Is there a single honest Bernie supporter on DU ....

[salinsky]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by azurnoir (a host of the 2016 Postmortem forum).

.... who can watch the first 7 seconds of this video ....

.... and then read the following statement ....

The office of the pope moved quickly to distance the pontiff from Sanders’s visit. Father Federico Lombardi, the Pope’s spokesman, said Sanders had been invited “not by the pope but by the pontifical academy of social sciences.” Lombardi told the Italian news agency Ansa: “For the moment there is no expectation that there will also be a meeting with the pope.”

.... and square the two.

I haven't found a single Bernie supporter who can honestly assess this contradiction.

I actually had one tell me that personally meeting with the pope and having a meeting anywhere in Vatican City were interchangeable concepts.

I shit you not.

[hedgehog]

1. I'm married, but I don't see how that changes anything......

[jmg257]

58. Ha - I see what you did there! :)

[Amaril]

102. Folks, y'all can all go home now.

Hedgehog just won the internets.

:::mike drop:::

[SidDithers]

2. DU rec...

In b4 the Bernlock.

Sid

[Sky Masterson]

3. Grasp at um.

[Buzz Clik]

6. Why would anyone want to take your straws?

How could they possibly extract them from your desperate grasp?

[Sky Masterson]

14. I am a liberal

I'll share them. Heck, I'll drop them and back away slowly....

[dchill]

51. +1

[daleanime]

61. And remember.....

no sharp movements.

[Octafish]

22. Thread win.

The collapse of support for Hillary Clinton in New York must be accelerating.

[artislife]

40. This is the best soap on the internet! nt

[mmonk]

59. Either that or they can't accept the chancellor's invitation at face value

because they fear it may help Bernie.

[DanTex]

4. There's no way to square them. It's a flat-out lie.

[Buzz Clik]

5. Damned skippy!

[upaloopa]

7. How many pinocchios will that be worth?

Maybe Bernie can add pinocchios to his delegate count at the convention and pull out a win.

[riversedge]

10. Sanders had them for lunch yesterday-uga uga wooden pinocchio's. It is the weekend-

perhaps he Fact checkers are off.??

[pkdu]

19. Bernocchios! Nt

[timmymoff]

105. I certainly hope this isn't as harmful to Americans

as someone's Iraq war vote. Or bankruptcy vote? Or support of free trade deals. Or support of military coups.

[salinsky]

8. Oh yeah, I forgot ....

.... another Bernie supporter told me he had a problem with the audio from the clip (even though it's crystal clear), so here is the transcript of the first 7 seconds for the hearing impaired ....

HOST: "You're meeting with the Pope??"

SANDERS: "Yup."

HOST: "Pope Francis has invited, uh, Bernie to visit him in the Vatican."

.... and again ....

The office of the pope moved quickly to distance the pontiff from Sanders’s visit. Father Federico Lombardi, the Pope’s spokesman, said Sanders had been invited “not by the pope but by the pontifical academy of social sciences.” Lombardi told the Italian news agency Ansa: “For the moment there is no expectation that there will also be a meeting with the pope.”

[riversedge]

9. I saw the post/comments you have in your post!

.... and square the two.

I haven't found a single Bernie supporter who can honestly assess this contradiction.

I actually had one tell me that personally meeting with the pope and having a meeting anywhere in Vatican City were interchangeable concepts.

I shit you not.

[DrDan]

121. I got something similar

"My assumption after seeing that is that he assumed she was asking about the Vatican invite"

you are meeting with the Pope = you have been invited to the Vatican

I sometimes wonder who ties their shoes.

[bigtree]

11. k&r

[jmg257]

12. Nope Bernie said Yup when asked if he was meeting with the Pope. Now we know who'll be doing what...

Seems appropriate doesn't it?

"It will cost more than four times the average income in San Francisco to have dinner next to Hillary Clinton and the Clooneys there next month."


"U.S. presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders will head to the Vatican next week to take part in a small scholarly conference revisiting an encyclical from Pope John Paul II confronting economic issues."


Can't wait to see how this plays out!

[hobbit709]

13. Is there a single honest Clinton supporter?

[TrueDemVA]

18. Be careful

I asked that same exact thing n the same format as this post and my post was hidden. They can certainly dish it out, but can't seem to take it. Now that I have said this, I am sure I will get hit again. Just silliness I tell you.

[hobbit709]

21. I really don't care what they try.

All they accomplish is proving my point.

[noretreatnosurrender]

30. Was on that jury

Is there a single honest Hillary supporter on DU [View all]

Seems like a decent question to ask in light of the constant "misinformation" being put up regarding Bernie Sanders. Come on Hillary supporters. This is getting a bit childish. I know there are good people that support Hillary and I wish they would speak up when seeing this going on.

A Jury voted 4-3 to hide this post on Sat Apr 9, 2016, 10:19 AM. Reason: This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. When the original post in a discussion thread is hidden by Jury decision, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted. Hide post

[noretreatnosurrender]

32. Juror #2

So I wonder if juror #3, 4 & #7 will alert on this thread? I sure won't alert on it.

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Apr 9, 2016, 10:19 AM, and the Jury voted 4-3 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: This is a discussion board. The person is asking for discussion. They say they know there are good people supporting Hillary and want to hear from them. Why would you want to alert on that?
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Just plain old shit-stirring. Hide it.
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Poster needs to grow up.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: Getting really tired of these broad brushed personal attacks.

[Yurovsky]

46. Juror #4 is clearly a graduate of the Kindergarten Debate Club...

Juror #4 : "You're a baby!"

Random Poster: "No I'm not! YOU'RE a baby!"

Juror #4: "Waaaaahhhh!!!! I'm reporting you to the appropriate authorities!"

Yes, the old dish-it-out-but-can't-take-it-crowd. If their tender feewings are hurt by the underhand softballs coming at them in the primaries, they aren't going to survive the onslaught awaiting them in the GE campaign.

Grow up indeed...

[TrueDemVA]

50. Thank you

I appreciate it. I think it is only fair to pose a question to the other side when all I see is this type of thing allowed for another group. I think seeing some of the responses in it referring to me only being on for 2 months and they think I am young and stirring up trouble shows what is the real motivation behind censuring others.

I have been coming to this site for about 9 years, but just recently decided to start speaking up. Sorry for the lengthy reply, really just wanted to thank you and the other that stick up for people like me.

[Dem2]

35. Yeah, but he did it first mommy!!1

[geek tragedy]

49. Yes, but we live in a foreign place called

the reality-based community.

[frylock]

70. Full stop.

[baldguy]

15. Sanders staffer: "We scored a meeting with the Pope for you!"

Sanders staffer: "Hillary said you were >unqualified< to be President! Her exact words!"

Sanders staffer: "The Clinton campaign is getting billions of dollars directly from corporations!"

etc. etc etc

Shit like this is proof that Sanders isn't being served well by his staff.

[noiretextatique]

16. So fucking what?

This is ridiculous parsing. And he may very well meet the Pope. I hope he does...then what will you have to complain about? This from people supporting someone who some splainin to do with the FBI.

[giftedgirl77]

64. Fail, Pope is going to be in a different country.

that's like saying I'm going to meet Alex Rodriguez because I'm going to a Yankee's game. There is no logic or reason for the claim.

[NorthCarolina]

65. Oopsie! Wrong.

Please try again.

[giftedgirl77]

73. Your opinion is duly noted & subsequently wiped from the bottom of my shoe.

[Amaril]

109. Not an opinion

The Pope will be in Greece on the 16th only.

Still doesn't mean that Bernie will get to meet him, but at least be honest about the facts.

[appalachiablue]

124. +1 Yes, what about the big FBI Hill event?

[NurseJackie]

17. Great post ... I wonder what the jury will vote.

[Nanjeanne]

20. I see someone during an intro where a hist was talking and people were cheering nodding

And saying yup. I took it as someone not wanting to interrupt the hosts opening and who was very clear during the discussion after what he was doing. His yup was pretty much overpowered by the cheers. I doubt he thought he was going to get a huge bump in his polls from the yup so I don't think it was calculated to fool anyone. He has been clear on why he was going and he has been clear on his admiration of the Pope as well as where he disagrees. And he was clear that he hoped he might meet the Pope.

I doubt he gave a second thought to all the Sherlock Holmes Clintonites scrutinizing his invitation for something to get all riled up about. But when token gate failed, he should have known the absurdities they would go to.

[rurallib]

23. source of statement please?

[spyker29]

24. Their fallback answer: Alert

On Sat Apr 9, 2016, 09:21 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

Is there a single honest Bernie supporter on DU ....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511689087

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

No comments added by alerter

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Apr 9, 2016, 09:29 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No comments from Alerter = a "LEAVE IT" vote from me.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No comment from alerter?
Leave
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I think Bernie just was not being precise enough. Clearly what he wanted to talk about was the Pope's attitude towards the injustice of the global financial system. Anyone who has followed this knows that Bernie clarified his remarks about the trip. This is much ado about nothing on the part of the Hillary supporters, but it is not deserving of a hide.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I guess this alert answers the OP's question. Shameful alert.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: While I disagree with the OP, it is certainly no worse than many posts on the other side of the Great Divide. It can be refuted, no need to hide it.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: the quote is unsourced. In comparison to much of the crap that is going on here, this is just more crap but not to the point of censoring
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Using actual footage to prove a point should not be hidden

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

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[NWCorona]

26. This shouldn't have been flagged

[NWCorona]

25. I don't see what the big deal is

He clarified the comments right after The View. Besides it's looking like he will be meeting the Pope after all.

[B Calm]

27. Did you know Bill Clinton pointed his finger at the BLM movement?

[Hiraeth]

31. pointed. And WAGGED.

[Zen Democrat]

43. YELLED. And made an ugly face

[beedle]

42. And basically confirmed

that his crime bill was all about going after blacks, who he thought were basically all criminals, or if not, not important enough to worry about if they got caught up in an over zealous (corrupt) "justice" system.

And any black person protesting that injustice today is supposedly defending child murders!?

----- but Bernie may have said 'yup' to a question that he should have said "not sure at this time, but it would be awesome".---

[B Calm]

126. We'll we know why Hillary supporters are doing everything possible,

like a million nasty op's condemning Bernie over going to the Vatican. It's all a coverup because they know how devastating Bill's remarks can be to Hillary's campaign.

[JudyM]

28. I'm wondering about it; he isn't the chronic manipulative Deceiver, so was likely misinformed or

else there are some other facts that will come to light... In any case, it pales in comparison to Her deceptions and malfeasance, which are the source of continuous scrutiny by yes, even this democratic administration. And which will be the daily fare of rethugs (and the voters) right through November and beyond.

It may turn out to be a misstep but the scale of her wrongs is telescopic in comparison.

[NurseJackie]

29. JURY RESULTS: 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

On Sat Apr 9, 2016, 09:21 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

Is there a single honest Bernie supporter on DU ....
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511689087

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

No comments added by alerter

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Apr 9, 2016, 09:29 AM, and the Jury voted 0-7 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No comments from Alerter = a "LEAVE IT" vote from me.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No comment from alerter?
Leave
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I think Bernie just was not being precise enough. Clearly what he wanted to talk about was the Pope's attitude towards the injustice of the global financial system. Anyone who has followed this knows that Bernie clarified his remarks about the trip. This is much ado about nothing on the part of the Hillary supporters, but it is not deserving of a hide.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: I guess this alert answers the OP's question. Shameful alert.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: While I disagree with the OP, it is certainly no worse than many posts on the other side of the Great Divide. It can be refuted, no need to hide it.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: the quote is unsourced. In comparison to much of the crap that is going on here, this is just more crap but not to the point of censoring
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Using actual footage to prove a point should not be hidden

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

[Schema Thing]

33. good god you're grasping desperately at straws.

[salinsky]

39. So ....

.... you can't square the video with the statement?

Thanks for playing.

[Zen Democrat]

45. You concocted a shitty game. How do you know the Pope's brain and activities.

For all you know, the Pope and Bernie may skype regularly.

[artislife]

47. I think we would all be better served to

Not answer Posters who have been here less than two months.

You seem to have a lot of bottled up anger for such a short time. May I suggest breathing slowly in and out?

[redstateblues]

63. You would be eliminating a big chunk of BSS

I see tons of lo post Bernie fans

[artislife]

66. But they aren't low information posters.

hee hee

[salinsky]

79. I'm having the time of my life ....

.... I love to expose the hypocrisy of sanctimonious aholes.

But, you seem perturbed.

Is it because your candidate told a whopper?

[artislife]

107. No, because I believe we have met before. nt

[Schema Thing]

34. And the Vatican has some interest in not looking *too* political or biased

So they are walking a fine line here too.

Doesn't mean the pope isn't very much pro-bernie and anti-hillary.... of course he is -she's awful wrt the things he cares about. But she also may be President one day, so...

[revbones]

36. Since you're so hung up on misspeaking,

Since you're so hung up on misspeaking, how about when Hillary misspoke about Nancy Reagan's role with AIDS activism?

How about her blatant lie about being under sniper fire?

Maybe when publicly she told unions she'd fight the Colombia Free Trade Agreement, and had her released emails show she lobbied for it, secretly.

[salinsky]

37. So ....

.... you can't square the video with the statement?

Thanks for playing.

[revbones]

38. And you can't square the sniper fire right? nt

[riderinthestorm]

54. I must be on everyone's ignore list...

I actually answered the question and so far crickets in return.

Me thinks they really don't want an answer.

[Katashi_itto]

77. More likely they give you the same pirority someone would give

Pigeon shit is all. Nothing personal, just not worth really bothering with.

[riderinthestorm]

41. I'll tackle this

1. Pope Francis has a history.of stopping by these events

http://ncronline.org/blogs/eco-catholic/vatican-worlds-mayors-vow-tackle-climate-change-poverty

2. This is a similarly small summit as the climate change conference. The Pope is in town on that day.

3. I think its reasonable to believe he'll similarly stop by this conference.

FWIW, I don't believe there will be a private meeting. Any meeting will be with the entire group. Diplomatic speech leads me to parse "at the moment" as keeping that door wide open.

I don't know the teevee show you posted a clip of but I do note that the woman actually made the erroneous statement. Agreed that Bernie did not correct her and say it was the Vatican Academy but honestly on a show like this (which feels slightly frivolous? ), I can see letting that slide imo. I'd extend the same to Hillary actually.

Sorondo is a close aide to Pope Francis. He issued the invitation to Bernie. I find it impossible to believe the conference attendees weren't approved by Francis. He took a close interest in the Vatican climate change conference so I think its reasonable that this conference, on another passionate topic for the Pope, has received similar scrutiny.

[Surya Gayatri]

44. Don't hold your breath, or you'll go blue in the face.

The BS BS is so thick, you could spread it on bread like Nutella.

Some bright light yesterday claimed that "the Vatican is the Pope's house, therefore the Pope has invited Sanders to visit his own house"...and I'm quoting almost verbatim.

[Zen Democrat]

56. Do you really think that the Vatican aide to Pope Francis invited Bernie Sanders to come to speak on

the Idolatry of Money, and that the Pope won't meet with him? I think that's the whole point! Of course Pope Francis will meet his economic brother.

[Surya Gayatri]

60. Do you recall the Kim Davis blow up?

Pope Francis fired the papal envoy who tricked him into that bogus, inadvertent "meeting".

The Pope will NOT be seen to be interfering in internal US politics, which this Jeffrey Sachs-finagled "invite" is.

The kind of uproar that's being kicked up by this international incident reflects VERY badly on the Vatican, and that's anathema to ANY Pope, the first duty of which is to preserve the integrity of the Papacy.

[ibegurpard]

94. I guess the Vatican will have to sort that out.

They invited him after all.

[Surya Gayatri]

95. Expect further "clarifications" imminently. Pope Francis will

make sure to take a giant step away from this international diplomatic mess.

[ibegurpard]

99. haha!

"International diplomatic mess"??? Do you people actually believe the shit you peddle?

[Surya Gayatri]

108. You did...enough to try and craft some sort of coherent response.

[lunamagica]

116. The Pope will be traveling to Greece that week

[salinsky]

48. Frankly, given the purity of their candidate ....

.... I'm a little surprised that it wasn't the Pope who requested a personal audience with Bernie to kiss his ring.

[haikugal]

52. Yawn.....

[Logical]

53. LOL, with no link to your quote why would fucking believe anything you posted? nt

[Hoyt]

55. Other than fact Sanders tried to make it appear he was summoned by Pope to gain an edge in NY, this

whole Vatican issue would be irrelevant. But, that is exactly what he did.

[panader0]

57. Hillary wanted the Pope to hear her confessions

But he didn't have an extra six months.

[seabeyond]

62. I agree. I went to bed last night shaking my head. Lying is... lying, no getting around it. Nt

[Armstead]

67. Honest answer: I think he either misheard, or perhaps thought he might be meeting with the pope

Bernie is not stupid. There would be no advantage in deliberately lying about it.

Any idiot would realize that the truth would have been revealed once he went over and didn't meet with the Pope. Any short term "benefit" of lying wold be erased and made worse.

His release did not mention the Pope personally. it referred to the Vatican.

Here's another interview in which the Pope was not mentioned.

[frylock]

71. Well, were not exactly dealing with any idiot here.

The idiots we are dealing with are desperate beyond all hope for something, ANYTHING to slow Bernie's momentum.

[Surya Gayatri]

68. Kick while waiting for that honest Sanders supporter to square the circular reasoning...

[frylock]

69. Yeah, this is a game changer right here.

So this is where Hillary Supporter is going to make their stand? Best o' fucking luck to you.

[salinsky]

74. So ....

.... can't square what Bernie said on the video with the official statement from the Pope?

Thanks for playing!

[frylock]

75. No no, thank YOU for playing.

You guys have really lost your shit over this, and I am quite enjoying it. So, please do proceed.

[mhatrw]

72. bold faced liar!

[anotherproletariat]

76. I don't think Hillary will use this in an ad...but you can bet the repubs will, if given the chance.

What a perfect example of a bold face lie...with documented evidence that can perfectly fit into 30 sec.

[jmg257]

82. Unless he eventually ends up meeting the Pope of course. Now that would be cool!

[athena]

88. The Pope will not even be there during Bernie's visit.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-europe-migrants-pope-greece-idUSKCN0X227F

[jmg257]

89. Not sure on that one: The Pope to visit Lesbos on 16 April, 07.04.2016

http://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/en/bollettino/pubblico/2016/04/07/160407c.html

Vatican City, 7 April 2016 – According to a communiqué issued by the Holy See Press Office today, in response to invitations from His Holiness Bartholomew, Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople, and the President of the Hellenic Republic, His Holiness Francis will visit Lesbos on Saturday 16 April, 2016.

Maybe maybe not, but not holding my breath either way.

[salinsky]

83. No, Hillary won't use it ...

... she's not going negative.

That's Bernie's thing.

[basselope]

78. Clinton desperation.

Its kinda funny to see.

[athena]

81. Really?

Sanders's own words and behavior are now evidence of desperation in the Clinton campaign?

[basselope]

86. Nothing wrong with his words or actions...

The Clinton response reeks of desperation.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

80. I honestly think the "scandal" about invitations is downright silly.

And, more than a little sleazy.

[salinsky]

84. This isn't about invitations ...

... it's about lying.

[basselope]

87. Where is the "lie"?

Just can't find one here.

[salinsky]

90. Here it is again ....

HOST: "You're meeting with the Pope??"

SANDERS: "Yup."

HOST: "Pope Francis has invited, uh, Bernie to visit him in the Vatican."

.... and then from the Pope ....

The office of the pope moved quickly to distance the pontiff from Sanders’s visit. Father Federico Lombardi, the Pope’s spokesman, said Sanders had been invited “not by the pope but by the pontifical academy of social sciences.” Lombardi told the Italian news agency Ansa: “For the moment there is no expectation that there will also be a meeting with the pope.”

Want me to break it down even further for you?

[basselope]

97. Sorry, still don't see the lie.

Unless you are talking about the host statements?

[salinsky]

125. Geez, .....

..... are you completely unaware of the concept of lying by omission?

The host asked if he was meeting the pope.

He answered in the affirmative. < Lie #1 barefaced

The host repeated the erroneous information.

He failed to correct her. < Lie #2 omission

[shadowandblossom]

127. I'm in awe

that you had to break that down that far...

[jmg257]

91. The View... Q "You're meeting with the Pope?" A: "Yup". nt

[basselope]

98. Yeah? Sorry, still not seeing the lie.

[jmg257]

103. I think the point is, he isn't (supposed to) meet the Pope. He is going to a conference

at the Vatican by invitation - still a cool deal.

[basselope]

104. He's going to a Vatican conference on one of the Pope's biggest subjects.

Does anyone really believe the Pope isn't going to attend and meet the speakers??

Come on.

[jmg257]

106. I don't know how all that stuff works. It would be cool!

[basselope]

111. Its much more likely than not.

This is where the word lie gets thrown around a lot.

A lie, by any definition, is something uttered KNOWN not to be true. It is based on INTENT.

Given the information Bernie had at the time, and even that we have today, it is hard to see ANY intent at deception in his statements.

If I received an invitation to the white house, I would probably tell my friends, "Holy shit, I'm going to meet the president" Even under scrutiny, no one would say I was lying... they'd say.. yeah.. pretty reasonable statement given the invitation to the White House.

My friend got invited to Notch's Halloween party this last year (creator of Minecraft) and he told people he was going to meet Notch. I don't think he ended up meeting him, because the party was so packed, he never got to him. Did he "LIE" to me? No.

[Separation]

85. Lol big fucking deal!

If >THIS< is truly the >WORST< most hateful and scary "lie". Then whoopty big fucking doo da deal.

I mean it's not like the FBI is investigating him over it.

[salinsky]

92. You seem angry ...

... is it because your sanctimonious candidate got caught telling a whopper?

[Separation]

93. No. Really. I'm actually laughing about it.

[Avalon Sparks]

96. My thoughts

Pope gate is the most trivial political gate I've ever heard.

Much ado about nothing. This is the only comment I'll make on the topic.

Can we get back to important stuff like policy and the 100 million dollar grifters instead of lame "gotcha" games?

[Lil Missy]

100. To be fair, lying isn't the same as being in denial, or delusional.

They believe what they are saying, facts be damned.

[salinsky]

101. Who's "they"? ....

.... do you think Bernie really thought he had a meeting scheduled with the Pope?

[mooseprime]

110. sure.

you have to understand that the way high-level visits are put together involves lots of considerations that are never made public. high-level figures have both official (public) and actual schedules. i know this from personal experience working as an interpreter. here's an example. if someone from country A meeting the president would be considered out of line by country A's current leader, the person is ushered into a room that connects two rooms where the president has official meetings. moving from room 1 to 2, the president meets with the person from country A as long as they need and they conduct whatever business they have right there. then the president continues to room 2, which is the next scheduled thing on the official record. so in fact the person from country A both did and did not meet with the president. this kind of thing is absolutely routine. because so many factors are involved, including timing and who else is in town doing what at that precise moment, often meetings are arranged in advance but the arrangement is not made public. so the fact of and deniability can be espoused at the same time. of course this won't be substantiated in advance by the vatican. what if clinton changes her plans and happens to be in rome at the same moment? well then the meeting would be canceled or she would be included or some other arrangement would be cooked up. the press is always two bounces behind what's really going on, and the info they receive is fragmentary and often contradictory. it's an exercise in futility to try to make sense of something like this in advance because at best you have partial information; you may also have only been told what they want you to hear. you won't know what's intended here until after the meeting takes, place...if then. see what happens and then draw your conclusions about what the plans were. in my experience with high-visibility affairs, the media narrative and what actually happens NEVER coincide.

[salinsky]

112. That's a heluva lot of words ...

... to admit that no, you can't square what Bernie said in the video with the statement.

Nice effort, tho.

[mooseprime]

114. pardon me

how naive, i took it for an honest question and that you really wanted to better understand what might be going on. my mistake. i was relating a personal experience from the white house. please, take everything you encounter in the media as 100% true, accurate, literal, and linear. sanders is a liar, the vatican is a bunch of liars, the pope is a liar, sanders supporters are liars, i'm a liar. and that's a lie too. see, you were right all along! i just wonder why you bothered to ask the question. go back to your sandbox until lunch is ready.

/Full ignore

[Ellipsis]

115. Conversely... Bernie never said he was meeting with the pope

Joy did. So your premise in the OP is fucked

[Bobbie Jo]

118. To which Bernie responds

"Yup." while nodding in agreement.

[lunamagica]

117. And he answered "Yup"

He could have as easily said "No", remained quiet, or clarified once he started to talk

[fighting-irish]

119. I just learned that the Pope is heading to Greece on the 16th

So there is still an excellent chance that Sanders might be granted an audience with the Pope. You never knpw.

[Vattel]

120. The two don't square. Obviously Sanders was incorrect, and he clarified things soon afterwards.

You do know that there is a difference between being mistaken and lying, right?

The idea that he was lying is far-fetched. Why would he tell such a lie and then immediately correct himself? Sanders makes mistakes. Who doesn't? But there is a huge difference between making honest mistakes and consistently smearing another candidate in the way Clinton, her campaign, many of her surrogates, and some of her supporters have consistently done during this primary.

[Marr]

122. Yep. Lying is like when you say, for instance, that you were under sniper fire

when you were not. That's not something you'd just be 'mistaken' about.

I swear, this determined effort to slime Sanders' Vatican invitation just seems incredibly phony and shallow.

[Vattel]

123. It is phony. Sometimes, though, I wonder whether it is more a case of self-delusion

than deliberate deceit. Some DU Clinton supporters seem to really buy into their own bullshit. It's hard to tell sometimes, though.

[azurnoir]

128. Locking as disruptive meta