2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumDemocrats see Hillary Clinton-Elizabeth Warren dream ticket
Democrats are openly pulling for Hillary Clinton to pick Elizabeth Warren as her running mate.
Amid concerns that supporters of Bernie Sanders will stay home on Election Day, writes the Hill, a number of Democrats see a Clinton-Warren alliance as an all-woman dream team capable of igniting enthusiasm in the progressive base. Jamal Simmons, a Democratic strategist, told the Hill the longer Sanders stays in the race, the more likely Clinton will select Massachusetts Sen. Warren. He said Warren solves so many problems: enthusiasm, women, young liberals, older white liberals. The Hill writes Clinton insiders have been asked about their thoughts on Warren, among other possible vice presidential picks.
It would also eliminate the pro-Wall Street storyline that has haunted Clintons campaign throughout the primary season, Clinton allies believe.
Democratic strategist and presidential campaign veteran Jamal Simmons said the longer Sanders stays in the race, the more likely Clinton will select Warren.
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/279306-dems-see-clinton-and-warren-as-dream-team
VulgarPoet
(2,872 posts)the idea that Clinton actually gives a fuck about the issues they find the most pressing. Pass.
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)that BERNIE accomplishes his agenda.... Yep! NOBODY ELSE is involved.
You haven't listened to a God Damned Thing he has been saying. Pure exposure of ignorance there.
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)I'm listening
Baobab
(4,667 posts)Hillary will have trouble finding a running mate. She is already at the Nixon stage of dysfunction.
Nobody in their right mind would want to tie their future to hers.
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)Baobab
(4,667 posts)Does the Party want to commit seppaku? Ritual self-disembowelment?
You likely are a better judge of THAT than I.
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)I look forward to working with you to advance a Democratic agenda.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)choice of The Democratic Establishment. But not the General Public. Bit of a disconnect, but I'll grant that she's likely to draw it out to the bitter end.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Good point!
AgerolanAmerican
(1,000 posts)I'm sure she'll find someone suitably craven.
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)I'm sure someone has wasted your time before trying to deliver you the information in the form of an engraved invitation. I'm done doing that with baiters. You either prepare yourself as a Democrat as I did by examining the candidates, or you don't. You shouldn't need more than that, unless you want to purposely fuck with someone. I'm not one to suffer fools...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1280193468
For his full resume, go here: http://www.sanders.senate.gov
Be sure and ask the waitress for extra napkins and location of the restroom.
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)That's pretty much what I expected. Still waiting for Single Payer to be enacted in VT. How's it going?
MrMickeysMom
(20,453 posts)Speeches rhymes with beaches... I suggest you get some fresh air, cause it ain't helping you on this thread. Maybe you'll "renew" yourself!
Renew Deal
(81,856 posts)And maybe that's Bernie's problem. He has an admirable list of proposals, but he has no plan to enact them and no track record of accomplishment.
highprincipleswork
(3,111 posts)what they are told is "realistic". And by Progressives I mean most of the American people, who hold Progressive ideas and only need someone to actually represent them. If we're not careful, for some of them that will mean Trump, at least on issues like trade and the economy.
Wouldn't want to be on a sports team with any of the severe doubters around here, because all we'd do is lose, lose, lose.
Demsrule86
(68,556 posts)I admire both women tremendously.
Armstead
(47,803 posts)Just askin'
JaneyVee
(19,877 posts)SheenaR
(2,052 posts)libdem4life
(13,877 posts)liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)brooklynite
(94,520 posts)Clinton: 1,704 Pledged Delegates
Sanders: 1,421 Pledged Delegates
liberalnarb
(4,532 posts)West Virginia
Kentucky
Oregon
The Virgin Islands
Puerto Rico
California
Montana
New Jersey
New Mexico
North Dakota
South Dakota
and DC
brooklynite
(94,520 posts)Sunlei
(22,651 posts)Imagine where America would be today if our President Mocks everyone like only a Republican Bagger can mock countries, religions, Mexicans and even our own Senators and Congress.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Also, the fact that she praised Clinton's bogus plan for the big banks was really telling.
yourpaljoey
(2,166 posts)"the fact that she praised Clinton's bogus plan for the big banks was really telling."
JTFrog
(14,274 posts)NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)I think EW will be her greatest strength in the senate. Different than Sanders, she understands human nature and the complexities of the issues. Both important qualities in a legislator.
TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...than to team up to be used by Hillary. I also doubt she'd want her name associated with whatever stupidity Hillary might try to do militarily.
CanadaexPat
(496 posts)CTyankee
(63,912 posts)to be hard enough to get a woman elected president in the first place.
djean111
(14,255 posts)neutralizing Warren - getting Warren out of the Senate, where the Third Way whines she is "getting out of hand".
Not voting based on gender. Voting based on issues. So very hard to understand for some.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)and Warren in a cabinet or stay in Senate. But, it would be an awesomely powerful ticket of women.
Baobab
(4,667 posts)Nor would Hillary's new backers let her pick EW.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)And you wonder why you are ridiculed.
Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)BlueStater
(7,596 posts)If she puts that untested lightweight on her ticket, it will only prove what many of us have long suspected of her: she's a craven, pandering politician who would do anything to win and puts what she thinks is best for her ahead of what's best for the country.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Baobab
(4,667 posts)Nor one who is going to have opinions.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)Vote2016
(1,198 posts)seabeyond
(110,159 posts)work really well together. I think so many comments on this thread are bogus, hence speaking up. I prefer Warren elsewhere, but she would be a kick ass Vp and they would be an even better team. I prefer Castro. But Warren would be great and fun, too.
Vote2016
(1,198 posts)Texas Democrat, but I'd like to see a young Hispanic on the ticket (I'd prefer a young PROGRESSIVE Hispanic, but 2 out of 3 ain't bad)
Baobab
(4,667 posts)For six years America is in mortal danger. One corrupt Presidential pen stroke could sign away everything worth stealing forever.
Look at how GATS has screwed up health care.
At least a million Americans have died unnecessarily in these 20 years.
CobaltBlue
(1,122 posts)Baobab
(4,667 posts)If the Democratic Party would pick her, but unless something has changed for the better, they wouldn't.
There are a number of other women who would make great VPs.
I would LOVE to see a ticket with two women on it.
I do not see Hillary Clinton as being a good first female President. I do want to see a female President.
One who represents the best qualities of all women and who is in fact supportive of the interests and values of American women .
Which is not Clinton. She is not a person who is helpful to American women - she is for corporations.
Autumn
(45,066 posts)Lizzie Poppet
(10,164 posts)Particularly after Princess Weathervane's (expected) hard lurch to the right now that she thinks she has the nomination locked up...
Real or just for show, Liz?
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)They've spent the entire race throwing our misogyny in our face, and now they think we would vote for an all female ticket? That only makes sense if they were lying about our misogyny this whole time.
And surely they wouldn't have done something that despicable.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)ieoeja
(9,748 posts)I know that's true because DU told me so.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)TCJ70
(4,387 posts)I see people giving Warren more credit than to be used by Hillary.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)representatives are like... adults. Respectful, valuing each other. Makes working together a productive endeavor. Not the immature, childish dissing for nothing else but pettiness.
TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...ok.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)TCJ70
(4,387 posts)...you responded with something about mutual respect. Your response had nothing to do with my post. Whether they respect each other has nothing to do with anything or the potential reasons she may or may not be comfortable being her VP.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)ieoeja
(9,748 posts)... appealed to their bigotry.
Do you seriously think Hillary is not getting a ton of support this year from people who love her because she tried to stop the n***** in 2008?
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Actually if you looked at exit polls you will see she is losing the white working class voters she won in 08. Some of my fellow Democrats will support a white female Democrat when she runs against an African American male Democrat but will not support her when she runs against a white male Democrat:
Mrs. Clintons profound weakness in a county named Coal is not because of her comments about shutting down coal mines, as one might expect. Those comments came after the Oklahoma primary.
Its because Coal County, like much of the traditionally Democratic parts of the South, has a huge number of registered Democrats who now vote Republican in presidential elections. In the states with closed or semi-closed contests like Oklahoma these registered Democrats can participate only in the Democratic primary.
When they do, they have tended to vote against Hillary Clinton (and for Bernie Sanders, the senator from Vermont).
Coal County, Okla., is one of the most extreme examples. There, 80 percent of voters are registered Democrats, yet President Obama won just 27 percent of the vote in 2012. Mrs. Clinton has performed very poorly where the share of voters who are registered Democrats is much greater than the share of voters who supported Mr. Obama.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/10/upshot/where-democrats-like-hillary-clinton-the-least-besides-vermont.html?smid=tw-upshotnyt&smtyp=cur
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)The data suggests they embraced her in 08 because she was running against an African American. Now that she is running against a white candidate they are eschewing her.
When this primary season started I thought Clinton would win handily because she would win all the demographic groups she won in 08 and add African Americans. It became more difficult for her because she is losing the white working class voters she overwhelmingly won in 08. In retrospect it wasn't so much they liked her but they they didn't like her opponent.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)And props to her for not actually appealing to religious bigotry this time.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)No ... I do not think HRC is not getting support this year from people who love her because she tried to stop the n***** in 2008.
Where do you come up with this crap?
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)I assume you mean you do not think HRC is getting support from racist Democrats this year mostly because she tried to stop Obama in 2008.
If so ... well ... okay then.
I can absolutely assure you that a lot of racist Democrats really love Hillary for that reason. But if you for some odd reason can not believe that, I don't know what more to say.
"Where do you come up with this crap?"
The real world where real people have really said it. I am White. Most racist White guys keep their racism to themselves around African-Americans. You only hear a small fraction of the racist crap I hear on a regular basis.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I do not think HRC is getting support from racist Democrats this year mostly because she tried to stop Obama in 2008.
You could tell the truth and say you made that up ... unless, perhaps, you are projecting your 2008 feelings onto some unidentified others.
You have heard white people saying they support HRC this year because she failed 8 years ago? Cool Story, Bro.
ETA: There is no question in my mind that there are white Democrats that voted for HRC in 2008 because she was running against the Black guy.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)For there is no way you can possibly be so naive as to believe that there are no racist Democrats who view Hillary as their hero because of her fight against Obama in 2008. Or that none of them would vote for her this election because she is their hero for that reason.
You at least admit she was a hero to those people in 2008. Why would she not still be so to some?
Why is it so important to you that this obvious reality to everyone but you not be true?
Because it doesn't make a bit of fucking difference. Some racists support Hillary. So what? Does that somehow make her tainted in your eyes?
A lot of racists probably love the same beer/food/car/etc that you do. Does that make that beer/food/car/etc bad?
Or does it piss you off because makes it more difficult to tar Bernie because some of his supporters are racist too?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)I, clearly, stated that there is no question in my mind that IN 2008, there were Democrats that supported HRC because she was running against the Black guy.
This is so far fetched as to be laughable.
Obvious reality? Wow ... we have differing understandings of "obvious" and "reality".
A lot of racists probably love the same beer/food/car/etc that you do. Does that make that beer/food/car/etc bad?
Or does it piss you off because makes it more difficult to tar Bernie because some of his supporters are racist too?
Okay. I'm going to bow out, now. I'm not going around the bend with you.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)and thinking/believing that the racists that voted for HRC because she went against (and lost to) the Black guy in 2008 ... are supporting her in 2016 because she went against (and lost to) the Black guy in 2008 is crazytown!
JustAnotherGen
(31,818 posts)Like - eh? I dunno. I think you are taking the right approach.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,818 posts)Memory, Perception and Sanity are AOK.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)JustAnotherGen
(31,818 posts)And handled that well for being referred to as stupid. Don't attack back. Just let them be what they are - and be glad you don't go home to it!
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)ieoeja
(9,748 posts)So I guess you also believe that no racists are voting for Hillary this year because they like what Hillary did to Obama in 2008?
While DSB clearly believes that to be a very small number, at least he does not deny the truth of that. And I still don't see why this is such a big problem for 1SBM. Could you explain that to me since all I get from 1SBM is snark?
JustAnotherGen
(31,818 posts)I can't read 1Strong's mind - but I will consider the task.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)Perhaps it escaped your attention, but racists are fucking idiots. What you call "crazy", they call "wicked smart".
White racists believe that all White people are racist. They believe many bury it under feelings of guilt. They believe most pretend not to be racist in public because they are afraid.
So where does Hillary fit? Before 2008 the White racist would have probably credited her with "Liberal guilt" making her their opponent. But "Liberal guilt" does not countenance her dog-whistling campaign in 2008.
She gave them a wink-and-a-nod. They now believe her to be one of them. They believe she is just pretending to like African-Americans for political reasons.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)ieoeja
(9,748 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,710 posts)Can you point to data that indicates that primary voters in 2016 are rewarding her for opposing Barack Obama in 2008?
In 2008 Hillary's best demographics were working class whites and Latinos. In 2016 her best demographics are African Americans, Latinos, and more affluent whites. Working class whites have abandoned her campaign in droves.
That fact would seem to suggest the argument that folks are voting for her now for opposing the African American candidate in 2008 was incorrect.
It seems like they liked Hillary enough when she was running against an African American candidate but don't like her nearly as much as when she is running against a white male candidate.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)You want numbers. I can't give you that. But I have no doubt there are plenty more out there.
As I said to 1SBM, "so what". It doesn't mean anything. It makes it harder to tar Bernie, but to deny this reality is silly.
Does Hillary have to be so pure that no bad person would ever vote for her?
Heck, I'll bet at least one guy who killed his mother voted for Hillary this election. And at least one voted for Bernie.
But I don't have the data on that one either.
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Who is trying to tar Bernie? ... Who even mentioned him?
I take that back ... that's the crazy, right there ... violent crazy, at that.
ieoeja
(9,748 posts)Heck, I'll bet at least one guy who killed his mother voted for Hillary this election. And at least one voted for Bernie.I take that back ... that's the crazy, right there ... violent crazy, at that.
Do you believe that no person who killed his mother will have voted in this election? Why?
Do you believe that no such person has voted for Hillary this election? Why?
Do you believe that no such person has voted for Bernie this election? Why?
1StrongBlackMan
(31,849 posts)Do you believe that no such person has voted for Hillary this election? Why?
Do you believe that no such person has voted for Bernie this election? Why?
This is getting really weird. Excuse me while I, quietly, back out the door.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)...but I would hate to see her nerfed in the Senate.
A Hillary Clinton that can woo her as a running mate would, however, be a Hillary Clinton more to my liking.
Ino
(3,366 posts)It's rather arrogant.
seabeyond
(110,159 posts)libdem4life
(13,877 posts)They are so fond of you...they will listen. Sorry, but I don't have Warren pegged as a flip flopper on her primary issue. But like Hillary, Elizabeth used to be a Republican, as I recall. So, there's that.
Thinking Clinton, like Trump, may have a hard time finding someone credible to chance teaming up with such high unfavorables. Also, the VP role is largely ceremonial, so little political bump.
Trajan
(19,089 posts)'Democrats' are pulling for this?
WHICH Democrats? ...
Fucking lazy ass writers . .
farleftlib
(2,125 posts)would not see this harebrained idea for what it is. HRC riding the coattails of the ethical, principled
and highly effective Warren into the WH, thereby neutralizing Warren of all the good she could
accomplish in the Senate so that instead she can go to ribbon-cutting ceremonies while Clinton
crashes and burns the ship of state into the ground. What an idea!!
BeyondGeography
(39,370 posts)Moving to the center and trying to get more moderate white male votes is an utter waste of time.
oldandhappy
(6,719 posts)demmiblue
(36,845 posts)tularetom
(23,664 posts)I also doubt that Warren wants to spend four years biting her tongue.
I get that the thought of a Clinton-Warren ticket makes some people all giddy, but these two have basically nothing in common, other than gender.
It doesn't matter who the nominal VP candidate is, the true running mate will be Bill Clinton. We've already seen some disturbing indications of that.
FreakinDJ
(17,644 posts)Hillary's 3rd Way has been attacking Warren for years
hueymahl
(2,495 posts)Agree with the article. Clinton-Warren would be unstoppable.
NorthCarolina
(11,197 posts)the Democratic base to her side by name dropping Warren. The reality is she's far more likely to pick someone like Kasich than EW, but dropping a name is ok if it wins a few extra votes.
whatchamacallit
(15,558 posts)Attorney in Texas
(3,373 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)Hillary will absolutely never pick the following:
1. A liberal
2. A person who will outshine her
3. Someone who will fight Wall Street
4. Someone who isn't a war hawk
Look for Hillary to pick the most boring, milquetoast candidate that might draw in a group or region.
Her candidacy will be the biggest yawner since Dukakis/Bentsen.
wendylaroux
(2,925 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Juicy_Bellows
(2,427 posts)If it did, I'd forever wonder wtf happened to Warren.
notadmblnd
(23,720 posts)She's not going to kow-tow to Hillary. No way- no how.
Mike Nelson
(9,954 posts)...she needs a "shore up the base" VP, Warren's got it. But most think she will need to move to the center (yes, I know many Bernie supporters believe Hillary Clinton already is a far-right Republican).
3hummingbirds
(58 posts)A Warren/Clinton would be even better. My own personal belief is, Senator Warren can be more powerful where she is and accomplish more than being Hillary Clinton' mouthpiece.
libdem4life
(13,877 posts)she'll run into someone who shares her values.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)That's as logical as pretending that the primaries are over before 23% of the voters have voted.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)PATRICK
(12,228 posts)it might seem a simple answer, but it might just be impossible for both women.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)Warren ain't gonna do that - bless her socks!
She would be significantly more valuable to the Nation, in the Senate, where she can help progressives and liberals counter her chick-hawk corporate neocon agenda
Hiraeth
(4,805 posts)pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)I think most wouldn't