Climate change. So here are going to be the choices...

[nadinbrzezinski]

Continue doing what we are doing, which people Like James Hansen say is far from enough, or do even less...

Suffice it to say, the one with the most toys wins...and then the species goes away

The Clinton plan is very familiar to me. It is essentially the CA plan under AB32. When that was implemented we had yet to reach 350 PPM. These days we are at over 400 PPM and we are at 2 degrees centigrade. We are already having the leading edge of climate change driven storms and tornados in the Spring. We also have flooding in Miami, I will argue San Diego is moving in that direction. Ah, get a boat I suppose.

I will not bother with other places ourside US borders...Americans give two shits about that.

When AB32 was passed it was seen as pie in the sky. Some of CA utilities are near or expected to reach 30 percent reduction and meeting renewable portfolio standards (RPS)...so that is proof in the pudding...they are not out of reach. Yes we cover this shit. Some is being met by building plants in Baja in tje Sierra Juarez. If the Mexican government ever nationalizes the energy sector, San Diego Gas and Electric will have to shit three plants to replace that major project, and Mexico did such in 1938, good times.

So the choices are bad ones and worst ones. This is quite inspiring, not.

Try to keep it civil kids, but we really need a bold vision. And this is not bold.

[Lizzie Poppet]

1. Climate change is one reason I "primaried" our incumbent Governor here in Oregon.

Okay, the other is that she endorsed Hillary, but I may have done so anyway. Not that Kate Brown is off-target on climate change...but Julian Bell has made it his top priority. I consider that appropriate for a gubernatorial candidate, as that office has considerable influence on climate-change-related matters here.

Highly unlikely Brown won't get the nomination, unfortunately.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Americans are slow to act...this is a historic fact

The problem is that when we decide to act it will be too late.

[Lizzie Poppet]

4. Yes, and it's a particularly dangerous trait in this matter.

Current delta was caused by a whole raft of factors, many of which are long-term in nature...slow-acting influences that take considerable time to produce change in any direction. Put (far too) simply, changes in causal factors behind climate change don't actually produce that change very quickly at all. Thus reversing changes is just as time-consuming. If we woke up tomorrow with massive changes to those causal factors in place, they'd not show any real effect for a decade or so (depending on the specific change).

The longer we wait, the further in the future any benefit from what we do will come. And Americans, as a people, really, really suck at delayed gratification...

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. I know

[riderinthestorm]

3. I've come to believe Hillary Clinton supporters are in deep denial on climate change.

Or they're incredibly selfish and simply do not give a shit about the rest of us.

We need aggressive global leadership on the issue from Day 1 of the next presidency. It's been depressing to see DUers simply ignoring the realities.

In any other context than Hillary-worship, we'd be united in the face of the obvious evidence that humanity is in deep trouble and we must demand more from our leaders.

Her tepid incrementalism dooms us as surely as climate change deniers. Its the final hour and its so distressing to watch the ignorance.

I've been active in my local community's environmental green activist group (mostly anti-fracking, with notable efforts on supporting sustainable ag, groundwater protection etc) and will continue to fight til the end to protect this green earth.

Thanks for this important OP.

BIG K&R!

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. It is not just HRC supporters

It is Americans in general. We have the end of a gaming convention today. Yeah, yeah we all need a break. But I will sit down and do a break down of this plan in a detailed article. Media in tne US will finally mention climate change and connect it to the storms I mentioned that happened yesterday when it is way too late. In contrast, I have been in Mexico City when we have seen weird weather, and the equivalent of the head of NOAA is on my tv explaining it and how it is connected to it. The difference is in the level of lack of denial.

The other day I was screaming at my TV. Local fox weather bunny came this close to the words climate change crossing her lips. "You can do it!!!" Oh so close. But there is money to still be made, atmosphere be damned.

As to the gaming, we have been posting some photos of some incredibly painted miniatures. And no, not taking the pro camera...not baby seating that when I am also baby seating my toys.

[riderinthestorm]

17. Well this board sure seems to be a microcosm of Americans obviously

I see this thread has been studiously ignored...



Futile pm kick

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. I know. I had one give me her plan

Which of course it is revolutionary...I took it apart in two seconds. Doing the same is far from revolutionary. Hell, going over the EPA rules the court recently said nyet to. Damn they are very very moderate. And we cannot even get that! I am glad I never had kids

[cantbeserious]

7. Polling Shows - HRC Supporters Are Generally Older And More Affluent - The I Have Mine Mentality

eom

[procon]

9. I must be the lone exception.

(sigh) I always miss out on this affluent stuff, so where do I go to "get mine"?

[nadinbrzezinski]

11. While that is true

Americans in general are in a chronic state of it cannot be that bad. In the meantime, just downloaded a really bad boy on energy analysis.

[procon]

8. I remember when President Jimmy Carter installed solar panels on the WH roof.

Back in 1979, he was a true visionary, and he took on the same idiotic Republicans and their paymasters in the fossil fuel extraction industries over clean energy and green issues to change our dependency on Big Oil.

At the dedication ceremony, Carter predicted: "In the year 2000 this solar water heater behind me, which is being dedicated today, will still be here supplying cheap, efficient energy…. A generation from now, this solar heater can either be a curiosity, a museum piece, an example of a road not taken or it can be just a small part of one of the greatest and most exciting adventures ever undertaken by the American people."

Then Reagan came in and not only tore out the solar panels, but gutted the research and development budgets for renewable energy projects. We still haven't advanced enough to make up for that shortsighted policy decision, and look where we are now.

[flamingdem]

10. I did not know that

Thanks for posting about this, though it's very depressing!

[Ghost Dog]

12. Knowingly taking measures against measures to combat causes of climate change

should be classified as crimes against humanity.

[procon]

15. If we'd expanded on Carter's vision of clean energy 35 years ago,

just imagine what the country -- the world -- would look like today.

[Downwinder]

13. How much does sea level need to rise

to connect the Salton sea?

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. Not that much, but that be in the Sea of Cortez

It should not happen in my lifetime, but all loops are accelerating.

[Go Vols]

14. :/