86derps]

51. Who the heck cares?

He is freaking Jewish! The only issue her is that Hillary supporters wish they got invited and not Bernie. Hillary supporters are the ones making this political. He is freaking Jewish!

[oberliner]

63. Seems to be an internal dispute between her and the bishop

Guessing she felt slighted by being overruled.

[oberliner]

66. That sounds right

Obviously she did not like the way it went down otherwise she would not have made a public statement, but who knows what actually transpired.

[Ned_Devine]

54. This gif may not work, but if it does, my point is made

http://www.reddit.com/r/shittyreactiongifs/comments/2ib67v/mrw_im_literally_grasping_at_straws/

[KingFlorez]

59. I just posted an article

Don't get mad at me because Sanders misrepresented the situation. He was NOT invited without solicitation. It's not as if the Pope just called him up and said he wanted him to come to the conference.

[TheSarcastinator]

56. Bernie Sanders: Mind-Controlling Magician Who Hypnotized the Pope!

He MADE them invite him!!!

[Desert805]

71. Aaaaaaand...

Thread fail.

I'd say "nice try" but this was pretty weak, heh.

#sniperfire

[GeorgiaPeanuts]

72. LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE

This is not true and she knows it. I invited him with her consensus," said Sorondo, who is senior to Archer.

[beam me up scottie]

78. OOPSIE!

[haikugal]

76. Didn't Hilly get an invite? nt

[katsy]

77. Do yourself a favor and self-delete.

Debunked.

The Vatican did invite him to speak.

Embarrassing, no? All that hand wringing for nothing.

[Kalidurga]

79. Funny you care more about this than #HoodGate