Why Bernie Sanders will rue his ‘deep South’ dismissal of black voters

[NCTraveler]

Right there, at the end of the Brooklyn debate, it happened. A whole slice of the United States, home to the bedrock foundation of the Democratic Party, was written off by a candidate for its nomination. But that wasn’t the first time Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) or someone from his campaign has done this. It is an insult that stings more than the campaign seems to realize.

The argument from the Sanders camp is that Hillary Clinton won in conservative “deep South” states that Democrats will never win in November. To Sanders supporters, this makes a lot of sense in explaining why their progressive candidate was pushed aside by a more conservative electorate. To the African American voters who fueled the double-digit ballot beat-down Sanders suffered in those states, it is baldly dismissive. And totally in keeping with the candidate’s tone-deafness with this voting bloc, best exemplified by his campaigning with Cornel West, who famously said President Obama was “a black mascot of Wall Street oligarchs and a black puppet of corporate plutocrats.” Obama’s approval rating with blacks sits now at 89 percent.

The many references go as far back as the day after the March 1 Super Tuesday primaries when Sanders’s wife, Jane, said on MSNBC, “[M]ost of the states are historically red states and are not likely to carry the day in the general election. Most of the states that Bernie has won are mostly blue states or battleground states.”

On March 28, senior strategist Tad Devine made this remarkable comment about Hillary Clinton’s primary victories. “Her grasp now on the nomination is almost entirely on the basis of victories where Bernie Sanders did not compete.” He went on to say, “Where we compete with Clinton, where this competition is real, we have a very good chance of beating her in every place that we compete with her.” And then there was this from Devine: “Essentially, 97 percent of her delegate lead today comes from those eight states where we did not compete.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2016/04/18/why-bernie-sanders-will-rue-his-deep-south-dismissal-of-black-voters/

[geek tragedy]

1. he doesn't give a shit, he's peddling that "we're out of the south"

line to get more people to cough up money to his campaign.

he has no path to the nomination, so it's an ego ride for him anyways.

[Armstead]

4. It's not an ego ride for Clinton?

What does she actually care about accomplishing, aside from being president?

[geek tragedy]

11. from January

CLINTON: I would work quickly to present to the Congress my plans for creating more good jobs in manufacturing, infrastructure, clean and renewable energy, raising the minimum wage, and guaranteeing, finally, equal pay for women's work.

I suspect the real #1 priority for any Democratic president would have to be immigration reform.

[Armstead]

14. The Number 1 priority for me (and I think most others who support Sanders)...

is pushing us away from the ingrained corruption and concentration of power in the wrong hands.

We need to change the conditions that it is now automatically assumed by the majority of Americans that nothing constructive will ever get done in DC because of the massive selloff of government and narrowing of the political spectrum to what is acceptable to Corporations and Wall St.

None of those nice goals Clinton mentioned, nor immigration reform, will get accomplished if we keep buying a political status quo that has passed its sell-by date and is beginning to stink up the refrigerator.

[geek tragedy]

18. the problem is Republicans. The Tea Party types are not beholden to any corporate interests

or Wall Street, yet they're the ones causing all the problems.

There was enormous money influencing our political system before Citizens United, it's unclear that Sanders could do a damn thing about that.

[Armstead]

31. I wish that were true...but also I would point out that the Tea Party are a corporate creation

They are AstroTurf, backed by the Koch Bros and other big money interests. The problem for the GOP is that the tea party actually started thinking for themselves and opposing the same establishment that organized them...Kind of a Frankenstein scenario.

Sanders has already proven he can do something about corrupt campaign finance by walking the talk.

Also, and I know I'm boring on this, but this video shows what Sanders is capable of in real-world terms of offering a large context and attending to the nuts and bolts..To me it ios very telling both .both in the enthusiasm of his constituents...and in terms of actually getting stuff done.

It's long and rough edged, but his speech is amazing...Takes his stump speech of today and puts it in terms of real stuff.

[Hortensis]

66. "[Tea Party] are AstroTurf, backed by the Koch Bros

and other big money interests. The problem for the GOP is that the tea party actually started thinking for themselves and opposing the same establishment that organized them...Kind of a Frankenstein scenario."

Armstead's spot on about this. The so-called "Freedom Caucus" is as free as congressmen can be from control by the GOP and from need to please their constituents. They only need to satisfy those who fund their campaigns and take out their opponents for them. If they displease, they will be primaried and replaced.

[MFM008]

76. That's a pretty big accomplishment

being president, or 2 time senator or first lady or Secretary of State.

[griffi94]

8. It is really starting to look that way.

I think his lack of answers about how he'd pass his proposals
have really hurt him with voters who weren't already for him.

At this point it is looking more like an ego boost.

[Hortensis]

78. I suspect he has to regret "tactical errors."

As narrow as his view of things may be, the facts that 38% of all Americans are NOT "non-Hispanic white," and that all groups would be taking negative messages from his decision not to pursue the black vote, would be hard to misunderstand.

And, of course, his major revelation of his lack of knowledge on both how to pass, as you say, but also how to implement.

As for merely "ego boost," tho, I feel pretty darned sure that Sanders is a True Believer in himself and his cause. If that's the case, then the obvious assumption is that he continues as a national figure in the presidential race because that is how he feels he can best serve that cause. And that would obviously be true. Plus, he clearly sees that the GOP and other extreme right groups intend to destroy all government progressivism, literally make things like Social Security unconstitutional, and may well intend to also turn his bully pulpit to fighting that enormous threat.

We'll see...

[workinclasszero]

13. You are right

Just think if Bernie did win the nomination now after slamming southern democrats for months, what would he say to them in the general???

Uh....nevermind! Vote for me!!!!

[Goblinmonger]

16. So Clinton is going to win South Carolina in the GE?

[geek tragedy]

19. No, but she will win Florida and Virginia

Bernie flunked his audition in those states

[Goblinmonger]

22. That's a pretty bold statement

Even her husband only won Florida once and Virginia never.

[geek tragedy]

24. This isn't the 1990's. Demographics have changed.

And, she'll be running against a toxic, deeply unlikable, narcissistic troglodyte--we just don't know the name yet.

[MineralMan]

32. Texas and Georgia may also be in play in November.

I think she is going to surprise a lot of people in November. Much will depend on which clown comes out of the Republican convention with their nomination. In reality, I'm thinking a landslide in November is a real possibility, and may approach a probability depending on the Republican candidate.

The world is changing.

[geek tragedy]

36. and this is before the Trumpocalypse at the RNC in Cleveland

That will not end well

[MineralMan]

40. I've been savoring the debacle that is the Republican

primary race for some time now. Ours is extremely neat and tidy in comparison.

Whichever candidate earns the nomination at the Democratic Convention, the candidate who doesn't have that honor is going to stand up and heartily endorse the nominee. Sanders is a career politician. He knows how to behave once the primaries are over.

Now, there are some Sanders "supporters" who will wail and gnash their teeth and declare that they will not vote for Hillary. Most wouldn't have voted for Sanders, either, really. Some are in this primary debate to trash Democrats in general, and those will continue to do so following the convention.

[geek tragedy]

44. Did you see the story out of the Virgin Islands re: Republicans?

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/virgin-islands-gop-meeting-ends-with-shoving-shouting-and-cops/ar-BBrUavP

[SwampG8r]

45. Lived on the rock.for.two years

I would.say there are maybe 50 republicans on st thomas
over on love island (st john) Maybe another 150
No idea about st croix

[Arkana]

83. And I'm sure Hillary being around -20 in her favorables will help SO much with turnout.

[GreatGazoo]

2. Which campaign has been writing off the votes of everyone in the states which have

not voted yet?

[Dawgs]

3. Do people realize that there are also a lot white Democrats in the "deep south"?

People like me.

Cuz it doesn't seem like it.

[MineralMan]

33. A lot of people never realize anything about the southern states.

A lot of people still think it's the 1950s. They haven't been keeping up very well, really.

[CrowCityDem]

5. If you write off entire regions, you can't lead a party. Period.

[merrily]

28. "Writing off" is spin. He had limited resources and knew the likelihood of winning those states.

Also, those are red states.

Claiming it was about only black voters is nonsense.

[CrowCityDem]

37. BS from BS

More 'red state' garbage. Bernie sure loves talking about his wins in Idaho, Utah, and the progressive bastion that is Oklahoma.

Face it; Bernie completely dismisses a region that he was unwilling or unable to try to compete in. Regardless of why, it's completely insulting to people he wants to lead.

[merrily]

39. Wait. you know I'm not Bernie, right?

[apcalc]

42. Great Democratic states

Idaho
Alaska
Wyoming
Utah
Oklahoma
Kansas

[dsc]

49. Florida is purple

we won it 3 times out of the last 6, 4 if you think Gore won it. VA was won the last two times and NC was Romney's closest win in a year that our Governor's race was a fiasco. That is over 40EV

[merrily]

51. What about the other part of my post?

[azurnoir]

68. These are mumblings of Jonathan "that's not Bernie in that picture" Capehart nuff said

[winter is coming]

69. I guess HIllary wrote off those caucus states. n/t

[NurseJackie]

6. Didn't Rachel thoroughly debunk the "did not compete" nonsense?

[uponit7771]

72. Yeap, Sanders put a lot of resources into the south and lost... did not do such in non deep south

... red GE states and won

Difference

demographics...

They know this

[Orsino]

7. That's silly.

The primary's over in those states.

Silly spin-fantasy.

[Bobbie Jo]

23. But the comments and attitudes remain.

Continuing to dismiss these people doesn't help Bernie at this point.

[DCBob]

29. We need those voters in the general.

Alienating them is wrong and risky politically. If African Americans don't show up to vote in Nov we lose.

[Orsino]

53. But is it true to say that we need all votes equally?

Should we act surprised when the Democratic nominee campaigns lightly or not at all in states likely to stay red?

[DCBob]

55. Sure so why say anything to alienate any group at all?

Face it, Bernie screwed up once again in regards to African American voters.

[Orsino]

57. There's gray area between pragmatism and alienation/dismissal.

If you want to argue that his phrasing should have been more careful, sure, why not? But it's a far cry from there to actual dismissal, and you should probably withhold judgment until you see where the nominee actually campaigns.

But no one will remember your spin by then, because if it's a "screw-up," it's not the sort that will register for long in the minds of voters, particularly when both our remain candidates are out stumping for our nominee.

[pnwmom]

50. No, it isn't. Bernie said he didn't get the votes in the deep south because they were conservative

but "we're moving up now." The truth is he doesn't get the majority of the African American vote ANYWHERE in any state, and the south was just the first place where that was demonstrated.

71% of Mississippi Dems were black, according to the exit polls. So when Bernie dismisses them, he's dismissing a group that was mostly African American.

[uponit7771]

64. +1, the fact they keep saying it is one of the reasons why his base is mostly homogenous

[IamMab]

9. Democrats still run for state legislature, governor, attorney general. Bad move by Popey McPopeface

to write them off as "conservative Democrats" just because of which state they live in. (And also clearly because they didn't vote for him either.) These are still liberal Americans, people who believe in green energy, social justice, and all of the other core planks of the Democratic platform.

[merrily]

30. I have no idea why so many heads exploded over that invitation, but it's been fun to see.

[uponit7771]

73. Its the bullshit ass'd sophistry of the whole trip that Sanders keeps pushing that establish's what

... people who aren't voting for him think already; he's NO LESS full of shit than the other politicians

Pope said it was hand shake greeting "nothing more" but Sachs, a Sanders minion, keeps saying it was a "meeting"

[oldandhappy]

10. So == clinton is 'pragmatic' and this is admired.

But Bernie is slapped for recognizing reality. I love it!!

[TexasBushwhacker]

20. That's what I don't get

I'm in Texas. I fully acknowledge that my one vote during the primary is the only one that could help my candidate. In the general election, my liberal white vote will likely be cancelled out by a conservative white vote. That's not being dismissive. That's MATH.

When it comes right down to it, the general election is decided by the swing states. In fact, it's decided by independent voters in the swing states. Unless we get rid of the electoral college, that's the way it's going to be.

[oldandhappy]

27. I have been pondering this

for several months now. Somehow we want give each person a vote, and we want each state to have equal power. Hard to make that work. The Senator and House thing is a good example. Does it work? Electoral college. Does it work? I dunno. Seems as if we stumbled along OK for a long time but now with our extreme divisiveness -- a few states and a few people in those states (as you clearly said, smile) decide elections. Maybe we can send those voters to the moon, let them decide. Might be cheaper! OK Thanks for letting me ramble.

[Orsino]

56. Aw, come on.

Can we not permit each campaign's supporters leeway for spin?

Of COURSE recognition that all states aren't equal all the time is realistic, but only the most careful parsing of this fact won't be spun by opponents as "dismissal" when convenient.

[LexVegas]

12. He's fucking done. Dismss all they want. nt

[Dawgs]

48. Hillary lost 8 of the last 9 states.

Hardly a winner.

[Peregrine Took]

15. Yikes! You're still pushing that dated canard?

Holy cow! Have you been locked away in a meme bubble?

Better check that email...pretty sure there's a brand new one out this morning.

[glowing]

17. How about this idea, "Hillary Post", if the south were to vote

today after seeing Bernie, learning who he was/ is, the massive up-swelling, and the racist crap Bill is pulling, I have a feeling the results would look wildly different. I think FL would have either gone to Bernie or been writhin a couple of points. Perhaps MO and OH would have been blown out enough to keep shady vote flipping schemes out of play. The idea of universal health care and free college for someone in the south would be a real political winner; especially since so many govs down here refuse to expand Medicaid.

But beyond that, we all know many of these states where she won "big" are states that will be red for the general. They shouldn't be, but they are. And who knows, Bernie actually speaks to people across the political line. My sister in law would be more than happy to vote for Bernie because she has 3 smart boys, one is in high school and the rest are popping up right behind. Being able to send her kids is a big deal. Having universal healthcare coverage is a big deal (she wouldn't be beholden to stay married to her husband; quite like I am, if insurance wasn't needed). Medicare for All would help so many women, it's not even funny what an equalizing agent that would provide in work places, in jobs that women primarily take, and peace of mind, one huge less worry for their children/ family for that access to take a sick child to the Dr and to be able to afford the medicine prescribed by it... And how many women would go back to school or begin taking college classes around their daily lives to improve their economic mobility if that access was free? So many women would choose to go, go back for a different degree, or choose to work on a higher degree. If you think a bachelor degree is expensive, just take a gander at a masters or doctorate! I chose science. To make any money in research at all, you have to have a masters, but a Doctorate is much more preferred. If I had reasonable ability to go back and further my education without sticking my family in financial burdens of school loans/ debt, with NO guarantee of a better paying job after and with NO ability to bankrupt the loans away from the family, it's too costly a risk for many who are with "family". I couldn't afford it when I was single and starting out; I certainly wouldn't take food out of my babies' mouths on that sort of high cost, minimal return on the investment. I'd be better off heading to Vegas for the weekend. But don't think for a second that if it's possible to go to school for a Masters, that I wouldn't... And my Masters would be in secondary education so I could teach science to the next generations coming along. Indenting myself to teach high school would be lunacy in America.

[geek tragedy]

25. Reality check: she won Florida by 30%. nt

[Godhumor]

34. Not to mention she has maintained her very impressive margin with black voters in every single state

Win or lose.

This belief there is some kind of mass buyer's remorse is an odd one to me.

[glowing]

80. Reality check, barely anyone knew who Bernie was when FL voted.

They surges for Obama by GE because of his message of progress. Believe me, I-4 and below, his message would resonate and bring those "iffy"/ "sometimes" voters out to the primaries if they had a clue.

I only heard, Donald Trump or Hillary? They had no real idea who else was running because that was the reality of the media messaging for 2015 and the beginning of 2016. Now, people know. Shoot, they now know where VT is on a map. And ask if I'm proud of a fellow VT'er doing so well. I hear it at the hotel I work for... They talk about his message. They hope he can win so they can vote for him in the GE. After that momentum from the West, he rose into some prominence.

Believe me, we have the most regressive tax base in the country. We have wealthy and poor and barely what anyone calls middle class anymore. His message resonates very, very well here. I doubt if the primary was being held in April or May, FL would be a blow out for her. The younger voters would probably engage like they have been around the country.

[geek tragedy]

81. Why did he do so much better in IL, MO, and MI? nt

[glowing]

87. They had more time with him.

[geek tragedy]

88. FL voted the same day, so did Ohio.

And just wait for the results tomorrow.

[beedle]

21. But Hillary will not rue her dismissal of Bernie Supporters?

Maybe you should check into the direction the Democratic party is headed in terms of members, vs independents ... hint: You will not win without support from independents, the people Bernie attracts and Hillary drives away.

[brush]

38. Yeah, yeah, like every independent is anti-Clinton will vote Green, for a repug or stay home.

How do you know that?

[hollysmom]

47. oddly enough I talk to people, I can just represent my area, but geeze louise, Clinton is hated

around here. it is so weird, so many people will just not vote for her because of the baggage put on her over the years true or not, I am not talking informed voters passionate voters, although I know some of them also not voting for her. I am talking about blue collar workers, the union warehouse guys, the secretaries in the office. I committed the unforgivable sin of talking politics at my brother's memorial lunch after the funeral. And besides the idiots who were considering voting Trump (that celebrity "good Businessman" idiocy crosses party lines and you better believe it), the others were pretty much any one but Hillary. If Biden was running they would back him over Hillary. It was seriously just a room full of Hillary hatred because people have been trained to hate her for 20 years by the media, but the right wing nut cases and all the hearings. To them Bernie is just = not Hillary.

Maybe it was just my section of NJ, but this is how it is, I don't even bother talking to my closest neighbors here because I know they are Ted Cruz people ugh. don't get my started on my latest iteration of neighbors. I even miss my crazy old neighbors who thought that Bill Clinton strangled 13 people with his own hands because he was a hands on kind of guy.

my point is these people for the most part are democrats, not on-line, not active in the party but really hate HRC and won't vote for her (and won't vote in the primary or off year elections, they so irritate me).

[DCBob]

26. Yeah, that comment struck me as well.

I expect to hear such nonsense from Bernie supporters here on DU but not from the candidate himself in a huge nationally televised debate. He keeps pushing black voters farther and farther away. Not good.

[Turin_C3PO]

85. Yes

But on the flip side, Clinton needs Sanders supporters to win the GE. Both sides need to cut out the hot rhetoric or we are doomed to lose in November.

[brush]

35. Ego boost for Sanders, big bucks for Devine as his company makes $800k per month off the campaign

Devine wants to keep the campaign going for as long as possible.

[hollysmom]

41. this person has interpreted stuff wrong before and definitely deliberately misinterpreted this

I have wondered what is the point of winning red states just for statistical reasons, It does nto mean that I am dismissing anyone, I have family in red states who represent! However how much do people here there everywhere dismiss me for being in one of the last states to have a federal primary - I am going to vote Tuesday in the primary for mayor and school board and most places, but still no federal offices. it sucks, who ever set this up to cost us twice as much to have two primaries.

Discussing the influence in the way the electoral college works is not the same as dismissing people, what is the next stupid Clinton Meme going to be?

[hobbit709]

43. Rue the day.

[Bluenorthwest]

46. Every State in the Deep South has anti gay laws. They don't speak for me.

I get that they speak for some of you, we see what is being done in NC on a bipartisan basis voting against LGBT rights. But to me that crap is vile, bigoted atavistic and morally repugnant.

Your State is attacking LGBT and you are here attacking Bernie. Priorities like that are what make those bigoted laws i States like yours possible. In your name LGBT are being mistreated but that is not what you care about.

Repulsive.

[uponit7771]

71. Because of primary dem voters? You understand how overtly dismissive or uninformed this claim is?

[WhaTHellsgoingonhere]

52. Bill Moyers ranks Clinton 42 up there with Reagan as top "dog whistle" campaigns

http://billmoyers.com/content/six-case-studies-in-dog-whistle-politics/5/

For some reason, the Clintons didn't rue those years.

[ThePhilosopher04]

54. They have it exactly backwards.

Bernie Sanders is far and away better for African-Americans (and all Americans) than Hillary Clinton, and it's not close.

[w4rma]

58. I was just about to post that very same point.

Hillary is backwards and Orwellian on many things, actually.

[Tarc]

60. Funny how they, by large numbers, do not vote for Sanders. Why is that, you think?

[ThePhilosopher04]

61. Misinformed and clinging to old ways. Fortunately, young people are seeing the light

and the more they learn about both candidates, the more they support Bernie.

[Tarc]

62. Really? Hasn't almost a year of campaigning been enough?

I think the "they don't know Bernie" argument petered out around January or so. He practically saturated the South Carolina airwaves, even rolled out "Killer Mike" and Spike Lee before getting trounced by ~45 points.

The A-A community has chosen to go in another direction than Sanders, and I think it's time to accept that. By all means try to woo some away, but alleging ignorance and Stockholm Syndrome behavior isn't exactly a winning formula there.

[ThePhilosopher04]

63. Nope. Not when you start with zero name recognition and have to overcome constant race-baiting

and misinformation tactics from a well-funded and well-known opponent. He's actually doing well considering. The more they know, the better he does. Hillary is just the opposite. That's why her favorables are in a near free fall state right now.

[uponit7771]

74. So is it your position that after nearly a year black and brown politicos still don't know Sanders?

... REALLY?!

You think we don't have TV and the interenets too?!

What "misinformation" do you think is pushed on blacks and browns? tia

[Tarc]

75. Sorry kid, but the A-A community is a bit smarter than you think they are

This sort of attitude is why the Sanders minority vote has tanked.

[uponit7771]

65. Podium Bird tell you that too?

[Karmadillo]

59. Back to race-baiting? Uh oh. Internal polls must show NY closing.

[uponit7771]

70. Stating facts relevant to context of the primary is race baiting to racist. Sanders meme here

... is overtly demeaning and typical out of context (primary dem voters are mostly liberal) bullshit he pushes often and now it's about black people seeing he's not saying such about the GE conservative states he won.

[restorefreedom]

79. yes exactly, internals be scaring clintoncorp. nt

[azurnoir]

67. Jonathan Capehart says what?

[RandySF]

77. #Berniemath is colorblind

If you didn't vote for Bernie, you don't count.

[Autumn]

82. Race baiting is so yesterday.

It's been around 2 weeks since there has been a decent race baiting OP . Guess Capehart will have to do in a pinch.

[Turin_C3PO]

84. Honest question.

When Hillary wins the nomination,do you think she'll allocate very much resources to southern states that she won't win? I say it's doubtful she will and for good reason. Bernie certainly has a few things he should have done better in regarding winning minority support but I don't fault him for spending less $$$ and time in areas that polling shows he wouldn't have won.

[QC]

86. Jonathan Capehart?