I am 100 Percent Bernie or Bust......

[Armstead]

Last edited Tue May 3, 2016, 02:27 PM - Edit history (1)

through the last primary and/or the convention. Or if and when Bernie concedes, if he doesn't win.

I hope all those who want to vote for Bernie should do so in the upcoming primaries, because this is a competition until it isn't.

Don't give up the ship.

(Obligatory disclaimer: This post expires on the day Bernie concedes the nomination.)

[ProudToBeLiberal]

1. I understand your pain. Don't worry. Time will heal the hurt. Keep fighting. Nt

[JonLeibowitz]

4. Not for dead Palestinians it won't. Innocent ones too.

Hillarys AIPAC speech was vile.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

6. What about the 33 thousand people who die from gun violence each year?

With your logic, the blood of the dead from gun violence is on Senator Sanders. Wow, I cannot believe you are putting those deaths on Senator Sanders shoulders. Shame on you.

[JonLeibowitz]

9. Guns are legal in the USA. People who defend that right are called patriots.

Those who stand with state sanctioned murder of innocents are not.

Btw, I also consider those who work to overturn the 2nd amendment to be patriots. They are working within the constitutional framework of govt.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

10. Do you consider me a patriot? Nt

[JonLeibowitz]

12. That depends on whether you agree all constitutional rights deserve defending

A patriot would defend all rights from attack simply because they defend the constitution. It is different to try to seek to change the constitution. That has my wholehearted support.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

13. Thank you for the vote of confidence. You are a good dude. Nt

[cherokeeprogressive]

37. I'm going to bookmark this, and ask you about it when it doesn't change during a Hillary admin.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

45. Are you serious? How is this fair? nt

[NuclearDem]

58. Some dead children are more equal than others.

Palestinian children die, you're a war criminal. First graders in Connecticut die, you're a patriot.

[Vattel]

59. Bernie doesn't defend killing those first graders.

Hillary does defend killing the Palestinian children.

[NuclearDem]

65. ...

[Vattel]

68. Like I said . . .

[eridani]

64. Clinton is fine with pedling Remington products to Saudi Arabia

But the, only Americans count. Not to mention cluster bombs.

[Urchin]

71. Two-thirds of gun deaths are suicides.

Two-thirds of gun deaths are suicides.

And thanks to income inequality, suicide is on the rise as people find their jobs shipped overseas or automated out of existence.

Fix income inequality if you want to reduce gun deaths.

You'll improve most everything, from race relations to who's allowed to marry who, if you fix income inequality and reduce the frustration people feel because they can't make ends me, which makes people racist and nasty and even violent to each other and even to themselves.

Fat and happy people don't pick on people who are different from themselves.

[Armstead]

8. In the long run, time heals all wounds because we'll all be dead

In the meantime, gonna keep on pushing

[riderinthestorm]

23. Climate change can't wait for incrementalism. There's no more time

I don't understand your utter lack of concern.

My pain and empathy for those already dying in increasingly severe weather and environmental events, and those millions more who will start dying on an accelerated time frame under Hillary’s slow walk, is real.

I hurt for my children. I hurt for humanity.

Your callous platitudes are noted.

[JonLeibowitz]

2. June 7 CA Independent millennial here. I always vote.

go Bernie!

I will be telling all the students at my grad school to vote Bernie. Well, the 25% who are US citizens anyway

[BootinUp]

3. This is a replay of the Black Knight Scene in The Holy Grail. lol.

[Armstead]

5. But you have to admire his persistance

[basselope]

7. I'm Bernie or 3rd party.

[DeadLetterOffice]

15. Jury results, courtesty of #5

On Sun May 1, 2016, 09:19 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

I'm Bernie or 3rd party.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1251&pid=1878099

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Members of DU are expected to support Democratic candidates, it's in the terms of service. Please vote to hide, thanks.


You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sun May 1, 2016, 09:24 PM, and the Jury voted 3-4 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Until the convention, and until we have an official Democratic party candidate, I'm adopting a policy of magnanimity on these posts. Healing, and party unity, doesn't happen overnight.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: It's probably against the TOS, but there is such a thing as overreaction, and this is overreaction.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Until we have an actual nominee, this post is ok at DU as far as I'm concerned.
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: No explanation given
Juror #7 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given

[ronnykmarshall]

17. What a shocker from the "fair" jury.

[artislife]

51. Skinner and the DNC haven't called it yet....

breathe out.

[Mosby]

19. the poster stated that if BS doesn't win

They will vote for a third party candidate.

This is a clear ToS violation that you and the poster are ignoring, having a nominee has nothing to do with it.

[Armstead]

22. No the OP did not say that. Please show me where I referred to third party

sanders has already said he will not do that.

[Mosby]

25. basselope said "im bernie or third party"

That's a pretty simple declarative statement.

If Bernie does not get the dem nomination they will not vote for Clinton. ToS violation:


Winning elections is important — therefore, advocating in favor of Republican nominees or in favor of third-party spoiler candidates that could split the vote and throw an election to our conservative opponents is never permitted on Democratic Underground

It says, NEVER PERMITTED, the poster is not expressing ambivalence, they are saying they WILL NOT VOTE for the dem if it's not bernie.

[Armstead]

27. I thought you were referring to the OP...Sorry

[basselope]

44. Say what I will do an ADVOCATING are two different things.

I do not vote for Republicans, so I will NEVER vote for Clinton.

[840high]

43. Thank you jury.

[aikoaiko]

61. Community standards at work:"; just as Skinner intended

Although not the specific outcome he would have wanted likely.

[Mosby]

73. not according to Skinner

Star Member Skinner (61,558 posts)

1. Advocating third party will definitely get people banned during the general election.

Strictly speaking, yes, the TOS states that members are never permitted to advocate third party. "Never" means never and does not have an exception for primary season. But when faced with the prospect of banning half of my members, most of whom are going to regain their sanity once the primary is over and will undoubtedly do the right thing, we decided to give people the benefit of the doubt and let them stick around.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1259&pid=10208

Like he said, people just don't understand the ToS or just don't care.

[aikoaiko]

74. Community standards override anything written.

It's not a bug, it's a feature; and it the way it's always been with the jury system.

[Mosby]

78. Community Standards are a subset of the Terms of Service

So you are wrong.

See for yourself:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=termsofservice

and the Community Standard paragraph says:

"Those who exhibit a pattern of willful disregard for the Community Standards risk being in violation of our Terms of Service, and could have their posting privileges revoked."

[aikoaiko]

81. But you need jury hides to show the pattern of disregard of community standards.

If the jury doesn't hide a post, then that's their statement on acceptable community standards.

[demwing]

80. Actually, that's NOT what the TOS says

Referring to 3rd party candidates:

In Democratic primaries, members may support whomever they choose. But when general election season begins, DU members must support Democratic nominees (EXCEPT in rare cases where a non-Democrat is most likely to defeat the conservative alternative)

The way the TOS is written, Bernie would qualify for that rare case exception.

[Herman4747]

72. Dr. Jill Stein of the Green Party may merit your consideration in Nov. nt

[NurseJackie]

11. That's fine ... well take it from here.

[Armstead]

14. And you'll be welcome to that nasty debacle

That neither implies that she will lose in the GE nor that I won't put a clothespin ion my nose and toss her my tiny vote her way in November if necessary...But it's going to be an ugly, ugly mess and I'm going to tune out those months of mud

[NurseJackie]

24. You'll be fine. I have every confidence in you.

Stop buying into the vicious cycle of the hair on fire end of the world plague volcano earthquake locusts zombie apocalypse hysteria.

[Armstead]

26. Naw to be honest what I am most worried about is 8 years of gridlock and stagnation

and continued steady decline of the things I believe in.

But we've been through 35 years of that already so it's not like Zombie Apocalypse.

[cherokeeprogressive]

39. Oh I see her as a one-termer.

And after three years of gridlock, I'll gladly see her primaried. The millennials are waking up and after three years of the status quo they're going to realize they passed up an opportunity to make the nation and the world a better place. Hillary is only in it for the prestige and the history... Bernie wants to change the world.

One. Term. And fighting for her political life after three years maybe less.

[baldguy]

16. Then you support Donald Trump as President.

And if you try to claim to be a progressive or a Democrat, you're lying.

[Armstead]

18. And if you didn't notice that I said until the convention you're not very observant

[Luminous Animal]

35. If you are worried about Hillary losing to Trump, then you should vote for Bernie.

[artislife]

52. No, because if you voted for Kerry and he lost

that doesn't make you a Bush supporter. You are still a Kerry supporter.

Voting for someone is a supporter
not voting for someone is someone who isn't a supporter of said candidate.

My gosh...

[ancianita]

21. Bernie says it's going to be a contested convention. May progressives prove their mettle.

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[tonyt53]

28. Uh, that guy in the picture, was a Democrat

Not a pregressive. Not a socialist or an independent. He was a Democrat and hard core one at that.

[Armstead]

30. Which used to mean liberal/progressive

And he did institute socialist style programs, even though not called that.

[ancianita]

49. The post is called cheerleading. For the FDR wing of the Democratic Party. Times are

different; hard core then isn't hard core now.

Bernie votes more with Democrats than some of the long-term party Democrats.

And the purpose of your "correction" is...?

[pinebox]

66. FDR wasn't a progressive? More Hillary fan history rewriting!

Are you fucking joking?

Holy shit you need to learn some history http://www.discoverthenetworks.org/viewSubCategory.asp?id=1228

[vintx]

79. It's astounding, isn't it?

Thanks for doing your part to #correcttherecord

[tonyt53]

29. Then for you, bust it shall be.

The attitude and position you and others have taken, is exactly how the tea party thinks. Your way or no way, even if it means losing.

[Armstead]

31. Not really....I know Tea Party is a handy meme

But the social and economic goals are totally the opposite.

Do you realize that your attitude also sounds like "my way or the highway"?

[tonyt53]

33. Not even remotely

You are living in an alternate universe if you think that. Yes, your thinking is exactly like that of the tea party.

[Armstead]

36. Are you gonna charge me $100 an hour for that brilliant psychoanalysis?

You know not one damn thing about my inner psyche.

Except Sanders supporter....Strong Opinions....Therefore just like Tea Party.

[cherokeeprogressive]

40. "exactly like that of the tea party." You DO know that the TEA in tea party means

TAXED ENOUGH ALREADY, right? Are you stupid? YOU'RE the group screaming about Bernie and how he's going to raise taxes a few pennies on the dollar. WHO'S exactly like the tea party again?

YOU.

[tonyt53]

56. When those taxes hit those least able to pay them, hell yes I'm going to complain

Most economists, unless they are lined up with Bernie, have said that taxes will have to go up for everyone. As a real Democrat, I find that disgusting. A few pennies on the dollar might not seem like much to you and other Bernie-ites, but to someone living in poverty, that is a life crusher. That is daycare so they can have a job. That is gas in their car. That is a new pair of shoes for their kids. Oh, and by the way, my wife and I pay our taxes and never complain.

[Cobalt Violet]

62. you are wrong and don't make a shred of sense.

Not supporting Hillary doesn't make one a tea partier. I don't see how that could be logical to even a member of the double digit IQ club.

[artislife]

53. They have actually ended up winning

because they had their convictions and voted the way the wanted to vote for something.

I may not agree with their platform, but in the end, they are winning.

[amborin]

32. so are we! so are millions! that seemed to be everyone's criterion today at the CA caucus:

choosing not only strongly pro-Bernie delegates, but pro-Bernie delegates who are BernieOrBust

[Luminous Animal]

34. Me too.

[kgnu_fan]

38. Never Give Up!

[La Lioness Priyanka]

41. to be fair your position is not a bernie or bust position

no one has argued against your position (that you should vote for the candidate you want in the primaries)

[ncovington89]

42. Me Too, Here's Why

The democrats need to learn a hard lesson if they don't give us Bernie. For too long democrats have allowed their party to be one that is basically just like the Republican party, except the Dems go out of their way to throw the people a bag of peanuts every now and again. We need to punish the Dems severely or this will just continue ad infinitum. It's not so much about throwing a tantrum as it is about taking a stand for party principles.

I don't see any argument to be had in Hillary being the lesser of two evils. For one thing, Hillary is pretty evil, to the point where it isn't clear that you could elect a worse person than her. She's lied repeatedly to the public and to officials about her use of a private server, for example. It's been well documented on CNN and MSNBC. She is probably engaged in massive voter fraud, based on the chronic mismatch between the exit polls and "official result" that is chronically and unilaterally in her favor.

[840high]

46. .that^

[blue neen]

48. "We need to punish the Dems severely".

Who is "We"? How are you going to punish us?

What does this line mean?: "The democrats need to learn a hard lesson if they don't give us Bernie".

GIVE you Bernie?

[MFM008]

60. sounds like blackmail

[ancianita]

77. Don't put words in Berners' mouths. Bernie's fought for every dollar and shred of success.

This isn't about "we" vs. Hillary voters. This is about the party itself maintaining a shred of credibility that it's not sold out to corporate governance. So far, it has, and Hillary is their candidate.

The hard lesson will be about representation. If Bernie, then Hillary, has to lose for the whole country to learn to vote for candidates who have a working class vision for this country -- though I doubt they're capable of learning, since they haven't since Reagan -- then a hard lesson is what they will get.

IF Hillary wins in the contested convention -- and I hope she doesn't -- let her 'hard lesson,' show itself as a progressive president. She's given only lip service about a progressive presidency so far.

[blue neen]

82. Those are direct quotes from post #42.

Direct quotes. If you will read the post, you will see that is true. I didn't put words in anyone's mouth.

If you have a problem with those words, perhaps you should let that poster know.

[ancianita]

83. Fine. Sorry if this was misdirected.

[MisterP]

50. heck, even Cruz never handed a whole country over to the cartels

and plantation-owning murderers, and he's basically a mass of spiders in a human skin

[Kalidurga]

54. a mass of spiders in a human skin

That is the best description for that walking turd I have ever seen.

[artislife]

55. This is such a bust of a post.

[dana_b]

76. K&R this post!!

I will not vote for the lesser of two evils. They are both pretty damn evil.

[PowerToThePeople]

57. Me too.

After that I am 100% Bernie, or bust.

[Betty Karlson]

63. This ship will still sail after the convention. Bernie isn't the only one keeping it afloat.

This year's primaries were only a little taste of things to come. The status quo is done for, even if DINO-Debbie and the other Hill-bullies do everything in their power to preserve their precious privileges.

[Armstead]

70. Hope so

[Godhumor]

67. I supported Clinton in 2008 till almost the very end

Absolutely nothing wrong with doing so.

Good luck, mate.

[Pastiche423]

69. Never gonna give up on Bernie!

[NCTraveler]

75. Fuck the Bernie or Bust crowd.

It's unfortunate that gets close to a hide around here. With Weavers last disgusting ploy to separate idiots from their money, it's time to start calling the Paul loving Audit the Fed in Chief Sanders what he is. A very shady career politician completely under the control of Weaver.

Fuck Bernie or Bust.

[ancianita]

84. Fuck the Hillary-or-Bust crowd. For key reasons.

1. Hillary is a PAC baby. And, NBCUniversal, News Corporation, Turner Broadcasting and Thomson Reuters are among more than a dozen media organizations that have made charitable contributions to the Clinton Foundation

2. As some DU'er recently asked, did she ever get that flag burning bill passed? No. All she got passed were bills to pay for rehabbing Schumer's New York after 9/11.

Hillary has "introduced," "fought for," "worked with" and "co-sponsored" legislation. But what she has passed? Three for New York after 9/11 and one minor bill. That's IT.

3. Policy depth? Hillary's foreign policy is lauded by Dick Cheney and Henry Kissinger, genocidal killers. As other DU'ers noted here before her candidacy, even, Hillary is a reliable vote for most wars and will argue for most regime changes, none of which have worked out.

Other Du’ers have pointedly argued that we all know Hillary oversaw arms sales to countries that contributed to the Clinton Foundation -- Saudi Arabia, Oman, Kuwait, UAE, Qatar and Algeria -- to all our very best allies.

Hillary has voted with Republicans against a single purpose ban on the use of Cluster Munitions in civilian areas, WMD's which most of the world knows hurt civilian women and children long after the bombs are dropped.

4. Where does climate change stand in Hillary’s list of to-do’s? As other DU’ers have pointed out, Hillary wants to lead the world fight against climate change by bringing greenhouse gas emissions to 30 percent below what they were in 2005. Now she “misspeaks” about opposing coal. The whiplash of this campaign. Wow.

5. It’s clear to all that Hillary will sign the Trans-Pacific Partnership to keep that New World Order logroll going.

6. Hillary offers milquetoast changes domestically. Others here point out how she never says how she will pay for ANY of that, since tax increases on the rich will not be part of any of her program funding.

7. Not least, to me, is that Hillary has not done black people any good, and she will likely not beat a Republican if 90% of black voters don't come out for her.

Foreign policy? “Gets Things Done”? People need to recognize. Hillary's lousy record of "getting things done" speaks for itself. Her poor foreign policy decisions speak for themselves. She can have half her cabinet be women. Let's see what they do.

In the meantime, this Berner sees that Hillary Clinton, like her hubz, is New World Order, bought-and-paid-for Republican lite. The PR misnomer, Bernie-or bust, is what will happen to this country with or without a Hillary win.