For one brief shining moment, I thought the Dem party had really moved left

[Fast Walker 52]

with Bernie Sanders.

Oh well.

[Freddie Stubbs]

1. We are a party of moderates--Let the Republicans be the fringe party

[morningfog]

2. Nonsense words.

[TM99]

8. If more proof was ever needed, this would be it.

Yes, you are right. The Democratic Party is now the moderate on some social issues, center right on economic & foreign policy issues party.

The DLC take-over is complete.

[Broward]

17. And people like yourself keep facilitating a further push to the right.

[dragonfly301]

27. Hope you aren't too attached to your SS benefits

because it will be grand bargained away by those smiling moderate Dems faster than you can say chained CPI.

[leftofcool]

114. Thus speaketh Rush Limbaugh.

[dragonfly301]

115. No. Unless you mean he would be cheering on the cuts...

[Armstead]

51. Corporate Center Right is not moderate -- unless one is a conservative Republican

[B Calm]

65. I heard that too, Rush Limbaugh says the same thing.

[KPN]

77. Sounds to me like you are the real Republicans

[Kelvin Mace]

129. And this is why we fail

When it comes to being a "moderate" I take my cues from William Lloyd Garrison:

Assenting to the "self-evident truth" maintained in the American Declaration of Independence, "that all men are created equal, and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights -- among which are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness," I shall strenuously contend for the immediate enfranchisement of our slave population. In Park-street Church, on the Fourth of July, 1829, in an address on slavery, I unreflectingly assented to the popluar but pernicious doctrine of gradual abolition. I seize this opportunity to make a full and unequivocal recantation, and thus publicly to ask pardon of my God, of my country, and of my brethren the poor slaves, for having uttered a sentiment so full of timidity, injustice and absurdity. A similar recantation, from my pen, was published in the Genius of Universal Emancipation at Baltimore, in September, 1829. My consicence in now satisfied.

I am aware, that many object to the severity of my language; but is there not cause for severity? I will be as harsh as truth, and as uncompromising as justice. On this subject, I do not wish to think, or speak, or write, with moderation. No! no! Tell a man whose house is on fire, to give a moderate alarm; tell him to moderately rescue his wife from the hand of the ravisher; tell the mother to gradually extricate her babe from the fire into which it has fallen; -- but urge me not to use moderation in a cause like the present. I am in earnest -- I will not equivocate -- I will not excuse -- I will not retreat a single inch -- AND I WILL BE HEARD. The apathy of the people is enough to make every statue leap from its pedestal, and to hasten the resurrection of the dead.

It is pretended, that I am retarding the cause of emancipation by the coarseness of my invective, and the precipitancy of my measures. The charge is not true. On this question my influence, -- humble as it is, -- is felt at this moment to a considerable extent, and shall be felt in coming years -- not perniciously, but beneficially -- not as a curse, but as a blessing; and posterity will bear testimony that I was right. I desire to thank God, that he enables me to disregard "the fear of man which bringeth a snare," and to speak his truth in its simplicity and power.

tl;dr

Screw moderates and moderation.

[Thirties Child]

136. If the Democratic Party is a party of moderates, there's a vacuum on the left

A vacuum on the left that WILL be filled.

[John Poet]

142. 'Moderate' means you're only "half-way" batshit rightwing crazy?

Certainly applies to Hillary and her fascist neocon foreign policies.



We can do better than "only halfway batshit rightwing crazy".

[Art_from_Ark]

143. Some people seem to be satisfied with just

"only halfway batshit rightwing crazy".

[pacalo]

3. Money talks -- & can buy anything

except love, of course.

[Bodhi BloodWave]

95. but money can buy cake which is almost the same thing

sorry, its just a saying i love and couldn't resist finishing with slightly differed wording

Fingers crossed that things will actually improve in some ways

[pacalo]

119. Cake works for me...

but my true weakness is seafood.

[gollygee]

4. It has moved left

No way would Bernie have done so well 20 years ago. I'm stunned by how well he did. And it's going to keep moving left.

[woolldog]

20. This is the correct answer.

[Fast Walker 52]

29. this is true-- and the young generation gives me a lot of hope

I just hope Hillary doesn't take their idealism and turn it sour.

[Svafa]

105. I hope you're right! I want to think that this is a real

movement to the left, not just a political "oddball" year. The powers that be will do what they can to make us think the latter. We need to stay motivated.

[liberal from boston]

138. Go Bernie

Bernie is still in this race. Susan Sarandon was on Stephen Colbert tonight. Stephen showed a photo of Susan & Hillary then asked you were good friends what happened--Susan jokingly replied " I had to break up with her". Susan pointed out that Bernie does well in open primaries- (the remaining primaries are all open). http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017362988

[2banon]

152. No, the voters have, but the party establishment has not.

that's why we're in this passionately contested campaign.

[99Forever]

5. Nope.

I don't expect it ever will. And so, I'm done. Permanently.

[votesparks]

14. Organize at your state and county level

And you'll be amazed at what we can do. All politics is local.

[99Forever]

25. Been there, done that.

Got a drawer full of those t-shirts. Hasn't done jack. ALL politics is more corrupt than ever.

[BillZBubb]

126. "ALL politics is more corrupt than ever"

Exactly. And people are falling all over themselves to defend the corrupt politicians.

[99Forever]

144. I spent a lifetime watching it slide into the slime pit.

Not since Bobby Kennedy have I had the kind of hope that we might yet straighten it out that Bernie generates. But apparently, Democrats prefer lies, cheating, wars, terminal global climate change and corruption.

So be it.

I'm done.

[Fast Walker 52]

30. maybe... but I live in a very red area. I just don't see how a Dem/liberal can ever get elected here

It's like in their DNA to vote GOP.

On the state level, it's a bit better though. We do elect both Dems and Repubs, depending on the candidate.

[seekthetruth]

6. I think we're more like a party that is fractured......

....lots of people happy to support the status quo, but a large minority is actually awake and understands that our democracy is being taken from us little by little.

And what I mean by the term "awake" is that they don't want to rock the boat, so to speak, and they're scared of the s-word (socialism).

But, take heart, brothers and sisters, the younger generation is coming up quickly.

[Fast Walker 52]

31. I do have a lot of hope for the younger generation and I hope they stay engaged

with politics.

[COLGATE4]

50. The younger generation is coming up quickly

and, as they move into the real world and get jobs, start families and accept new responsibilities will understand that the Democratic Party reflects their real values.

[Bayard]

73. Really?

How are they supposed to get decent jobs, afford a mortgage or kids?

[COLGATE4]

94. Perhaps the same way we all did???

[nadinbrzezinski]

102. So you moved back home

Because a you could find was a ten buck an hour job?

Ladies and gents this is part of the disconnect

[COLGATE4]

109. Do you really believe that most people in their 20's are doing that?

I have been connected with several universities for years now and I see that virtually all of their graduates are securing employment within a year of graduating- many long before that. No disconnect here.

[nadinbrzezinski]

118. A larger percentage than they used to

yes.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2013/07/30/2381031/census-bureau-high-poverty-among-college-students/

https://higheredtoday.org/2015/06/29/fighting-food-insecurity-on-campus/

http://www.epi.org/publication/the-class-of-2015/

You may not see it, but ALL STUDENTS. That is impressive. I do not think that even Phoenix U would claim that.

[COLGATE4]

130. It may be we have reached the point where too many people are

pursuing college degrees for the sake of pursuing college degrees, although a 7.2% unemployment rate among recent college grads does not strike me as being addramatically excessive (2% higher than the national average). The reported high 'poverty' rate among college students living off campus is not a new phenomenon. Many of us, and probably most of us who lived off campus during our college years met the government's definition of 'poverty' during that time. It is however a temporary situation and should not be confused with families living in poverty with little possibility of the situation improving. Likewise, the phenomenon of college students skipping meals to use their money otherwise is nothing new. Again, many of us have done it with no lasting ill effects. It''s good that some universities are making funds available to ameliorate this in the case of students who are literally forced to choose between food and books but I don't think that admits of any further generalization. There does need to be alternative career tracks for technical and vocational education as in Europe, rather than just pushing everybody through a B.A. program and hoping to get a job on that basis. Finally, as all the articles point out, we are still in a period of recovery from the Bush-induced recession that hammered our economy badly. As the economy continues to improve we should continue to see these metrics decrease accordingly.

[nadinbrzezinski]

132. It is the whole shebang including making far less

Than their parents generation and the ahem...sharing economy.

You got a good job and obviously no worries. Many of the kids don't share that outlook.

In fact, they are expected to do worst than their parents for the first time in US history. I will once repeat, sleep walking through history.

[COLGATE4]

139. Statistics demonstrating that today's graduates are making

'far less than their parents' generation'???

[KPN]

80. That strikes me as naive.

Young people in general are not starting families for a couple of reasons, one being they can't find and get jobs that provide a sense of financial security. They will not see the Democratic Party in a positive light if it does not meaningfully change that -- and frankly, I'm not holding my breath.

Hillary is a corporate shill -- always was and likely always will be. She is progressive on social, but a neo-lib on economic issues. She won't win the young people over. She doesn't have what's needed in her to do that.

[LondonReign2]

98. I had no idea the younger generation supported more wars in the middle east, fracking,

cluster bombs, reductions in social security, and constitutional restrictions on a woman's right to choose. Thanks for sharing.

[COLGATE4]

111. I don't think they think much about the Middle East and/or cluster bombs.

Those I know don't believe they will ever have Social Security so likewise it isn't an issue. And, as far as a woman's right to choose, you do understand that there are and always have been constitutional restrictions on abortion. Roe v Wade was based on constititional restrictions. There are no unlimited rights.

[VulgarPoet]

148. You think wrong.

I grew up in a very military family, am engaged to someone in a very military family, and am active duty military myself.

A lot of us, even those on the outside who either couldn't or wouldn't enlist are incredibly concerned about what even on the inside, looks like neo-colonial sentiment towards the Middle East.

[COLGATE4]

149. I didn't intend to include military in my statement. I was referring to young civilians.

[TrueDemVA]

7. There is still hope

This primary has shown people what is possible. A generation of people are waking up and hopefully will continue to fight. I am with many of our brothers and sisters that are tired of the establishment.

No more DINOs. BERNIE OR BUST!!!

Oh, and I wasn't paid to say that.

[KPN]

81. I'm with you on that one.

Bernie or Bust!!!

[tom-servo]

9. Yeah, I'm still trying to digest the fact that...

...the largest liberal party in the US is going to let the opportunity to field a strong, popular, genuinely progressive candidate pass them by. It's painful to watch.

[Fast Walker 52]

32. Yep! Welcome to DU by the way!

[tom-servo]

150. Thanks for the welcome, and...

...sorry for the late response.

[Maedhros]

110. Psst. The Democrats are not a liberal party anymore.[n/t]

[BillZBubb]

128. Nice first post!

But the Democratic party is now liberal in name only. We're just not a conservative as the republicans.

And it is indeed painful.

[Peregrine Took]

10. The Klintoon's have thier hooks so deep into the DNC/DLC that it will take years to purge them.

God Forbid she wins the nomination - we are dead ducks.

War forever and ever thank to our Queen Hawk.

[Barack_America]

15. No, they are aging out quickly.

The truth about Bernie's revolution is the emergence of a liberal generation, while a more conservative, some would say, "me" generation, dies out.

You want to talk about the real math, look no further than the average human lifespan.

Only question is whether the boomers will yield the Democratic Party gracefully, or kill it on their way out.

So far it's been the latter.

[Armstead]

54. Don't put all of us Boomers in that category please

Many have been fighting that crap for years...just not enough of them

[BernieforPres2016]

67. Not so fast on the Clintons aging out quickly

If Hillary wins the Presidency, look for her to give Gillibrand a spot in her adminstration to open the NY Senate seat for Chelsea in 2018.

[2banon]

154. Chelsea is ripe for Congress/Senate and then she'll be headed for POTUS

it's the whirl a berg dynasties machine. Bush daughters might even be in the game eventually.

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

159. Yeah, we need another Mezvinsky in the House.

Her father-in-law had a long and distinguished career in politics.

[BernieforPres2016]

160. He almost made Bill look like an honest man

Bill probably would thrown him in with Marc Rich and the other last minute pardons if they had gotten the application in sooner.

[auntpurl]

40. Really? The "Klintoons"? That's what poster on Free Republic call the Clintons.

Do we really need that here?

[Fumesucker]

11. You never learn, Charlie Brown

Lucy is always, always, always going to snatch away the football.

Come to think of it Hillary has a personality much like Lucy.

[Fast Walker 52]

33. haha, good analogy

[actslikeacarrot]

12. Our fellow dems have spoken. And they have no...

...problem with war and maybe even support it. Makes me think that most "anti war dems" in the early 2000's were only against it due to the "R" behind the presidents name. Go team!!1!!

[Fast Walker 52]

35. exactly-- this is what really gets me. Pro-war Democrats really make me

National security state Dems really make me



Pro-NSA spying Dems really make me



Pro-Wall St. banker Dems also make me

[COLGATE4]

52. You might need to see a doctor about that

persistent vomiting you seem to have.

[noretreatnosurrender]

61. We've been working on the cure

through this campaign. One day we will have it and all the people who have laughed at our efforts will realize what they've done to impede their own progress

[COLGATE4]

62. One day... very soon now... just wait... it's coming... any day now...

We will all see the Bernie light. When is the canonization again?

[noretreatnosurrender]

71. Foolish Partisan

Bernie is just out front during the campaign. It's not about Bernie. While he has been an excellent candidate whose honesty and integrity has helped to get out the message these issues come from all of us and they survive the campaign. Clinton supporters who only focus on personalities just show their ignorance of what's actually happening in this country. I feel sorry for you.

[COLGATE4]

96. I really appreciate your concern. What's happening in the country is more

or less the same thing that happens every four years. Some voters get disaffected and/or are pissed at their economic situation or whatever else disgruntles them at that point and look to those potential candidates who promise them the sun, moon and stars, all without any effort or sacrifice on their part. On the Rethug side there is the Donald, who has already told them that immigrants are responsible for all their troubles and fans the flames of false patriotism by telling them how "we (meaning you, Joe American) aren't respected in the world anymore" and he's going to fix that too. On the other hand we have Bernie, promising all kinds of great free stuff with no plausible explanation as to 1) just how he would pay for it and 2) how he would pass all that through a Congress dominated by troglodyte Republicans. Once again, grandiose promises but with no work or sacrifice required on the voters' part. Fortunately, most voters understand that things promised like this have a way of never coming true, and after hearing all the stirring speeches they wind up voting for the most reasonable candidate.So, no, I don't expect the revolution this year, or next, or the year after, either. We'll hear much thie same in 2019 and 2020 and afterwards.

[nadinbrzezinski]

120. Sleep walling though history

?w=700

?w=700&h=&crop=1

?w=300&h=200

but you are correct, this only happens every four years, and yes they are all connected

[COLGATE4]

125. All temporary without any lasting effects. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

131. Hmm I am sure glad the 1740s generation gave up

No permament results either

[COLGATE4]

133. I think you're being overly dramatic.

Movements come and go. Most of them have no lasting long term effect. I suspect Bernie's will be one of those as well.

[nadinbrzezinski]

134. Best case he is in the 1740s for the elite that is

And this one is well...global. Nope, I am not being overtly dramatic

[COLGATE4]

135. Time will tell.

[COLGATE4]

113. And the Sun came up and the village was saved.

Got it.

[Fast Walker 52]

90. LOL. I should probably just avoid politics.

[COLGATE4]

92. EXCELLENT. I think we both probably should.

[Robbins]

48. most of them supported bush on everything he was doing

they had to pretend to be anti-war for political reasons since many of democratic base was against war.

[jzodda]

56. See this is where you get it wrong

Many of us are not anti war at all times. It was democratic leadership that won WWIi

I was against that war in Iraq because the rational for war, weapons of mass destructiontruction, was a fabrication. I protested and ranted and raved over it. I did support the first Gulf War.

[votesparks]

13. About 40-45 percent there

And we did it in LESS THAN A YEAR. The movement just learned to walk. Just wait for our terrible twos!

[Fast Walker 52]

36. ah that song-- so many memories!

[nolawarlock]

93. Yeah, we saw how that story turned out. nt

[Barack_America]

16. If I may be blunt, every presidential election, 4 years worth of young, liberal...

...voters come of age, while 4 years worth of right-to-center right older voters die off.

The real political math is the average human lifespan.

Clinton is likely the boomer's last gasp. At least for Dems, that is. Republicans are going to end up running 90-year olds soon, lol.

[JimDandy]

24. Good analysis. It's is sad that such a flawed human being, though, might become

our first woman president, instead of a strong upstanding progressive.

[auntpurl]

38. The problem with your analysis

is that people tend to skew more moderate as they age. I would have voted for Bernie at 20 - I was not very politically aware, and his policies, however ill thought-out, would have appealed to me. At 40-something, I recognise pie-in-the-sky promises with no legitimate plan for implementation when I see them. Hillary all the way.

[Armstead]

55. At 64 I have learned what a long-term disaster "Third Way" policies are

Seen the cycle too many times. So called "centrist" Dems sound good when campaigning, but when they get in...it's a whole different kettle of fish

[auntpurl]

59. I thought both Clinton and Obama were excellent presidents

And I look forward to Hillary continuing their legacy with progress of her own.

[Armstead]

66. Depends on what level you're talking about

With the perspective of history Clinton was a disaster. Life seemed happy, happy at the time but the temporrary "boom" was a like a cocaine fueled binge. Meanwhile he presided over policies that have undermined the middle class, further marginalized the poor, and gave Monopolistic Corporations and Immoral Wall St. banksters the power to take over the economy, siphon money from the productive sectors into their overstuffed pockets and almost crash the economy in 2008 and extort their repayment from us....That's all just for starters.... We like to Blame Bush, but Bush only finished the job Clinton started.


Obama is much better. If he could run for a third term I'd be happy to vote for him.....But his liberal side is his good side. Unfortunately he too has been too closely aligned with the wrong people and institutions. The TPP is bad, for example.....And, although he finally learned, he was willing to compromise too much with the GOP, who have managed to limit his actual accomplishments.

[KPN]

82. Well, you thought wrong then!

[Fast Walker 52]

39. Yes, the trend is good

I just hope our corrupt system can hold on until they get of age.

[BernieforPres2016]

68. That's the problem

This country is going to be fucked beyond all recognition by the time this current generation of 0.1%ers and the politicians they own are finished.

[lumberjack_jeff]

18. The party hasn't. The public has. n/t

[Onlooker]

19. It has. Bernie has moved the party left.

Now, it's up to Bernie and his supporters to lock in whatever gains they can. Bernie needs leverage in his negotiations with the Clinton campaign, and only his supporters can give him that.

[hatrack]

21. And it will stay there for at least a week, maybe even two.

.

[mvd]

23. True! I am encouraged. I never expected Bernie to do this well.

While tonight was disappointing because Bernie speaks to me in ways Clinton couldn't dream of, this has not happened in a long time. Liked Kucinich, but he went nowhere. Nader had very little support. Kennedy in 1980 didn't catch fire like Bernie. The youth will be more of the voters next time. The future looks bright.

[LiberalFighter]

22. The country has moved left.

And the Republicans are a fringe party in a different way. The crazy Republicans are becoming the majority of their party with those to the left trying to figure out where they belong.

[Warren DeMontague]

26. The party reflects the people. Or it will, eventually, if it wants to compete.

What is causing tectonic shifts in the views of the electorate is Millennials, basically, and mark my words- that shit has just started.

Ive said it before- this century truly belongs to those born in it. The rest of us are just here on an extended layover.

The creaky cranks will creak and crank, predictably (they dont vote! Get off my lawn!), but the wheel is turning.

[nadinbrzezinski]

121. Yup, and it will not be pleasant for the old cranks

[Warren DeMontague]

123. Change is hard.

[haikugal]

153. Yep...not hard for ALL the old cranks though. Many are on board, ready to rock and roll! nt

[Fast Walker 52]

42. what does less white have to do with being less liberal?

[KPN]

83. Bernie couldn't deliver????

Nonsense. Look beyond your nose for crying out loud. The reason he hasn't delivered yet is because you and folks like you won't let him. But in the long run, he will. Bernie has recharged a movement that began in Seattle in 2000 during the WTO convention. The movement has been growing in fits and starts since. It isn't going away so get used to it ... and get used to being in the minority if you don't climb on board.

[nadinbrzezinski]

122. Thanks for that, I never think of Seattle for some reason

in my mind it started in 2009, but I might have to do some reading and expand my horizons. Unlike the cranks I can do that.

[B Calm]

34. and then you go to GDP and see all the Conservative posts supporting Hillary

and say wtf.

[vintx]

37. The Dem party is now where republicans used to be.

They have left us and we need to stop being held hostage with cries of "SCOTUS!"

[KPN]

84. Spot on!

That's exactly what I've been saying. My three kids have convinced me that it's gotta be Bernie or Bust because the future of the world as we know it is at risk. Of course, the DINOs here at DU will poo-paw that by making trite comments about "chicken little" etc. That's to be expected.

The point my kids make is that social issues don't and won't matter 20 years from now if we don't deal with global warming NOW and/or we don't avoid the eruption of World War III NOW.

Millennials are right about that. I'm with them 100%!

Time for the revolution! Bernie or Bust!

[Fast Walker 52]

89. hmm, interesting thought

But I do have to say, there are more positives to Hillary just SCOTUS.

[haikugal]

155. Obama taught us how hollow that is...another myth used to control us.

[LondonReign2]

99. We've become the party of Bob Dole

We have a Democratic President that describes his own economic policies as "mainstream 1980's Republican" and admits that "in many ways, Nixon was more liberal than I am".

And Hillary is to the right of Obama.

[Vinca]

41. Only a temporary move left to pick up votes.

Hillary is now in a comfortable position to go back to her right-leaning roots. Dems duped again.

[Fast Walker 52]

43. if Hillary moved left in this campaign, I'm a bit afraid of what her moving back right means

The big question is do more liberal Dems take this bait and switch again, or gasp, vote third party?

[Vinca]

45. What do you think? One step forward, two steps back.

[eShirl]

46. Last time I felt this "meh" about a presidential election,

John Edwards had just imploded.

But at least there was still a candidate I could vote for, even though he wasn't left enough for my tastes.

This time, not so much.

le sigh.

[Nanjeanne]

47. The country has moved left. The Dem Party has moved their language left while

they move center right. And the media has misinformed at every turn. The Dems in power will continue their populist talk as they give us chained CPI, raise retirement and Medicare age, lip service to gun control as they and their friends get rich off of selling arms to other countries and outsourcing military jobs as they find another war to engage in. We will head more into low wage service jobs so the powerful can stash more money in tax havens and we will continue to slide lower on the chart for childhood poverty and infant mortality as the Congress and the new President hand more money to the insurance and pharmaceutical industry.

The media gave us George Bush and sold us the Iraq War. They have given us a choice between Trump and Clinton. Their power structure will stay intact. They did their job and don't give a damn if the country loses. Net neutrality? It's going to be on the goodbye list. Consolidation of media companies? You betcha.

Obama is opening up more drilling. He said after primary we get TPP. AND some of you think life will be just as great or even better with Hillary? Well good luck to us all.

I'm over 60. My heart goes out to that group of 18-29 who so strongly supported Bernie. They are the future and they lost their opportunity to make a real difference in their lives. I may not have been the over 65 white woman who dashed their dream personally, but I still say I'm Sorry. You deserved better.

[Robbins]

49. more

I am 42 year old disabled white guy on SSI,food stamps,and medicaid among other government assistance.clinton or trump it
doesn't matter.people on social safety net are going to be screwed.

Social security will eventully go bankrupt since clinton made clear she wouldn't left cap on those who pay into social security.

republicans have been waiting to gut the social safety net especily food stamps and medicaid.The clintons history shows they
would go along with it even if she can beat trump.

with more war where do you think money will come from to pay for it? gutting social safety net is where.

the working class will continue to be hurt by more trade deals.Clintons never saw a trade deal they didn't like.Unions will continue to
disappear since union jobs will with more trade deals and more corporate power.

Clinton has about as much legitimatce as bush did.all this voter fraud they did.

[Armstead]

58. Regrettably I agree with you

[noretreatnosurrender]

53. Just Donated $50

I want Bernie to continue to get our message out so that all the people who have dropped out of the Democratic Party will hear it and join us. This Political Revolution is just getting started. Donate what you can so we can reclaim our democracy from the special interests and their enablers.

Keep the momentum going!
Email48x48 Send an email

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Click the button to send an email, or copy and paste the text that will show up below into an email message.
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[Trust Buster]

57. We are a country with a two party system. Sanders' supporters discount the millions that vote

for Republicans just like they discount us for voting for Hillary. They just don't care about the political realities in this country.

[KPN]

86. Pot, meet kettle.

[LondonReign2]

100. Crazy Republicans and New Republicans

[CrowCityDem]

60. It's center-left vs far left. Some people call anything short of the extreme left "the right".

[KPN]

87. Haha.

Center left. That's a good one!!

Sadly, many Bernie supporters consider themselves center left. That's how different our world views are.

It isn't calling it "right" if its "right". If it look, acts and walks like a duck ....

[My Good Babushka]

63. We can't say silent on issues

This has to move beyond which personality is winning because the fight is going to be longer that any one election cycle.
I find that on the issues, democrats are being too silent. There are threads about the recent cable merger, and the TPP, that are languishing in indifference and silence. We have to start spelling out, to ourselves, what our ideas are.

[Armstead]

70. You are correct...I tried to stir up interest in the Cable Merger but crickets

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027691088

[workinclasszero]

64. You can't build a national movement

using young white males on reddit, DU, KOS etc.

You can't have a winning movement that lives and dies on the historically least likely to vote segment of the population.

You can't take control of the democratic party without having PoC on your side.

Bernie's tent was way to small and exclusive.

Better luck next time.

[Armstead]

69. Clinton did an excellent job at artificially separating the tent into different sections

We'll see how that affects her ability to bring back together the groups she helped to set against each other.

[My Good Babushka]

72. Yes, we've thoroughly sliced and diced the demographics into who supports whom

and that does nothing for our platform.

[workinclasszero]

74. You..the "revolutionaries" were the ones throwing bombs into the tent

It was a fail from the very beginning and 99% of you still don't understand why.

So you will keep failing which is a pity really because America needs to move left but the same mistakes keep being made, over and over again.

Bernies side was the exclusive one, that's easy to see.

[Armstead]

76. I'm a moderate liberal -- but in this climate that makes me "far left"

Please tell me what specifically about Sanders analysis of the present situation you disagree with.

Please tell me what goal you disagree with. Do you think that some form of public coverage (a la medicare) to provide universal and affordable healthcare is not a worthy goal?

Are you happy that a handful of Big Wall St. Banks have such an immense amount of the nation's wealth in their vaultsm, and the power to make or break the economy?

Does it make you feel all warm and fuzzy that a tiny handful of zillionaires at the top are making out like bandits at the public's expense? And that the class structure is ever widening, with most being pushed in a downward direction -- or remaining stagnant if they're lucky?

And please tell me what Bernie Sanders did to deserve the charges that he doesn't care about racism or POC.

[nadinbrzezinski]

124. For that matter they told actual POC that they do not care about either racism or POC

I shan't forget.

[forjusticethunders]

158. They don't want to understand because doing so

Means the affluent white "left" have to stop grandstanding and virtue signaling and get to work instead of blaming everything on conspiracy shit.

Marginalized people don't have fucking time for that shit.

[jfern]

127. Bernie wasn't the one attacking his opponent's supporters for their race and gender

Screw your divisive politics of hate.

[Kittycat]

140. Bernie made me a male under 30 & turned my sister white

Screw your narrative. A majority of Hillary's voters weren't black, nor a majority of over 30. She one the older crowd of 50+. Bernie won <40, and they split 40-50.

[djean111]

75. I am absolutely not moving to the right with the Democratic Party.

Reached my limit on how much warmongering Third Way corporate Wall Street toadying I can take. Done.

[LondonReign2]

101. 100% agree

Done

[demwing]

78. It has moved left

45% of the party are now fine with a Democratic Socialism nominee for President

Consider this:

In 2008, only 39% of Americans favored Gay Marriage.
In 2012, 47% of Americans favored Gay Marriage.
Today we have legal Gay Marriage, despite a Red Congress and SCOTUS

http://www.people-press.org/2012/04/25/more-support-for-gun-rights-gay-marriage-than-in-2008-or-2004/

Don't miss the forest because a few trees are in the way.

[djean111]

106. The Party is not the same as the voters.

The Party has not moved left, it has moved right. They figure that the voters will just dutifully vote for the D, no matter what.
When Debbie DINO can sneer for the camera, and say the super delegates are there to protect the Party from us grubby out-of-line grassroots - that, really, is all you need to know about the Party moving left. And Debbie has a say in EVERY race that needs support from the DNC. We see that in Florida. She would rather let the GOP run unopposed than support a liberal. She campaigns for GOP buddies, against "fellow" Dems.

The whole system is rotten.

[demwing]

107. Fair enough

but I think the voters - not the bosses - are the real party, just like the workers - not the bosses - are the real unions.

[djean111]

108. Yes, but the voters don't really get to tell the Party what to do, and the union leaders

make the deals with management. We have been told outright that Party members who have worked within the party for years of course have more say in who the candidates will be. The actual voters are presented with a pre-selected and narrow choice, much like the union members are presented with whatever their leaders agreed to with management. This is why we saw union leaders endorse Hillary, and rank and file get angry because they support Bernie.

I don't know what the answer is, but I do know that I cannot belong to a party that espouses the things Hillary stands for, like war and fracking and the Third Way and the TPP. Those are all Conservative things.

[Maedhros]

112. Do not underestimate the power of propaganda.

Democrats are just as vulnerable to it as Republicans are - just look at how ubiquitous the "lesser of two evils" rationale has become. That is propaganda directly from the Party, designed to keep us voting for economically-conservative policies.

[Mnpaul]

116. The voters are moving left and the party leadership is moving right

DWS can't seem to figure out where they lost everyone(along with the House and Senate). Maybe she is only concerned with her own self promotion. DWS appearing on Fox, is not doing the party any favors. She just sits there in Bachmann mode reading her script and ignoring the questions.

[Bayard]

79. So who's appointed next?

Who gets appointed next after 8 years for Hillary? Chelsea Clinton?

Yeah, for one brief shining moment, I thought my vote might matter. Silly me. Hillary will "win" because its her turn. Anyone who thinks The Powers That Be don't pull the strings for every presidential election are naive (Google, the Rothschild family). They let the population go thru their little voting charade so there is no overt revolution.

Expect to be in another war in the next few years. Its good for business. I think that's one of the main reasons Trump won't get it is that he pretty much says, let the rest of the world take care of themselves. He doesn't get a turn.

[haikugal]

156. War is our only job program for our young. It's bread and circuses for the USA...boy, we're

number one!!

[procon]

85. Oh, it is slowly moving left.

By incremental degrees instead of a revolution, and patiently convincing and reassuring skeptical voters. Its happening at a calm and steady pace, ushering the long time Democratic base voters into the leftward tilting party's changing framework that Bernie Sander's inspired. It won't happen overnight, but it takes time to build that all important solid foundation that is necessary to install a permanent change.

[KPN]

88. Ppsshaw!!! It has moved left!

40-45% of D Party voters support Bernie right now! That's huge!

This movement has only just begun. Bernie has already won by taking us all the way to the convention -- in force.

At this point, we should all be saying BERNIE OR BUST!

Time for a real revolution!

[w0nderer]

91. K & R for visibility of this N/T

[Donald Ian Rankin]

97. It has moved left, just not as far as Sanders.

On balance, Clinton will be one of the most liberal candidates ever (only McGovern and arguably Obama are further left).

It's just that left-wingers tend to ignore and take for granted liberal positions that would have been unthinkable a few decades ago, and focus on the issues where the party hasn't moved left.

[LondonReign2]

103. LMAO. Yes, the Democratic President that described his own

economic policies as "mainstream 1980's Republican" and said that "in many ways Nixon was more liberal than I am" is one of our most liberal candidates ever.

You guys could give Rush Limbaugh a run for his money.

[intheflow]

104. I think we would have if the media hadn't deemed Sanders a fringe candidate for the fir 6 months

of his campaign. If they had given him the same coverage they gave Trump, and ignored Trump like they did Sanders, this would be a very different election cycle.

[Nanjeanne]

117. Democrats and people in general have moved left. Party and politicians and those who want to

consolidate their power - no way. The Party is hanging onto their money and their chance to become lobbyists a la Howard Dean - they aren't giving it up easily - as this primary so ably demonstrated.

[basselope]

137. The Dem party is too scared to win.

They will be learning a very hard lesson in 2016.

They will have another shot in 2020.

[CanadaexPat]

145. The Left in the Democratic Party found a voice

and learned it was bigger and more effective than anyone thought. This is the start, not the end.

[Orsino]

146. How many Sanders delegates will be helping to write the platform?

That's not nothing. We're still here and we will help this party to function more in accordance with reality.

[Fast Walker 52]

147. this is true-- I don't discount the enormous influence Bernie has had and I hope continues to have

on this election

[w4rma]

151. Assuming that the Anybody-but-Trump Republicans don't take over the Democratic Party

The Democratic Party HAS moved left. Hillary's front runner status is only based on her name recognition and unreciprocated loyalty from African-Americans.

Hillary's voters tend to live in old folks homes and more progressive voters, activists and Democratic Party insiders will replace them.

[haikugal]

157. Her status a front runner is complete AstroTurf...