While Sanders has some highly questionalbe writings and comments with respect to women.

[NCTraveler]

He isn't out there playing grab ass. Just stop it. Don't use a cause so dear to me in this manner. It is offensive and no different than how many Sanders supporters have been using POC to score political points.

Sexism, misogyny, and overall oppression are serious issues. Don't minimize it. Dear God, the Big Dog is famous for playing grab ass.

Clinton has won the primary. If you want to take issue with Sanders and women please stick to his quotes and rape fantasies. Don't use a perfectly fine picture with Sanders and a model where nothing wrong is happening to score cheap political points. I think it also paints a situation showing where the model tolerated the grab ass. She did not as Sanders clearly wasn't playing grab ass.

Here are some excerpts from Sanders writings in his thirties.

"A man goes home and masturbates his typical fantasy. A woman on her knees, a woman tied up, a woman abused." Bernie Sanders

"A woman enjoys intercourse with her man — as she fantasizes being raped by 3 men simultaneously." Bernie Sanders

"Have you ever looked at the Stag, Man, Hero, Tough magazines on the shelf of your local bookstore? Do you know why the newspaper with the articles like 'Girl 12 raped by 14 men' sell so well? To what in us are they appealing?" Bernie Sanders

Please back down from scoring cheap political points with something that did not happen. Sanders supporters have been doing it from the start. We have no need to, it hurts our cause, we won, and it paints the model out to have tolerated being groped by a seventy year old man. She did no such thing.

[LexVegas]

1. Those quotes are disturbing. Surely he was not an adult at the time he wrote that. nt

[RandySF]

2. Well, he was 28 when he wrote this.

Often "a child has an old bitch of a teacher (and there are many of them) or pehaps (sic) he simply is not interested in school and would rather be doing other thing (sic)," Sanders wrote in his column, "Cancer, Disease and Society," for an alternative publication called The Vermont Freeman.

https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=hillay+clinton+born&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8#q=bernie+sanders+born


And yet they counter with Hillary supporting Goldwater when she was all of 17.

[NCTraveler]

3. He was in his thirties when he wrote them. nt.

[JudyM]

4. It was a short piece he wrote actually questioning this mentality... In fairness, these are out of

context and he has been a strong feminist his whole life. Take any feminists' writings and you will see the same type of characterizations of men's proclivities. It was bold for sanders to step into that and question it.

[NCTraveler]

11. I don't think they are out of context at all. He broad brushed society in a very foolish manner.

Even Sanders himself states that. He does not back his own writings here.

Please post the whole article if you think it is taken that far out of context.

[JudyM]

15. Please see post # 10 in your thread... That is all there is to say. Unless you want to twist it

rhetorically. It wasn't a great thing for him to write as it is now being twisted like this, but it was a satirical piece in an alternative publication and that is all.

[NCTraveler]

16. Post 10 does not address the foolish and incorrect broad brush he was painting with.

Post the whole thing if you want to make the case.

[JudyM]

17. That's just silly. Satire is satire and that's all I have to say about it, not interested in a slug

fest with you.

[seabeyond]

23. He shared with us how he gets off and how he feels women do. That says everything about how

he sees men and womens role. Yes, he was questioning it. But it is still how he sees the role. Allow us to decide whether we see that as a strength in feminism or not. I personally see a huge ass fail.

[JudyM]

25. Assuming facts not in evidence. You have no idea how he gets off. LOL

[seabeyond]

26. But I do. He shared it with all of us, even those of us that really, REALLY, did not want to know.

[JudyM]

29. You wish. It was satirical writing; if you wish to take it so literally that says more about your

issues. And we'd do well not to get into that.

[seabeyond]

30. See. You and I disagree. Nt

[gollygee]

10. He was criticizing our society's effect on women and men

Last edited Tue May 3, 2016, 07:37 PM - Edit history (1)

These quotes have IMO been taken wildly out of context. He wasn't advocating for that - he was pointing it out as a problem caused by our society.

Although I will say that his writing was awkward and weird and hard to interpret so I do understand why people are reading it the way they are. I just feel strongly that they are misreading it.

[TheBlackAdder]

13. People with limited intellect or political agendas are allowing this meme to continue. nt

[seabeyond]

24. I think you are right, but it does give us a very personal insight how he sees women and mens roles.

He isn't advocating and even calling out, but this is his shared experience. And that gives us an insight how he interprets the roles. It is not the end of the world, nor a huge deal, just a little insight that really affirms perceptions many of us have had over these last 8 months and have had many conversation. Why he does not get the older women votes, the blacks vote, the gay vote. Because he is seeing the world from his male white privileged eyes and is unwilling to listen to us.

[zazen]

31. Andrea Dworkin, Catherine MacKinnon and John Stoltenberg have written on this too

And Nikki Craft . . . and so forth. They're calling out the how dominance and submission are reified into what seems like biologically determined "sex" and "sex roles." Are they misogynists too?

[gollygee]

34. His personal insight on how he sees the roles as given by society

You can comment on something without agreeing with it. You can comment on something and specifically disagree with it, which is what I think is happening here. Commenting on something does not mean that you think it's a good thing.

[KittyWampus]

5. FFS, ONE DU'er posted a thread and not one other DU'er went along with it.

Why the need for now three other threads?

The original was so stupid it should have ignored or locked.

[Matt_in_STL]

14. Not one other DUer went along with it?

Have someone sit down and read that thread to you because either you didn't read it or are outright lying.

[sufrommich]

6. I wholeheartedly agree with this OP.

Quit the crap.

[JaneyVee]

7. He wrote that in 1972 while in his 30s, heres what Hillary was doing at that time:

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/12/28/us/politics/how-hillary-clinton-went-undercover-to-examine-race-in-education.html?referer=

[NCTraveler]

8. Thank you for adding that. I read that article a couple of months ago. Good read.

The future Mrs. Clinton, then a 24-year-old law student, was working for Marian Wright Edelman, the civil rights activist and prominent advocate for children. Mrs. Edelman had sent her to Alabama to help prove that the Nixon administration was not enforcing the legal ban on granting tax-exempt status to so-called segregation academies, the estimated 200 private academies that sprang up in the South to cater to white families after a 1969 Supreme Court decision forced public schools to integrate.

Her mission was simple: Establish whether the Dothan school was discriminating based on race.

[shireen]

9. not all

Sanders supporters have been doing it from the start.

They are a disruptive vocal minority. Just as there is a disruptive vocal minority of Clinton supporters doing the same. Both types of people are simply doing it to stir up petty arguments for their entertainment. I've started adding them to my ignore list to filter out the garbage.

Your post is a thoughtful one, and I appreciate it. And for the record, I like and respect Hillary Clinton and if she is the nominee, I will vote for her. I believe the majority of Sanders supporters share those sentiments. But you don't hear them because they're not responding to the garbage posts.

[NCTraveler]

12. "not all" Fully agree.

"They are a disruptive vocal minority. Just as there is a disruptive vocal minority of Clinton supporters doing the same. " Fully agree.

I actually just ended a conversation with one of my favorite Sanders supporters because I think we were getting too personal. They are a poster I have great respect for and want to make sure we have a good relationship after the primaries.

"Just as there is a disruptive vocal minority of Clinton supporters doing the same. " I also understand that I have personally been guilty of this on occasion. Self reflection is extremely important.

Thank you for the thoughtful post.

[aikoaiko]

18. He wrote those as an writer, an artist, and not a politician or public servant.

[seabeyond]

21. He thought he hand a handle on women, just like he thinks he does today. Dismisses what we say, and

tells us what we think. Not much different from the 30 something self.

[KingFlorez]

19. Turnabout is fair play

Clinton has been attacked relentlessly for month with all sorts of crazy logic, so it's not surprising that the tables have turned.

[seabeyond]

20. 2013 Playboy interview. No consideration to women. Not even a thought, probably a giggle. Grown ups

at the table. That would be men, cigar, brandy and naked women entertaining them while they talk the serious stuff.

[BootinUp]

22. Better to take the high road, agreed nt.

[Nye Bevan]

27. The concept of "rape fantasy" absolutely baffles me.

I just don't get how such a thing could turn anybody on.

[seabeyond]

28. A woman's "rape" fantasy is a lot of things and has nothing to do with rape. Total control, while

definition of rape is no control. Yet, when a man fantasizes about rape, he is the one with control, and it is the definition of rape. So he is literally fantasizing abusing, hurting and getting off on it. That is what Sanders shared with us. I wonder if he still only sees it from his eyes, or if women have been allowed to be a part of the conversation. We certainly are not allowed in this primary.

We are merely the establishment, or we need to listen and allow Sanders, our Feminist hero, to do our talking for us.

[Blue_Adept]

32. Everyone has very different things that work for them

Then again, having seen some of the amusing sex threads at DU, I wouldn't be surprised if 99% of folks here are for the plain vanilla stuff.

My significant other likes to bring this particular fantasy in from time to time among other fantasies. It changes things up a bit and it works for her completely because she's in an utterly safe environment and retains control because she gives it over.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

33. AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service

On Tue May 3, 2016, 01:19 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

While Sanders has some highly questionalbe writings and comments with respect to women.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/12511888835

REASON FOR ALERT

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

Taking quotes out of context and claiming Sen Sanders has "rape fantasies" in order to label him as a misogynist or a pervert: "his quotes and rape fantasies"

Also a broad brush attack on other members: "Sanders supporters have been doing it from the start."

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue May 3, 2016, 01:27 PM, and the Jury voted 2-5 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: No explanation given
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Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
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Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Nacho party at my house tonight. BYOB. And if you can hook up some guac, bean dip, and a nice cold salad of cucumbers, tomatoes, green peppers, banana pepper rings, light chili powder, light red onion, drowned in italian dressing, that mos def would be AWESOME! As for hiding this... can't do it (and I am a so-called Bernie Bro)
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE
Explanation: Oh goodness
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Juror #7 voted to HIDE IT
Explanation: transparent

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.