2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumI smell a major conspiracy....
There's no doubt that Bernie probably smelled one a long time ago...
CompanyFirstSergeant
(1,558 posts)...an entire post is a photo...
...and I cannot see the photo on this computer.
VulgarPoet
(2,872 posts)tonyt53
(5,737 posts)You and Bernie should be tested for it. Bernie is behind by about 3 million votes. You just can't accept that.
Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)How about that.
J_J_
(1,213 posts)n/t
brush
(53,782 posts)floppyboo
(2,461 posts)But they didn't because it is the Democratic Party Primary, and many are independents, and looky--loos. But with those #'s and the # of individual campaign contributions, I think you have to admit, that is a better representation of where America as a whole stands. All the match-up polls support this claim as well.
How this will play out in a general election when all independents will have a say in November is certainly a nail biter!
While there are some RW independents out there, there are also a bunch that want a small d democrat, and Hillary ain't it.
But I repeat what has been said over and over. I'm not giving up though!
Atman
(31,464 posts)It's sad, but true. Presidential elections are a sham..."they" will install the person they want to install. We get the bread and circuses to keep us amused. The powers that be will no let an ass-clown like Trump get his hands on the red button. But Hillary is perfectly acceptable. She's one of them, and she'll keep the controversy going for their "news" teams to report on, while America wages for-profit wars around the globe.
It's what we do.
brush
(53,782 posts)What do you think of this: IMO Obama tried to keep us out of more wars. He resisted going into Libya and Syria for the most part so far.
The MIC is very powerful though, let's see if he can resist a full-on Syria involvement in his time left in office.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)Sheepshank
(12,504 posts)It's a curious thing.
Seems like these rally are more like concerts and pull in people who lack the motivation to actually do anything. The privileged and entitled are used to having everything done for them. They lack the will and desire to actually do anything other than look like a participant in an event. Too many keyboard warriors in this world and way too many non voters.
PS...I guess Hillary's listening tour doesn't seem so stupid to the BS crowd after all?
PPS...is there any chance that some walked away from the rally and decided not to vote simply because of the messaging? Wouldn't that be a kick in the shorts. Maybe we should just go with the unmotivated voter angle.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Ever
firebrand80
(2,760 posts)Or incredibly stupid
Either way, I'm hanging out here for my afternoon lolz
beachbumbob
(9,263 posts)The rules....
Baobab
(4,667 posts)You Hillarians have all the angles figured out, don't you?
Are you proud of yourselves?
Still waging a global war on public education, too, I see.
It started way back in 1995
Trajan
(19,089 posts)The rallies are PACKED with citizens of every age group ...
I'm nearly sixty, and what I can say definitively - you are full of shit ....
dana_b
(11,546 posts)and 60(x2), 61 (x2) , 67, 90, 91, 58 (x2), 55, 62 and 68
Those are all the ages of people very close to me that are voting for Bernie. Anecdotal but it's much more widespread than the poster would like to admit. It's difficult to win when you're fighting the entire establishment of a party and the very hackable voting machines.
GreatGazoo
(3,937 posts)how convenient
Response to Playinghardball (Original post)
NCTraveler This message was self-deleted by its author.
RandySF
(58,884 posts)Does not make up 100% of the electorate.
scscholar
(2,902 posts)can't fill a room, it certainly looks suspicious.
RandySF
(58,884 posts)She spent her money on voter contact, which doesn't attract media attention.
KansDem
(28,498 posts)This organization compared internet searches with media reports. Bernie had thrice the internet searches than Hillary, yet she scored almost three times the media reports.
Clinton: Internet searches, 9,235,231 Media reports, 87,737
Sanders: Internet searches, 21,536,032 Media reports, 29,525
Clinton receives a high amount of coverage, despite no dramatic changes in polls and lower search interest.
Candidates like Rand Paul also appear to be locked out of the mainstream press. Paul isnt the most popular candidate, but if the average held hed have been in twice as many stories. Rubio, despite being 36% more popular than Paul was 403% more likely to be covered by the news
http://decisiondata.org/news/political-media-blackouts-president-2016/
NuclearDem
(16,184 posts)It's twuuuuuuu
BootinUp
(47,156 posts)The only real path to increasing the power of Bernie's supporters and others who are in similar circumstances is to build a stronger coalition, ultimately enhancing the Democratic Party. By letting this turn this into a second rate conspiracy yarn, he will be making that much less likely to materialize.
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)We are supposed to believe huge crowds, and huge donations by millions of people, don't translate into voters. They did for Obama, they do for Trump, bur somehow they don't for Bernie. That idea is bullshit and people are blind.
fun n serious
(4,451 posts)This is NOT. Clinton has a large amount of support in 2008 as she does now.
onenote
(42,704 posts)He has received mostly smaller donations, from 2.4 million people. He has received almost 9 million votes.
And Trump has only received around $12 million in contributions from a relatively small number of individuals. (Compared to over $200 million that Clinton and Sanders have each raised)
You shouldn't call bullshit when your own claims are based on bullshit.
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)And you probably knew I meant that.
onenote
(42,704 posts)And getting contributions from 2.4 million while getting 9 million votes (with, obviously, the number of votes will rise as the primaries continue) isn't much evidence of some conspiracy.
Also, care to clarify what you meant about Trump? Do you think his $12 million came from millions of donors?
Punkingal
(9,522 posts)I was talking about the crowds who show up to see the asshole.
onenote
(42,704 posts)And only around 1 million more than Sanders. Another conspiracy?
Baobab
(4,667 posts)I suspect the real fear she has is that the american people will realize she's been working against us on health care - behind our backs using trade deals for 20 years!
BootinUp
(47,156 posts)it would be clear. And early June BEFORE the convention, she conceded the race. She also pointed out the factors that made it worth waiting for that brief period of time. This is quite different than what Bernie is saying.
Baobab
(4,667 posts)Hillary's whole health care plan was a smoke screen and a diversion , to help us be bamboozled out of health care affordability and JOBS, potentially millions of high paid middle class jobs- that started 20 years ago,
And the trickery is still going on. please, read it. Below and to the right, after the two charts.
brooklynite
(94,585 posts)Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)Squinch
(50,950 posts)rock
(13,218 posts)Number of people attending a rally NOT = number of people voting for cadidate
Some are just gawkers. That's just the way it is.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Me: One hundred thousand showed up to the game and they lost. How does that work?
Someone smarter than me: Because wins and losses are actually determined by something other than crowd size.
Me: What!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Are you fucking telling me that crowd size doesn't have anything to do with the scoreboard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I smell a conspiracy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Someone smarter than me: Go change your drawers, that smell will subside.
Maru Kitteh
(28,340 posts)Congratulations.
Beacool
(30,249 posts)I'll sic Albert on you.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Go Gators!!!!!
Warrington College of Business Grad
Beacool
(30,249 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)I knew there was something special about you outside of your obvious intelligence, sharp wit, and charm.
Beacool
(30,249 posts)StevieM
(10,500 posts)Beacool
(30,249 posts)uponit7771
(90,346 posts)oasis
(49,388 posts)hrmjustin
(71,265 posts)This encapsulates the desperation we have seen too often on DU and it has only increased recently.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)have lives and don't have time to go to political rallies but make sure we have time to vote?
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)... that Bernie's Facebook group was taken down by Hillary's campaign.
NurseJackie
(42,862 posts)littlebit
(1,728 posts)attended several Sanders rallies and none of them bothered to show up and vote. Both of my parents, all three of my brothers, and myself have never attended a rally and we all voted for Clinton. See how that works? Just because large crowds show up doesn't mean anything.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)littlebit
(1,728 posts)It wasn't because they couldn't get to the polls. TX has early voting for two weeks. I guess they had better things to do.
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)Thanks for the reply!
Beacool
(30,249 posts)Large crowds don't necessarily translate into votes.
Jitter65
(3,089 posts)I will give another example along those lines. In 2008 my late wife and I went to two Clinton rallies in South Carolina. We didn't vote in the SC primary because we lived in NC.
fun n serious
(4,451 posts)have seen this time and time again in elections be it Presidential or otherwise. You underestimate the power of people who do not attend rallies.
The Second Stone
(2,900 posts)for the Sanders campaign, committing a felony of unauthorized access to the private information of thousands of people.
J_J_
(1,213 posts)I know the list is long, but the absurd excuses the Hillary camp has come up with for why she has no visible popular support, loses by much more when there is a caucus and votes are seen by real people, or the 17% increase in MA where votes were hand counted...
It is so freaking obvious they are stealing it for her, and she sucks so bad she will lose to Trump.
We are screwed.
mooseprime
(474 posts)can hardly hold a candle to "resistance is futile."
i say as a term of getting the government contract, they have to print "love and kindness(TM)" right on the cluster bombs.
La Lioness Priyanka
(53,866 posts)LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)In the NYC area consisting of 17 congressional districts 788,312 voted for Clinton and 464,324 voted for Sanders. Out of those 464,324 Sanders voters only 27,000 showed up at the rally. Why weren't the rest of them there?
mooseprime
(474 posts)when a little phone tree involving the DNC and state democratic parties will take care of it nicely.
every totalitarian group ridicules discussion of unfair elections. it's how they roll.
Tarc
(10,476 posts)It's not rocket science...
lunamagica
(9,967 posts)How is it possible that Romney didn't win by a landslide with these crowds in Oho?
When I saw those Romney crowds, I laughed. By the I knew crowds were meaningless. I learned my lesson the hard way with John Kerry.
(For some I can't post this picture here, but you can see it at the link)
http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/democratic-presidential-candidate-john-kerry-is-joined-by-musician-picture-id51598242
Look at those crowds for Kerry! I myself went to one of his rallies...so exciting! I knew he was going to win, I just knew it! How could he not, when he can attract such huge crowds! And yet...
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)270,000 people voted in Manhattan alone.
The saddest thing about these boneheaded conspiracies is their complete misunderstanding of scale. We need math education and badly. Filling a 30,000 seat arena is massive, but it's a drop in the bucket when 300,000 vote. Sandersites were excited about 3,000 people coming out to see Bernie at an event in Philadelphia. 3,000!
300,000 people voted in Philadelphia alone.
Godhumor
(6,437 posts)Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)but it certainly highlights a major difference between the level of devotion & enthusiasm of Bernie supporters vs HRC supporters. The crowds at HRC's AstroTurf events exhibit all of the enthusiasm one might expect at a colonoscopy.
So for me it boils down to 2 candidates that millions of Amercans dislike squaring off in November. Trump's followers are highly motivated to vote for Trump. HRC's supporters strike me as kinda "meh" , although several of her followers have tried to make the case that she'll win because people will come out to vote AGAINST Trump. Now I don't have any hard data at hand, but I've heard numerous pundits over the years say that it is damn near impossible to win a race by getting people to vote AGAINST someone rather than FOR someone. And FWIW, there are plenty of Republicans and Independents who will vote AGAINST Hillary, so I don't see the "anti-Trump" vote tipping the scales when you account for the "anti-Hillary" vote.
It will be close, but in the end, Wall Street wins either way if it is in fact Trump vs HRC. Economic justice will get placed on the back burner even if HRC wins, and we'll have to settle for whatever crumbs she decides to toss our way to give the appearance that she gives a rat's ass about anyone NOT in the 1%.
qdouble
(891 posts)show that Hillary supporters are just as enthusiastic about her becoming president as Bernie supporters.
Maybe reciting the same stump speech about the 1% just doesn't inspire as many people as you think it does?
Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)you must not think the prevailing economic injustice is a real problem. And I'd say you must not get around much. There is a growing number of Americans being left behind each year. The upper crust may be doing great, maybe even the upper middle class (who feel the 1% is within their grasp, rightly or wrongly). But most other Americans are watching their standard of living decline. And I've yet to hear HRC offer anything of significance to alter the status quo.
qdouble
(891 posts)Nothing beyond strong armed wealth redistribution will change that. I don't hear anything that Bernie has suggested that will stop there from being a 1%. Empty slogans and populist demonization of the wealthy does not equal sound policy.
DrDan
(20,411 posts)Bernie-supporters by showing up at rallies.
Guess which is more critical to gaining the nomination.
Yurovsky
(2,064 posts)so the trend is not positive. In both election years she had every imaginable advantage, yet either lost, or - best case scenario gor her this year - got dragged all the way into May before she could put away a challenger nobody in the media took seriously a year ago.
She's not well liked. Never will be. Even if she gets elected, she'll enter office with historic negatives and a likely impeachment trial for crimes real or imagined (or both).
Maybe she would surprise me. Maybe she'd work to empower the poor & working class. Maybe she'd eschew militarism and seek peaceful solutions in international disputes. Maybe she'd reform Wall Street & the mega banks. Maybe she'd make single payer a reality.
There's a lot of things she could do that would benefit most Americans. And I would love to see her accomplish them if she gets elected POTUS. But I fear that much of what I would like to see her accomplish runs counter to what many of her big donors would like to see her do. And she'll have a re-election on her mind not long after she gets settled back into the WH, which means she'll be raising money from those corporate interests who will oppose progressive change.
I'd love to be proven wrong if she does in fact prevail. I'm not holding my breath, but if she shows courage and promotes a center-left agenda, I'll seriously consider supporting her in 2020. For now, she's given me no reason to.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)For every one person that shows up at a rally, there are hundreds that don't.
I haven't been to any this year but I did show up at the ballot box and voted for our next President, HRC.
apnu
(8,756 posts)Gives the illusion of a ground swell. Everybody does it, including Bernie.
ContinentalOp
(5,356 posts)The numbers in your photo add up to only 126,000 people spread out over 12 states. That's only 12% of the votes that Clinton got in New York alone!
The biggest rally you list there in a state that has already voted is Seattle with 15,000 people. That's in a state where 230,000 people caucused, and there are 4 million registered voters. The Seattle metro area is 3.7 million people, which is about half of the entire Washington state population. So figure 115,000 caucus goers in Seattle, and 2 million registered voters. If 32% of them are Democrats, that's probably 640,000 registered dems in Seattle, so that rally represents maybe 2% of Seattle Democrats! And maybe at best 40% of the people who actually participated in the Seattle democratic caucus.
Response to Playinghardball (Original post)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
KansDem
(28,498 posts)Five will do.
MFM008
(19,814 posts)I swear he buses them from place to place.
Beacool
(30,249 posts)More Democrats have voted for Hillary than have voted for Sanders. Sucks, but it's reality.
Stuckinthebush
(10,845 posts)Big rallies don't mean crap. Hell, Millie Vanilli pulled in big crowds.
Beacool
(30,249 posts)I wonder what they're doing now. Working at a karaoke bar?
Stuckinthebush
(10,845 posts)at a Bernie rally!
Ned_Devine
(3,146 posts)Beacool
(30,249 posts)I'm sorry to hear, sad ending to a promising life. I just looked it up.
"In order to restore their career, Farian agreed in 1997 to produce a new Milli Vanilli album with Morvan and Pilatus on lead vocals. This all led up to the recording of the 1998 Milli Vanilli comeback album Back and In Attack. Even some of the original studio singers backed the performers in their attempt to bring back some of the fame that had been shed so quickly. However, Rob Pilatus encountered a number of personal problems during the production of the new album. He turned to drugs and crime, committing a series of assaults and robberies and was ultimately sentenced to three months in jail and six months in a drug rehabilitation facility in California. Farian bailed Pilatus out of jail and paid for the rehab and plane tickets for him to fly back to Germany. On the eve of the new album's promotional tour on 2 April 1998, Pilatus was found dead of a suspected alcohol and prescription drug overdose in a Frankfurt hotel room. Pilatus' death was ruled accidental."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milli_Vanilli
Ned_Devine
(3,146 posts)I think VH1 did something on them too.
Beacool
(30,249 posts)May he rest in peace.
Ned_Devine
(3,146 posts)And there's a reason we use them as a punchline for jokes. I just personally would never equate them with Bernie Sanders in any way because I think he's the genuine article. His ideas may seem unattainable in this political climate, but for liberals and the working poor like me, he's been the voice we've been waiting to hear for a long time. I loved Obama in '08 and '12 and am disappointed that our system hasn't allowed him to bring the change he had promised. While it's easy to make fun of the big rallies and the hippies and "free pizza" eaters that may show up, we really believe in his message.
DrDan
(20,411 posts)Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Next question.
Bobbie Jo
(14,341 posts)I seem to remember the complaints early on in the campaign about how the DNC wasn't registering voters at his events, like it was their obligation to register Bernie voters.
The campaign should have been doing this from the get go. This is Ground Game 101.
Talk about missed opportunity...
Starry Messenger
(32,342 posts)Those commitment forms that Hillary's people got filled out at events--there's your list. Then you call people and check to see if they are registered and know where to vote.
I worked an election where we even asked mail-in voters if they had the right color pen to fill out the ballot.
Zynx
(21,328 posts)SaschaHM
(2,897 posts)And you're wondering why you're not winning?
There is no way in hell that the New Orleans' pic is representative of the state, let alone the city.
obamanut2012
(26,079 posts)Takket
(21,573 posts)felix_numinous
(5,198 posts)Don't believe your lying eyes.
synergie
(1,901 posts)assuming they're registered, and bother to do so, and are not following Bernie around like groupies and attending numerous rallies in numerous places.
Also, he's losing in literal landslides because people who are not partying at his rallies are looking at his positions on issues, and seeing that he can't back up anything and has no plans or knowledge or even interest in actual facts.
It's why VOTERS are flocking to his opponent, and will be doing so in November. If Bernie and his supporters are smelling rats, at some point they need to start questioning if that odor is coming from themselves.
uponit7771
(90,346 posts)Scurrilous
(38,687 posts)Andy823
(11,495 posts)For anyone who wants to be a Sanders supporter, to be able to smell major conspiracies around every corner?
brooklynite
(94,585 posts)Maybe they thought it was somebody else's job...
Maru Kitteh
(28,340 posts)How to sign up, deadlines, rules, etc. Boring details like how to actually vote must not have been "revolutionary" enough I guess.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)are owned and connected to Soro's #1 contributor to Clinton. No tallies, no receipts nothing to check the vote, nothing....her 12 million is not 12 million. The fraud that has been in video is huge and appalling. This election is rigged and the queen has a coronation. The supers gave her their endorsement long before her opponents entered the ring. She is not winning fairly. Our Country among others sucks. No verification of the vote is on purpose. Missing votes is on purpose, switching votes is on purpose, trashing votes is on purpose. She will win this at any cost and any possible means.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Maru Kitteh
(28,340 posts)emulatorloo
(44,130 posts)Hard to keep though on which days he's good and which days he's bad,
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)high water or preordained rigged election system. The proof is there but somehow you all on H's side don't seem to see any of the video's point blank showing it.
brooklynite
(94,585 posts)I'll note that this drivel ignores the number of States that use and retain paper ballots for recounts.
I'll ALSO note that Sanders hasn't challenged the "rigged" vote count in a single State.
bkkyosemite
(5,792 posts)tabulators all privately owned and easily manipulated. You must have post it notes all over the place by now.