“Supporters of Bernie love rallies. Supporters of Hillary love to vote.”

[CrowCityDem]

A very interesting article by Joan Walsh talking about her experiences in NYC this weekend:

http://www.thenation.com/article/surprise-new-york-democrats-like-the-democratic-party/

There are very good anecdotes in there about why Bernie's supporters turn off so many people, and why Democrats are not warming up to Bernie's "democrats are corrupt" schtick.

Welcome to Clinton Country!

[AgingAmerican]

1. Stupid

She can't draw a large crowd, so they do this....

[Buzz Clik]

3. Vote. They vote.

[LonePirate]

4. The only crowds that matter are the ones who show up at the polls on Election Day.

[RandySF]

7. I'll take Hillary's vote totals over Bernie's crowd numbers any day.

[Tarc]

12. Some of us have, y'know, jobs

I haven't been to a political rally since 2008.

[AgingAmerican]

51. That was the GOPs excuse for there being more port-a-potties than attendees at Tea Party rallies

And Iraq war rallies.

[Amimnoch]

62. And they were Horrendously successful.

I wish the Bernie "Revolution" would take a cue from the success of the Tea Party (just not their fucked up positions). In one way the Tea Party was so much smarter than the Bernie "revolution". They knew to go after the landscape of congress, instead of lumping all of their political capital into a lottery ticket presidency that wouldn't get anything they wanted passed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_politicians_affiliated_with_the_Tea_Party_movement

I count 92 politicians in that list. It's not a majority, but it has been strong enough to have VERY strong influence on every bill that's gone before congress.

Just imagine what REAL kind of revolution there would be if Bernie's momentum was used to reshape congress.

But, alas, no real movement has resulted. It's all about Bernie. And win or lose, neither Democratic Party candidate will make any real progress in the next congress.

So, for those of us who decide on reality, instead of idealism, Hillary is and remains the best choice.

[AgingAmerican]

68. It's a presidential campaign

Hillary supporters have lost sight of that

[Amimnoch]

69. It's a series of Primary elections, followed by a General Election..

And involves a HELL of a lot more than just the people running for POTUS.

Bernie supporters appear completely oblivious to that.

[DemonGoddess]

73. Exactly

The primaries are to select the nominee for the PARTIES. The Presidential election isn't until November.

[KittyWampus]

19. She isn't seeking large crowds to practice demagoguery. She's doing smaller groups

where people can ask questions and get in depth answers.

And THAT is why Sanders is losing.

He can't answer anything in depth.

He's all slogan and no substance.

[Thinkingabout]

54. You can't hear what people are saying if you are the one talking. She listens, it is important

to me for a candidate to listen, I think this is how she will be as president, she will not be separating herself from citizens.

[roguevalley]

25. Joan Walsh's DAUGHTER WORKS FOR HRC! She's a pathetic, sad, despicable person,

our Joan. Nothing like continuing the meme that millennials are stupid and think with their ovaries. HER DAUGHTER WORKS FOR HRC.

[CrowCityDem]

36. That is a sad, small-minded insult for absolutely no reason. Very 'progressive' of you.

[roguevalley]

37. no, its the truth. I remember her railing against Obama for Hillary in 2008. She's even more

compromised with her daughter. That isn't small minded or an insult. Its history repeating itself.

[CrowCityDem]

38. None of that justifies calling her a despicable person. It was ugly, and we're supposed to be better

[Dawgs]

2. A bunch of quotes from Bernie haters is not evidence of anything.

Other than Joan Walsh has an agenda.

[itsrobert]

5. Yes, they Vote 2.4 Million more than Bernie

[northernsouthern]

8. Yes they do...

These people love to vote for her. But when you rig the election for these people you do get more votes, and they also get more angry when they lose at their own rigged game.

[passiveporcupine]

24. Hooo, she's a winner

It would be fun to listen to some of the posts here in the real voice of the posters.

[northernsouthern]

30. Some one posted this on my other thread about the WA caucus

We had a lady like that, a bit younger, get up and yell at around 800 Bernie supporters that we would not vote for him if his name was BERNICE SANDERS. She was yelling that at the women there too.

[uponit7771]

6. Sanders voters are attracted to "Camplaigners" ... (Boston Bean)

[NurseJackie]

9. Oh, DAMMMN! Joan Walsh nails it!

[Peregrine Took]

18. After departing from Salon, poor Joan has really lost it!!

'Think she needs a good "lie down."

[roguevalley]

27. she's a hack. Her daughter works for HRC. By the way, love glozell Oh and she's getting her ass

handed to her on twitter.

[Sheepshank]

10. Seems like...doesn't it?

[roguevalley]

28. her daughter has a stake in the outcome. She works for HRC.

[Sheepshank]

72. And my daughter roots for Bernie...so?

[Lizzie Poppet]

11. ...and war and fracking and TPP and oligarchy and...

[KittyWampus]

21. Now, if only Sanders had actual, in depth, workable PLANS to deal with any of that.

[mhatrw]

13. Supporters of Clinton love to form their opinions by watching or reading

corporate media.

[KittyWampus]

22. When Sanders supporters trash Clinton for fundraising down-ticket Democrats

it sure doesn't seem like they are well informed by the Sanders campaign or whatever other questionable sources they use to form opinions.

[WhiteTara]

14. ...

 On the Sanders side, his young supporters hated Clinton with a bewildering intensity. Their outreach to the Clinton folks consisted of trying to convince them that she is evil, rather than promoting Sanders.

I think this says it all.

[Arkana]

15. They sure do!

Some of them like to vote multiple times in the same election even!

[jillan]

16. Supporters of Bernie like to make phone calls. 3 MILLION over the weekend in fact, all to NY voters.

[Doctor_J]

17. And Clinton supporters are ALLOWED to vote

That helps

[ridgenvalley]

20. ^^this^^

[KittyWampus]

23. Clinton supporters are smart enough to check the rules. But then we've been involved

in the political process and understand it isn't all about going to a large rally, listening to empty slogans and then showing up to vote after posing oneself as an "Independent" for years before.

Where were you complaining about NY Primaries before?

Edit- Your profile says member since 2001. Have you ever complained about the NY primary process before?

If not, why now?

[Doctor_J]

46. Its a shame that you and the party big shots are intent on pushing millions of voters

away from the party. And I LOVE what you've done to it over the past 25 years. Congratulations on all but killing it.

[Stuckinthebush]

63. Bingo

Most of them have been Democrats for a long time so have no problem voting in NY.

[azurnoir]

43. check this out and think maybe this whole meme being catapulted by Camp weathervane

is a crock or an attempt at discouraging potential voters

Closed Primaries
Eleven states operate closed primary elections or caucuses. In either case, only voters who are registered as members of a political party prior to the primary date may participate in the nomination process for its candidates.
Proponents say that closed systems contribute to a strong party organization. Opponents note that independent or unaffiliated voters are excluded from the process.

Delaware
Maine
New York
Florida
Nevada
Pennsylvania
Kansas
New Jersey
Wyoming
Kentucky
New Mexico

http://www.ncsl.org/research/elections-and-campaigns/primary-types.aspx

[ThePhilosopher04]

26. I would say the system is rigged to make it difficult for Bernie supporters to vote, and easier

for Clinton supporters. Closed primaries are bad for real democracy.

[CrowCityDem]

29. If it's rigged, it's only rigged to favor Democrats.

[ThePhilosopher04]

31. Corporate, establishment Democrats.

[Stuckinthebush]

64. Those pesky Democrats

And their long standing rules!

[berniepdx420]

32. You all are in for a big surprise.. you are expecting hillary to crush it in New York city... she

will probably win Manhattan...it's the only borough which performs like other cities in elections... the other Burroughs... that's a different story... here's who will win NY for Bernie.. Jewish, Asian & Latino.. NYC is super liberal.. that's Bernie's base.. add in Bernie winning the 3 aforementioned groups by 70 to 30 (Asian vote may be 60-40, the Jewish vote maybe 85-15) oh and Bernie will win or tie most of the other counties of NY except for Onondaga Co.... which all leads to Bernie winning NY state by 6 to 8 points. Oh and don't forget her base from 2008, well a good slice has passed on..

IMHO

[brooklynite]

66. NYC is NOT "super-liberal"...it is "super-Democratic"

[OilemFirchen]

71. I can't speak to the other groups...

but Jewish voters will go 60/40 for Clinton, if not better. The polls have consistently reflected this and the vote will bear it out.

[apcalc]

33. To me it is so sad

To see what Sanders has done to my party.

[Merryland]

52. dry those tears, my dear

revolution is a good thing.

[Ed Suspicious]

53. To me it is so sad to see what Clinton has done to my party.

[4nic8em]

58. It's OK cause

it's my party...but you can cry if you want to, cry if you want to...

[Stuckinthebush]

65. He will be gone soon

No worries

[lunamagica]

34. Very interesting...Thank you!

[mcar]

35. K&R

[anotherproletariat]

39. My mom and all of her large group of friends are big time Hillary supporters...

and none of them would ever go to a rally. Well, I'll take that back. They have all paid to go to local fundraising teas and women's groups. They even have a book club that is dedicated to Hillary fundraising. For them attending a rally is just not something they find enjoyable...driving far away, parking, walking to some large venue and standing in a crowd of thousands for hours. As my mom said, "You couldn't pay me to do that! I'll gladly donate another $1,000 to NOT have to go to a rally...but I've already hit my limit."

As for my dad, he is also a Hillary supporter, but doesn't have the same type of friend circles. He tells me that he would be fine with a Hillary rally, if it happened at a sporting event. Otherwise, he is also content to just vote and make campaign contributions.

[ibegurpard]

40. They also seem to be A-OK

With people's registrations being changed without their knowledge...what's up with that?

[Skwmom]

41. The 16 year old said he was not a Bernie Supporter. Someone handed him the Bernie Sander's sign.

It wouldn't be like the Clintons would think to engage in political dirty tricks to make Bernie supporters look bad

[Skwmom]

42. This type of stuff really doesn't pass the smell test. n/t

[CrowCityDem]

44. Why?

Because it's positive regarding Hillary and her voters?

[AzDar]

45. I see she and Kacie Hunt got their Talking Points from Der Brockster:

Too bad REALITY disproves their bullshit...

[Ken Burch]

47. There was no good reason for the speakers at those rallies to keep ranting about the party issue.

It doesn't make any freaking difference when Bernie joined us. He had to run or no one in this campaign would have spoken truth to power at all. No one else in the race was fighting for the people and, especially for the powerless among the people.

If Bernie had been a Dem the whole time, it would have meant he couldn't have strong principles. Look what this party did to Jesse Jackson, Tom Harkin and Dennis Kucinich-the last three Democratic presidential candidates who stood for anything beyond bland mush.

[CrowCityDem]

55. Do you get how insulting that is?

To say that you can't be a Democrat and have principles? That's no different than the religious people who say that atheists can't be good people. It's demeaning, and the sort of thing that makes this campaign season a disgrace.

[SFnomad]

59. +1 n/t

[Ken Burch]

70. Individual Dems can have strong principles, obviously.

But the way the party is currently structured(and the way it has been since Tony Coehlo sold it to Wall Street in the Eighties)no one above the level of House or Senate backbencher, and certainly no presidential candidate, is allowed to be get close to power and be progressive on anything but the sort of issues that are worthy but totally nonthreatening to anyone who runs this country, issues that will make the country slightly more decent but won't ever transform it into a land of justice for all.

That is why Bernie is being demonized by our party leadership: because he committed the unpardonable sin of seeking the presidency on a program that treats class and corporate power, and the way we interact with the world as being just as important as identity politics.

We all support identity politics, but we can't do anything that matters if we treat those as the only issues on which change is possible.

[Live and Learn]

48. But not show up at caucuses. nt

[Marrah_G]

49. enough

[Surya Gayatri]

50. K & R most enthusiastically.

[Number23]

56. Good GOD these people are just deranged. Who the hell acts like this???!!

Meanwhile, a young white woman carrying a “Unidos Con Bernie” sign pushed through the crowd, jostling the older Latinas who were crushing the stage to get closer to Clinton, chanting at them, bewilderingly, “Shame, shame, shame.” It was not a good look.

Does she think she's the damn nun walking behind Cercei from Game of Thrones?? What the hell is wrong with these people??

A young (but older than Justin) female Sanders supporter with a “Bernie para presidente” T-shirt joined the circle and started screaming at Dear and McLaughlin. “Hillary didn’t just vote for the Iraq war—she promoted it state to state for George W. Bush! She traveled around the country to sell it!” Dear, calmly, tells her that isn’t true—or at least, no one has ever reported that news—and the Sanders supporter starts pointing her finger in the older woman’s face.

And EVERYONE believes that these folks acted like this article says because so damn many of these people have been screaming and acting like complete fools for months. I feel like Todd in Community, "What is WRONG with you people??! HUH??!!!"

[Maru Kitteh]

57. Hillary's supporters don't need a circus, pots & pans and dancing pandas.

They just vote.

[brooklynite]

67. Well...Pandas ARE nice...

[Renew Deal]

61. Maybe here are just more Hillary supporters